very sad newsx

[Enid]

this is terrible, I think you need a solicitor.

 

my only advice is to do everything they say, and always always keep the contacts, dont miss any. they will eventually extend the contacts, and I am sure you will get home visits beofre very long,

 

J has behaved the same at school as he has at home, schools couldnt cope with him, they are having the honeymoon period now and will see the real j before long.

 

So feel for you, I was terrrifed when my J was at his worst and was in respite for 4 weeks, the first 2 he was a saint!! then he showed his true colours, and they couldnt cope with him. reallly feel for you, sending all my support. much love. xxx

[Kathryn]

Sorry J's mum - I don't know enough about care issues or contact decisions to know how you would challenge this or what SS obligations are to review the decision. What does your solicitor think - I'm assuming he/she is still working for you??

 

I think Bid and Enid are right, give it time, go with what SS say for the moment as there's not much else you can do. If you protest it may just reinforce their view of you as being obsessed with dx labels. At least you know he's beeing well looked after in respite. Save your energies to fight for the thing you wanted all along - a school that meets all his needs.

 

sending you <'> <'> at this difficult time

 

K x

[JsMum]

Sorry J's mum - I don't know enough about care issues or contact decisions to know how you would challenge this or what SS obligations are to review the decision. What does your solicitor think - I'm assuming he/she is still working for you??

 

I think Bid and Enid are right, give it time, go with what SS say for the moment as there's not much else you can do. If you protest it may just reinforce their view of you as being obsessed with dx labels. At least you know he's beeing well looked after in respite. Save your energies to fight for the thing you wanted all along - a school that meets all his needs.

 

sending you <'> <'> at this difficult time

 

K x

 

 

Thanks for your advise, however today I wrote on the care plan that I dont agree with their opions thats I perseve Js needs more than they are and that other proffessionals do consider J to be on the ASD.

 

I am making a mess of it already arnt I,

 

 

Just one big MESS.

 

JsMumx

[Sally44]

Again, this is why you really need someone working with you on your case.

 

It isn't about parents searching for and accumulating labels. The SEN Code of Practice says that EVERY need should be identified.

 

From what you have said you have pushed for this to happen so that his needs were met. Other professionals have actually diagnosed him and they will have done that because they felt it was appropriate. They won't have diagnosed your child with a lifelong disorder just to appease you.

 

And I think we all know that although many professionals may say "his needs can be met without the diagnosis/label", in reality that doesn't happen because it is only WHEN you identify the need that there is then a requirement for it to be included in section 2 of the Statement, with provision quantified and specified in section 3 - and that adds up to describe the kind of placement needed in section 4. Often LEAs won't even acknowledge that there is a need until there is an actual diagnosis of it because once a need is identified it costs them money.

 

Your child has not received all these "labels" because you have somehow collected them. He has seen professionals and they have observed and assessed him and given him those diagnoses. If SS have an issue with that they should go to the professionals themselves [which they are not qualified to do], rather than try to pin some kind of munchausen syndrome onto you [which actually is an accusation made of parents more often than most people realise].

 

If they challenge any of his diagnoses ask SS on what grounds they are challenging the diagnosis of xxxx made by xxxx [and put it in writing] - in that way divert SS to the professional that diagnosed and away from you as his mum. For example, if SS do not think he has a Conduct Disorder that is their opinion [and not one they are able to make because they are not suitably medically qualified to make that decision]. But if they do say something along those lines ask them to put that in writing that they do not acknowledge the diagnosis of xxxx made by Dr xxxxx (or SALT or EP etc). Try not to get into an emotional argument with them about yourself because they maybe trying to picture you as a neurotic mother - if the Panel have the reports and evidence from the relevent professionals they will see his list of diagnoses and who made them. You haven't self diagnosed your son.

 

I agree with Bid that you must cooperate fully with SS, but if they challenge his existing needs or diagnoses, they need to take that up with the responsible professional and not accuse you of somehow being to blame for him receiving the diagnosis.

 

So does your son now have a diagnosis of ASD? - along with additional diagnoses that other professionals have added along the way.

 

It might be useful for you to itemise the different diagnoses and also detail which professional identified them eg. ASD diagnosed by xxx on xxx in their report dated xxx. And make sure all those reports/documents are sent to SEND.

