OPooh Report post Posted November 20, 2006 My son's school are just putting on his IEP that he is gifted and talented at the same time that he has been diagnosed with ASD. I just wondered if there was anyone else with any experience of this? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
oxgirl Report post Posted November 20, 2006 (edited) My son's school are just putting on his IEP that he is gifted and talented at the same time that he has been diagnosed with ASD. I just wondered if there was anyone else with any experience of this? Hi, My son is certainly gifted in some areas as well, but it's not always that useful as his abilities are very unbalanced and he is very delayed in some areas due to his AS. ASD kids can often have a particular area where they are very interested and very talented, but in some ways I'd rather he could just make a friend or pop to the shop on his own. <'> <'> ~ Mel ~ Edited November 20, 2006 by oxgirl Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
annie Report post Posted November 20, 2006 I agree with Mel. When our son was younger, we were told that he was gifted. In our experience, it was more of a hindrance. The label of gifted caused more confusion because staff couldn't get their heads around how a child so bright didn't have basic skills. It's far more important for a child to have support in improving basic skills. Annie xx Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BusyLizzie100 Report post Posted November 20, 2006 My son was initially diagnosed with Asperger syndrome by a private ed psych who did cognitive testing, which found that his Verbal Skills IQ is 134 and his Spatial Skills IQ is 87. She said he met the criteria for being Gifted, but has a huge discrepancy between what's going on in his head and what he can do physically, so he has fantastic ideas but cannot get them down on paper (his handwriting is barely legible, even he has difficulty reading it). He's nine in a fortnight. The result is that he does well enough at school, because they sort of create a balance, so the high IQ brings the low one up but the low one brings the high one down. Eh????????! I know, I confuse myself sometimes. Anyway, school are basically complacent- he's doing OK, quite well in some things and not too badly in other things, so as long as he's ticking the boxes, there's not a problem as far as they're concerned. That's not much good for my son, whose potential is just ignored. On top of that, the true extent of his difficulties is not recognised, either. I don't want to turn this into a rant about my own son, I just wanted to say that yes, it is possible to be Gifted and have ASD, although I'm sure it'll have different implications for each individual. It's good that your son's school is recognising his differing needs. Lizzie x Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Canopus Report post Posted November 20, 2006 Gifted and talented lacks precise definition in practice and is often open to interpretation by teachers. Gifted usually means sports and music, whereas talented usually means high ability in a school subject. High ability in a subject outside the school curriculum doesn't usually mean anything to teachers and LEA reps. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
OPooh Report post Posted November 20, 2006 Yes am hoping that now he has a dx of asd the school will stop ignoring stuff. Like just because he's really bright doesn't mean he can cope with them changing say a room and expecting him just to remember because they've told him once - like they would with something like maths. Is nice to find other people know how I feel - and yes I think the extreme brightness hinders friendships even further. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Minxygal Report post Posted November 20, 2006 I once knew a boy who could memorise the phonebook, line for line. I suppose he could have been labeled gifted and talented. The thing is he couldn't use that information, he couldn't pick up the phone and make a phonecall. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gladysmay Report post Posted November 21, 2006 Gifted and talented lacks precise definition in practice and is often open to interpretation by teachers. Gifted usually means sports and music, whereas talented usually means high ability in a school subject. High ability in a subject outside the school curriculum doesn't usually mean anything to teachers and LEA reps. I agree, if it fits a known criteria, and can be readily applied then it is gifted or talented, otherwise you just a nuisance! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
curra Report post Posted November 21, 2006 My son was also seen as gifted when he was younger and I still think he is , at least is very talented in some areas. But he cannot show this well at school because he learns in a different way, he prefers to stick to his own subjects, and in those subjects he likes only details and has rather inflexible ideas that don't always convice his teachers (History, Art etc). I have some doubts as to whether he will be able to reach higher education in spite of his talents unless he receives the right support. I'll be happy to see him do a job that he likes and live an independent life. Curra Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kathryn Report post Posted November 21, 2006 At my daughter's school they regularly ran a summer school for gifted and talented pupils. Access was by invitation only. Although she was extremely abe in some areas, she was never invited, possibly because she had such an uneven profile of abilities. I think most of the pupils who were selected for the week long programme of activities were good all rounders, and very sociable and popular as well. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Karen A Report post Posted November 21, 2006 Hi.Ben has a current Dx of social communication difficulties and DCD.He has a statement and significant help in school.However he is very able in some areas. Eg He has an advanced ability in reading and the vocabulary of a 16-21 year old.He is 8.Although there is nothing on the statement to say he is gifted or talented there is a recognition that he needs to be provided with work in line with his ability.The school also try to enable Ben to have oppurtunities to use the strengths he has.Ben is now able to work in the top groups in numeracy and literacy with TA support when needed.It is working very well for him.Karen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
