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lizj

Struggling with benefits. Help please!

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A brief update: Son of 20 with ASD, MLD and dysprxia has now left college with hard-won Level 1s.

He has been on JSA for 6 months but can't cope with the system of claiming, all the paperwork and appointments is too much for his organisational skills. He has a DEA and is now with Mencap Job programme, but all they seem to do is add more paperwork and meetings, and then tell him off when he doesn't get it right. "You really need to learn how to do this on your own" etc. As if he could be normal if he tried hard enough.

Job Centre make him apply for jobs he won't get and couldn't do if he did get them, so it's a waste of everyone's time and money.

If he doesn't apply or turn up for meetings etc his money is stopped.

He did get a Christmas job at Asda but they let him go because he couldn't work quickly enough for them. Then he lost £160 benefits for not filling in a form that no-one told him he needed to complete.

I would like to know whether life would be easier if he was on ESA, and what chances are there of him getting it if we applied? I believe he is capable of work if it were the right job in the right place, but coping with the JSA system is proving so stressful for us both.

Any advice gratefully received.

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There are a number of organisations I am thinking could be of help and give you some advice.

 

Firstly for him to have a benefits check. Citizens advice should either be able to do it, or tell you where you can go to get one carried out - and also help with any completion of forms.

 

If he is eligible for DLA that will also help with him meeting other criteria for either benefits or help because one of the first things you are always asked is whether you have DLA.

 

Also ask the CAB about any organisation such as Disability Direct, etc that can give you advice about the kind of support you may need in work, and how to be registered by the Job Centre and any potential employer as being disabled [ie. must be a condition physical, neurological etc that has lasted 12 months or longer, or which is likely to last 12 months or longer. This used to fall under the Disability Discrimination Act, but this has recently been renamed the Disability and Equality Act. This is a link to it http://www.direct.go...ghts/DG_4001068

 

Once he is registered as being disabled, it can also state what kind of "reasonable adjustments" your son would need to enable him to work eg. help with organisation, being allowed longer to complete a job, working reduced hours etc.

 

If he is unlikely to be independent completely, and he has MLD, then you need to ask Social Services to assess him. He may get a social worker to help him with things, or he may be entitled to Direct Payments to buy in support he might need eg. to go out and socialise [because he won't want mum to always be the one going with him].

 

You could also speak with Social Services about the possibility in the future of sheltered housing as he may also have access to certain supports that maybe useful to you or him to gain independent living outside of the family home [my sister achieved this in her forties]. And Social Services involvement is also something that can help prove need when looking for work. And as he has a MLD and ASD he does fit their criteria.

 

And those reasonable adjustments have to be taken into account when the Job Centre are looking for jobs that he could do. So if those adjustments are very specific, they should not send him for any job that includes those things he is NOT supposed to undertake.

 

If you need to support, organise him etc, then you maybe eligible for Carers Allowance - again CAB can advise you on how to claim that.

 

If you have someone in the house with DLA you can also claim Council Tax Benefit [depends on household income whether you are eligible], but again if/when he moved out and became independent, having DLA would allow him to claim a reduction in council tax and to also claim Disabled Tax Credit if he were working.

 

Being eligible for DLA seems to be a gateway to accessing other services/supports or benefits.

 

Also have you looked to see if you have a Remploy employer in your area? They are a sheltered workplace - although I know that a number of those factories are losing their funding.

 

So see if Remploy can advise on getting a job, or using a service provider to help your son find a job he can hold down.

 

I would also lobby your MP and write to them about the difficulties you are having because I think it does help to keep our MPs aware of what our daily concerns are.

 

And you need someone to help you complete the forms because having gained the qualifications he has is brilliant - but that does not mean he does not have significant complex needs that would require reasonable adjustments and support for him to access work.

 

Also, when looking at travelling to work, you can see if he would meet the criteria for Access to Work support. My own sister travels to work by taxi, which is part paid by Access to Work and her employer [Remploy]. This is because there is no early morning direct bus route to her workplace and she is too vulnerable to travel alone at 5.00am in the morning into the city, to wait alone for about 30 mins to catch another bus to her workplace. We had to get a GP letter to support us in this. He also had to confirm that she could not walk to work or learn to drive! In the afternoon she leaves work and has two different bus journeys to get home.

