Going to look at special school after half term

[Sally44]

Who are the "Vulnerable Learners"?

 

You can still appeal after an AR if amendments are NOT made. So if you have anything in writing from the Vulnerable Learners you can appeal to SEND and include that info. If they just gave their recommendations verbally, phone them first and ask them to put it in writing, and then follow that up with a letter stating what you discussed and what was agreed.

 

It is so annoying that they don't produce reports. Or if they do produce anything it is not circulated 2 weeks before.

 

That is why we got that included on our Statement because we could prove that without it it would not happen.

 

So also include that in your appeal eg. that all professionals involved will assess your child using standardised assessments and will produce an up to date report for the Annual Review, which will be circulated at least 2 weeks before the date of the AR.

 

Mind you, having said that, that still does not stop them producing a report that is pants!

 

If they are saying alot of 1:1 and withdrawal, you also have a good case for arguing for an independent school that can do that, and which can also deliver those therapies within the classroom [by the SALT and OT working with children in the classroom], and which can work 1:1 and also in small group work with similar peers.

 

Make sure you don't miss the deadline to appeal.

 

Go and visit Farleigh so you have a good idea of whether you think it is/isn't suitable for your child. Because you need to be absolutely clear on which is the ONLY school that can meet his needs, because that will form the basis of your argument in the appeal and at the Hearing.

 

If you are unsure about placement, you can even leave that our of the initial appeal, eg. appeal parts 2 and 3, and then send in a Request for Changes form asking for part 4 to be included in the appeal because you are now sure that his current placement cannot meet his needs and that xxxxxxx school is the ONLY one that can.

 

Remember at my AR the EP said my son did not have dyslexia [eventhough he was illiterate at 10+ years old]. Then when I lodged a formal complaint, the LA decided to do a total re-assessment which meant the EP went into his school and assessed him just one month after the AR and decided he did have dyslexia! But as part of the re-assessment the LA refused to include any of my earlier independent reports, which formed all the provision in his current Statement.

 

So remember that LA's do know all the tricks. But when you get to the actual hearing the Panel will not like what they have done. So spell out anything the LA/school have not done in your appeal.

 

My appeal also mentioned the wording of the Statement and how the LA were managing to dance around the interpretation of the wording eg. "should" does not mean "must" etc to allow them to NOT provide the provision in his Statement or identify needs, and I asked the SEND Panel to word the Statement so that it was legally binding on the LA, otherwise the Statement was not worth having.

[Sally44]

I would also make sure that from now on you put everything in writing.

 

You always have someone with you at meetings who minutes what is discussed and agreed.

 

Or record meetings verbatim. But you may need two dictaphones to enable you and the LA to both have a copy of the meeting at the end. Otherwise the LA can accuse you or tampering with the taped evidence.

 

Such a pain that we have to go to such lengths. But as you have experienced yourself. You are in a meeting where you think everyone is agreeing and nodding and then the outcome is like it was a totally different meeting to the one you attended!

[KezT]

Vulnerable Learners are just the SEN team really! It's who they send in to assist the school when they don't have a proper EP for one reason or another. Cos we're such a small county, we only have one EP (as far as I can work out) and she was off sick for ages so they are massively behind. I have already made my complaint about the lack of proper EP assessment/report clear - but the VLS woman seemed so confident that she would get everything written into his SM immediately!

 

She did say she would be writing a report - if it doesn't turn up in a wek I will chase/formally complain..

 

We are booked in to see The Priory School in Frome shortly, and I am also looking at Cambian Group, although they are further away. I have told the LA that we are still only looking at this amended SM as being an interim measure while we research suitable provision in neighbouring counties - which is vague enough but still true:) I think they know we are looking at Independant though - it is the obvious choice for him.... I can't see any hope of getting the placement wthout a full Tribunal The problem with being a small county is that such a placement would take up a large portion of the SEN budget - but the prognosis for him without a decent educational placement would cost a lot more in the long run:(

[Sally44]

Also remember to get evidence on the provision and staff your LA has.

 

It is important that the Panel knows that they only have one EP that covers how many schools??

 

At our first Tribunal the LA said that they would involve the Autism Advisory Teacher. Her input was detailed in my Statement, but said "advice and input from the Autism Advisory Teacher should be sought when necessary". Unfortunately the wording was like a chocolate teapot! The school SENCO never thought it ever was necessary as they never had any concerns. And I later found out via a letter I wrote to the Head of Specialist Teaching Services, that the AAT never even goes into that school because it is classed as enhanced resource. The AAT only went into mainstream schools, and she worked alone, and had around 200 children on her caseload.

