Panel of LEA experts - core team panel

[workingmum]

Hello, anyone here has any experiences of meeting with a panel of LEA experts to discuss what school will be suitable for their child - as mainstream suggested initially a bit unsure - child might need a much smaller school setting. however we dont want a special school.

[caci]

I think you will find the "experts" will always offer what they consider "best use of resources" which actually means the cheapest option they can provide.

 

If you want another setting, you may need to employ a good solicitor and go to tribunal to prove the school you have chosen can meet your son's needs, whereas the one they suggest can't. It can be done, but could become very time consuming (and expensive)

[Sally44]

You can ask your local authority for their list of maintained, approved and independent schools.

Your LEA will have some mainstream schools that will have an autism unit.

There will be some special schools which are usually for MLD.

There maybe a school for children who are profoundly autistic.

 

From your post it sounds like your child falls into that very difficult category of being cognitively capable - and therefore does not fit MLD criteria - and yet cannot cope mainstream due to difficulties associated with his diagnosis.

 

You can go and visit all the schools you identify on the LEA list and see what they have to offer. You are looking specifically for any schools that have higher proportion of students on the spectrum, or who have an autism unit (you would hope those schools had more understanding and better approaches/teaching strategies etc).

 

If there is nothing suitable, you can search in neighbouring LEAs. Then it would be down to your LEA agreeing the fund a place in a neighbouring LEA.

 

There are also independent schools where LEAs fund a place at such a school because they do not have anything else available. You can go and visit them. These schools are usually for children with speech and language disorders/aspergers/SpLD etc.

 

But the LEA will fight vigerously against any parent who wishes to place their child anywhere other than maintained mainstream simply because it costs them more money. It would almost certainly mean you would have to go to an educational tribunal and you would need as much evidence as you could gather to support your claim that school X is the ONLY one that can meet his needs.

 

Can I ask how old your child is now? And are you seeking mainstream for the reasons I've indicated above, or is there some other reason?

 

I would just like to add that if you did find yourselves seeking an independent placement that the best time to do that is at secondary transfer.

 

If you feel that your child is not coping mainstream, then it is definately worth visiting special schools as well to see the kind of pupils they have.

 

Although a MLD is not really suitable, the facts are that you would almost certainly fail any attempt to move a primary school child into an independent school. And if your child is not coping mainstream, then you run the risk of future problems with anxiety, emotional problems, and even mental health problems.

 

In a special school there should be specialist teachers, and there maybe more access to Speech Therapists and Occupational Therapists that your son would certainly find it harder to get the same level of access and provision in a mainstream school.

 

If the special school is able to meet his academic level, and is also able to teach him social skills and emotional literacy skills - which mainstream schools often completely fail to address - then IMO it is worth considering seriously whether such a school could meet his current needs and teach him skills he will not automatically pick up and leave the big fight for secondary school to transfer year.

 

As someone else posted in another posting. No child learns if they are not happy. And children on the spectrum are notorious for having anxiety issues.

 

But if you post a bit more to give everyone a better picture of your child that might help.

[workingmum]

Thanks for all your comments. well we had preferenced a mainstream secondary school with ASD unit attached but LEA and school turned us down before the DX of ASD was made. LEA named a mainstream school with no provision for ASD and dont cater for my child complex needs.

we do not want a special school as abilities are well above a special school arrangement.

 

Now the panel to sit and discuss which setting - school would fit as it seems their previous choice wont be suitable and our preference - the school says cannot meet needs. we had not planned for an alternative however have been lokking and no school in the borough caters except some special schools and a few independent schools. we have a tribunal hearing in May.

 

anel to sit before May, we dont have an idea on what school as we are limited. We are thinking of asking our advocate/solicitor to look into asking the LEA to name an independent school - however we need to visit all these schools before end of next month and make a decision in less than a month. so confused.

You are right Sally44 - reasons for mainstream choice. so with the new ammunition - DX of ASD - we might be able to push for the previous mainstream however school thinks child might struggle and needs a much smaller setting. So confused now. not sure which way to go with this one.