 

Access to Work will also take into account any medication and how that affects the person, especially first thing in the morning, and obviously with Dyspraxia and MLD, your son's ability to problem solve if needed maybe an argument you could use that he needs to go directly to work by taxi [if it is an early start, or a number of different bus journeys].

 

And getting all these things does paint a picture of the level of need and the kind of support required.

 

It seems that at the moment you are just not being recognised by the "system" because you have not registered yourself via either DLA or by being registered as disabled under the Disability and Equalities Act.

Edited by Sally44

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I read somewhere that having qualifications can except you from the learning disability criteria needed for supported living placements and social services funding. If MLD is under the educational terminology 'mild learning difficulties' it isn't enough to claim benefits because Dyslexia / Dyspraxia come under that heading where as learning disabilities come under severe learning difficulties.

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charlie C i have autism, dyspraxia and moderate learning disability and mental health problems and i receive DLA, ESA with support group with the added severe disabled preminum. To be on ESA support group u need to score 15 points or more and not capable of doing a fulltime paid work but voluntary

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I live in supported living too and to meet the criteria you have to be assessed as having a learning disability, learning difficulties is different to learning disabilities because thats educational terminology.......

 

I live in a house with three other people who are all under the CLDT as this house is only registered for people with LD, meaning people with learning difficulties won't meet the CLDT criteria to live here.

Edited by Charlie C

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i do not know what cdlt stands for. I live in a supported living for Learning disabilities. They except people with ASD, Dyspraxia , Down syndrome with an accompany learning disability. Which i wouldnt be hear if i didnt. I receive housing benefit but pay a small contribution towards the gas, electric and all that. I am too move this place might take a while considering i have been here for 2 years and should be gone by now but its going to take a while

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oh i see i am on them with my community LD nurse they are part of social services. this house has to have someone come through a social worker to come here but once your here they disappear because this place is for moderate needs and social services only take substantial/critical cases now. its not really fair, i even lost my direct payments too. this house is funded by adult social care, not supporting people no more but this supported housing is from a private housing association

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Same here adult social care fund my care package (22 hours a week) housing benefit pays the rent £186 a week just for a room which is a ripp off

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Hi Liz,

 

I definitely think your son should apply for ESA. He shouldn't be pressured to keep applying for jobs if it's causing him so much stress, and if he's very restricted to what kind of job he could manage (to the point where he can't find anything suitable) then his disability really does make him incapable of working for the moment.

 

I agree with the suggestion to see the CAB, they should help yoru son make a strong application for ESA.

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I read somewhere that having qualifications can except you from the learning disability criteria needed for supported living placements and social services funding. If MLD is under the educational terminology 'mild learning difficulties' it isn't enough to claim benefits because Dyslexia / Dyspraxia come under that heading where as learning disabilities come under severe learning difficulties.

 

Depends on the qualifications, wordpower and numberpower for example are designed for those with academic (as opposed to social) LDs.

 

i have an undergraduate degree and wasn't asked about my qualifications when i applied for the advanceuk housing scheme. i also get SS

funding at 1st my gran got it to support me now i have it in my own right. MLD is moderate learning disabilities.

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I live in supported living too and to meet the criteria you have to be assessed as having a learning disability, learning difficulties is different to learning disabilities because thats educational terminology.......

 

I live in a house with three other people who are all under the CLDT as this house is only registered for people with LD, meaning people with learning difficulties won't meet the CLDT criteria to live here.

 

You're getting the criterion confused here, learning difficulties is the annoying PC term for IQ under 70 type academic learning disabilities. Dyslexia comes under Specific Learning difficulty.

 

Going back on topic to the original poster i would follow the advice of Sally44, except there is one problem access to work i heard was no longer available for newer claimants as the government cut the funding.

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Same here adult social care fund my care package (22 hours a week) housing benefit pays the rent £186 a week just for a room which is a ripp off

 

Shame you couldn't have claimed the HB yourself then had it paid to the landlord as before 2008 you would have got local housing allowance. You could try and change it so they cant charge you over the odds for your rent. You get more support hours than me and i have additional physical needs, i get about 13 but i dont want to ask for more at the moment.