OPooh Report post Posted November 22, 2006 Karen that sounds very positive. How did they enable the opportunities to happen? My son is been put in the top maths grp in the school at the moment. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
barefoot wend Report post Posted November 22, 2006 A number of schools have a 'Gifted and Talented Register'. Those children who excel in specific areas are noted and should be provided with extension work to challenge their capabilities. Of course this can be a double-edged sword as some children realise that they are being given harder work than their peers and resent it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Canopus Report post Posted November 22, 2006 At my daughter's school they regularly ran a summer school for gifted and talented pupils. Access was by invitation only. Although she was extremely abe in some areas, she was never invited, possibly because she had such an uneven profile of abilities. I think most of the pupils who were selected for the week long programme of activities were good all rounders, and very sociable and popular as well. Funny you mention this. A summer school for gifted and talented kids existed in my area during 1988 to 1990 that was only open to invitation. A couple of kids from my junior school attended but I wasn't invited. My parents suspected that the organisers preferred to select kids who worked hard, behaved well, and were good all rounders rather than kids who were experts in a few areas but had a chequered track record at school. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
OPooh Report post Posted November 22, 2006 Ironically I know my son is allowed in the year above maths group because they know how to get him to behave well whilst another able lad is kept behind for "behaviour" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pepper Report post Posted November 24, 2006 hiya Opooh, just noticed thread, Im not sure how old your child is but mine was DX at 11 - 1st year of senior school, and after the 1st fraught year of settling in was also added to the schools gifted register but it isnt added to IEP. He is now 14 at a mainstream Grammar school with 4% SEN That may be because hes at a grammar school - that I feel my son is coping well, as all pupils are expected to attain to high levels ( so thats at least one issue solved - no bullying because of ability) I personally have found that streaming works very well and in the main the boys at his school are very well behaved and teachers seem able to give a little more one on one for kids needing extra attention, for example, my lad struggles to write coherant notes in homework diary, so teachers can find time to double check he has correct information in diary so we can do homework....generally In my area I was aware that my local comprehensive has a excellant reputation with SEN and many facilities, ie many LSA but when I looked closely, they seemed to be in the lower sets and generally helping class, if son was streamed there he would have had no LSA anyway. There is also a school here with an AS unit, but again, it isnt suitable for my son and he seems able enough to cope with mainstream with little support ( touch wood so far) Again, as many mums have pointed out - academic ability is sometimes a hindrance, the expectation that as he's so bright - he can follow verbal requests is presumed and causes much difficuty...and although my son has an IEP I'm not sure many teachers understand his precise needs. As the senco said to me, they have a few children with AS in each year but every single one presents differently and has unique needs and teachers have to use different stratagies individual to each child Ironically my sons gifted ability seems wholy dependant on his teacher that year? for example Math /Physics / Latin / ICT were strongest subjects last year, this year its Maths / English / Biology /Chemisty and its all down to who his teacher is..... On the gifted ability front - I know some schools do the UK Maths challenge run by NAGLY and my lad got aded to the UK register from that. From reading the paperwork a parent can apply and my son really loves it as you can access forums online and speak to likeminded children, he has far more freinds online than in person so I have found the WWW to be a godsend for him as well as me for socialising LOL sorry if I seem to be writing a monologue about my child ! but was offering a personal viewpoint about 'gifted/able' an teh only familiarity I have is our family experiences xx pep Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Canopus Report post Posted November 24, 2006 A number of schools have a 'Gifted and Talented Register'. Those children who excel in specific areas are noted and should be provided with extension work to challenge their capabilities. Of course this can be a double-edged sword as some children realise that they are being given harder work than their peers and resent it. Most kids would enjoy work that they find challenging as opposed to the crushing boredom of work that is too trivial for them. A G&T kid who is given more advanced work often feels that they are a cut above the rest. Therefore, I doubt that many G&T kids would resent being given more advanced work. There was some mention of broadening the subject rather than giving G&T kids more advanced work. This is an approach that many schools have used in the past, although it is often done to the advantage of the teacher rather than the kids. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LKS Report post Posted November 24, 2006 We received a letter home yesterday re my ds to say that 'he has met the eligibility criteria for enrolling into NAGTY (The national academy for gifted and talented youth) We presumed it was because of the high standard of his work in History as most of his other subjects he is not so good at. The G&T co-ordinator e-mailed me today to say that he had been put forward because of a very high score he had achieved in some verbal test, she didn't specify what this was. She said that at the moment 10% of each year group are meeting the criteria for NAGTY and this is entirely separate to the Gifted and talented regiter that the school keep Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Karen A Report post Posted November 25, 2006 Karen that sounds very positive. How did they enable the opportunities to happen? My son is been put in the top maths grp in the school at the moment. Sorry I have not been around for a few days to answer.I can give a couple of examples.Ben played the part of a news link person in his class assembley-a part that suited his style and abilities.He also helps with the scoring in class maths challenge.He helps others at computer club as he is very able in ICT. The fact that Ben is recognised by other children for his skills in some areas has helped him to come to terms with his difficulties with things like football.Karen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nvapid Report post Posted November 28, 2006 Gifted and Talented is a VERY HIGHLY DESIRED LABEL!!! recent governmenrt inititatives creating a partnership with NAGTY based on the 11+ test scores - this is now being used to rank children in year groups. this is a recognition that is absolutely essential to your child's education. ASD kids are above average intelligence - but with limited capabilitites of comunicvation. Also - they bore VERY easily. When bored they create distractions. Then get sanctioned and their education suffers and they get limited teaching time hense poor base skills. It is the teachers who thought our children were slow, lazy and subinteligent in the first plae that got our hildren where they are today... More importantly NAGTY is a government recoginsed organisation which you can use to say - Stop treating my kid like he/she is an idiot! It also says my child is smart - but has no base skills - and clearly lays the blame in the teacher's lap. Even better! NAGTY is focused on the children. My dd is a memeber and has had more support from the other children (every one i have met so far has had an SpLD!) and is now happier with her dx and has made friends for the first time! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
oxgirl Report post Posted November 28, 2006 We received a letter home yesterday re my ds to say that 'he has met the eligibility criteria for enrolling into NAGTY (The national academy for gifted and talented youth) We presumed it was because of the high standard of his work in History as most of his other subjects he is not so good at. The G&T co-ordinator e-mailed me today to say that he had been put forward because of a very high score he had achieved in some verbal test, she didn't specify what this was. She said that at the moment 10% of each year group are meeting the criteria for NAGTY and this is entirely separate to the Gifted and talented regiter that the school keep How do you get your child recognized as being G & T, my son certainly is in science but not much else! ~ Mel ~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Canopus Report post Posted November 29, 2006 How do you get your child recognized as being G & T, my son certainly is in science but not much else! By convincing the teachers. My parents tried to get me recognised as G&T but the school wasn't convinced. I had a sneaky suspicion that my reluctance to do written work was letting me down because the teachers didn't have much concrete information to get me recognised as G&T. Perhaps you could have a meeting with the head of science about the matter. They will probably be better at spotting talent than a typical KS3 science teacher. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
OPooh Report post Posted November 29, 2006 Thanks for the replies.I think it was the results of his CATs that did it...means nothing to me lol. Pepper that was really insightful. My son is 10 next month and am considering entering him into the top grammar school in the area...that's made me feel even more that it is right for him. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
oxgirl Report post Posted November 29, 2006 By convincing the teachers. My parents tried to get me recognised as G&T but the school wasn't convinced. I had a sneaky suspicion that my reluctance to do written work was letting me down because the teachers didn't have much concrete information to get me recognised as G&T. Perhaps you could have a meeting with the head of science about the matter. They will probably be better at spotting talent than a typical KS3 science teacher. Cheers Canopus. Think I'll look into this. ~ Mel ~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites