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jacquelineh1468

strange behaviour

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my son who is 10 has been dx with adhd and asd and i am just wondering if anybodys children either walk in circles or pace from one foot to another.Why do they do this and what is it called,i dont know if to try and stop him doing it or to just ignore this,also can anybody give me any advice on getting your child to shower,have his hair washed or cut as my child is terrified of everything

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Hi there my son is six,he has a funny walk to he walks on his toes and runs on them to,he has corns on his feet in fact his feet look like ballerina feet!I have asked others this question every one says it is common and the solution would be to take your child to the OT so it can be corrected so I will mention it when I go to his next assesment.The hair washing I dont know what to suggest I let my son wash his own hair but he loves washing anyway so for me not a problem and with cutting his hair I resort to bribery,usually a lollipop trip to the park anything really,when he has had his hair cut he loves it and says he feels better.good luck.

 

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Hi Jacquelineh,

 

With regard to hair cutting, we could not cut our son's hair for 2 / 3 years. It got really long and looked so cool!

At our local shopping centre there is a hairdresser shop. Each time we go to the shops, we always walk past this hairdressers. I calmly mentioned to him 'Wow, look! What a nice shop!' The next time I pointed out the people having their hair cut. After quite a few trips past the shop, he wanted to go!! So, all his hair came off last week, broke my heart! hehe. BUT it was really good that he decided to go himself.

 

So, maybe if u can find a hairdresser that looks warm and inviting, casually walk past with him, or even ask if you can pop in for a few visits?

 

We have a major issue with toe nail clipping, so I can understand where you're coming from.

 

All the best.

 

Zeb x >:D<<'>

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Shower/bath as part of his routine. DS can chose which one he wants but he must have one each Sunday (once a week is good enough - plus a once a week swim LOL). Nails get donw after the bath once a month - his idea originally as he reckons they are softer then & don't hurt as much. Plus lots of dsisussions about how ingrowing toenails hurt!

 

we were lucky woth hair, as we have found a barber he trusts and lets us take him regularly - after screaming some other places down it was a BIG relief!

 

Weird walking & jiggling etc - we've been to the OT & PT who say there is no physical reason, so we just inform him when he is doing it & try to encourange him to stop. He usually does after a few weeks, then finds another movement instead :rolleyes: same with the noises!

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my son who is 10 has been dx with adhd and asd and i am just wondering if anybodys children either walk in circles or pace from one foot to another.Why do they do this and what is it called,i dont know if to try and stop him doing it or to just ignore this,also can anybody give me any advice on getting your child to shower,have his hair washed or cut as my child is terrified of everything

 

Hi jacqueline

 

I am sorry to say this but your post made me chuckle :oops: Only because most of us have problems like this, especially the washing bit.

 

Autistic children often love spinning (themselves or other things), my eldest got in trouble at school for spinning a protractor and it falling on the floor repeatedly (he didn't think it was his fault it went on the floor as he was only spinning it, not pushing/throwing it on the floor). He may feel 'weird' standing still, pacing may help him ignore other things he would become aware of if he just stood still and quiet. My son just turned 16 and still walks on tiptoe - obviously so in bare feet, but still slightly in shoes. We took him to a specialist having told him it would affect him in the future and may lead to an operation, but the specialist said it wasn't a problem and not to worry about it :wallbash: . He doesn't want and has no intention of not walking on his toes, so there isn't much we can do about it really.

 

When he was younger he had various 'habits'. He would make noises with his mouth, or make gestures, perhaps this is your son's version of a 'habit'. We were told that if we tried to stop him doing what he was doing, he might start doing something less desirable, which made a lot of sense to me !! He doesn't really have any noticeable habits now, although he will occasionally chew his tongue when he is concentrating.

 

We manage to get him (very reluctantly) to have a shower once a week (mostly), but I'm not sure if soap or shampoo is involved. I try to keep his clothes, pyjamas and bedding washed regularly which helps. Being a teenager he smells strongly of BO at times, but then so do other lads his age.

 

Would your son play with cups, bowls, or toys in water? We used to put a tiny amount of water in the bath with some little boats for Mj to play with, he used to spend ages in there (although not actually washing, he was 'soaking' clean :ph34r: ). Shame he won't play with toys now he's 16!!! I know your son is 10, but sometimes they are still happy to do something a younger child would do.

 

Good luck >:D<<'>

 

 

 

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My son is also terrified of water and the weekly hairwash is a terrible ordeal. We have tried goggles, which helped a bit, and asking him to lie down (no chance). The best technique is to wash his hair in the bath explaining step by step what is happening. Sometimes we manage it without hysteria. Asking him to wash his willy is even more traumatic! We have one possibly two baths a week. I got a real shock when i had another child who LIKED water!