 

That kind of information is VERY useful. So I could include that information in the Bundle as part of our appeal. Our LA simply did not have the staff or expertise to meet my sons needs. They had one person to cover 200 children which allowed her about one day per year per child. But it took me years to get that information out of them. When you have that information it becomes very clear whether the school/LA really can meet need - and often they can't, but pretend they can.

 

We also argued that the more our child learnt whilst in school about academic, social, relationships, daily living skills and life skills, the more he would be able to contribute towards society and had potential to be independent living and working. But that IF he did not have that input now, that as a dependent adult it would cost alot more for him to be on benefits for life, in sheltered accommodation, with carers and a social worker 24/7.

 

And we know that with help and support it is possible because we achieved it for my older sister who lives and works independently.

 

School hunting is rather like house hunting. One of them will just feel right.

 

Make a list of questions you want to ask about professionals employed on site, qualifications of teachers, class sizes, approaches used, peer group and criteria for the school, any co-morbid diagnoses your child has, whether they will produce a report or assess, what kind of trial period he would have with them etc.

 

Please don't believe anything you are told by the LA unless they put it in writing to you. Always follow up conversations with a letter [because if they don't respond, that is considered agreement with the contents of the letter].

 

Good luck with it all. This should be the final push and then wherever he is placed he should remain there up until age 19.

 

Ask each school where they feed their children into eg. colleges etc. and which types of courses and qualifications are available.

[KezT]

Visted the Priory Group School today - it iwas so much better than the special school:) The other students "looked" like DS would fit in there.... their classrooms looked like a secondary school, rather than a primary. They were all studyng for GCSE's - had a good chat t a couple of teachers, who spoke about their subject as well as the social issues.

 

All of their students are LA funded, so it IS possible. I explained that I was hoping to get the funding BEFORE DS was dx'd with several co-morbidities, which is against the system, but ought to be possible!

 

Next job I guess is to start getting the private reports and to try to get current school on side to say outright that they are not coping with him..... I'm a bit torn between allowing DS to "play up"/refuse school to get the reports, and working with him to keep him in school and learning during the appeal process. atm I'm going to keep working with him as it the best thng for him personally......

[bed32]

It sounds interesting - we are off to see a Priory school next week - and a Cambian school in April - our son is almost nine so we are a couple of years behind you and we're not sure when we'd be looking to transfer if we think that it the right way to go.

[Sally44]

Can you get any co-morbid diagnosis as part of any independent reports you get? What co-morbid diagnoses are you thinking are in the pipeline?

 

If the school or the NHS have or are dragging their feet with a diagnosis, you can include that as well ie. "in 2009 we informed the SENCO that we had concerns our son had Dyslexia. This has not been acted on. The SENCO has not referred him to the EP and the EP has not assessed our child and is stating that the LA has a policy of not assessing or diagnosing children with a SpLD. This is a blanket policy and is illegal. This has caused our son to have increased anxiety in school demonstrated by his low self esteem, lack of confidence, and school refusal. The Priory school can meet these needs, and they have many children with a similar combination and severity of disorders as our son"

 

It would also help to know how many children at his current secondary school have a formal diagnosis of ALL his diagnoses eg. how many with Aspergers, how many with Dyspraxia. If the school write back that a number of children have 'similar' difficulties but not a diagnosis, that is further evidence that the LA/School are not referring children to professionals for their needs to be identified, they are "assuming" a child has certain difficulties without any medical confirmation. And that means that any support [if there is any], is going to be a general one size fits all approach to all children with dyslexia, or dyspraxia - where these difficulties are individual to the child and can need very different kinds of approaches or supports. It also means that the school has no idea of the "cause" of a child's difficulties and may not be meeting the need at all especially if it has a sensory base eg. being easily distracted maybe due to sensory overload and until that issue is addressed any other approach to improve focus or attention is going to fail.

 

Remember that you don't need those diagnosis to lodge the appeal. Your appeal basically would state [with examples], that part 2 does not identify every need and part 3 does not quantify and specify provision. You can include part 4 [the placement] now as part of the appeal, or leave it until a bit later on and add part 4 using a Request for Changes Form and the reason you would be asking for part 4 to be included could be something like "we now believe that the current placement cannot meet our sons severe and complex needs and that xxxxx school is the only placement that can."

 

Remember that your private reports will be submitted just before the deadline for submissions date, and they should include co-morbid diagnosis.

