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jordansmum33ok

ASD son has had placement in tuition centre for last 2 yrs now LEA want move him

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Hi back again,

Just received a letter from a school run by the council to say they now have a place for my son 15 and they want him to start in Sept 2012.

They have said that they will amend his statement to that school :sick:

 

My son is doing really well at his unit and has come on so much an is working towards his ocr and hopefully gcse

he has had only minor outbursts whereas prev he was having them every day and was excluded every day

until the special school said they could not meet his needs.. he has been at this unit now for 2yrs and never at any time did we think it was a temporary placement.

 

Of record im told most of the children have now been given a placement in Sept 2012 at this new school

so basically all of my sons friends..he has no other friends and is really worrying now that they are all going to be going..

 

His place now have said they dont think he will cope there and I agree 100%

any advice?

What can we do now to stop this?

If it was for my sons benefit then I would be happier but I know its due to cutbacks

its a private run unit he is at now.

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I would phone IPSEA and get advice from them.

 

What advice has this private unit given to you?

 

Is this placement named on his Statement?

 

Has he recently been re-assessed by the LA EP?

 

Has he been making progress at this Unit [sounds like it from your post, but have the unit also identified that he has made progress socially, emotionally, academically etc and do you have that on paper via IEPs, school reports, targets and programmes this unit has used?]. And I presume this private unit is not closing?

 

If this placement is named in his Statement you maybe able to use Judicial Review. This would involve you instructing a SEN Solicitor to represent your child. You pay an initial figure up front of about £350, and from that point the solicitor is working for the child and so there are no addtional fees. Judicial Review is needed when an LA is not fulfilling the Statement. So check if you can use Judicial Review because that is the cheapest option [if you have to use a solicitor].

 

If they have totally re-assessed your child and are in the process of writing up a new Statement, they have to prove via professional reports that this placement is no longer able to meet his needs or that he has not made progress there. They may argue that their new LA maintained school is a better use of their resources, but do they have the same level of therapy and qualified staff that the unit has? And a major part of your argument is going to be that he was not coping in a mainstream placement previously, to the extent that he was almost permanently excluded. And that any change in his placement is going to risk him refusing school again and/or being excluded at a time when he is near to sitting his examinations, which would be detrimental to his future prospects and life choices.

 

You would need to look at each aspect of the unit he currently attends and identify differences eg. teachers at the unit have additional qualifications on top of their teaching qualifications to teach children with ASD. The LA school does not. The Unit has SALT and OT based on site [or has a budget of xx hours per term and your son receives xx hours per week/term of SALT and OT input]. The LA school has no budget etc. The Statement SHOULD detail in terms of hours how much 1:1 SALT or OT time he gets per week. Again the LA would have to demonstrate they could provide that in the new school.

 

Do you have all the evidence in documents, letters, reports, of how he was previously within a mainstream school?

 

If you cannot use Judicial Review - and I think that option is the best one at this stage. Then the LA may amend the Statement [as they have said they will do], and then you would need to appeal that decision to SEND. At an Appeal you would need documentary evidence of how he was not coping in his previous mainstream placement as opposed to how well he has done in the unit. You would also need to demonstrate the differences in provision between the two schools. And it would also help if the Head or SENCO from the Unit attended the Tribunal to support your case.

 

Is this Unit for children of around average cognitive ability or is it for children with MLD? If it is for MLD, the LA would find it hard to win a case of moving him to a mainstream school when he was below what is typical cognitive ability for a mainstream school.

 

I would advise you immediately find out if you can use Judicial Review. Don't ask the LA about assessing him etc as that may warn them that they need to do this, and you don't want to prejudice your case. I am assuming at this stage that they are talking about amending the Statement without any evidence that an amendment is needed.

 

If you don't have the option of Judicial Review and you have to appeal to SEND, I think a Panel would be very reluctant to move him at such a crucial stage, especially if there is alot of evidence of his exclusions previously, and his behaviour and progress has been so excellent where he is.

 

Has the suggestion of amending the Statement come after an Annual Review?