[Sally44]

Was there a mainstream maintained school with an ASD unit that you said was your parental choice and the LEA said it was full?? Were you seeking the ASD unit and they said it was full? Or were you seeking a mainstream place and they said the school was full?

 

If so, go to tribunal for that placement. The tribunal Panel can ask the school to make another place if they feel that is the right place.

 

Alternatively, go to tribunal seeking an independent school that caters for cogntively able children on the spectrum and watch how fast a place appears at the school you initially wanted.

 

In my experience, many schools that have an ASD unit do not move mainstream children into the unit for the occasional lesson or extra input etc. That is because everyone will say that it can upset the children who are the regulars in the unit. Those children in the unit may well be fed over to mainstream for occasional lessons. But not the other way around.

 

And you would hope that some of the expertise from the autism unit rubbed off in the mainstream school. But that has not been my experience. My experience is that they are two different entities and they do not meet.

[Sally44]

If you have a tribunal in May you have to get your skates on.

 

What is your final date for submissions to the appeal?

 

You need an EP to go into the school the LEA has named and for them to say "it cannot meet your son's needs", and you need that same EP to go into the independent school and say it can meet his needs.

 

Your son needs to have been seen by this independent school (usually over a 3 day period). The independent school has to say that they can meet his needs and they need to write to you offering your son a place there.

 

You need to provide costings for this placement. The independent school should give you/LEA details of their fees. Check and make sure they have all the professionals your son needs in-house. If they don't then they need to get costings for additional professional input.

 

The LEA have to produce their own costings of how much it would cost them to provide the level of support your child needs.

 

You can also get evidence of costs to compare against the LEAs cost. For example, if the LEA do not have an OT provision for education, then you need an independent OT to quote for the provision your son needs (and that should already be in the OT report you have towards this tribunal).

 

If you have not included part 4 as part of your appeal to SEND, you need to contact SEND and tell them you want to include part 4 in the appeal. SEND will send you a form to fill in. You return it and they send it to the LEA with a decision on whether the LEA needs any extra time in which to consider the independent school placement.

 

Look also at transport. The independent school may already have children coming from your area by taxi - see if there is a place available in any taxis so that your son's cost is spread between the children.

 

Any provision the LEA are suggesting they will "add on" to the mainstream, you need to Cost in the travelling time of all professionals too, so it isn't 1 hour/wk speech therapy if it takes the SALT an hour to travel to/from the school. You would cost that at 2 hrs/wk of Speech therapy.

 

What age is your son now and what year is he in?

 

Do you have all independent reports to support your case? Are they all coming to tribunal as expert witnesses? Is the solicitor also coming to the tribunal? This is all very costly, so unless you can afford to do this again and again it is worth considering whether to save your money until transfer year - unless you are in transfer year already.

[workingmum]

Tribunal dates are - Attendance details to the LA and Tribunal by 28th Feb

Last date for submission of evidence and arguments is 18th April

Hearing date is 18th May.

 

Sally44 - we asked for a mainstream with ASD unit attached - we were offer a closer school. this was before the DX of ASD. the school with ASD unit said they cannot cater for needs and they are full.

 

We had gone to tribunal for the school with the ASD, the SENCO mentioned that they (sch and the ed psych) discussed that Dc might be better in a smaller environment - smaller class. I have asked an independent Ed psych to assess both the mainstream sch with ASD and another independent school with ASD provision.

 

We had not even considered independent school to be honest so am a bit at a loss - as need to do this with regards to the dates above as well as the ed psych results. we now feel we have to fight for the independent school instead. we have not contact them yet - will do so as soon as the half term is over. Lot of time have been wasted by LEA to be honest - no need crying over that now - we are where we are.

 

DC is in year 6 - hence sec school transfer etc.Solictor will be attending both the core team panel meeting and the tribunal hearing.

[Sally44]

Okay, so correct me if I am wrong.

 

The school with the ASD unit has already said they are full and cannot meet his needs?

