Teachers treating Autism as an excuse

[Cynical]

Have you read this?

[shamu]

I'm horrified

And the LEA wonder why I'm so adamant I want to push for a Special School placement for DS

Shamu

[Bagpuss]

That makes scary reading, especially that many have agreed with it I don't understand why someone would chose to teach with an attitude like that...surely if you feel you are only dealing with crowd control and babysitting, and many of these disabilities are used as an excuse, why not change profession.........it must dishearten all the really wonderful teachers out there

[pearl]

He didn't even spell it correctly

[krystaltps]

Really upset by this one. Have emailed the offending person. This is what I wrote...

 

ASPERGERS - if you check a dictionary, you will find that this is how it is spelled. How embarassing for you. Have you heard of inclusion, have you lived with a child on the autistic spectrum for 8 years, do you teach special needs? Please do not tar them all with the same brush, and please do not subject others to your uneducated and inexperienced opinions. If you looked into Aspergers Syndrome, you would learn that the majority of these children do sit still in class, are eager to learn and can, with encouragement, sensitivity and support, make extremely valuable contributions to society and academia. Their problems lie in the playground where they are bullied, or on the sports field, where they struggle to understand the rules of this social interaction. My son is a very brave, polite and gifted little boy, as are the children I teach. I have found your comments hugely offensive and very damaging to the reputation of our wonderful profession. If you dislike it so much, have a career change - before you do some serious damage to these vulnerable children.

Regards,

 

FUMING

[elun1]

Brilliant reply!!

That person should surely leave teaching. My heart goes out to all the children in his classes

[baddad]

One of the biggest problems with this kind of oversimplified BS is the horrible and uncomfortable truth that there is a SMALL amount of substance to it, and grains of sand like that will always be grabbed and exaggerated, and expanded out of proportion by some. ADHD is overdiagnosed, no doubt about it, and it is bandied about as a 'home' diagnosis for just about every poorly disciplined and undercontrolled child who are not provided with basic continuity of care and consequences to their behaviour. The same happened with dyslexia a couple of decades earlier, and, to my mind is already begining to happen with AS.

There are some parents who rally against every attempt to discipline their children as inappropriate or an imposition on their rights and any intervention to stop behaviours that have a negative impact on others as a challenge to individual rights of expression.

 

At the same there is another really negative sets of associations beginning to emerge where undesirable characteristics in the general population (selfishness, lack of manners or consideration, lack of commitment, arrogance, rudeness.......) are labelled as 'autistic' behaviours while any positives that can be present (determination, commitment, loyalty, morality, perseverence) are viewed as the pinnacle of NT 'personal skills'...

 

There's one other thing that's really damaging (IMHO) too, and that's this 'special' label that gets applied to people on the spectrum and to the people who care for them. I was not 'blessed by god' with one of his special angels to care for because he knew I was the 'right person for the job', and my son wasn't blessed with a special parent who is skilled above all others to care for him and provide for his needs....

 

Now none of that should be taken as me suggesting that the person who wrote this stuff is right (though I suspect elements of what I have posted may be taken out of context to mean exactly that), because he's not - he's talking out of his hat! What i do think, though, is a flatline response denying the occassional truth of his observations is as damaging in the long term, because that inconsistency will be grabbed upon and turned against the very people we seek to defend. You can't put something right without acknowledging there's a 'wrong', and while Mr C is 'wrong' it is equally wrong to dismiss the things he has said out of hand; and two wrongs have never made a right in my book...

 

L&P

 

 

 

BD

Edited June 23, 2007 by baddad

[David Matthew Baker]

Urgh!! That article annoys me. Going to take a bit of time and come up with a reply. After all I presently work in a inner city mainstream school which has a lot of problems with attendance and behaviour. However the majority of this is rarely caused by the children who have a diagnosis. Some times the situation gets worse because of them but that is normally because the teacher doesn't get the class under control quick enough. Or when they do step out of line tackle them in an effective manor that stops things degrading further. There is also a question of suitable support been provided in lesson. I can think of a couple of kids as examples who are fine if there is support in the class to help remind them how to act but wreck classes where the support isn't available. Nomally again though when you talk to the teachers and get them to tell you the sequence of events you find the trouble began else where and they just got distracted by it and then ended up causing trouble themselves. Will think about this some more a right a reply later. I think I'll end it with helping those types of children is one reason I find education interesting and beneficial.

[Wicce]

That's really quite frightening. My son's about to lose his place in a specialist unit because they think he can cope with mainstream school - and this kind of teacher might well be what he's up against.

[bid]

OK, first of all, please don't lose sight of the number of teachers posting who are disagreeing with the original poster.