Edited by Sally44

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Another aspect I am not sure about is this. If you cannot use Judicial Review [and again use this route if you can because it will be quicker and cheaper than a SEND Tribunal]. Find out from IPSEA if your son would remain at his current placement whilst an appeal was in process. I think he would, but get that confirmed.

 

If that is the case, then stretch it out as long as possible, eg. when the LA amend the Statement ask for a meeting, then when they finalise the Statement lodge your appeal just inside the time limit [i think it is 3 months, but check that too]. In that way your appeal would be lodged late August/September, and the appeal itself is usually about 3-4 months away. So your son would have to remain at the Unit for the start of the next school year in September 2012. So your hypothetical appeal would be December 2012 or January 2013. Again that makes it even less likely the Panel would agree a move half way through a school year.

 

Does the Unit go up to age 19? Does the Unit include social communication and life skills? Can the LA maintained school provide that too. [don't ask the LA, go direct to the SENCO of this school].

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Is the unit saying that they don't think he will cope at the unit without his friends, or do you mean the unit has said they don't think he would cope in the new placement?

 

If the latter, get the school to put that in writing. This Unit can write a report for you to use and they can attend the tribunal as your expert witnesses.

Edited by Sally44

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Thanks Sally the suggestion has just come out f the blue the Annual Review is in December

this is letter I received ...

 

Dear....

As you are aware, the Local Authority has made arrangements under section 319 of the Education Act for .... to be educated

other than at school at ...tution centre.

 

This arrangement was made because at the time that the Amended Final Statement was issued, we were unable to secure appropriate school provision for him.

However, the arrangement has always been considered as temporary pending the availability of an appropriate vacancy.

 

As from September 2012, there will be a new maintained special school provision in Medway.

The Blue Zone will be based at .... school and is specifically for pupils who has complex Autistic Spectrum Disorder and associated learning difficulties.

I encl details for your information.

 

Following consultation with the head of centre at the blue zone, we believe that the school can meet... needs appropriately ,and a place has been allocated with effect from September 2012.

 

A Proposed Amended Statement will be issues shortly,with the intention to name the Blue zone in part4 of an Amended Final Statement.

 

During June and July, Blue zone staff will begin to visit new pupils in there current provision to build important relationships and prepare a successful transition from September 2012.

 

 

yours sincerely SEN Assessment Manager

cc/ social worker.

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I just looked briefly through your old posts and I remember the hard time you had getting him where he is now.

 

Try to get in contact with the same people you used last time [eg. woman from KIDS], they can also testify to how difficult it was before and what a huge improvement there has been whilst he has been at the unit. So get back in touch with anyone who was supporting and helping you last time because they can also testify to how bad things were before.

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The unit he attends now have said he wouldnt cope and they are worried about him and alot of the other children that attend..I think most of

the parents there have got the same letter..the staff got it on the same day too.

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So they haven't re-assessed.

 

I would get in touch with IPSEA or network81.org and ask if you can use Judicial Review. If you can I would get that going incase they do decide to re-assess. If they do start a re-assessment you cannot use Judical Review. So get your skates on.

 

The placement named in section 4 is the placement. It doesn't mean it is temporary [or permanent for that matter]. That just means he has to go to the named placement in section 4.

 

So try JR first. If you cannot use JR come back and post an update.

 

If you can use JR, it might be worth asking the school to arrange a meeting with all the parents [because i'm sure all of them will be as worried as you are]. You could ask IPSEA to send you advice in writing via email. And if they say you can use JR you could read out their advice to the other parents - as they may have this right as well.

Edited by Sally44

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Thanks Sally the only issue with the JR is the cost involved

Im a single parent with a grandchild on the way too so there is noway I could afford the cost plus alot of the other parents are on low incomes.

I hate to say that but its true x

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Have just sent copy of letter to lady who dealt with us before from Kids.org

 

do you know how I can find previous thread on here about issues I had?

thanks x

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I would suggest you get in touch with an SEN solicitor anyway and ask them if you are eligible for legal help.

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It is also very important to get his current placements views on his progress and whether he would cope with the change.

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I am watching this one with interest.