 

So the LEA have offered you another mainstream school which has even less expertise and experience than your parental choice, and that school refused on the grounds that they can't meet your son's complex needs? Do you have that refusal in writing from them? If not write to them saying that "further to our conversation/meeting, that you just want to clarify the position that your school cannot meet my sons SEN and that you have no place available for him." You want to get that in writing because at tribunal that school may "find another place" - you'd be surprised how often that happens. That might be the happy ending you are after. But you have said they have told you "they cannot meet his needs." That is something totally different. They are not just talking about a lack of places, they are saying they cannot provide the provision he needs to meet all his SEN. That is significant because it means the LEAs other offer is totally ridiculous.

 

So you are now looking at an independent school, but have not approached it yet, and the EP has not visited it yet. Have you named this independent school in your appeal? Have you appealed section 4?

 

 

I would check this with IPSEA. But my advice would be to phone SEND and say "the reason for the appeal was because the LEA could not place your child in your preferred school places as that school (which has expertise and experience of ASD), said that they could not meet his needs and that they were full). And that this has now left you without any other choice of school other than looking at an independent placement." Ask SEND "In these circumstances I will need my son to be assessed by this school to ensure that they can say they can meet his needs and for you to obtain the written letter from the school offering your son a place there." Say "You would like to seek an extention on the time limits to achieve this". They will tell you what you need to do. You will need to make a formal request to SEND and they are not obliged to agree to any extension. But don't request this extention until you have spoken with your solicitor and the Independent school.

 

But your solicitor, should know all about this anyway. Is he a specific SEN? solicitor?

 

Eventhough it is half term it is still worth phoning or emailing the school because staff are often in and your query needs to be dealt with urgently.

Edited February 21, 2011 by Sally44

[workingmum]

Exactly Sally44, our preference which is the mainstream school Sch A -with ASD unit - says they will not be able to cope and yes we have this in wrting from the school as well as the LEA supporting the school - in their response to the tribunal- my appeal.

 

However the other school has not sent any response whatsoever and in a letter from the LEA to the school - they implied that if no response was given - that meant they - sch B can cope - however when i rang them to discuss they said they had no experience of ASD or similar. Not sure if i have to get them to put that in writing - pressure from LEA i feel , they might not

 

so sch A with ASD unit says no and Sch B with no experience has kept quiet no response to LEA or ourselves.

 

Yes, our solicitor has SEN experience with the SENDIST - i am to speak to her on Wed - to discuss these. Thanks for your responses so far - please keeping it coming - so i dont go insane. i am very appreciative. I have tried to contact the school today - sent them an email, will try again and hopefully can attend their open morning next month. its just that time is of the essence and that worries me.

 

Also worying is what the core team panel might come up with - not knowing how they decide is doing my head in - can they suggest mainstream or independent - any ideas- i gues they might play the finance game.

Edited February 21, 2011 by workingmum

[smartloobylou]

Hi

 

dont know if you saw my post from yesterday?

 

http://www.asd-forum.org.uk/forum/Index.php?/topic/26193-interesting-article-on-obtaining-lea-support-in-independant-schools/page__p__303299__fromsearch__1#entry303299

 

My son is in an independant school and im now starting out down the stauatory assessment route as i feel he would get more support in a state school - but the right state school! However im new to all this and i wonder if it will end up needing to be an independant school due to the smaller class sizes and individual attention. However after reading this, i would not hesitate to either go for funding or to request a state-funded learning support assistance. My son also has dyslexia and is very bright. A really tricky combination to accomodate.

 

HTH, Louise x

[workingmum]

Hello SmartLoobylou.

 

yes, read this - all information about costing are now on the DCSF website. I was looking at this all night yesterday,

 

5-6k per child in state school per annum

 

12k and much in special school.

 

Independent school round 12K minimum per annum

 

 

i wonder how the other bits are calculated - e.g 1 to 1 support (10 hours per week), OT input, specialist TA, scribe for exams, laptop maybe and added to the state cost.

 

Looking at the cost as a rough guide really. However will speak to my solicitor today.