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Definitely worth trying to claim ESA. My eldest son is in the support group and he is capable of working if the job/staff are right, but is not able to get work as easily as most people. My other son is on JSA and has to apply for at least one job each week - my eldest cannot even fill in application forms due to his dyslexia.

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I think a total benefits check should be done.

 

Write down the type of difficulties your son has eg. you mentioned executive functions. You need someone to help you fill out the form because you have to think about the level of support your son needs on a bad day, not a good day. And alot is down to the wording used. DLA has a care and mobility element to it.

 

I don't know about Access to Work ceasing for new applicants?? But definately worth checking. If your son had severe anxiety around using public transport, etc, or other issues that made it difficult or impossible to get to a work location [where the work was something he could actually do], then getting Access to Work would be a big help.

 

And regarding looking for work, I think the biggest thing is to get your son recognised as having a disability. I am in the process of helping my brother do that now. He has mental health problems, and some physical ones too, and his employer has said that all employees must work overtime. He is only just coping with working full time and has been off sick from work on more than one occasion and his mental health condition has caused him to be off work for over a year.

 

So we have written to his employer to state that he is disabled under the criteria of the Disability and Equalities Act. His GP has written a very strong letter in which he states he "strongly recommends" that xxxxx is not requested to do additional hours as his condition is difficult to treat and it is more a case of him having to manage his disability. So we are asking that reasonable adjustments are made so that he is not asked to work nights, and not asked to do additional hours.

 

For DLA it is not about IQ, it is about the impact the difficulties have on the individual. For example he may need a high level of supervision, may not be able to problem solve, may have severe anxiety difficulties, may have speech and communication difficulties in understanding and being understood, may find it hard to plan how to approach things or to organise himself, may be easily distracted and find it hard to concentrate, may have sleeping problems etc.

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I don't know what level 1's in college is equivalent to.

 

What is typical of someone with an ASD is a spikey profile. Good or even brilliant at some things, and poor or totally unable to do others.

 

A good educational psychologist should be able to carry out thorough assessments using both verbal and non-verbal assessments [as those with an ASD usually perform badly on verbal or language based assessments].

 

My sons scores range from a 1 or 2 [where 3 is classed as severe difficulties], to a 14 and 15 [where 8-13 is classed as normal or typical].

 

What that mean in every day situations is that he may be able to approach a task, but some element within that task may cause him to fail because it involves something he is unable to do. But he does not have a general mild or moderate learning disability. He has a specific learning disability due to dyslexia, executive functions, poor short term and working memory, distractability, lack of imagination to be able to think things through etc.

 

So if you get problems with having his needs understood or having him being recognised as disabled, then you may need to think about a private assessment, if that was suggested as something that would be useful.

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My older brother is also in the process of having himself recognised as being disabled by his employer.

 

Just before christmas he had a stroke. He is in his 50's and had a very high powered executive job.

 

He has been left with significant and extensive brain damage. His weakness on one side has improved significantly.

 

This was a man that ran 10 miles a day every day for 30 years!

 

Now he struggles to remember sequences, problem solve, make choices and no longer feels capable of doing his previous job. He finds it almost impossible to plan and organise himself. His long term memory is good, but he finds it extremely difficult to learn something new. He cannot watch someone do something and then copy what they did.

 

So a disability is anything mental or physical that has, or is expected to, last more than 12 months.

 

If you met him and just talked to him you would have no idea he had any difficulties at all.

Edited by Sally44

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Wow, that's a lot to read and take in! Thank you all for your input.

To clear up one or two things: he is recognised "disabled" and receives low rate DLA. He gets the JSA disability premium, sees a DEA and has been referred to Mencap for help finding a job. Although their idea of "help" is mainly bullying him into things - yesterday they told him he should learn to drive...where he gets the ability to pass the theory test, the money, co-ordination and road sense from was not explained.

His IQ is about 72, which puts him only just above the cut-off point for most support. If he hadn't got Level 1 he would get a lot more help.

