Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
oxgirl

Jay made quite alarming comment .......

Recommended Posts

Jay said something quite alarming to me the other day, it was totally out of the blue and I feel a bit disturbed by it. Could be nothing and totally 'normal' teenage bravado, but just thought I'd run it past you guys, as didn't know who else to discuss it with.

 

We were watching a programme about reptiles and they were talking about the female being in charge. So, I turned to Jay and made a jokey comment along the lines of, 'yep, the girls are in charge, get used to it kid', that kind of a thing. He said, 'Yeah, well, I could stab you with a knife and you couldn't stop me'!! :unsure::o

 

I dunno, you'll have to tell me if I'm over-reacting, but it was just so out-of-the-blue, I haven't a clue where it came from! He didn't say it in a menacing or threatening way, or anything, he doesn't have those elements in his repertoire, he didn't look at me when he said it and didn't change his facial expression or anything, he just said it very matter-of-factly. I said something about that not being a very nice thing to say and we continued to watch the programme as if nothing had happened, but it's been playing on my mind and I don't know what to make of it. He's not a violent person or threatening in any way, he's totally innocent, it's just that he's never said anything like that before. :tearful:

 

Can anyone reassure me about it??!! :unsure:

 

~ Mel ~

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'd kinda assume, with knowing Jay, that he's not realising the full implication of his comment. Maybe he doesn't understand what a serious action this would be, and could be thinking of it as a flippant, throwaway remark, without thinking through the consequences. If he has shown no sign of violence, I'd not be overly worried. I would try to help him understand that he can't make comments like that, because if he says it someone else, they may take it seriously, but you seem to have done that already Mel. >:D<<'>

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, I kind of thought he was just being flippant, but it just seemed such a strange thing to say. Maybe he was attempting to make a sort of joke and it just backfired a bit. Guess I just wondered if there might be some sort of repressed aggression or something, probably reading too much into it. >:D<<'>

 

~ Mel ~

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

since my son has been going through a very strange phase this last few months, he has made very similar comments to me, he is 12. Like you I havnt discussed this with anyone, till now!!! but he has lately, when I have told him off, made the exact same comment.

 

Enid

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
since my son has been going through a very strange phase this last few months, he has made very similar comments to me, he is 12. Like you I havnt discussed this with anyone, till now!!! but he has lately, when I have told him off, made the exact same comment.

 

Enid

 

 

Maybe it's a puberty thing, Enid, testing the water and getting bolder, maybe? I guess it's only words to them, maybe they don't realize the impact of what they're saying.

 

We were listening to the radio the other day as well, a news item about the teenagers in Wales commiting suicide and it was saying about low self-esteem. Suddenly, he just piped up, 'I've got low self-esteem, maybe I should commit suicide', totally normal voice, no upset or emotion at all. I said, keeping it light, 'yeah, well, then you'd be dead, you don't want to be dead, do you?' and he said, 'naaaaaaaaahhhhhhh'. I suppose I should feel glad that he's willing to say these things out in the open to me and air them!? :unsure:

 

~ Mel ~

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hiya - I don't think you need worry too much - You've explained to him why it's not a nice thing to say >:D<<'>

 

My son who's 8 makes similar comments, he says them very flippently, and I think it's when he thinks he's being funny - but he doesn't realise that what he says isn't funny - I don't know bout yr son but mine never particularly changes his tone of voice or facial expression when he talks so it's always quite hard to tell when he thinks he is making a joke.

 

I just remind him everytime he says something of that nature why it's not a nice thing to say etc

 

>:D<<'>

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It sounds like a joke, just not a very good one.

When B does this sort of thing, i don't ignore it, I extend the conversation and the 'joke' so that through a longer conversation, I can pick up what he really meant.

Sort of along these lines..

 

" We were watching a programme about reptiles and they were talking about the female being in charge. So, I turned to Jay and made a jokey comment along the lines of, 'yep, the girls are in charge, get used to it kid', that kind of a thing. He said, 'Yeah, well, I could stab you with a knife and you couldn't stop me'!! "

' I'd just have to tickle you with my amazing extendable tickling sticks like this...and tie you up whilst you were helpless ( This is B and me, I have no idea how J would react!) Then I tickle him, and he tries to either wrestle his way out or slime me with toxic spit...oh you get the picture.

