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CE3K

Toileting

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Hi. My grandson has a problem that every time he goes to use the toilet he ends up missing the pan leaving a small, sometimes large puddle in bathroom. Unless he is supervised this is what normally happens. As far as we are aware this does not seem to be a prob at school, well nobody has mentioned it to us. Also on occassions when doing a no.2, if it does not drop he helps it on it's way. As you can imagine this can result in a lot of mess being put elsewhere. We often have to check him and toilet after use. He does not bed wet and doesn't wet his trousers when out, although often asks to do no.1 on way home from school where no toilets are available. So as he's only 7yrs. i allow him to do so. He does this even when i have asked him if he needs before leaving school for home.

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Don't know if this is any help, but you can get these toilet targets, which may help. Lots of different designs are available:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Wee-Target-toilet-trainer-Football-Design-/160889616865?pt=UK_Baby_Potty_Training&hash=item2575c4b9e1

Best of luck :)

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Thanks for the link. Noting ventured nothing gained, so they say.

Thanks again.

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My son is still not using the toilet properly at 11...when he needs to use the toilet for no1, it is always at the last minute, when he can't hold it any longer and will either miss getting to the toilet on time or will use the toilet missing it completely and leaving a mess all around the toilet...it will take him litertally 30 seconds to leave the reception room pass through the dining room, through the lobby into the bathroom, use the toilet, wash his hands and be back in the reception room...I've tried everything but for some reason he just hates spending any reasonable amount of time in the bathroom, unless he wants a shower, than I have a problem getting himout;)p!...

 

My cousin used a penny dropped into the bottom of the toilet to train his son to wee straight into the toilet and it worked for him, we did the same but it did do any good...but give it a go, like you said, nothing ventured nothing gained:)...Gud luck!

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I also remember reading Donna Williams saying that she doesn't feel "I need to go to the toilet" the same way most NT people do. She will get a "feeling" in her tummy and have to think "Could this be hunger? Do I need to eat? Could it be I need the toilet? Do I have stomach ache, am I going to be sick?" - there doesn't seem to be much differentiation between the sensations for her. This could cause problems with toileting - not recognising that feeling? I don't know :s

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I also remember reading Donna Williams saying that she doesn't feel "I need to go to the toilet" the same way most NT people do. She will get a "feeling" in her tummy and have to think "Could this be hunger? Do I need to eat? Could it be I need the toilet? Do I have stomach ache, am I going to be sick?" - there doesn't seem to be much differentiation between the sensations for her. This could cause problems with toileting - not recognising that feeling? I don't know :s

 

rufusrufus, not to steel the thread from CE3K, but this reminds me of a time when I thought this may be the problem with my son not knowing when he really need to go...I also thought they may be a problem with the wiring system between his head and his stomach, maybe the stomach not recognising the need to go or the head not getting the message quick enough...I talked to my sons peadiatrician aswell as any other professionals who would listen but they looked at me with that look that says, 'hmmm...an over protective mum'...we're the specialists and shes telling us...and it always came back to one diagnosis....constipation!...why they wouldn't even consider this may be the case, I still have trouble understanding...

Edited by karmadestiny

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rufusrufus, not to steel the thread from CE3K, but this reminds me of a time when I thought this may be the problem with my son not knowing when he really need to go...I also thought they may be a problem with the wiring system between his head and his stomach, maybe the stomach not recognising the need to go or the head not getting the message quick enough...I talked to my sons peadiatrician aswell as any other professionals who would listen but they looked at me with that look that says, 'hmmm...an over protective mum'...we're the specialists and shes telling us...and it always came back to one diagnosis....constipation!...why they wouldn't even consider this may be the case, I still have trouble understanding...

 

That's so frustrating and shows lack of knowledge and understanding on their part. Unfortunately I hear this time and again of parents being told "we're the professionals, we know best". I think there is a tendency on the part of medical professionals to want to explain away autistic symptoms in an NT way, without recognising that autism isn't just in the brain, it affects the whole body. Therefore they hear "toileting problems" and think "physical cause, most likely of which is constipation" rather than "possible sensory processing / integration / sensory aversion / sensitivity etc". It just ends up in a situation where professionals become the enemy of the parents and can then offer very little assistance :(

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Just wanted to agree with rufusrufus and karmadestiny. Our k and us were told the same thing about it being constipation and when i explained at GOSH (great ormond st) they said it was down to constipation, i said its because he was stool withholding ( i did not know at the time and just thought his lack of drinking at school was to blame, teacher complained he was leaving bottles of water) at the previous school and of course this has built up and continued onto his next school. Our k says he cannot feel it and we have to ask him is it belly sick up or belly poo down so he has to think and check. His system is out of sync. He is 10 now and still has difficulty wiping himself which leaves him sore. It being dealt with now and everything is in the process of getting sorted one way or the other. He now has so much anxiety over this it shadows other areas of difficulties.