My main problem is, because he on JSA he still has to do all the things "normal" Jobseekers do. Sign on every other week, see his advisor regularly, apply for at least 3 jobs a week and provide evidence that he has done it. There are no allowances or exceptions. His advisers who are supposed to help him just say "Oh, it's annoying isn't it."

If he doesn't find and apply for 3 jobs a week, he is sanctioned. Even when there is nothing suitable. I end up doing applications for him, and we know it is a waste of everyone's time, there are 80 applicants for every vacancy.

If we did manage to get him on ESA would he still have to sign on, go to appointments with advisors and keep a job log (which I write for him as his writing is illegible)?

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ESA its a bit complicated, have to proof that he is unfit for work and even if they say he is capable of working then he will be in the work related activity group which u have so long before you have to find another job or he loose benefit.

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Okay, that clears things up a bit.

 

I would still recommend you contact the person I PM'd you about at Disability Direct. She is a former nurse, and supports people with a vast array of different disabilities.

 

Another thought is contacting connextions and asking if there is a way around your current problems with JSA.

 

Having DLA is not the same as being recognised as being disabled. I know what the process is to get registered by them as disabled when you are already employed. I would assume there would be something similar for someone looking for work.

 

As you say, there is no point your son attending job interviews if he has no chance of getting or keeping those jobs. And it is ridiculous for them to be suggesting the things they are.

 

I have always found that getting things in writing is much more powerful. So why not write to whoever it was who suggested he learnt to drive and ask them to put that in writing that they think an adult with MLD is capable of learning to drive.

 

See what advice you get from Disability Direct.

 

Also Citizens Advice may have advice as another type of benefit maybe better, or point you in another direction. Maybe even legal help regarding employment law.

 

Also ask Disability Direct/CAB etc if it would be helpful to see your GP and ask them to write a letter stating that your son is not capable of learning to drive etc. We had to do that for our sister.

 

IF a thorough assessment of ability is needed and the outcome of it go towards reasonable adjustments [which is part of the Disability and Equalities Act WHICH IS LAW], then again you could ask your GP to refer your son to Clinical Psychology for them to assess him or you could pay to have one done independently. And before you did that I think it would be useful to seek advice on the pros or cons of him being considered MLD or not. He is very borderline, and if his difficulties are best met by being considered MLD, then you would need a report to state that.

 

I, and i'm sure many others, have found that schools, LA's, employers etc have their own "internal" criteria and regulations. But the law of the land always trumps that. So IF he is eligible to be regarded as disabled then he is also eligible for "reasonable adjustments" and then the Job Centre cannot force him to do those things. If they did they would be breaking the law, and there should be some recourse for that.

 

Also write to your MP on this subject. It is one that many with a neurological or MLD difficulty have trying to work through the system [whichever system that maybe] and trying to get and keep a job.

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If we did manage to get him on ESA would he still have to sign on, go to appointments with advisors and keep a job log (which I write for him as his writing is illegible)?

 

No, he woudl not have to sign on or keep a job log or apply for any jobs if he didn't want to. He might have to see his DEA occasionally and there was a one-off 6 week work programme that was supposed to help them with CVs, interviews, etc that they had to attend once, but that is not going at the moment.

 

There is no limit on how long you can be in the WRAG group - you do not have to get a job. They do review the ESA claim every so often (6 months the first time for us, hten 18 months).

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My housemate is on wrag and if she doesnt get her job she is going to loose her benefits.

 

What is the employment and support allowance work-related activity group?

 

The ESA work-related activity group is for claimants who the DWP consider will be capable of work at some time in the future and who are capable of taking steps towards moving into work (work-related activities) immediately.

 

What are the main differences between the work-related activity group and the support group?

 

The major differences are that:

  • ESA work-related activity group members have to attend work-focused interviews and undertake work-related activities, such as training or condition management programmes, but support group members do not;
  • ESA work-related activity group members get less money because the work-related activity component is paid at a lower rate than the support component;
  • if the government introduce a proposed one year limit on claiming contributory ESA, this will apply to members of the work-related activity group, but not to members of the support group.

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Being recognised as being disabled under the Disability and Equality act happens when you fit the criteria [ie. have a physical or mental/neurological condition that has or is likely to last 12 months or longer.]