The point being that if he's serious about something, he'll just say 'STOP BEING SO ANNOYING YOU SILLY WOMAN'

and then we can have a different conversation. Our children, NT and ASD, try ideas and questions out on us because we are safe, our responses are predictable and familiar. So I wouldn't worry if B said something like that to me, if he was serious rather than just joking, I'd listen to what he said and ask for more explanation of why.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks everyone, I feel better about this now. >:D<<'>

 

Yep, I think you're right, Bard and, yep, I do have similar kinds of jokey conversations with Jay in the way that you're describing, maybe he thought that is what he was doing but wasn't getting it quite right. If he has some Smarties or something, I'll say in a weedling voice, 'gis one' and he'll say, 'no, they're mine', 'gis one or I'll beat you up and nick the lot off you', I'll say in an exagerated voice, growling and shaking my fists at him. 'Then I'll have to phone Childline', he'll say, trying not to laugh. I'll then put on a whining voice and say, 'oooooooo, Childline, my mum nicked my Smaaaaaarrrrrrrrties' and we'll laugh. Oooooops, now I know where he gets it from!! I'm officially a bad influence! :whistle::ph34r::lol:

 

~ Mel ~

Edited by oxgirl

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Thanks everyone, I feel better about this now. >:D<<'>

 

Yep, I think you're right, Bard and, yep, I do have similar kinds of jokey conversations with Jay in the way that you're describing, maybe he thought that is what he was doing but wasn't getting it quite right. If he has some Smarties or something, I'll say in a weedling voice, 'gis one' and he'll say, 'no, they're mine', 'gis one or I'll beat you up and nick the lot off you', I'll say in an exagerated voice, growling and shaking my fists at him. 'Then I'll have to phone Childline', he'll say, trying not to laugh. I'll then put on a whining voice and say, 'oooooooo, Childline, my mum nicked my Smaaaaaarrrrrrrrties' and we'll laugh. Oooooops, now I know where he gets it from!! I'm officially a bad influence! :whistle::ph34r::lol:

 

~ Mel ~

 

:thumbs::) this made me laugh! (and I agree with other posters, it sounds like you have a good relationship, and it was prob a joke).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My son when he was younger was referred to an ed psych because the schoolteacher had stated he was obessed by the macabre and knives etc.

 

My son actually refused to attend and sat on the steps outside the consulting room and we were interviewed instead. The ed psych dismissed the reference to the macabre and knives and then went onto interview us.

 

What came out of it was that he thought our son "dumped" all of his frustration and problems on his mum, it would all come out just before he went to bed. The advice given was for us not to take on board his problems by trying to get him to solve them himself and that this was a normal part of life.

 

We were also asked did we want to push my son academically or to go for a social child and we chose the social child. The ed psych warned us that we would have trouble with his school by choosing this option which we did (my son actually refused to be treated any different than the other children especially when he was singled out as special needs). It was very important for my son to be treated as all the other children and we agreed with him on this but this was something the school seemed unable to deliver.

 

The school saw it as parents refusing help for their child and we argued that my son and we saw his personal wellbeing more important at this stage. We were eventually asked to attend a meeting and questioned about our "refusal" to allow them to help our son and we argued we weren't refusing help just rather the way they were identifying my son as "not normal". In the end we demonstrated our point that it was all about how they delivered it when we explained we were paying for private help, help that they could not deliver.

 

This meeting seemed to be the turning point and they accepted my son and our point of view.

 

He now has a masters degree and wants to do a Phd which is a great statement to his own personal endevours. I know there are others on the forum who have also attained high educational achievements which is great for the AS world by showing that they may have AS but it doesn't mean they are not intelligent. The hard work, dedication and committment etc that lies behind these qualifications is awe inspiring and I believe its not recognised by the university as to how much more effort is needed by AS students.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
My son when he was younger was referred to an ed psych because the schoolteacher had stated he was obessed by the macabre and knives etc.

 

My son actually refused to attend and sat on the steps outside the consulting room and we were interviewed instead. The ed psych dismissed the reference to the macabre and knives and then went onto interview us.

 

What came out of it was that he thought our son "dumped" all of his frustration and problems on his mum, it would all come out just before he went to bed. The advice given was for us not to take on board his problems by trying to get him to solve them himself and that this was a normal part of life.

 

We were also asked did we want to push my son academically or to go for a social child and we chose the social child. The ed psych warned us that we would have trouble with his school by choosing this option which we did (my son actually refused to be treated any different than the other children especially when he was singled out as special needs). It was very important for my son to be treated as all the other children and we agreed with him on this but this was something the school seemed unable to deliver.

 

The school saw it as parents refusing help for their child and we argued that my son and we saw his personal wellbeing more important at this stage. We were eventually asked to attend a meeting and questioned about our "refusal" to allow them to help our son and we argued we weren't refusing help just rather the way they were identifying my son as "not normal". In the end we demonstrated our point that it was all about how they delivered it when we explained we were paying for private help, help that they could not deliver.

