hello and thanks

[latmaz]

well i have been reading this forum for over a year now and it has helped me no end, so thought it was about time i posted .. i also wanted to ask for some advice hope thats ok

 

i am pretty sure my son has some form of aspergers (tho compared to what some of you have to go thru i feel churlish even mentioning this)

 

he is about to leave primary school (HOORAY!!),,, throughout his primary school refuse to accept there is any problem at all with him and i am continually having to fight with them about things that happen, him walking out of class, having meltdowns, he has even been suspended once for kicking a teacher when she cornered him

 

for the last 6months or so i have been bringing him home for lunch twice a week which the school have asked me to continue to do as it seems to 'take the pressure off and he behaves better', altho they still refuse to accept there is anythinn wrong and he is not on any sort of plan.... when i told this to the secondary school SENCO he was quite shocked that they dont have him on any school action plan

 

i should say i brought this up when he was about a year 3 and the then SENCO at the school said he could be on the edges of some sort of aspergers but its nothing to worry about!!!.. when i brought it up again in yr4/5 the SENCO jus said it was normal behaviour and i have been arguing with her since then, might as well talk to a wall tho!!!!

 

he has been to CFCS whos reaction was well he relates well to adults and we dont see a problem and he is under TASCC who we saw but the lady theres comments were well yes theres maybe a problem but what would be gained if u had a diagnosis and didnt seem to want to take it further from there

 

i am just to at the end of my tether with the junior school and these agencies and yes i know its near the end of term there but where do i go from here?.... he had the worst meltdown ever on friday and ended up punching me and me crying for the rest of the day wondering if i have failed him.

 

gosh sorry jus realised how long this is getting but i dont feel able to talk to people around me about this cos i dont think a lot of them would understand and they would jus label him as 'naughty' as they have no conceptioon of aspergers

 

thanks for listening and any comments would be appreciated

[Flora]

Hi latmaz

 

Welcome to the forum.

 

It certainly sounds like things don't add up with what the school say, and what actually happens. The fact that your son has had one fixed term exclusion, and the fact that you have been asked to bring him home at lunch times suggests that there is definately a problem. That 'problem' may or may not be related to an un dx ASD, but whether or not it sounds like your son needs some extra support and isn't getting it... or rather he is, but it's via you (lunch times!). (someone else may come along who knows more about exclusions, but if the school have insisted you take him home at lunch times this may be classed as unofficial exclusion?? I don't know about this but someone else will).

 

Wish I could offer some useful advice. The only thing I can think of is to go back to your GP and tell him everything you've described here, and ask to be referred elsewhere for a full assessment.

 

Hopefully, while this is happening, the secondary school will put in place some sort of plan when he gets there.

 

Has your son been assessed by an Educational Psychologist? If not, that's the first thing you should raise when he starts secondary school in September. At least the SENCO there sounds sympathetic.

 

Flora

[pearl]

Welcome latmaz

Hmmm, so no prob according to school yet they want you to take him home at lunchtime? Hmmmm.

Lets hope secondary school take your concerns seriously. <'>

[latmaz]

for some reason i cant see this in the meet and greet section tho i can find it thru my history nor can i see replies unless i click to reply myself... HELPPP!!!

[Bagpuss]

Hello latmaz and welcome to the forum

[latmaz]

aah all ok can see my post now thought i was going mad there lol

 

thanks for the replies, spoke to the new school last night and they seem keen to look into it a bit more and are very suprised at primary schools attitude so have a meet with the SENCO there on tuesday YAAAY some light (hopefully)

 

i forgot to add to my other post that i do think he may have some form of aspergers for lots of reasons, lack of social skills. meltdowns, sensory problems, lack of empathy etc etc... most of which i have read on here and is partly cos of what i have read here that i think thats what the problem is and that its not just me, which is what the primary have made me feel like

 

no he hasnt seen an ed psych, again primary see no need cos he is academically achieving and the CFCS people say he relates well to adults so whats the problem (??!!!)

 

i did think i might ask for his school record from primary to see what they have put in there or if there is any reference to the concerns i have raised over the years

 

thanks for the replies

x

[Clare63]

Hi & Welcome,

 

Please don't be put off by the academic thing, my son is extremly bright but was still assessed by the EP and has a statement. The statement can focus on social skills sensory issues etc etc etc

 

Clare x x x

[latmaz]

thanks i did say to the school just cos he was excelling there didnt mean he didnt have problems elsewhere.