 

Remember to write to specific departments within your LA that may claim they can meet certain needs for example Dyslexia, and ask them how many teachers they have, how many have a specific dyslexia qualification [or indeed any ASD qualification] on top of their teaching qualification. Ask the same questions from the Priory group too. Infact, ask the Priory group for a copy of the letter the LA usually sends to them asking them questions, and send those same questions to your LA too. This usually involves asking questions about qualifications and on-going training etc.

 

Remember that you will need to prove your child needs the provision at the Priory School [or any other independent school, if you choose a different one]. So you need recommendations in reports that state the class size, the therapy input needed from OT and SALT. A diagnosis of Sensory Processing Disorder. And that the priory group is a similar peer group.

 

Do the Priory write any report or letter when your child has a trial period with them?

 

Will all the independent schools require that he boards?

 

Do you have CAHMS and Clinical Psychology involved due to his anxiety, school refusal, etc.

 

I'm glad that you found it much better than expected.

Edited March 23, 2012 by Sally44

[Aginoth]

Hi all,

 

Quick update of where KezT and I have got to with our DS.

 

We have today officially requested an Independent Specialist School to be named in Part 4 of his Statement...and so begins our latest fight against the LA.

 

Will keep you posted.

[Sally44]

Has that school offered your son a place in writing.

 

Has your son gone for a trial period?

[KezT]

Has that school offered your son a place in writing.

 

Has your son gone for a trial period?

 

No - they said to request the change of named school, and when LA contact them they will offer the trial/place. They have spaces atm.....

[Kazzen161]

I would check with IPSEA, as if you specify a school and they then do not offer a place I am not sure where you stand with your appeal.

[Sally44]

Ask the school what you do if the LA do not respond. You do need an offer of a placement in writing to submit as part of your appeal. As well as a trial at the school [usually 3 days], with the school writing up a report about that - and their therapeutic team should spend some time with your son and include their observations and findings in the report.

[KezT]

Just a quick update .

 

I met with the VLS woman again last night and we all agreed that the practises/techniques she had put in place were not working - he was getting worse rather than better:( She agreed that the school was doing everything it was asked to, and that he wasn't currently getting an education there. I said that it was the best choice of mainstream in our LA and she agreed that there was no point looking at moving him to another MS school. I then said that the autism units in neighbouring borough were also not suitable and she agreed that he wouldn't get the academic teaching he needs there. She asked if I had looked at anything else and I said we had been to independent special schools which we thought would be eminently suitable. She said "I don't blame you" which is not the worst answer I s'pose;)

 

As I didn't get any kind of report/minutes etc from the last meeting,I have sent a letter confirming what was discussed this time.

 

So far this term, DS has attended less than 50% of lessons. It was parents evening last week and I asked each subject teacher if they thought he could be educated at that school - all except one said no:( A couple said that they would be will to put that in writing if we wished - trying to decide if I should write to each teacher individually to confirm what they said?

 

He was excluded for 5 days at 9.00am today..... I can't really get much out of as to why (he has explained from is PoV, but what he said wouldn't warrant a 5 day exclusion) - the school has called an emergency SEN team meeting. I assume this is similar/the same as an EMergency review and wonder if they are going to try to push things along a bit?

[Sally44]

Do try to get things in writing.

 

And remember with meetings to keep putting the ball back into their court. The meeting is not about what you want. It is about what they recommend for your son. They are the professionals. So keep them talking. Ask them the questions.

 

We were asked a number of times "what do you think it would take to get your son back into school", and we replied "we were hoping that this meeting was about you telling us how you would achieve that."

 

Don't assume anything. Always ask what the point of the meeting is. Always ask who is attending beforehand. Always take notes or record it on dictaphone.

 

A 5 day exclusion sounds like it was something major. I don't know much about exclusions. Maybe some advice from ace-ed.org would be useful?

[KezT]

Still waiting for the emergency SEN meeting - as I haven't heard anything and although DS has finished his exclusion, he is only in school for a couple of hours a day, and not in class at all until the end of term (I know this counts as an illegal exclusion, but I'm using it as evidence that they can't meet his needs), I wrote to the school on Monday maintaining that he was not being adequately educated and it was unacceptable and detrimental to his long term education and mental health to continue to keep him isolated. I repeated my expectation of an urgent review meeting "to discuss a long term solution". I will ask them what they suggest when that is finally called......

 

Today we get a phone call saying that Vulnerable Learners have given up and are passing him up to the EP service - which I believe is what I asked for (in writing) several months ago! grrrr!