 

As I understand it the LA can amend the statement whenever they like - and can implement the revised statement immediately. You can of course appeal but I think they have the right to change his placement immediately pending the appeal (if this is the case then it is shocking - but as I read the rules it is permitted).

 

It might be somewhat different if you went through appeal first time to get his current placement on Part 4.

 

Certainly you need to contact IPSEA or SOSSEN or the like - this needs specialist advice.

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Thanks bed,

Just heard back from solicitor and they said looks like they can take on the case

Im going to give the details to the other parents as they was all given the same letter it seems

how can they expect a child to transfer that quick?

Before when he was at primary ed they did it over a year this is going to be a few months an less

if you account the holidays.

School have said they are all in shock they got the letter on the same day.

Its cost cutting an to a unit that has no history so we wont even know if they can meet his needs or

there success rate etc..my son has gone in himself a bit already hearing the news x

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We may face this same issue - our LA is supposedly setting up a new unit next year and they think M might be an appropriate candidate. We are still going through the statement process but if we were to go for an independent placement we could face the same problems if/when that school comes on line.

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We may face this same issue - our LA is supposedly setting up a new unit next year and they think M might be an appropriate candidate. We are still going through the statement process but if we were to go for an independent placement we could face the same problems if/when that school comes on line.

 

I hope for your sakes it works out ok.

Found out today its not even finished yet..they have just finished recruiting staff too..just gets worse

Future Developments :

As from September 2012 the ..... will include brand new ASD Provision for students in the 3-19+ age range with additional SLD. The provision is due to take in about 25 students initially in KS1-5 from September 2012 and then ultimately expand to 40 students in the age range 3-25 over subsequent years.

The teaching resources will include a £1,5m new build and adaptations to current rooms on our Upper & Lower School Campus

 

Staff are currently being recruited with a clear expectation that they have the skills of our current staff team i.e. : the successful candidates will have a clear understanding about effective teaching, raising and sustaining achievement, ASD / SLD provision and care and support of complex young people.

The Teachers appointed will start in April 2012. Initially they will be involved in curriculum design in preparation for September 2012 and their teaching delivery. They will also be given further intensive training in complex ASD and the strategies to secure a caring pastoral and therapeutically supportive learning environment.

During June and July they will be joined by a team of twelve new Teaching Assistants and begin to visit the students in their current schools to build important relationships and prepare for a successful transition from September.

 

We have every intention of appointing quality individuals willing to work hard in our happy team of staff to further develop .......ASD specialist provision as an outstanding part of our well respected Special School.

 

thoughts? x

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You need to pin them down to specifics. How many teaching staff will there be. What will be the class sizes. What will be the adult:pupil ratio in the classes. What additional qualifications do the teaching staff for teaching children with autism and severe learning difficulties [does your son have severe learning difficulties?]. How many of the teaching staff have these additional qualifications.

 

Does your son receive SALT or OT input, or a social communication programme etc at his current placement? The new placement would need to provide what is in his Statement - so I hope it is all included in part 2 and 3 of his Statement?

 

As far as I know it is not so easy to move students once they are in independent placements. If mainstream has not worked, that is proven and a Panel is unlikely to agree to a pupil being moved back into mainstream. And if they did attempt an immediate move, most of the children would deteriorate and refuse school and that would be proven at tribunal.

 

As I understand it the LA have to prove that the child is not making progress at the independent school. Which is hard to prove, as usually they are making progress there - that is why they got the placement in the first place!

 

LA's can try it on. But if a placement is named, and the LA send you a letter saying they plan to change it, you can use Judicial Review which forces the LA to uphold the current Statement.

 

Maybe others on the forum have had to use JR for this very reason.

 

In my case, I made the mistake of telling my LA that I would use Judicial Review if they did not fulfill the Statement. So they decided to do a total re-assessment. Once you have received a letter from the LA saying that they are going to do a total re-assessment, you cannot use Judical Review. You have to follow the process through to Tribunal. But if the child is at an independent placement they are going to be fighting to keep the child where they are. And the LA will have a very difficult case to prove that a child that was out of school for a year [as in our case] was self harming and has an anxiety disorder and OCD is somehow going to cope with transition to a different type of school that provides less support.