 

the SENCO at the secondary has said he will try and get him into see an Ed PSych as soon as he can YAAAAY, there is light at the end of the tunnel

[Karen A]

Hi latmaz Welcome to the Forum.

I have Ben who is 10 .Ben has Dyspraxia and Social Communication Difficulties.He is also very bright and very able in some subjects.He relates extremely well to adults and most adults appear to think he is one. However he has also found school a difficult experience and I relate to many of your coments.So you are not alone.Ben has a Statement and full time support so it is possible.

 

I wanted to offer some encouragement regarding the move to secondary school.Our elder DS was not in school for several weeks this time last year during year 6.He suffered from anxiety and panic attacks.He received no support in primary school because he was bright and was not recognised as having SEN.

However the SENCO at secondary school was excellent and support was put in place at secondary very quickly indeed.

J is now settled in Secondary and doing extremely well.

So even if the primary school have not done a good job things can be turned round.Transition may turn out to be a good thing.

Karen.

[Karen A]

It certainly sounds like things don't add up with what the school say, and what actually happens. The fact that your son has had one fixed term exclusion, and the fact that you have been asked to bring him home at lunch times suggests that there is definately a problem. That 'problem' may or may not be related to an un dx ASD, but whether or not it sounds like your son needs some extra support and isn't getting it... or rather he is, but it's via you (lunch times!). (someone else may come along who knows more about exclusions, but if the school have insisted you take him home at lunch times this may be classed as unofficial exclusion?? I don't know about this but someone else will

 

 

Hi.I think the DFES position regarding lunch time exclusion has changed in the last year or so with the latest guidance.It used to be the case that if a child was sent home at lunch time for disciplinary reasons then it should be recorded as a half-day exclusion on each occasion.However I think it is now not the case.

However it is still worth pushing for documentation to state that the parent is being asked to take the child home.It may well be counted as evidence in support of a Statement if a request for Assessment is made at a later date.Karen.

[Karen A]

Hi.The latest information I could find contradicts what I posted above.

Lunchtime exclusion

34. Pupils whose behaviour at lunchtime is disruptive may be excluded from the school premises for the duration of the lunchtime period. Lunchtime exclusions are counted as one half of a school day for statistical purposes and to trigger governor meetings so that parents can make representations. Lunchtime exclusions will not be counted towards the school's duty to provide full-time education from day six of a fixed period exclusion. Therefore lunchtime exclusions are not affected by the new regulations on providing pupils with education from the sixth day of their exclusion. Taking into account the child's age and vulnerability, the head teacher/teacher in charge should ensure that a parent/carer has been contacted and is available, if appropriate, to arrange collection and supervision of the pupil during the lunchtime exclusion. A lunchtime exclusion for an indefinite period, like any other indefinite exclusion, would not be lawful. The Secretary of State does not expect lunchtime exclusion to be used for a prolonged period, e.g. for longer than a week. In the long run another strategy for dealing with the problem should be worked out. Arrangements should be made for pupils who are entitled to free school meals to receive their entitlement which may mean, for example, providing a packed lunch.

http://www.teachernet.gov.uk/wholeschool/b...ance2007/part2/

 

So it is worth asking for documentation that a lunch time exclusion has occured even though they do not count towards the regulations re the school's duty to provide education from day six of a fixed period exclusion.

I thought I would add that when the Head Teacher attempted to exclude Ben for an afternoon illegaly a few weeks ago I contacted the LEA.The fact that the LEA were aware and supported me in stating that the exclusion would be illegal if not formally documented helped us in attempting to obtain appropriate support for Ben.

Edited July 9, 2008 by Karen A

[latmaz]

thanks for the those comments it does make me feel a bit better about this transition, to be honet i couldnt feel worse about the primary schools attitude

 

he is not excluded from 2 lunchtimes a week cos of he is disruptive, more that he cant cope with noisy lunctimes and becomes 'wound' up if he is forced to stay there every day of the week... having 2 lunchtimes at home a week seems to diffuse the situation, i guess he gets some quiet time twice a week at home and feels more able to cope the other days

 

i am going to write to the school for a copy of their records to see what it says, my bet is that it will not mention the home lunches at all and will no doubt say it is my suggestion when it fact it was theirs and they specifically asked me to continue with it as hes 'was better' having been at home, tho that of course will also be denied

 

thanks everyone.. u lot are great and so knowleadgeable

[Karen A]

thanks for the those comments it does make me feel a bit better about this transition, to be honet i couldnt feel worse about the primary schools attitude