 

I have taken to writing letters "confirming" every conversation we have now, as all the professionals seem incapable of putting anything in writing! I'm hoping that these will count as written records in a tribunal if required.

 

We're still waiting for the independent school to arrange a trial placement/assessment

 

Getting very frustrated - time is ticking on and soon we'll be into another term:( *sigh*

 

On the plus side - without the stress on attending school, DS has been much nicer at home......

[Sally44]

Yes you need it all in writing as that is your evidence of what you have told them and that they have done nothing.

 

Don't push too much for them to do stuff. Leave them to do nothing. Just ask things like "are school doing everything they can to meet his needs." If they confirm they are, that means they have nothing else to offer. So ask them if there is anything additional on top of what has been provided up till now that they could try. And if they say no that is very useful.

 

At least they have passed him onto the EP service, which means they cannot argue at Tribunal that their next step would have been to involve the EP and that they need time to see what improvement the EP involvement can achieve.

Edited May 22, 2012 by Sally44

[Aginoth]

UPDATE: DS has been offered a place at North Hill House in Frome. Appeal letter drafted and will be off to SEN Team today asking for change of Part 4.

 

He hasn't been in lessons at his mainstream school now for almost 2 months, they have agreed with us that they cannot, nor will they be able to, meet his needs; so have the SEN team's own Vulnerable Learners Service. Every meeting and phone call for the last few months has been minuted and as yet LA have failed to respond to any of the minutes and records of telephone calls we have sent them.

 

LA EP is reviewing him today, so the school have had to return him to proper lessons for the day for him to be assessed by the EP, all a bit of a faff really. He is in a pretty foul mood this morning about returning to the school following his visit to North Hill House, so should give a good showing of his "Normal" in class behaviour I expect.

 

DS got on really well at North Hill House and enjoyed it a lot, lots of incentive for us to keep on going until he gets the funding to attend there from the LA.

 

The fight continues

[Sally44]

I think the fight is so much easier when you are focused on what you KNOW is the only placement that will work. Up until then it is all about 'what if's'. And a move to this school is 'not going to solve all the problems', which was an argument our LA put forward. BUT if that is the only placement that can meet his needs, that is the only placement that can respond quickly and flexibly to meet his support and therapy needs on a day to day basis. Without them having permanent employed staff, you [our] children often end up refusing to go to school and it is not good for them to get out of that routine.

 

You are so fortunate to have other NHS/LA professionals and the school backing you on this, and that you have it all minuted in writing.

 

What therapies does North Hill House provide as standard? - is it SALT and OT, and do you have reports stating that your son needs those therapies, and the frequency of them?

 

My LA did provide funding for an OT to my sons former mainstream primary school. So be prepared for anything the LA may suddenly decide to OFFER to his school as part of their argument that they can meet his needs.

 

Regarding the OT, we proved that they were not qualified to deliver a pure sensory integration programme as the LA could not/would not confirm if they had completed the required sensory integration modules. The funding was also part time, and we argued that due to my sons needs access to OT had to be available flexibly across the week as and when he needed it on top of 1:1 therapy - which also needed to be flexible for the times when my son would refuse, or be unable to engage.

 

So be prepared for anything.

 

Also make sure that North Hill House can meet his needs within their standard fees. My son's independent school had to provide for specialist Dyslexia Teaching on top of their fees because my son had Dyslexia and they did not have anyone suitably qualified [and neither did the LA - which I checked and had confirmed in writing].

 

Have you actually lodged the appeal yet.

[Aginoth]

We lodged our intent to appeal to the LA this afternoon, actual appeal letter to the tribunal service will be sent in next day or so.

[Sally44]

Now the fun begins.

[Aginoth]

SEN Panel Meeting to decide if they will accept the change of named school on Wednesday (20th June). Writing a letter/email right now to send to our SEN officer to make sure he knows our thoughts and views, and to thank him for his efforts on our behalf (never hurts to say nice things to people ), and to remind the SEN team what they have said to us over the last few months - that being everything we put in writing and they didn't reply to to contradict.

 

Have spoken to Supportive Parents today to pre-prepare (made up word) for the inevitable appeal, but sounds like we have most of the evidence we need already; just an up to date Private EP report to get really to back up all the earlier evidence in our favour, and a few supporting professional statements from former teachers of high standing to get.

[Sally44]

Make sure you time any additional independent reports so that they are the most up to date ones before any appeal. Don't get them too soon, so that the LA or NHS have an opportunity to sneak in and re-assess before he Tribunal.