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With the hair cutting, The Barbers his Dad and Brother goto has wall to wall Mirrors which distracted him as he just stared at himself from start to finish.

With the toes and the nails its impossible to do them at awake times.

With the hair washing he has accepted it has to happen now but still screams while asking how many cups of water are left.

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With the hair washing he has accepted it has to happen now but still screams while asking how many cups of water are left.

My mum had this odd contraption she used to wash my hair (in the bath) - it was like a large plastic circle with another circle that was soft and elasticy cut out inside - it was worn around the top of my head (like an angel's halo!! :devil:) with all the hair through the top and the hair could be washed without the water coming down my face at all (and def not in my eyes). I dunno if you can get something similar anymore? :unsure:

 

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As a toddler my son used to spin. Now he is older he still sometimes spins, but if he is thinking about something, or sometimes when he is repeating TV or DVD dialogue to himself he will walk in circles.

 

The bathing, hair washing/cutting, nail cutting is probably a sensory issue ie. being over sensitive to the sound, smell, touch sensations involved. I am not on the spectrum but do have sensory issues which are mild compared to my son or others on the spectrum and I can tell you that many times it actually hurts ie. the sensation of touch can be uncomfortable, painful or can remain for minutes or even days afterwards. For example, if I don't remove a clothes tag it may feel very uncomfortable to begin with. But in about a minute it becomes as painful as if I have a needle stuck in my clothes that keeps sticking into me. The same goes for some types of touch. If my husband squeezes my arm it is painful to me and the pain sensation remains for minutes afterwards and only goes it I rub at the spot he has squeezed.

If you just accept that he 'experiences' sensory information differently to you, then you will begin to see what his behaviour is telling you.

If your son is verbal run through a checklist of questions with him eg. why don't you like to wash your hair. Does the shampoo smell bad, does it hurt to wash your hair etc. You can try to desensitive him by doing things like pressing firmly on his finger nails every morning and evening for the next couple of weeks and also just before you trim his nails. See if that causes any improvements. But sometimes it takes a while.

Also ask for a referral to an Occupational Therapist because they are the professionals that deal with these difficulties (ie Sensory Integration difficulties). And they should be able to give you some ideas. As my son got older (ie. 6+), I found it helped for him to do it himself because he could control it rather than have the unpredictable sensation of me rubbing on his head. Again combing/brushing hair is a problem for him and also for me. I don't brush or comb my hair at all.

For my son socks and shoes are another issue. Sock seams have to be in the right place and new socks or shoes can be painful to begin with and take a while to get used to.

Regarding haircuts. In the past we have had to leave the barbers with half a haircut because he couldn't bear the sensation of the clippers (that was pre-diagnosis!). Now I take him to a ladies hairdresser and she knows that she has to tell him everything before she does it ie. 'now I am going to spray some water on your head', and she will give him a demonstration by spraying some water on his hand.

The other things to remember with Sensory Integration difficulties is that they can vary from day to day. That causes them an awful lot of anxiety because something that was okay for them on one day can be painful on another. This causes alot of avoidance behaviours, tears and tantrums. So for me I might be able to wear a certain item of clothing one day, and on another I cannot tolerate it next to my skin. Wherever possible give an example first to see if they can tolerate it. Fully explain what is going to happen and teach them what to say or do for it to stop. Sometimes they just need a few seconds break to calm themselves down again before they continue.

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As a toddler my son used to spin. Now he is older he still sometimes spins, but if he is thinking about something, or sometimes when he is repeating TV or DVD dialogue to himself he will walk in circles.

 

The bathing, hair washing/cutting, nail cutting is probably a sensory issue ie. being over sensitive to the sound, smell, touch sensations involved. I am not on the spectrum but do have sensory issues which are mild compared to my son or others on the spectrum and I can tell you that many times it actually hurts ie. the sensation of touch can be uncomfortable, painful or can remain for minutes or even days afterwards. For example, if I don't remove a clothes tag it may feel very uncomfortable to begin with. But in about a minute it becomes as painful as if I have a needle stuck in my clothes that keeps sticking into me. The same goes for some types of touch. If my husband squeezes my arm it is painful to me and the pain sensation remains for minutes afterwards and only goes it I rub at the spot he has squeezed.

If you just accept that he 'experiences' sensory information differently to you, then you will begin to see what his behaviour is telling you.

If your son is verbal run through a checklist of questions with him eg. why don't you like to wash your hair. Does the shampoo smell bad, does it hurt to wash your hair etc. You can try to desensitive him by doing things like pressing firmly on his finger nails every morning and evening for the next couple of weeks and also just before you trim his nails. See if that causes any improvements. But sometimes it takes a while.