 

Remember that the LA do have to prove their case.

Edited by Sally44

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Thanks Sally we are going for the appeal

solicitor is going to get a independent education psychologist to assess my son

LEA have 7 days to respond as we have requested that my son stays at his placement for now

until the tribunal x

So worried my son is suffering so much at the moment

unsure of what is coming

he has been a nightmare sleeping and keeps saying he only has couple days left

he dosent want to go in as he dont want to say goodbye :-(

as his mum im trying to reassure him but its so hard

when i dont know either

If he has to go to the other placement

he be ok cause according to him his friends are all going

but i dont think he will be.

 

He has gone in today but that was a struggle

tomorrow they have a school trip then friday is last day

then fingers crossed.. I wonder what will happen

the unit is not built yet,no visits from the staff there, no visits from

the pupils that meant to be going there.. surely this is a bad situation just waiting to happen?

 

Come Sept, there will be about 30 new kids.. all having similar issues

why did they rush this? crazy..

 

 

Spoke to his school one case has been agreed but there are about 6 others all going for appeal

he does have SALT too x

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I think you have alot of evidence of what happened before.

You have alot of evidence of how well he has been at his current placement.

Make sure you keep a daily diary of his behaviour, lack of sleep, upsets, worries etc for what is going to happen next year.

If he remains where he is after the summer break that is great. If he does not, make sure that you record each and every day he refuses to attend and each and every incident at home or anywhere else the LA try to send him.

I'm sure you think he will just refuse to attend due to anxiety.

Are Clinical Psychology or CAHMS still involved? If his anxiety and fears increase get a referal to them, and get from them in writing, what level of encouragement/force you should use to get him to comply. If he simply will not comply, then that is also useful. You just need them involved so that the LA cannot threaten you with the EWO.

 

Personally, if it goes to Tribunal, I cannot see the Panel agreeing that he should be moved from somewhere he has done so well to a placement which has been proven before, is a type of placement he cannot cope in.

 

If possible, get in writing from his current placement, their opinion that he will not cope in the placement the LA are suggesting.

Edited by Sally44

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Well had tribunal on 25th Feb and Lea apparently have broke the code of practice

the panel was very direct..asking when we was told of the placement.. why it was not on annual reveiw nov 2011

an we only found out in April 2012.. why there had not been transition period.. told LEA to get there house in order

correct the termology and do a better job of the statement.

 

I was in complete shock as one of panel members said in all her yrs she had never come across such a mess

they was considering cancelling the appeal an reverting to current prev statement where his last placement was

listed in part 4.. but LEA argued that.. they considered a Stay? and finally we agreed on an adjornment

so my son an the prev placement could attend and give more answers..ie post 16 prov

an also LEA to have the answers in why the statement appears incorrect an steps was not followed..

Its to be held in April .. I thought we had slim chance of changing prt4 an we was changing prt 2/3

so was not prepared for this.. so next time im going be taking someone from kids..

anyone else ever had this?

 

Also LEA refused to let him stay in his prev placement whilst appeal was going through which the panel found shocking.. is he in his new school illegally?

Edited by jordansmum33ok

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My understanding is that the child stays where they are UNTIL the appeal is finalised and the Panel issue their Decision. The LA have acted illegally by moving him because you have a right to appeal any change in the Statement. So I think that yes, he could be illegally placed at the moment in the new school. You need to get that clarified.

 

You need to get as much evidence in writing to demonstrate that your son has made progress where he is, and that he should stay there up until [what age do they go up to?].

 

In my first reply to your post I said:

 

"If they have totally re-assessed your child and are in the process of writing up a new Statement, they have to prove via professional reports that this placement is no longer able to meet his needs or that he has not made progress there. They may argue that their new LA maintained school is a better use of their resources, but do they have the same level of therapy and qualified staff that the unit has? And a major part of your argument is going to be that he was not coping in a mainstream placement previously, to the extent that he was almost permanently excluded. And that any change in his placement is going to risk him refusing school again and/or being excluded at a time when he is near to sitting his examinations, which would be detrimental to his future prospects and life choices."