 

he is not excluded from 2 lunchtimes a week cos of he is disruptive, more that he cant cope with noisy lunctimes and becomes 'wound' up if he is forced to stay there every day of the week... having 2 lunchtimes at home a week seems to diffuse the situation, i guess he gets some quiet time twice a week at home and feels more able to cope the other days

 

i am going to write to the school for a copy of their records to see what it says, my bet is that it will not mention the home lunches at all and will no doubt say it is my suggestion when it fact it was theirs and they specifically asked me to continue with it as hes 'was better' having been at home, tho that of course will also be denied

 

thanks everyone.. u lot are great and so knowleadgeable

 

Hi again.I can appreciate that lunch at home may well be a good solution in the current situation.We considered a similar approach before Ben got a Statement.

It may be worth just bearing in mind that the school does have a statutary responsibilty to include your child in all areas of the curriculum which includes lunch time.So perhaps think about whether in the long term being too supportive may be enableing the school to do less than they should. Karen.

[Karen A]

Hi.I thought I would also say that school should be putting support in place to enable your DS to feel less wound up at lunch time.Then he will want to stay rather than being forced too. <'>

It is worth talking to the new Secondary School to find out whether they operate lunch time clubs or less busy areas at lunch times.Karen.

[latmaz]

thanks karen and u are no doubt right i have made it easy for them but i was about at the end of my tether as they would say they would put things in place then not do it and he would have a meltdown and walk out so i would have to come rushing back to find him and it was all too stressful and easier for me to just have him at home

 

will talk to the new school as its not going to be possible for him to ome home then as its too far... seeing them tuesday morning so will add that to list

[NickyB]

i forgot to add to my other post that i do think he may have some form of aspergers for lots of reasons, lack of social skills. meltdowns, sensory problems, lack of empathy etc etc... most of which i have read on here and is partly cos of what i have read here that i think thats what the problem is and that its not just me, which is what the primary have made me feel like

 

no he hasnt seen an ed psych, again primary see no need cos he is academically achieving and the CFCS people say he relates well to adults so whats the problem (??!!!)

 

Hi, latmaz

 

My son (dx of high functioning Autism) is also doing well academically, but as you say, that doesn't mean he hasn't got other issues. The teachers have always said that he relates very well to adults but finds it difficult to relate to his peers. He also finds times like assembly and lunchtime very difficult because he gets sensory 'overload' when there are lots of people and lots of noise. He doesn't attend assembly any more, and he sits on a table at the side of the dinner hall, along with some of his friends who have similar problems (this might sound sad but he's so much happier )

I'm really sorry that you've had so many problems at the primary school, but it does seem that the secondary school SENCO is much more sympathetic. The only other advice I can give is to keep the lines of communication open with the SENCO and teachers at the new school.

 

Hope all goes well in September <'> <'>

[Karen A]

thanks karen and u are no doubt right i have made it easy for them but i was about at the end of my tether as they would say they would put things in place then not do it and he would have a meltdown and walk out so i would have to come rushing back to find him and it was all too stressful and easier for me to just have him at home

 

will talk to the new school as its not going to be possible for him to ome home then as its too far... seeing them tuesday morning so will add that to list

 

Sorry. <'> <'> I did not intend to make you feel guilty.

I do understand very well how you feel.At the time you can only do what you feel is right.Karen.

[JsMum]

Hi I can relate soo much from what you have said, J started to go home every day at dinner times last year because he wasnt eating when at school at dinner times and he was been aggressive towards other children, especially his own year group, younger kids he was caring and protective, but his own age group he is dominant or withdrawn, he went part time over a year ago and that did seem to help at first, his attendance was improving and short periods of progress but where he struggles was in classroom or interaction needs.

 

J has a statement and he has a real severe form of dyslexia and major problems with processing and intergrating, and the only learning based support on his statement is half an hour a week, I have known since he was six he was dyslexic, even with private assessments they where still ignored, until now and its clear to see that J has really struggled to the point its caused him severe emotional problems, its eroded his self esteem and he has sadly been very mis understood by some of his educators, its eroded trust in me too, because I felt I could trust them and they would help my son but instead they made him feel stupid and that some how he was doing on purpose, which was far from the truth because he was trying harder than his peers but still it was wrong he hasnt recieved adequate support and its still not on his statement, though throw recent assessment it will be added, his recent primary has been a lot more understanding and it has helped but the experience has taught J not to trust others now and its very hard for them to get throw to J, he writes on a wipe board because he cant bare to make a mistake, in fear he will be in trouble, he has had more support over the last year but with part time table and not attending as regular he hasnt had access to the help he is been given.