Also ask for a referral to an Occupational Therapist because they are the professionals that deal with these difficulties (ie Sensory Integration difficulties). And they should be able to give you some ideas. As my son got older (ie. 6+), I found it helped for him to do it himself because he could control it rather than have the unpredictable sensation of me rubbing on his head. Again combing/brushing hair is a problem for him and also for me. I don't brush or comb my hair at all.

For my son socks and shoes are another issue. Sock seams have to be in the right place and new socks or shoes can be painful to begin with and take a while to get used to.

Regarding haircuts. In the past we have had to leave the barbers with half a haircut because he couldn't bear the sensation of the clippers (that was pre-diagnosis!). Now I take him to a ladies hairdresser and she knows that she has to tell him everything before she does it ie. 'now I am going to spray some water on your head', and she will give him a demonstration by spraying some water on his hand.

The other things to remember with Sensory Integration difficulties is that they can vary from day to day. That causes them an awful lot of anxiety because something that was okay for them on one day can be painful on another. This causes alot of avoidance behaviours, tears and tantrums. So for me I might be able to wear a certain item of clothing one day, and on another I cannot tolerate it next to my skin. Wherever possible give an example first to see if they can tolerate it. Fully explain what is going to happen and teach them what to say or do for it to stop. Sometimes they just need a few seconds break to calm themselves down again before they continue.

Hi sally WOW.I didnt ask the question but found your answer BRILLIANT great advice can use that advice for other things,my mother once told me something like this but as always I didnt listen to her.Thanks.

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my son who is 10 has been dx with adhd and asd and i am just wondering if anybodys children either walk in circles or pace from one foot to another.Why do they do this and what is it called,i dont know if to try and stop him doing it or to just ignore this,also can anybody give me any advice on getting your child to shower,have his hair washed or cut as my child is terrified of everything

 

In what context is he doing this behaviour? For example my son might move from one foot to another if his feet are uncomfortable - or he might just as easily disolve into tears or take off his shoes and throw them? Or in school he used to follow the lines on the playground. Or toe walk on patterned floors. During break time he used to walk up and down the fence line repeating TV dialogue to himself. In the classroom he used to walk up and down. Sometimes he uses this behaviour when he is concentrating on something. At other times he uses it because he does not know what else to do or what he should be doing. For example regarding school playtimes and dinnertimes I said that my son wanted to play and join in but did not know how to - hence the pacing up and down the fence line. The SENCo initially disagreed with me and said he needed to be allowed to be autistic. I disagreed because I felt this autistic behaviour was being used because he did not have the appropriate skills he needed. If we did not know how to communicate or socialise how would we fill up our breaktimes - probably with something similar. Anyway we had recently gone to tribunal for this school placement and also for increased professional input, which included SALT - whose responsibility is not just speech but also social interaction and play skills. We secured weeky therapy sessions from a SALT which is practiced daily in school with his nominated TA. And part of the difficulties she has to cover are social interaction and play skills. He joined this school in September and at that time was fence walking during breaktimes. Now he plays with the other children. They have concentrated on him learning some phrases to say to join in, he has joined a social skills club which teaches them to ask questions of other children and to give answers to questions children ask them. They have worked on him learning the childrens' names in his class. They have prompted him and supported him and his confidence has grown. He now plays football with them - something I never expected to happen. So my advice would be to try to find out what the behaviour is being used for. There is always a reason. It might be a practical thing ie. to avoid sensory issues - or it might be something he does to fill his time because he does not know what else to do. A good thing to consider is that any behaviour, if you are looking to remove it, has to be replaced with something that fulfills the same purpose or alleviates the need for that behaviour. For example, if you have a child that refuses to wear clothes there is no point putting into place a reward system whereby he gets a biscuit if he keeps his clothes on. If the issue is a sensory tactile thing ie. the clothes hurt him, no amount of biscuits is going to rectify that. But if you change the clothing to cotton only, no tags, elasticated waist, seamless socks etc then you may well get the result you want without having to even open the biscuit tin.

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And one final thing I wanted to mention regarding sensory issues is to talk to your child about it and explain it to them. Their behaviour looks like them being naughty or awkward until we realise that this behaviour is to avoid things that are uncomfortable or hurt them. And how it affects them varies day to day. But in the same way our children do not understand that they experience things differently and therefore it is very confusing and frustrating for them. For example they may be asked to do things in lessons that are uncomfortable for them it. cutting and sticking things. This may cause them to not trust the teacher or other children because the teacher is asking them to do something that feels bad to them. And yet at the same time they will see that the other children are doing it and appear to be okay. But you can explain to them that they experience things differently. My son does understand that. He is not able to 'give' that information. But if he is asked a direct question he can answer. Eg. if my son refuses to do something ie. wash his hands after going to the toilet and they ask him 'why' he will say 'because the hand dryers destroy my ears'. This used to be a real issue for him to the extent that he would not go into the toilet if there were any other children because whilst he was in there one of the children would set off the hand dryer and he would collapse to the floor screaming. Now they know what it is they can take him in on his own and he dries his hands on a paper towel. He also has DIY ear defenders for in school which he uses in assembly etc.