 

This meeting seemed to be the turning point and they accepted my son and our point of view.

 

He now has a masters degree and wants to do a Phd which is a great statement to his own personal endevours. I know there are others on the forum who have also attained high educational achievements which is great for the AS world by showing that they may have AS but it doesn't mean they are not intelligent. The hard work, dedication and committment etc that lies behind these qualifications is awe inspiring and I believe its not recognised by the university as to how much more effort is needed by AS students.

(Edit : cos I pressed the button too quickly and didn't post anything!!)

 

I found these comments very interesting. My ds over the last year or so (hes 9 1/2) frequently tells me he wishes I was dead or will stab me or get a gun and shoot me. So Oxgirl you are not alone at all here. I have tried to break the habit he has - he just throws in this sort of comment at inappropriate times. Sometimes I can see it coming - other times we are having a nice time and all of a sudden something goes wrong and there it is - I've got a knife in my back or gun to my head. I am really worried of course that it will only ever be in his mind. I found Kinda's comments interested because what I have come to realise over the last year is that the comments are 99 percent of the time directed at me. As is the physical abuse. It would seem that my ds has chosen me to take out his frustrations upon in whatever way they manifest themselves. Yesterday at the dreaded shoe shop when they didn't have his size - it was me that was evil, a bi**h, should be dead etc etc and me who got the kick punch and bite. When we went to the next shop and found some that fitted and he liked (big red shiny ones like Ronaldo wears!) he could not be more sorry (which I was pleased about - at least he knew he was wrong) but he also explained he couldn't help it - he just lost control. I'm not sure these comments are "flippant" in the full sense - they seem to me to be a sign of and symptom perhaps of frustration. I also agree Kinda that I would rather my child concentrate on his social abilities not academic ones - but I just can't get his school to get their priorities right. Hardly surprising really when a persons worth in this Country is determined by how many qualifications they have and not whether they are a nice person.

Edited by KateBall

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
We were also asked did we want to push my son academically or to go for a social child and we chose the social child. The ed psych warned us that we would have trouble with his school by choosing this option which we did (my son actually refused to be treated any different than the other children especially when he was singled out as special needs). It was very important for my son to be treated as all the other children and we agreed with him on this but this was something the school seemed unable to deliver.

 

I find it very worrying that parents are still being given the stark either or choice between academic excellence and social skills for their kids in this day and age. Back in the 80s and early 90s, almost all institutions for kids of high academic ability couldn't provide services for SEN, and almost all institutions for SEN couldn't offer an academic curriculum above basic primary school level. There have been tremendous advances in knowledge of SEN and AS since then, so it should quite easily be possible to combine a high level academic system with one that also provides the right social skills training for kids with AS.

 

It isn't possible for someone with AS to ever lead a conventional childhood or teenage life, so parents and professionals should avoid trying to force or mould AS kids into being like conventional NT kids because it just won't work and will probably cause serious long term damage to them. Most social skills training currently offered to kids with AS focuses excessively on social skills for childhood and teenage life and is more appropriate for EBD than AS. Instead, social skills training for kids with AS should focus more on the right sort of social skills training for life as an adult as it will have a much greater long term positive effect. It should also emphasise developing a nice pleasant person as opposed to fitting in with popular youth culture and acquiring the social skills to survive "playground politics". Kids with AS benefit more from having a few good friends who respect them and their quirks, than a large number of acquaintances many of which are hostile towards them.

 

Most kids with AS have a high academic ability in certain subjects and this should be supported strongly and not marginalised in favour of social skills or fitting in with the National Curriculum. I personally consider the suppression of high academic abilities by parents or the education system for both NT or AS kids as nothing short of criminal. If the education system won't provide support for high academic abilities, then parents should make provisions for them outside of the system. In contrast, many kids with AS struggle with certain subjects and often parents get very upset and uptight about it. Unless the kid themself wants to do better, or the low ability is going to seriously impair everyday life or subjects they are good at, then the best course of action is to sod it and tell the school you don't care if they fail. It is much better for kids with AS (and probably NT kids as well) to do well and succeed in what they are good at rather than become good or average all rounders.

 

There are almost no kids with AS who have the gift of the gab to be the next Richard Branson, or succeed in a career based around a high level of social prowess with little academic knowledge. Therefore sacrificing the academic ability of AS kids in favour of social skills could result in 16 year olds only fit for an unskilled job. The converse is just as bad with some parents believing the high academic grammar school system would benefit their kid best. In reality, they could leave as a traumatised person without the right social skills or confidence for successful life as an adult. I have come across 16 year olds with AS who fit into both categories and they are always unhappy people.