 

The rest of his support is based on his emotional, social and understanding difficulties, so he was in extra provisions for social groups, emotional class, art class, extra ICT and 1-1 for keeping on task and helping him understand instructions so most of his statement is for his SEBD needs, not actual learning ability as he excells in science and Maths, ICT, Games and other similair lessons, where he struggles is interaction, rules, interpretations, reading, concentrating and filtering sensory imput, that means he struggles with noise, overcrowding, busy enviroments. (corridors, halls, sports facilities, supermarkets)

 

I would say that J has made progress in some social settings, improving his ability to play with others but he doesnt understand rules, cant cope if he looses and he hasnt got confidence as his body acts in ways that make it difficult to score a goal or pass a ball, this frustrates him and that then leads to frictions with his peers.

 

Over the last 6 weeks have been really difficult and J has been very distressed/withdrawn at school and so we have had to returned home, he isnt learning any more and he isnt interested even in fun based sessions, hes had loads of support and lots of help in class and the school and I have worked our socks off, the progress is short before J is withdrawing again, so its hard even with support, our children have a lot more pressures and stress and its emotionally and mentally draining, evedent in lack of apitite, sleeping difficulties, headaches and general behaviour difficulties at home.

 

It is not easy, I sure do hope that in september your sons secondary school can listen and understand a bit more, and that some groups can be put in place to help him, there is a lot of things your school could of done to help him, its obvous that the lack of support has effected his emotional health and if things can be sorted out next september it will help improve his emotional health.

 

If he has external support too I would ask to see if he could be on SA+ so he can access the socail and emotional support at school.

 

From there you then could look at future assessments of SEN and then get a better idea on his overall abilities, I would also recommend private assessments like an educational psychologist and see what he could recommend if things get worse at school in secondary school.

 

Good Luck, we are going throw the process of SENDIST to get J into a school for children with the same diagnosis of Js.

 

JsMum

Edited July 10, 2008 by JsMum

[latmaz]

oh its ok karen u didnt make me feel guilty but did make me realise i made it easy for them

 

thanks for your story jsmum, my ds has no trust in any of his teachers now, he just says well they dont listen or they arent interested or i have told them and they do nothing etc etc... its very hard listening to a child feeling that no one listens or will take note of what he says

 

someone told me i could get an appointment with a private paediatrician at a private hospital near me and i am considering whether that may be worth doing before he goes to his next school

 

why do they have to make it so difficult for you, i feel so let down by his primary but still thats almost over and i must be positive about his new school and i think u are right if they support him a bit more he will feel have more faith and trust in them which will help him feel more secure

 

i do appreciate being able to witter on here as i said i dont talk to many people about all this in real life

[latmaz]

well just wanted to update everyone

 

saw his school record yesterday. nothin in there about my visits to SENCO, behaviour support, being taken out at lunchtimes NOTHING!! not one word, not even about the times he walked out of school or class... i guess i pretty much expected it but it was a bit of a shock

 

i spoke to the SENCO at the new school and he met DS he has suggests we get the first couple weeks out of the way and see how things are going and proceed from there, which seems like a good plan to me

 

on a positive note he got all level 5's in his SAT's... OMGGG i was so proud of him i could of screamed it from the windows, after all the rubbish he has had this year to achieve that is just phenomenal

 

thanks everyone for their supoort and i will continue reading all the helpful advice here

[latmaz]

oh gosh i just realised how insensitive that may have been to those of you whose children are not achieveing academically.. i am sorry i didnt mean to be.. i am just so proud of my munchkin i didnt engage brain properly

 

sorry hope i didnt upset anyone

[loobylou2]

<'> Hi latmaz, welcome to the forum

[NickyB]

oh gosh i just realised how insensitive that may have been to those of you whose children are not achieveing academically.. i am sorry i didnt mean to be.. i am just so proud of my munchkin i didnt engage brain properly

 

sorry hope i didnt upset anyone

 

Don't feel bad about being proud of your DS. Well done to him

[ASue67]

Hello!!! <'>

[latmaz]

thanks everyone.. i am proud of him

 

his problems really centre around sensory and socially and have got really bad this year,,, added to sever bullying so to achieve this despite all that is great

[baddad]

Hi latmaz - welcome aboard