 

Local Authorities cannot just amend Statements. They are legal documents that must be adhered to. Any change MUST come via an Annual Review or Emergency Review, and those changes must be taken from recommendations professionals have made after assessing your child. So the LA cannot increase or decrease or stop or start anything outside of that process.

 

Educational Law regarding Statements is very clear. Each and every need MUST be identified and included in part 2 of the Statement. Part 3 MUST quantify and specify provision to meet each of those needs. And Part 4 details the placement that can meet those needs and deliver the provision. The Local Authority MUST go with the parental choice of school UNLESS they can prove it is not suitable or they have their own school that they can demonstrate can meet all the needs.

 

However your situation was different. He was in a placement he was doing well in. The LA cannot move a child out of that placement unless they can prove a deterioration or lack of progress.

 

If I were you I would write to the LA saying that your son is going to go back to the placement detailed on his current Statement until the Tribunal Decision is issued. I would get that school to support your in writing to say that he will not cope in any other placement and also for them and you to detail the progress he has made with them academically, socially and emotionally. Submit all the evidence you have of how he was before this placement.

 

If there is anything in Part 2 or 3 that needs amending detail that too, and ask that the placement remains the same.

 

Has the Local Authority EP or an NHS Speech Therapist or Occupational therapist or any other professional that sees your son [ie. Clinical Psychology or CAHMS] re-assessed him?

 

I don't have experience of KIDS. Are they helping you get the Tribunal Case Statement and Working Document ready? And are they attending tribunal with you?

 

I'll post a link to a booklet that is very helpful in getting the Statement right. This is it http://www.ace-ed.org.uk/Resources/ACE/advice%20booklets/GettingTheStatementRight%20Mar2011.pdf

 

Remember that the LA cannot do whatever they want. They are bound by the law of the land which trumps any local authority school placement criteria. You and your son have rights under Educational Law, especially as he already has a Statement that names his previous school. You could have used Judicial Review if you had acted earlier. But now that opportunity has passed and you are now in the appeal process. You still have good evidence of how your son was previously [two years ago, compared to how he is now] and how he has progressed. You don't have any LA or NHS professional recommending he moves. So the LA have no evidence they can turn to to explain their decision to move him.

 

Has he deteriorated at all since being removed from the Unit? If so detail that and make sure you get a GP referal to Clinical Psychology or CAHMS to detail that deterioration and get it in writing and include that as part of your evidence that he should never have been moved.

 

If this unit has post 16 placements, then it is sensible for him to stay where he is making progress post 16, especially if he gets anxious, upset with change.

 

You really need to learn about the SEN system and process and do not automatically agree to or believe anything the LA says. Just because they are a Local Authority does not mean they are acting within their rights. They are not, as the SEND Panel have clearly said, and which has shocked you.

Edited by Sally44

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The LA are certainly ignoring the Code of Practice (no change there then) but I am not sure it is strictly "illegal" for them to move the child.

 

It appears that the relevant wording is "should" not "must" and so the provision is not obligatory - similarly the legal status of the Code of Practice is that the LA must "have regard to" so the Code of Practice itself does not have the force of law.

 

These are very fine distinctions that only a solicitor will be able to give you an accurate answer to.

 

That said if both new and old were state/maintained schools then I am not sure that they have any right to move him at all without your consent!

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This is a named special school in the child's Statement as far as I understand it. Is this "tuition Centre" as he LA like to call it named in part 4?. If it is then that placement cannot be altered on any grounds without some kind of review, some kind of assessment, some professional advice agreeing the move would be beneficial or the child or evidence that he is failing at the tuition centre. And the parents MUST have a right to appeal to SEND. That has not happened. The LA have just sent letters saying "from September 2013 your child will attend xx school." That is illegal because the Statement IS a legally binding document.

 

Is this Tuition Centre run by the LA or is it independent.