 

Second, in my experience most teachers are too busy to post on forums (my DH has been working on his laptop for the last hour or so, and he'll work most of today and tomorrow too). So, I don't think forums like this are necessarily particularly representative of teachers as a whole (a bit like s*x surveys: they are only representative of the kind of people who would get involved in something like that in the first place! ).

 

Last of all, having a dx doesn't mean that kids with SEN can't sometimes be naughty and downright unpleasant some, or even most, of the time, just like NT kids. It's also true that sometimes parents of kids with genuine SEN can have poor parenting skills too, and have a kid who has challenging behaviour that isn't related to that dx. As BD so rightly said, we aren't particularly 'special' parents, we're a mix just like 'normie' parents.

 

Bid

[mrs fussy]

Hi I am disgusted by this but am not suprised as i think this teacher could possibly work in my sons school , and the unfortunate thing is all the teachers he has to look forward to have the same attitude. I would like to add though that during the first 3 years of my sons schooling(at the same school) the teaching staff were wonderful, and if i get the chance (before my son is permanently excluded, as i think this is what will happen if his lack of support continues)i will personally thank them its just a pity theres not more like them eh! A frustrated and downtrodden Mrs F x

[barefoot wend]

It is pretty sad but the guy obviously looks to be contentious as he has books to sell.

 

Mrs Fussy

 

Sounds like you're going through a pretty bad time at present. Hope things work out for you.

 

Regards

 

Barefoot

[Clare63]

I think this teacher should be struck off or what ever they do in education, the children he teaches are bullied and abused by him, his attitude stinks and I wonder how this is reflected to his colleagues and pupils.....he needs to be got rid of and dam quick !

[elun1]

Just had a read through some of the replies to the post by that teacher. What a mix of views! They seem to be mostly from secondary school teachers I think whereas I'm a primary teacher and I honestly have not come across such extreme attitudes as these. Some were particularly damning of inclusion and only seemed to want to teach children without any issues!! So unrealistic! Also very worrying for the parents of these children. Personally I'm against inclusion for my own son as he is so severely autistic and could not access the mainstream curriculum but if he was AS I would EXPECT him to be catered for as a Unit placement would most certainly not be available in our area. In my experience so far there is little truth at all in the claims of this man. Yes some parents TRY to stick a label on their child to excuse poor behaviour but most parents who can't be bothered with their kids don't go to these lengths. If they do the school tends to spot them. By the way Baddad in this area (I wouldn't pretend to know about anywhere else) ADHD is most certainly not over diagnosed: the opposite is the case. This is a very difficult issue for parents of children with this disorder to come to terms with. In fact at school at the moment we have 2 families struggling with this very issue. I feel really sorry for them and so do the rest of the staff. An ASD diagnosis is also very difficult to get, particularly for children who present at the higher functioning end of the spectrum.

One point which did ring a bell in some of the replies though was the comment about lack of teacher training re. ALN. I did a PGCE (the one year teacher training course) and had 3 lectures on SEN. Disgraceful really and that needs to change if it hasn't already

Elun

[David Matthew Baker]

Argh!!! Just read some of his other posts. He seems to have a very narrow view point on most things. He looks to be a teacher who is stuck in his ways and just can't face change. Probably the type who wouldn't let me in his class room because the students obviously don't need my support (yes this does happen!). Worse he seems to be a scientist and his negative view points are very ill informed. He complains about the changes to the science curriculum. Most teachers I've talked to think it is a lot better and I agree with them. Had to comment on various of his posts. Urgh! I feel really sorry for any students in his class.

[Bullet]

Is this person really a teacher? I got the sense that it wasn't, call it a gut feeling if you like.

I am tempted to reply as a parent of someone on the spectrum and as someone on the spectrum themselves and set a few matters straight, but I doubt he'd pay any attention.

[madme]

I have to say that I disagree that ADHD is over diagnosed- as it certainly isn't in our area. To get my son's dx he was seen by a leading team and dx under the ICD10 criteria as Hyperkinetic disorder. His Aspergers was diagnosed by yet a different team as was the dyspraxia. I dont feel that dyslexia is or has been over diagnosed either. I see children in my daughters school who clearly have it but no dx. There are quite a lot with clear signs of dyspraxia but no dx. Adhd is a very real condition that has a huge impact on my child's life. These days he is much quieter and self restrained. Many would find it hard to see his difficulties but his teachers do- how despite his very high Iq and motivation he finds sometimes that he just cannot sit still or concentrate. How he finds it impossible to cross the road or will just run out even at the age of 11.