 

He now has a masters degree and wants to do a Phd which is a great statement to his own personal endevours. I know there are others on the forum who have also attained high educational achievements which is great for the AS world by showing that they may have AS but it doesn't mean they are not intelligent. The hard work, dedication and committment etc that lies behind these qualifications is awe inspiring and I believe its not recognised by the university as to how much more effort is needed by AS students.

 

I absolutely agree with this and students with AS generally need to put in much more effort than most NT students of comparable academic ability to achieve the same grade. The university system shoulders much of the blame as success at university is more a case of knowing the system rather than having a high academic ability. I have a suspicion that senior academics believe that university is meant to be the way it is which is why change to the system is so slow, and students with AS and other SEN do not get given the right support to achieve their full potential.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
We were watching a programme about reptiles and they were talking about the female being in charge. So, I turned to Jay and made a jokey comment along the lines of, 'yep, the girls are in charge, get used to it kid', that kind of a thing. He said, 'Yeah, well, I could stab you with a knife and you couldn't stop me'!! :unsure::o

 

I reckon he didn't understand it as a joke and took it literally. Perhaps he has had problems with girls or female teachers exercising their authority over him at school and he feels threatened in some way which is why he is considering revenge tactics.

 

We were listening to the radio the other day as well, a news item about the teenagers in Wales commiting suicide and it was saying about low self-esteem. Suddenly, he just piped up, 'I've got low self-esteem, maybe I should commit suicide', totally normal voice, no upset or emotion at all. I said, keeping it light, 'yeah, well, then you'd be dead, you don't want to be dead, do you?' and he said, 'naaaaaaaaahhhhhhh'. I suppose I should feel glad that he's willing to say these things out in the open to me and air them!? :unsure:

 

This is very worrying. I suspect that Jay has undiagnosed depression that warrants an investigation. Find out what is wrong sooner rather than later.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I reckon he didn't understand it as a joke and took it literally. Perhaps he has had problems with girls or female teachers exercising their authority over him at school and he feels threatened in some way which is why he is considering revenge tactics.

 

This is very worrying. I suspect that Jay has undiagnosed depression that warrants an investigation. Find out what is wrong sooner rather than later.

 

 

Canopus, I recognise that you are an adult now, but did you ever have someone to mess about with, bounce ideas off and try out social relationships and dialogue with as a teenager or younger?

Someone who loved you, or liked you come what may, and who would always allow you to make mistakes without the consequences being drastic? Where you can have a misunderstanding, frighten someone or upset them and be given the chance to put things back the way they were?

I've talked with B about what J said, and B pointed out that it's the sort of thing that 'anyone could say as a joke'

He thought the smarties dialogue was funny too.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I absolutely agree with this and students with AS generally need to put in much more effort than most NT students of comparable academic ability to achieve the same grade. The university system shoulders much of the blame as success at university is more a case of knowing the system rather than having a high academic ability. I have a suspicion that senior academics believe that university is meant to be the way it is which is why change to the system is so slow, and students with AS and other SEN do not get given the right support to achieve their full potential.

:tearful: :tearful: Unfortunately it seems that you are right.

 

Canopus, I recognise that you are an adult now, but did you ever have someone to mess about with, bounce ideas off and try out social relationships and dialogue with as a teenager or younger?

Someone who loved you, or liked you come what may, and who would always allow you to make mistakes without the consequences being drastic? Where you can have a misunderstanding, frighten someone or upset them and be given the chance to put things back the way they were?

Bard, I think I understand what you're saying and I understand you are coming from a parent's perspective. But I have read your and Oxgirl's recent posts with a mixture of envy and upset - real deep upset because this isn't something we've all had. I can understand why Canopus has said about depression and it may not be right, but it's a fair enough comment to make not understanding the support that some families give/get.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
:tearful: :tearful: Unfortunately it seems that you are right.

 

 

Bard, I think I understand what you're saying and I understand you are coming from a parent's perspective. But I have read your and Oxgirl's recent posts with a mixture of envy and upset - real deep upset because this isn't something we've all had. I can understand why Canopus has said about depression and it may not be right, but it's a fair enough comment to make not understanding the support that some families give/get.

 

I agree Mumble, and also that Canopus is free to make an observation based on his own understanding and experience.

>:D<<'>

Every child should get the sort of back up that Oxgirl gives her Jay, even though it has required huge patience, large amounts of time and endless judgement calls to try and help Jay become independent and able to cope in society whilst remaining true to himself. You're a star Mel.