 

Assessments should not be repeated inside of 6 months.

[Aginoth]

Decision of the Panel...

 

No Decision, not a "No" Decision, not a "Yes" Decision, nor a "Deferred" Decision just no decision; and no inkling given of when a decision will be made. In effect that means we currently have nothing to appeal against, we suspect this is a deliberate delaying tactic (maybe we're paranoid but we've been at this for a few years now)

 

The panel have asked the SEN Officer to investigate "other available suitable local provision", and then to report back to them. This then would be what we have already done over the last 3-4 months and kept them fully informed the whole time...just frustrating that they haven't done some legwork of this kind themselves at it was obvious to all concerned the exercise would need to be carried out.

 

So we have responded, trying to force their hand, asking for a clarification of whether they are officially saying "No" or "Deferred" at this time, as time is already worse than short for us to get an appeal in of necessary and get DS into the Independent School for September 2012. We have also asked them to clarify the time-scale they perceive this investigation of provision will take.

 

More updates as and when we get a response.

Edited June 20, 2012 by Aginoth

[Sally44]

Did all this start as an emergency review? If so, check what the legal timescale is for the LA to inform you whether they are going to amend the Statement or not. I think an emergency review, is the same as an Annual Review [i believe interim reviews are different], but get clarification and check up on the timescales involved with somewhere like IPSEA. Use their email service if you cannot get through on the phone.

 

If there is a timescale, they have to come to a decision within that timeframe.

 

If there isn't a timescale [which is unusual], I would write to them giving them a time scale eg. 14 days within which to respond.

 

You need to visit any other placement that is put forward as a possibility. And this is where you really have to scrutinize what the placement provides and what the qualifications of the staff are, and what the peer group is like etc. And you have to send them a letter asking all these things and asking for a written response, again within 14 days.

 

Then you have to write to the LA to their various departments and again ask them what provision they can provide ie. if your son has dyslexia, how many specialist teachers are in the specialist teaching department. How many of them have an additional qualification for teaching children with autism, and how many of those also have an additional qualification to teach and assess for dyslexia [must be level 7 as per PATOSS advice, because only a level 7 specialist teacher can 'assess', and you must have someone suitably qualified to not only teach, but to assess progress and monitor outcomes.]

 

When you have all that information you should be able to prove that that placement cannot meet his needs.

 

Think specifically too about questions like "xxxx school has an autism unit, however he children in that unit are fed across to take part in mainstream lessons, in mainstream classrooms with mainstream peers. There is no teaching that takes place in the Unit and the teachers in the unit are not suitably qualified to teach children with an ASD and dyslexia.

 

Or the children in the unit are mainly non-verbal or have challenging behaviours, which our son does not, and which would frighten him.

 

You've really got to be a detective about what the school/LA can provide and what they would have to buy in. You need a professional, qualified, cohesive teaching and therapy team that are employed on site so that they can meet his varying needs and deliver it flexibly across the week.

 

Also write to he NHS OT for confirmation that the PCT does not fund pure sensory integration therapy. Ask them if they do have anyone within their service that has completed the sensory modules, and if they deliver sensory integration therapy to any child within your LA, and is that delivered 1:1 in school.

 

You would also need to identify if the school had a suitable place dedicated to this type of therapy. It must be distractiion free, and cannot have people walking through it, past it etc. If they have a room that has various uses, that too is not practical. Would the therapist bring her equipment etc etc. You need to know everything because at the Appeal the LA will simply say that they will do whatever they have to do to meet the Stattement. You need to be able to prove that they cannot do it without buying it all in. Because your case rests on the fact that the LA/School cannot meet his needs.

 

You also need to put a case forward that the various professionals need to be employed on site so that there can be frequent discussions about your son. For them to immediately meet his needs on 'difficult days', and for him to have access to those professionals on site and not a 4 month referal.

 

Submit as evidence, but just before the deadline for submissions, that there has never been any joint meetings about your son's difficulties that is attended by all the professionals involved with your son. That professionals, especially health and education, do not communicate with eachother, that there is not a cohesive, multi disciplinary team delivery of his teaching and therapy needs and that professionals often do not speak to eachother from one year to the next.

 

If he is under Clinical Psychology and CAHMS, get in writing what his needs/difficulties are, what provision he needs and what they can offer to him and what laising, training they have done with your son's school to date. Which will be nothing I am sure.