 

Has your son refused to go into the new school at all? Has his anxiety increased etc? Have you asked your GP or any Consultant involved with your son to be referred to Clinical Psychology?

 

I think you really need legal advice on this. I am not sure what a "Stay" is. Would it not have been better for SEND to have thrown out the appeal and reverted to the original Statement with the Tuition Centre named in part 4? You have to be very careful what you are agreeing to. You should not have agreed to this if you did not understand what it meant. You should have asked the Panel what it meant on the day.

Edited by Sally44

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Sorry have moved house so not much chance to get online..it seems the placement was temporary an was not an actual school so they got around it that way.the placemrnt is now registered as a school. My solicitor said it is not illegal but not the normal way to go about it as no meting was called.we have discovered that another pupil didnt even go to tribunal an lea have returned him to his private placement in light of lea realising mistakes they made with moving a num of pupils.ie my son an our case..my son attendance is 33% an no signs of improving. He finds school struture an routine tiring..an school dont seem to be able to help.he dont want part time either..tribunal is on 30th april..im tryinh get kids as ipsea may not take case.as apparantly it holds low chance of success due To Cost Difference.so Going Speak To Kids Tomorrow.

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Hi in his last annual reveiw it said no ammenfments an his prev placement was named nov 2011.. then in late may..june his new school was mentioned.ie they had a place..i called local lea but normal contact was not there.. then last letter i got was saying a place from sept 2012..his placement is independant whereas his nrew one is lea maintained. It is bssically alot more money to send him to the private one.

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It is not about money [from the tribunal point of view]. It is about 'needs' or 'difficulties' identified and provision to meet each and every one of those needs.

 

For your Tribunal I would state what the situation was like for your son and the wider family before his placement. How he has made progress at that placement. That no professional has said he should leave that placement.

 

Basically it is the LA talking about cost. But if your son will not attend their placement then it is pointless then trying to change the Statement.

 

By LAW the LA MUST go with your parental choice of placement unless they can prove that they have a better use of resources. IE. cheaper but with the same level of provision as the previous placement. That is what they are trying to do with your son. However they have no evidence at all that he would cope in that new placement.

 

Highlight differences between the two placements such as class size.

Qualifications of teachers and ASD specific approaches.

How many children at the new school have the same diagnosis as your son.

What therapy team is based on site, or how would he access therapy from SALT, OT, EP that he needs.

 

If his attendance is 33% in an ASD specific unit/school, then how do they intend to improve on that figure in a placement they do not know that he would even agree to go to?

 

Has he had any trial days or transition to this new school?

 

Also, now that you have moved, are you under a different LA?

Edited by Sally44

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That is fantastic news and a huge weight off your mind.

 

What did the Tribunal Panel say in their Decision letter? And who did you take to the Tribunal with you.

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Hi I took lady from ipsea with me but she only had the weekend to read through the file..so was lucky witrh result.

On another note am becoming increasingly worried now as we still have not had the final working document from the tribunal

my solicitor has given then 5 working days now to return it..as lea cannot issue the final statement without it.

The lea has issued pass for travel for my son and the school have given us a start date but still awaiting the final statement.

I think they are now breaking the law, im so fed up now and think i have alot of issues around my sons statement already.

Am awaiting reply from my solicitor today as to next step..anyone else had this?

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I would maybe chase up the tribunal, but not worry too much if you have the Decision in writing that he returns to his current placement. The Tribunal are not out to trick you, in the same way as some LA are. So I would just let the solicitor sort it out. You have won so they cannot go back on that.

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You have the Decision letter don't you.

 

I would suggest that you phone SEND and tell them that you still have not received the amended Statement following the Tribunals Decision letter.

 

See what their advice is. You could also phone the Local Governments Ombudsman and see if they can help at all.

 

I would suggest that having taken their advice, that you write to the LA stating that since the Tribunal Decision letter dated xx/xx/xx that you still have not received the Final Statement and ask that that is sent to you within 14 days. If that does not happen then take the action that SEND has recommended, or contact the Local Governments Ombudsman.

 

Another organisation that could give advice is IPSEA. You can book a telephone appointment now.

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