I have a friend who was seriously abused in various different ways as a child and a teen. Every aspect of her life, she sees through that 'filter' and she judges situations from her perspective. Sometimes when she has a strong opinion about an issue, there is no basis other than her own feelings. But sometimes she is right.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's probably less use to you now as an adult, but perhaps this forum can give people the opportunity to ask questions, make jokes and be misunderstood or talk about feeling unhappy and depressed.

And they might get answers, or at least a response from other people who care about the issues involved. Even if there isn't a right answer!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
perhaps this forum can give people the opportunity to ask questions, make jokes and be misunderstood or talk about feeling unhappy and depressed.

Sorry :( And sorry I went off topic.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

FWIW my son (12) says this in temper. He told me he would strangle me to death today, I then said he wouldn't get tea if he did that :whistle:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sorry :( And sorry I went off topic.

 

MTM, you have nothing to apologise for, and you didn't go off topic. This isn't a parenting forum, and your comments are as valid as anyone else's, including mine!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
This is very worrying. I suspect that Jay has undiagnosed depression that warrants an investigation. Find out what is wrong sooner rather than later.

 

You're right in some respects, Canopus, Jay does suffer bouts of depressed and deep despair. I'm reassured, though, through this thread, that it's better out than in, if you know what I mean. I'd rather he express these things to me and for us to discuss it then to bottle it all up inside. >:D<<'> >:D<<'>

 

I have read your and Oxgirl's recent posts with a mixture of envy and upset - real deep upset because this isn't something we've all had.

 

I didn't have it either, Mumble, very far from it, which is why I'm trying my hardest to give it to Jay. Here's some for you too. >:D<<'> >:D<<'>

 

You're a star Mel.

 

:tearful: Bard, you're a sweetheart. >:D<<'> >:D<<'>

 

~ Mel ~

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi - just wanted to add that I feel quite reassured by reading this thread as my son sometimes says this sort of thing - not always directed at me but always to me, I think sometimes he thinks it's funny and sometimes he likes to shock a bit and sometimes it's an run on to his prediliction for gory and macarbre stuff!

I have at times when he was younger been really worried about it, and find it's something I can't/don't really talk about with other people because I presume they will think he has violent/nasty tendencies :tearful: which he doesn't. He actually is quite sentimental and soft hearted about a lot of things, he is protective of animals (rescues stray dogs :rolleyes: ), regularly gives his pocket money to the 'tramps' in town and can get very enthusiastic about making a victoria sponge! :lol:

I guess what I'm trying to say is that my son has lots of facets to his personality and character, but 'other people' especially school don't see that, they just focus in on what they perceive to be the 'negative' things such as his fascination with the macarbre and tbh they get their knickers in a twist about it :rolleyes: . So again it's reassuring to me to read some of these posts in particular 'kindas'.

Sorry went off on a bit of rant of my own their :rolleyes: but Mel - I don't think you need to worry 'bout it >:D<<'>

Luv Witsend.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's nice, Witsend, isn't it, to be able to come on here and just air concerns and talk about things that you wouldn't normally mention to 'others'. It's reassuring to hear other people's experiences of similar situations and to get a different perspective and just to have people put our minds at rest. >:D<<'> >:D<<'>

 

~ Mel ~

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
You're right in some respects, Canopus, Jay does suffer bouts of depressed and deep despair. I'm reassured, though, through this thread, that it's better out than in, if you know what I mean. I'd rather he express these things to me and for us to discuss it then to bottle it all up inside. >:D<<'> >:D<<'>

 

It's nice to see that you have the sense to let Jay express himself. My parents used to tell me to keep my opinions to my self. The headmaster of my residential school believed that bottling things up and concealing emotions was an essential part of being an English gentleman.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Canopus, I recognise that you are an adult now, but did you ever have someone to mess about with, bounce ideas off and try out social relationships and dialogue with as a teenager or younger?

Someone who loved you, or liked you come what may, and who would always allow you to make mistakes without the consequences being drastic? Where you can have a misunderstanding, frighten someone or upset them and be given the chance to put things back the way they were?

 

I had a few good friends who accepted / liked my quirkiness resulting from AS and were less likely than most people to get upset or angry when I made social mistakes. Most of them didn't attend my school or were in different year groups. This is one reason why I am wary of the school playground being the primary source of friends for kids with AS, and why I consider having a few good friends better than a large number of acquaintances.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The headmaster of my residential school believed that bottling things up and concealing emotions was an essential part of being an English gentleman.

 

Sounds like my mother! :o:lol:

 

~ Mel ~

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...