 

Does your parental choice of school have a Psychologist on site, or a budget for one, or access to CAHMS professionals? That was a major part of our case, that my son's anxieties could not be met in school and were not being met via the NHS, but that his school did have access to those professionals and did seek input/training - and they have. They have gone for meetings with Clinical Psychology.

[Aginoth]

So as expected really, panel have refused our request for a change n Part 4.

 

Only grounds given for the refusal other than "inefficient use of Local Authority Resources" were "it was felt more time was needed to see what impact the interventions suggested by the Senior Educational Psychologist will have on his continued placement <at current school>"

 

So looks like time to start getting our appeal up and running.

[Sally44]

What interventions have they suggested?

 

Make sure you cooperative with the EP service, but keep a detailed diary of what happens each day.

 

Is your son going into school full time, or part time?

 

My son had 2 weekly sessions arranged, each of 1.5 hours in his former school. To begin with I took him in, if he agreed to go, and I told him that if he had had enough or could not take it anymore, he was to tell the teacher and she would bring him home. We taught him a hand sign, incase he could not communicate verbally.

 

The LA arranged for a special teacher [from one of their primary special schools] to meet him in school and they would go off together to 'play'.

 

Make sure you ask 'where' he is when in school. My son was having to be taught in the store room. Ask if he is agreeing to go out and play with other kids. My son was refusing to see or speak to anyone and would not go out into the playground.

 

Get as much info as you can from whoever is working with him. Ie. daily communication via telephone for them to tell you how the day went.

 

Don't push them to come up with any interventions - they can be doing that, or not doing that, whilst your appeal is running.

 

By the time of our appeal date it was clear that no progress had been made and the Panel said it was unlikely he would ever agree to return to his former school due to his experiences there. So if he is not gradually increasing the amount of time in school that is your evidence that he does not want to return. So make sure you explain to him that all children go to school, and that he too at some point will go to school, that if he cannot take it in his current school he can say so and ask to come home. It is very hard for a child to say to someone in authority that they refuse to do what is asked of them and want to go home.

 

You now need to gather all your evidence of what the current school and LA can provide out of the provision detailed in reports that your child needs. This is where things like specialist dyslexia teaching, and Sensory Integration Therapy by a suitably qualified OT becomes VERY important. Because although he may not get the level of SALT he needs, it is much easier for the LA to buy that in. It is much harder to find a specialist teacher qualified to both teach and assess, and the NHS does not fund sensory integration therapy, so they would have to buy that in. So they would have to find a suitably qualified OT that has completed the necessary modules. They would need the school to have a suitable room that could be set aside for this therapy, and the OT would need to have suitable equipment.

 

And JUST AS IMPORTANT is that the LA and the school need to be able to deliver that support, teaching and therapy 'flexibly across the week'. If they buy in an OT for Monday mornings, what happens if your son is ill, or refuses to engage on a Monday morning? You need an OT/SALT employed on site to be able to provide immediate support when needed, and to deliver and re-arrange therapy as needed.

 

My son gets alot of 'off curricular' access to therapy due to his anxiety. And that was a major issue the Panel concentrated on. That my parental choice of school had experience and expertise and employed professionals on site that could and did manage his anxiety.

 

But being realistic, they were never going to agree to your choice of placement. It is worth them going all the way just incase they can win on the day and save themselves the money.

 

But from now on leave it to them to demonstrate what they intend to do. Always bat the ball back into their court. It is not about what you want it is about your child being able to access education and being happy and relaxed and able to go into school and being calm enough whilst in school that he can learn.

[Aginoth]

Sally, What interventions is a bleeding good question, because we have yet to actually see the EP report that these interventions stem from. We're not convinced such a document actually exists, in which case the panel has made it's decision without the necessary written evidence to back up the decision.

 

I have today asked the SEN Officer to provide me with copies of the EP report the panel based it's decision on and the associated Action Plan detailing the interventions; and as far as we can tell the interventions are currently remove DS from all lessons except for English and Maths...obviously not acceptable.

Edited June 28, 2012 by Aginoth

[Sally44]

Make sure everything is in writing. You can't submit any 'verbal' evidence.

 

Remember I told you about the Funding Panel meeting where my son was not even on the Agenda to be discussed [but the Parent Partnership confirmed he was discussed], and the 'paperwork requesting the funding' that the Inclusion Officer submitted to the Panel [where she and her boss and one other person were also the only Panel members], did not exist. And they turned down the funding because they needed to ask more questions [presumably of themselves]. And when I sought copies of the paperwork [which the inclusion officer said she needed 4 weeks to ensure they were 'immaculate' so that funding was not turned down'] could not be found!