However there may be parents who have self dx their child. I met one recently who claimed to have a former ADHD child who she had cured. The reality was that she had self dx.

I'm also offended by the suggestion that only those with "severe" autism should be entitled to the label and hence understanding and support. I haven't jumped on any bandwagon. I was thrown there by circumstances.

[elun1]

<'> Totally agree. A diagnosis of ADHD is extremely difficult to get in our area too. Two lovely caring families at the school where I work are seeking diagnosis for their children and it's not going at all well for them. This adds even more stress to their hugely difficult lives. My ds2 is severely autistic and got a diagnosis very quickly. However ds1 who has many aspergers traits and actually struggles more socially than ds2 becauses he's EXPECTED to get on with other people would never get diagnosis - I'm almost sure of it. Most people living our lives would never want to jump on any bandwagon - in fact I'd give anything to jump off it if I had a choice!

Elun xx

[LizK]

I don't know whether ADHD is overdiagnosed but it is sometimes wrongly diagnosed or used as a label by parents to excuse poor behaviour without ever been given a formal diagnosis. But it does most definitely exist and ill informed bigoted articles like that where an element of truth is magnified into a massive generalisation is so harmful and hurtful to those who do have ADHD.

 

The author of that blog also forgot to mention the effect of bad teaching on the behaviour of the students..............

 

Lx

[bid]

Driven to reply!

 

Bid

[pearl]

Me too! Your reply was v good David

[David Matthew Baker]

Urgh!!! One of our teachers today ended up sounding like this one. Going on about all these made up conditions. Luckily it was to one of the other support assistants (the one I get on best with) who managed to show restraint and just made a quick exit. I expect after the day I've had he'd have ended up with a few choice things to chew over. Been rushed off my feet today and found out that after I'd said to a teacher I could be there to support a certain student and got turned away because 'he isn't a problem'. That student and that teacher had a falling out. Other support assistant wasn't happy either as I was in his lessons as a favour to her as she thought he was likely to struggle at some point in the afternoon. Annoyingly have to work with a few teachers who think they know best and won't accept support in lesson. One just has me do 'word shark' every lesson with a child at a time. Apparently it is meant to help but I feel like a spare part whenever their on it. Occasionally have to help if PC breaks but that is it. Barely feels like good use of my time.

 

Sorry rant over.

[PinkSapphire]

I have answered a few times on this thread, I try not to bet keep getting drawn in

[pearl]

I'm going to stop reading it now. Its horribly upsetting.

[Bagpuss]

I went and had another look, felt quite sickened by it, won't be revisiting.

[Clare63]

Seeing Pearls & BPs post above I don't think I can face another look, I can only guess.

[Mumble]

Oooh, I've stayed well clear of this one because I could end up getting into horrible misunderstood arguments. Just wanted to ask one thing - are the comments by 'anonymous' all the same person, or is this attached to every poster without a name?

 

The 'anonymous' poster nearer the bottom at 12:14 made me shake with anger. That teacher was just very lucky they weren't anywhere near me in spouting that opinion - I'm not a violent person at all (in fact I actively seek to avoid violence) but that could have brought out a very nasty side in me Is it any wonder I'm too scared to disclose my Asperger's? How have we managed to get and to perpetuate such ignorance in this world?

 

Angry Mumble

[PinkSapphire]

When you post a comment on there it gives you the choice of being annon or giving your name.

[Canopus]

The 'anonymous' poster nearer the bottom at 12:14 made me shake with anger. That teacher was just very lucky they weren't anywhere near me in spouting that opinion - I'm not a violent person at all (in fact I actively seek to avoid violence) but that could have brought out a very nasty side in me rant.gif rant.gif rant.gif beatup.gif beatup.gif Is it any wonder I'm too scared to disclose my Asperger's? How have we managed to get and to perpetuate such ignorance in this world?

 

I'm wondering if it's the teacher from my secondary school who told my parents at a meeting that it is pointless for me to bother taking GCSE exams, despite my intellect, because no employer would ever want to go near me with my attitude. He also refused to take my parents seriously when they stated that I wanted to work with computers.

[pearl]

Thats why I've stopped reading, such ignorance & vitriol, I cant bear it. The ones who say AS people are unemployable have clearly chosen to ignore my one & only post. (Basically, I stated how well JP did in mainstream, culminating in his apprenticeship, & said how glad I was that teachers like Mr Chalk were few & far between in his school)

[Pippin]

Just had a quick look through (avoiding anything toooooo confrontational) and I loved the comment from one person..

 

"If you're not willing to go the extra mile for a child then you're not fit to be a teacher"

[madme]

Couldnt resist posting. God help our children with such ignorant attitudes.