 

I think his former school have already detailed his behaviour whilst at their school. Do you have that in writing rather than just verbal information? If he has had to be restrained etc the school should have each of those occasions documented in their records. The same applies for exclusions.

 

It sounds like you have a very complex child with a number of co-morbid diagnosies.

 

If your son has difficulties such as a Conduct Disorder, then it maybe completely irrelevent how many parenting courses you go on because he has a Conduct Disorder. That is not due to bad parenting. You have done your best and jumped through all the hoops and gone on all the courses (many of which are not even suitable for children with an ASD let alone his additional diagnoses).

 

Please try to get someone on your case on your side. You need someone with expertise in this area and an impartial view, who can be less emotional and who can put your case forward with the facts, that do appear to be there.

 

Are you eligible for Legal Help? Have you contacted any of the support agencies to help you prepare your Tribunal case and attend the Tribunal with you?

 

Regarding Auditory Processing Disorder, it is very difficult to get a diagnoses because nowhere seems to assess or diagnose. The best you tend to get is for the child to receive an auditory screening, and then for them to ask certain questions about the child's hearing difficulties which they may then say "maybe" due to an auditory processing disorder. The Speech Therapist can assess for difficulties typical of this disorder. My own son was assessed by the NHS SALT who said he had difficulties with recognising different letter sounds such as 'm' and 'n' and 'f' and 'v' etc. And the Auditory Department also said his hearing difficulties could be due to APD. There is also the APD(UK) website that has information on the kinds of difficulties typical of this disorder.

 

But I want to emphasise again that IMO your case is very complex and serious and you need more expertise, experience and support than can be expected from this forum alone.

[Sally44]

In my own case there was a team meeting where some professionals reported that my son had "acquired" a number of "labels" and said that mum can get very anxious and repeatedly contact professionals during stressful times.

 

So it isn't just you they do it to. It is how they try to portray parents sometimes because that is the last attempt the LEA have to discredit your case. Just concentrate on getting the relevent documentation to SEND by the due dates and don't get involved in any verbal or written arguments. If you do have to put anything in writing, just make it factual - don't use emotional language or accuse them of things. Just state the facts.

 

When parents are left to try to cope with a situation that is spiralling out of control, with no support, i'm not sure what they expect parents to do other than contact professionals. I'd love them to live my life 24/7 for a while and i'm sure lots of parents on this forum have felt like that. Thankfully we seem to be over the worst part (anxiety wise). But have the Tribunal infront of us, like you do.

 

Remember that the Tribunal Panel will be used to this type of thing. They are not stupid. They will read all of the documentation that you send to them. So it is more important to get that right, so don't concentrate on what SS are saying about you, don't retaliate or get angry or upset. Just be factual. Just do as they ask and comply with requests.

 

Please get someone to support you and attend Tribunal with you.

 

When you get all the documentation back page numbered, go through it all and note all the most relevent reports, letters, file notes etc so that you can find them quickly and easily refer to them when needed.

 

Do you know that you can request any LEA or NHS professional to attend as your expert witness? If you don't have independent reports/experts accompanying you to the Tribunal, you can choose those whose reports are most useful to you and who are most supportive of your son and his various diagnosis. You have to submit your attendees to SEND by a certain timescale - check what that is. You will have been send the Attendees form with all the initial paperwork. Obviously you need to ask them to attend and if anyone says they cannot make the date, you can ask SEND to Supina them as vital expert witnesses - and SEND will do it - they've done it for me.

 

For example the Psychiatrist you've mentioned has diagnosed a number of disorders on top of ASD for your son. Although you say he was not supportive of you, that could even work in your favour because the Tribunal is about his Education [which also includes life skills etc]. Because he is in respite he has a better chance of securing the waking curriculum you are seeking.

 

Does this Psychiatrist support your view about the placement your son needs?

 

So look at each individual professional and their advice and decide whether they are useful to your case or not. Typically you can have three witnesses (my LEA have requested 7! - but SEND have only allowed 5, which maybe reduced further as we have a telephone case management soon).

 

Don't invite anyone who could be considered a hostile witness. Your witnesses are there to back up the reports and recommendations they have made.

 

On the day of the tribunal you will feel nervous obviously. Try to answer the Panels questions directly and in as few words as possible. Do not accuse anyone of anything (such as lying etc), let the Panel draw their own conclusions from the evidence they have. The Panel need to see you as a parent that has done their best to get their child's needs met. You don't want to turn it into the Jerry Springer Show (not that you would - but you know what I mean). The Panel will not let anyone make wild accusations without backing it up with evidence.