 

Just to refer to CE3K i thought things were ok with the toilieting at school, they weren't and our k did not want to talk about it then so of course things developed to a point where he had to have private access to a toilet as he has to wear pads at school because of overflow/result from constipation and soiling his underwear daily, (gone through so many pants that soaking them and boil washing in the machine they were beyond saving).,

 

I am not saying this is the case with your grandson its just worth checking to see if the toilet at school is next to his classroom, what are the facilities like, proper soap, i would not always rely on teachers who are extremely busy as its something they could miss, just like we did, teacher is unaware and we were left thinking he must be going to the toilet at school. Through this personal experience i am a bit more wary now. Have you checked what he has for school dinners, does he say he likes them ? sorry i have not read your profile so do not know much about your personal situation. I just wanted to help as i am always on here asking for help just wanted to give some support back.

 

Best wishes

 

sarni

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Hi guys, thanks for the advice. So far the toilet taget doesnt seem to be working. Still having to clean up pools of pee on floor. It seems to be similar if not same prob as KarmaDestiny has with her child in that he waits to last moment and then suddenly its all over the place. Imust admit though that he doesnt tend to wet his trousers,very often. As for the showering, im afraid he doesnt like showers too much, he tends to sit not stand away from the water spray. Baths are slightly better but in both he just tends to sit there not washing himself,although heis particular about cleaning his hands after toilet, meals and especially after using sticky stiff whether it be sweets or glue ,tape etc.In one occassion he made a big fuss at school about not being able to wash his hands that the teacher had to take him to toilet so he could do so. He does go school dinners and on odd occassion go pack lunch. He is not a fussy eater and eats 99% of things put down to him. He gets choices on school lunches and he selects what he wants, enjoying most if not all. Thanks

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One thing people agree with is one has to be comfortable to attend to toilet facilities as perhaps we know what we are like when we go and stay somewhere else which we blame on the change in water. Anxiety is common to ASD and anxiety stops toilet needs until that point comes where the body just has to go often with disasterous consequences, I know I have been there the most memorable was when I was doing my GCE O levels the anxiety was so immense, the term ''caught short'' took on a new definition and all through the exams my mind was elsewhere trying to fight the need to go to the toilet. I remember cold sweats, shivering and containing it the pain was well pain, but as soon as i got off the school bus it was dive behind the pub gardens were the land is rough to sort the issue out.

 

As to targets in toilets, even our local pub has them in the urinals, a little goal keeper in front of a net, the game is to get passed the goalie.

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Just wanted to agree with rufusrufus and karmadestiny. Our k and us were told the same thing about it being constipation and when i explained at GOSH (great ormond st) they said it was down to constipation, i said its because he was stool withholding ( i did not know at the time and just thought his lack of drinking at school was to blame, teacher complained he was leaving bottles of water) at the previous school and of course this has built up and continued onto his next school. Our k says he cannot feel it and we have to ask him is it belly sick up or belly poo down so he has to think and check. His system is out of sync. He is 10 now and still has difficulty wiping himself which leaves him sore. It being dealt with now and everything is in the process of getting sorted one way or the other. He now has so much anxiety over this it shadows other areas of difficulties.

 

Just to refer to CE3K i thought things were ok with the toilieting at school, they weren't and our k did not want to talk about it then so of course things developed to a point where he had to have private access to a toilet as he has to wear pads at school because of overflow/result from constipation and soiling his underwear daily, (gone through so many pants that soaking them and boil washing in the machine they were beyond saving).,

 

I am not saying this is the case with your grandson its just worth checking to see if the toilet at school is next to his classroom, what are the facilities like, proper soap, i would not always rely on teachers who are extremely busy as its something they could miss, just like we did, teacher is unaware and we were left thinking he must be going to the toilet at school. Through this personal experience i am a bit more wary now. Have you checked what he has for school dinners, does he say he likes them ? sorry i have not read your profile so do not know much about your personal situation. I just wanted to help as i am always on here asking for help just wanted to give some support back.

 

Best wishes

 

sarni

 

Hi:), I hope you don't mind me asking you said your son is now being seen to for this problem...who is he seeing is it a specialist clinic for soiling or urinary situations?...So far has he been given any treatment or have you been told of what the optional treatments maybe...?

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