 

So I wrote them a letter asking them how it was possible to submit paperwork requesting funding which did not exist, and how they could turn down their own request because they needed to ask themselves more questions, and how bizzare it all looked when they were the only people on the Panel, and that it appeared to me that they were trying to appear to be doing something when actually they were not. And that the fact that this all happened without any paperwork so as to avoid a Freedom of Information Act search was highly irregular and probably maladministration that I would be bringing to the attention of the LGO.

 

So do ask the questions, in writing. And do do a Freedom of Information Act search on everyone school/LA departments and NHS. But submit it about a month after you have lodged your appeal.

 

So put in writing your request for a copy of the EP report and give them a timescale by which to provide it ie. within 14 days, so that you can see the 'interventions' the EP has recommended [as those interventions should be included into the Statement anyway].

 

Yes our EP suggested a reduced timetable of just two 1.5 hour sessions a week! Which I said, as part of the Appeal, was just giving him less hours in a place that he could not cope with or tolerate.

 

Has your son been for a trial at the school you want him to attend? It will be very interesting to see the contrast between his behaviour in the two different environments.

 

Our son went for two trials of 3 days. One when we lodged the appeal, and another about 6 months later. As he had deteriorated between those two trials, the independent school were able to detail his deterioration, which was very helpful.

 

You also need advice from CAHMS and ClinPsych if possible about his anxiety, and whether he has an Anxiety Disorder - and it is VERY important if your choice of school has pupils with similar difficulties and also if they buy in EP advice, or can go and visit the NHS CAHMS or ClinPsych professionals [as my son's therapy team have done]. You need to highlight that his current school has no contact or laison with NHS professionals in CAHMS or ClinPsych.

Edited June 28, 2012 by Sally44

[Sally44]

Just wanted to add something about timing.

 

You want to submit your evidence just inside the timescale for submissions. If you submit it earlier it gives the LA time to go through it and do something about it eg. if you say there have been no multi disciplinary team meetings about your son that have included both LA/school and NHS professionals, they may arrange one just so they can say they have recently held such a meeting.

 

An acquaintence of mine, whose son had been under CAHMS for years was asked at the Tribunal "how many MDT meetings have been held about your son?" She replied 'none'. The Panel were not happy with that at all. ASD is a medical disorder, and often there are additional diagnosis and difficulties which are also medical disorders. But Health cannot make Education do anything. However if a medical professional is not even being asked for their opinion or advice, that is very bad.

 

I did manage to get ClinPsych to write a letter confirming my son had an Anxiety Disorder. That evidence was submitted on the day of the tribunal. The LA refused to allow it to be submitted. But the Panel over ruled that as it was very important information.

 

It took quite a while, and a number of letters, to get ClinPsych to put that in writing. I basically told them that if they did not identify his needs, that they would not be incorporated into his Statement [which is true], and that if they were not in the Statement, those needs would not be provided for [which is true]. And that if we were left in that situation, without any medical evidence, my son would simply remain out of school and would deteriorate further.

 

Thankfully they confirmed the diagnosis. And that countered the LA's argument to the Panel that "parents have exaggerated the degree of difficulties xxxx has," which was their sole argument. That he is not complex, that he does not have these additional needs, that he can go back to his former primary school. So it made them look pretty stupid on the day of the Appeal to have to read that to the Panel as their counter argument.

[KezT]

Just an update:

 

The SEN officer admitted there is no EP report - she gave a verbal report to the panel! We are still waiting for the written report

 

SENDIST appeal going in this weekend

 

I have sourced private OT, EP & SLT who will be assessing in a few months time ready for the Tribunal.

 

Mainstream School Assistant Head in charge of SEN said he has been to two Tribunals previously, both of which the LEA lost, and is confident that we should win this one. He offered to attend on our behalf:)

 

Son has attended trial at Independent school - he attended all lessons, accessed the curriculum well,talked to some of the other boys, socialised in the evening (well, played computer games with others, but that IS socialising for an 11 year old ASD boy) and was generally a pleasant and happy child. No major violence of behavioural issues arose during his trail.