 

[i've also received a further case summary from the LEA stating that my son is not as complex as mum believes and that I am out of line with the LEA and professional opinion. I know that isn't true and I do have reports - from the LEA and NHS professionals that back up my position. The LEA are just throwing mud in an attempt that some of it will stick. But actually they are making themselves look very silly.]

 

Who are attending as witnesses for the LEA?

Edited May 4, 2011 by Sally44

[JsMum]

In my own case there was a team meeting where some professionals reported that my son had "acquired" a number of "labels" and said that mum can get very anxious and repeatedly contact professionals during stressful times.

 

So it isn't just you they do it to. It is how they try to portray parents sometimes because that is the last attempt the LEA have to discredit your case. Just concentrate on getting the relevent documentation to SEND by the due dates and don't get involved in any verbal or written arguments. If you do have to put anything in writing, just make it factual - don't use emotional language or accuse them of things. Just state the facts.

 

When parents are left to try to cope with a situation that is spiralling out of control, with no support, i'm not sure what they expect parents to do other than contact professionals. I'd love them to live my life 24/7 for a while and i'm sure lots of parents on this forum have felt like that. Thankfully we seem to be over the worst part (anxiety wise). But have the Tribunal infront of us, like you do.

 

Remember that the Tribunal Panel will be used to this type of thing. They are not stupid. They will read all of the documentation that you send to them. So it is more important to get that right, so don't concentrate on what SS are saying about you, don't retaliate or get angry or upset. Just be factual. Just do as they ask and comply with requests.

 

Please get someone to support you and attend Tribunal with you.

 

When you get all the documentation back page numbered, go through it all and note all the most relevent reports, letters, file notes etc so that you can find them quickly and easily refer to them when needed.

 

Do you know that you can request any LEA or NHS professional to attend as your expert witness? If you don't have independent reports/experts accompanying you to the Tribunal, you can choose those whose reports are most useful to you and who are most supportive of your son and his various diagnosis. You have to submit your attendees to SEND by a certain timescale - check what that is. You will have been send the Attendees form with all the initial paperwork. Obviously you need to ask them to attend and if anyone says they cannot make the date, you can ask SEND to Supina them as vital expert witnesses - and SEND will do it - they've done it for me.

 

For example the Psychiatrist you've mentioned has diagnosed a number of disorders on top of ASD for your son. Although you say he was not supportive of you, that could even work in your favour because the Tribunal is about his Education [which also includes life skills etc]. Because he is in respite he has a better chance of securing the waking curriculum you are seeking.

 

Does this Psychiatrist support your view about the placement your son needs?

 

So look at each individual professional and their advice and decide whether they are useful to your case or not. Typically you can have three witnesses (my LEA have requested 7! - but SEND have only allowed 5, which maybe reduced further as we have a telephone case management soon).

 

Don't invite anyone who could be considered a hostile witness. Your witnesses are there to back up the reports and recommendations they have made.

 

On the day of the tribunal you will feel nervous obviously. Try to answer the Panels questions directly and in as few words as possible. Do not accuse anyone of anything (such as lying etc), let the Panel draw their own conclusions from the evidence they have. The Panel need to see you as a parent that has done their best to get their child's needs met. You don't want to turn it into the Jerry Springer Show (not that you would - but you know what I mean). The Panel will not let anyone make wild accusations without backing it up with evidence.

 

[i've also received a further case summary from the LEA stating that my son is not as complex as mum believes and that I am out of line with the LEA and professional opinion. I know that isn't true and I do have reports - from the LEA and NHS professionals that back up my position. The LEA are just throwing mud in an attempt that some of it will stick. But actually they are making themselves look very silly.]

 

Who are attending as witnesses for the LEA?

 

 

Hi sally thanks for your reply.

 

I have found a independant SEN support service who are going throw the reports with me and could attend a tribunal if we go down that route.

 

J has already had independant assessments and reports so we have those too.

 

As for the pyshiactisits dx.

 

J was assessed by CAMS earlier this year as a urgent appointment and has recieved a dx of ASD and Anxiety Disorder.

 

The court psychiatrist dx Conduct Disorder and ASD Traits and OCD Traits and agreed with his preivious dx of ADHD, Dyslexia ect.... but said that his problems also extended because of his Mothers mental health problems.

 

I have never hid my Mental health problems and Ive had them before J was even born so proffessionals have known about my mental health problems before when they dx J with Features of ASD, ADHD, Dyslexia, Anxiety ect,,,, so my mental health didnt interfer with Js previous special needs did they, but some how now Im after a 52wk provision my Mental health is a cause of Js problems also, to extent because I didnt recieve the support I required it did have some effect on J but thier not the cause of Js special needs.

 

I have nothing to be embarrased or ashamed about my Mental health problems, Im functioning and Im stable when I meet my own mental health needs, caring for J 24-7 without support I struggle to meet my own needs.

 

The CAMS psychiatrist did a report to the LEA to recommend a 52 WK school

 

The court Psychiatrist and Guardian though feel his needs could still be met at his present resi special school and additional seperate respite provision they did see the benefit of a 52 wk provision and have recommended a 52wk provision on the agreement there is an intirum care order to ensure the right 52 wk provision is granted, meaning the Local authority have shared guardianship. (more control) hence I agreed to the ICO because I disagreed that the present 38wk resi school can meet Js needs, I have evidence that he wasnt progressing academically or in his SALT so I went with the agreement of an Ico to get what J needs in the long term, a 52 wk provision, which is now in process of finding one that will meet his needs and will offer J a place.

 

The specific hearing APD assessment has been agreed to take place at his present school, do you see why I am not holding out any hope there, they couldnt even manage his SALT.

 

The APD assessment was aproved to take place in previous child protection meetings, but its hasnt stopped the ss to try and suggest Im just after more labels and its going against me, this APD Assessment should of taken place three years ago.

 

Things have settled down though the last couple of days.

 

Im learning to let go a littlexxx

 

JsMumx

Edited May 5, 2011 by JsMum

[Karen A]

Hi.

 

Sorry I have not been around and just picked up on your awful situation. <'> <'>

Please do as Kathryn and others have suggested and try to work with SS if you can.

Once it is on record that a parent has a history of mental health problems it may well influence the opinions of those who read reports because that is what they look for.Even if a child has a diagnosis of ASD some professionals might argue that that makes them more vulnerable to the impact of parental mental health problems.

 

However well you are now it is still on record that you have been unwell and your son is very challenging which impacts both of you.

This is not intended to be critical.I learned from experience that even after years of support from CAMHS and Ben having a clear ASD diagnosis some professionals still never accepted it because I had happened to be unwell in the first three years of his life.

 

The court psychiatrist is likely to be extremely experienced in the field.Unfortunately their reports are probably likely to carry more weight than any professional you could fund.In my very limited opinion a diagnosis of conduct disorder will at least be taken seriously with a requirement for specialist input.

 

Karen.

Edited May 18, 2011 by Karen A

[JsMum]

Hi Karen, welcome backxxx

 

Yes its a deverstating situation but with some positives as well.

 

Respite is going well and though the resi school say that J is doing ok he is still recieving sanctions consecutively and I really do feel that the school doesnt understand Js needs, they do things with no warnings, planning and often no thoughts whats so ever the effect it has on Js well being.

 

 

My hands are tied and I cant do nothing but to listen to J and tell him I love him and I do care about him.

 

I know the court will favour the court Psych which is why I agreed to the ICO with the understanding J will be going into a 52wk resi school.

 

Jays Social worker has not been available for a while so things have been quiet on the SS front..would love to know what Id of done if none of this happened and I needed the social worker this week!

 

There is some amazing positive news in respect of new 52 wk specialists school, two schools have formally awarded Jay a place and can start as soon as the placement is required including the one I have already requested be in part 4 of Js statement.

 

It is amazing news, and another prospectus school is assessing Jay now, so we could have three 52 wk schools to choose from.

 

Were just waiting for the go ahead from LA for J to visit the schools and choose one and request it be written in part 4 of his statement.

 

J has a couple of weeks left to go before he breaks up so we will know more by then and were back at court soon.

 

JsMumx

[sesley]

a specialist school may well be best for him.The rules and routines is what they like. You will i hope be given plenty of oppertunity to have personnel time with him. To keep the family bond going. being positive and working with them is the best option. I wish you all the best for the future.