 

If you fit that criteria then you can ask for "reasonable adjustments" to be made by your current [and I would assume potential future] employer. HOW it is decided what reasonable adjustments are needed is not clear. In my brother's case he has seen his GP and his GP has written a very strongly worded letter stating that he should not work additional hours [additonal hours/overtime are part of his contract of employment]. The GP has also said he should not work shifts that include any night shift element.

 

This is because he has a mental health problem that is on-going and currently managed, but has caused two occasions of him being out of work for over 12 months, and which does not respond to medication.

 

His employer has already known about these difficulties for years, but because he did not "stake a claim" of being eligible for reasonable adjustments under the DEA, his employer has not automatically provided any, or even asked if he needed any. So you have to be pro-active yourself and provide evidence to your employer [or potential employer] of the limitations of your disability.

 

Other organisations will have different criteria.

 

That is what makes it all so complicated. Getting DLA doesn't automatically lead to being recognised as eligible for reasonable adjustments under the Disability and Equalities Act - and it is all rather confusing, so i'm not surprised that the very people that should be registering themselves are not, or don't even know they can.

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Again, IF you are having to do a number of things for him ie. write his job log or any other written material, then you need to state that to those who need to know and put it in writing, otherwise they will think he is doing it. Sometimes you have to stop doing things for your child/teenager/adult - and put things in writing very firmly, for people to sit up and take notice.

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Would the OP claiming carers allowance help to strengthen her case?

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Probably make it look immediately obvious that that person needed support.

 

With my own son I am always asked if he receives DLA and at what level. It is a kind of instant way of weighing up how much support a person might need.

 

With my older sister we had difficulties getting any help or support at all because my parents would not claim anything for her. They felt it was their responsibility to look after her. But when they wanted to find independent, supported living, they found they could not get anything. So then, with help from SS because she fits the learning disability criteria, they helped complete forms for DLA etc and had a social worker etc, and they began providing life skills training and proactively looked for a suitable flat for her to live in. My sister moved out of the family home when she was 44.

 

I had instigated my parents doing this because they were getting old [now even older and my dad has died], and I felt it would be an awful situation for my sister to remain at home until both parents were dead and then she had to look after herself. She had the potential to achieve it, and with support and lots of learning, she has achieved it. Which is brilliant for her and for the rest of the family.

 

But nothing came her way UNTIL we got a benefits check for her, and then re-applied for support we had previously been turned down for. I also think it was social services that agreed that she had a learning disability.

 

And under the Disability Discrimination Act she has received "reasonable adjustments" in the past in her employment as a machinist, this involved making easier access to get materials, and for them to be placed so that she did not struggle with the weight of them, or distance to carry them, or have to twist etc [the twisting should be covered by health and safety anyway as good back care management].

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Someone can still seek to be recognised as disabled by any employer EVEN even if they don't currently get DLA. Because the Disability and Equalities Act talks about any physical or mental illness that has lasted more than 12 months. So it could be for something in the past, which is not currently affecting the individual, but if reasonable adjustments were not made, those difficulties could surface again.

 

That criteria is invaluable because it is talking about potential to become ill IF reasonable adjustments are not made. So you can look at the individuals history as well as their current physical or mental health.

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I know that if your on WRAG you will get affected some point after listening in to the houses of parliament.

 

But what if nothing suitable comes up? Surely there is a way of extending the time you are on the WRAG?

Unless you are thinking of contributions based ESA which limits people to only 1 year.

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Sally44 thanks for pointing out to me that if my depression resurfaced at work allowances should be made for it. Shame that cant apply for volunteer work. :crying:

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But what if nothing suitable comes up? Surely there is a way of extending the time you are on the WRAG?

Unless you are thinking of contributions based ESA which limits people to only 1 year.

 

this may help all of which on the DWP website -

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/MoneyTaxAndBenefits/BenefitsTaxCreditsAndOtherSupport/Illorinjured/DG_171894

http://www.dwp.gov.uk/docs/esa-changes.pdf

http://www.dwp.gov.uk/docs/esa-changes-q-and-a.pdf

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