 

We have decided to try and speed things up any way possible, in the hope the panel may capitulate before a TRibunal and he may get to start in or at least near to September - therefore, we have written to the lovely Mr Gove, our local MP (also a Tory), Steven Twig, and a number of media outlets..... First report in the local paper today so hopefully it wil be picked up and the LEA will have some answering to do in public..... (Agi has started a separate post on this here: http://http://www.asd-forum.org.uk/forum/index.php?/topic/28364-attempt-at-media-pressure/page__pid__326813#entry326813 if you are interested)

Edited July 5, 2012 by KezT

[Sally44]

Hope it goes well.

What has the Assistant Head of mainstream school will be his opinion if asked by the Panel? Has he met your son, or is he simply going on the reports he has seen.

 

No i'm not surprised there was no actual EP report. Often there isn't. That makes it very hard to know what advice has been given to the Panel, or school, and to know if that advice is being followed.

 

Remember that although you are trying to rush things through for a September start, but as long as your choice of school says they will have a place available for the next 6 months, it may be better to leave it so that all the school places are full, and your son is not in school due to anxiety issues and not coping in his current placement.

[KezT]

Assistant Head will state that no mainstream or LA special Sch can meet his needs. He as done a lot of work with DS and I think honestly wants what is best for him. He didn't really become involved until things were starting to go very wrong, so hes only seen it not working!

 

The school received a verbal EP report too -which is when they shortened his days even more and removed him from the few lessons he was attending, much to the SENCo's frustration.

[Aginoth]

Long time no update...

 

SENDIST Tribunal is in January.

 

All our private reports are in, EP the last one we received today. We have engaged an Educational Specialist Solicitor to streamline our case for the last couple of months. Has inevitably cost us several Thousand Pounds we don't have but hope it will be worth it.

 

FOI/DPA request to council has turned up some interesting and very helpful (for us) internal conversations from LEA.

 

Don't want to post to much more detail at this stage as aware that anything we put here can be read by LEA.

 

We will give all the details though when we have been to Tribunal.

Edited December 12, 2012 by Aginoth

[Sally44]

I'm glad the FOI search turned up some useful evidence.

Good luck for January.

Remember to annotate your Working Document so that you can refer to reports immediately to where they have stated that need or that provision. Only annotate your copy, not the LA's.

Make sure you have in writing what your LA/school can provide, and also what the NHS services do and do not fund.

[KezT]

They have (almost) offered us http://www.priorygroup.com/Locations/South-West/Mark-College.aspx He could go as a day pupil!

 

Opinions? Its not ASD specific but seems to cater for him academically & physically...... I've asked my solicitor to book a visit for us & him. Its amazing how much more we've achieved since the council were contacted by a solicitor!!!!

 

With xmas just a few days away,and the tribunal less than 2 weeks into next term, its a bit short notice to make such a major deision - but shows a massive u-turn from the council, who were still claiming mainstream was right for him until we got the FOI stuff through showing that NO-ONE thought that was true!

[Sally44]

I would go and visit and ask questions like how many of the children have a diagnosis of an ASD [as language disorder is part of the schools criteria, and part of the criteria for an ASD diagnosis]. Ask if any of the teaching staff have additional quaifications to teach children with an ASD, what ASD approaches do they use in their delivery of the curriculum. Are therapy staff also trained to work with children with an ASD.

 

Does your son also have a specific learning difficulty?

 

How long is the travelling time to this school.

 

Priory group schools are generally supposed to be good. Have you looked at their Ofsted report?

 

Which school are you seeking at the Tribunal?

[Kazzen161]

Why have they not suggested either Farleigh College or North Hill? Both are also Priory schools but are AS specific?

[KezT]

Farleigh was our first chice but is full, so North Hill Hse is the one that we requested in his SM. He has been for a trial there and they've offered him a place. We think they're trying to avoid paying the higher fees and more expensively, the boarding that is required for NHH.

 

[Sally44]

Then you have to highlight the differences between North Hill [which is your parental choice of school and the LA must go with that unless they can prove it is not suitable, or is not a good use of their resources]. Surely the Priory Group themselves can detail what the differences are between their two schools.

I would go and visit the other school, because you do need to see what the school environment, peer group, teaching and therapy group are like to be able to state at Tribunal that only North Hill is ASD specific and can meet your son's needs.

[Kazzen161]

Independent schools don't bow to pressure from the LA, so when you visit it, if you can explain why you think Mark College cannot meet all his needs (and say that you have seen North Hill and believe they can) they will often back you up. They don't want or need children there whose parents don't agree with the school choice/ethos or whose child's needs they cannot fully meet.

 

Both North Hill and Farleigh backed up my argument to the LA that a specific Cambian school could better meet his needs and chose not to offer him a place.