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And one final thing I wanted to mention regarding sensory issues is to talk to your child about it and explain it to them. Their behaviour looks like them being naughty or awkward until we realise that this behaviour is to avoid things that are uncomfortable or hurt them. And how it affects them varies day to day. But in the same way our children do not understand that they experience things differently and therefore it is very confusing and frustrating for them. For example they may be asked to do things in lessons that are uncomfortable for them it. cutting and sticking things. This may cause them to not trust the teacher or other children because the teacher is asking them to do something that feels bad to them. And yet at the same time they will see that the other children are doing it and appear to be okay. But you can explain to them that they experience things differently. My son does understand that. He is not able to 'give' that information. But if he is asked a direct question he can answer. Eg. if my son refuses to do something ie. wash his hands after going to the toilet and they ask him 'why' he will say 'because the hand dryers destroy my ears'. This used to be a real issue for him to the extent that he would not go into the toilet if there were any other children because whilst he was in there one of the children would set off the hand dryer and he would collapse to the floor screaming. Now they know what it is they can take him in on his own and he dries his hands on a paper towel. He also has DIY ear defenders for in school which he uses in assembly etc.

hi i would just like to thank everybody for replying and your great advice

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Hi, I'm new to the forum, but this really struck me. My 11 yr old girl hates hair washing/cutting and nails are just a no no.

I bought ducks. She will get into a few inches of water now with the ducks about 50 odd ducks by now, no exageration... they get kept in the "ducksack" :rolleyes:

Up until this summer baths were just not happening, I had to get in the shower with her, she needed the security of me holding her while the water was on. Since I bought the ducks, she'll get into the bath and i have been leaving the mixer tap on at a trickle. When she gets out, I point out how high the water was and tell her how much more fun the ducks have when there's a little more water in. I think the amount of them i bought shocked and surprised her into letting her gaurd down long enough to get her interested.

 

She has really curly hair, and brushing it was a nightmare, but this year has also changed that a lot. Last year, I had to brush her hair when we got to school outside the classroom, not before and not on weekends. Her older sister this year has taken to going to the hair dressers to get her hair done, S went with her once, just to watch. She came home and asked could she "buy straight hair" well out came my straightners... she now get it done everyday before school, it means getting up an extra 20 mins early, but hey.... what ever works right? She's happy enough. I even managed to fine comb it the other day without all the usual screaming, crying and abuse that i would've usually got.

 

Still can't cut her nails, she just refuses, although they don't seem to need done. There is just war if one of her toe nails get broken and needs cut. She doesn't sleep a whole lot and when she does, if i go near her feet, she moves them.

 

I'm so glad i'm not alone in all this. Finding this forum has been so good. I spent most of last night just reading older topics. Its better than any book on ASD i have found.

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Occupational Therapists can put together 'sensory diets' for children with sensory issues. But OTs are scare and usually you need to get it incorporated into a Statement to even see one. And LEAs try to get out of it by telling parents that OTs are health and nothing to do with education. That is untrue. My son has termly reviews by an OT. He has received Auditory Integration Therapy in school and at home and we have seen a huge improvement. AIT is said to improve all aspects of functioning from physical movement to speech improvements to a reduction in hypersensitive sensory issues. My son's OT is going to put together a 'relaxation' programme in school to help him with reducing stress or anxiety and how to just calm down at certain times of the school day. She also gave me a list of exercises to carry out at home to help with sensory issues such as problems with nail cutting. This involved pressing on each finger nail morning and night and prior to nail cutting.

Another thing that can help is just as mentioned above, for the child to see and understand what the 'process' will involve. If you are hyper sensitive and have no real understanding of what 'going to the hairdresser' will involve, you are more likely to use avoidance behaviours. I have had to leave the barbers with my son having only received half a haircut because he could not bear the sensation of the hairclippers (that was prior to diagnosis). That was an awful occasion with the barber practically shouting that my son was disruptive and that there was no way the clippers could be hurting him. I could see he was upset, anxious and in pain. So it is important to go with the emotions they are demonstrating because if it is hurting them that is real regardless of the fact that the same thing would not hurt or bother us.

Since then I have found a lovely ladies hairdresser who tells him what she is going to do before she does it. She also gives him an example of it eg. she will spray the water on his hand before she sprays his head. She tells him he can tell her to stop at any time.

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