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Sherbet

Frustration & anger

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Hi All

 

I am new to all of this and after reading some of the news feeds and feel i have made a very positive move.

My son is 11 and since birth i just new something didn’t quite fit (not quite sure how else to put it) however we are now 11 and been taken seriously..... after moving to a new school and having a private tutor to help with his SEN they both feel my son has ASD. We have had a few meetings with the paediatrician etc and it looks like we are looking at ASD, ADD, ANXIETY and SENSORY issues - From early on we have ran life very routinely which helps, but what we struggle most of all with is the frustration levels and then the anger and that’s why i am here - hopefully to pick up some ideas on how its best to deal with these.

My son seems like he can take it all in his stride from the outside, but on the inside his problems and anxieties are erupting. I feel he waits until he is in a safe place before he expresses them (not the way i wont him too) - i also have to bare in mind we are heading to the hormonal time of life to, with puberty just around the corner. When the red mist comes he shouts and bangs around, if one of us is in his way he pushes or throws things at you. We try and leave him to calm down but he follows you around the house with his anger and i dont know how to help him learn to try and calm himself down by using other things. I have tried the calming down posters, stress balls, his guitar, his own space, screaming into a pillow but he seems to have to climb to the top of the hill before he starts to calm down - if that makes sense! This only happens when we have missed the warning signs or change happens that he doesnt like.

Any help and advice would be greatly appreciated

 

Many thanks

S.

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First of all welcome to the forum.

 

The red mist I love the description for it describes more than adequately some of the extreme emotions we can feel which become most apparent when we have bottled up many minor tensions. With me, there just comes a point and with me I recognise that point as a nauseous feeling where I start to tremble before all hell breaks loose and anything within reach gets it of which I always regret later. But it is not the destruction of the thing that salves my anger for I have found it is the physical grabbing of it that thing feels so good it is the source of the energy, what comes after, the destructive part actually dissipates the anger to be replaced by sorrow and some other pretty negative emotions.

 

People, I have never attacked people when I blow one, it has always been things and this I believe might be because I am more comfortable with things than people, I understand things better, but in work situations quite often I used to do the excalibur trick by burying a screwdriver deep into the work bench as believe it that dissipates anger using all the strength one has and so perhaps there is a clue turn the emotion into a physical exercise.

 

Another one that dissipates the energy is kind of negative and I learned it by accident because it was a minor accident that dissolved my fury for the fury put me into that situation and yeah pain dissipates anger too and why one may see people doing extremely stupid thing like punching brick walls and in my case a filing cabinet and I ended up paying for it because after I had finished it wouldn't open again, but I had to keep the damage to myself quiet as I broke fingers doing it. But where I worked was a high stress environment and it was not uncommon for people to lose it now and again and generally nothing was really said about it as long as we put right the damage we did, and didn't aim our frustration at the kit as three million pounds of inertial navigation computer it would not have gone down well if we killed one of those.

 

But the key in all this is to avoid the situation in the first place in which case perhaps people affected should be encouraged to vent aggression regularly even when they don't feel particularly aggressive as who knows what controlled aggression release actually does in practice and so here is a suggestion perhaps, install a punch bag and encourage boxing or even Thai boxing practice as one thing I do know about those that take it seriously, is that they go out of their way to avoid conflict.

 

But hormonal stuff common to puberty, I can only guess as I did not experience much in terms of that weirdness as I did not complete puberty

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We use "good strips" for all four of my boys(eldest is 12 though he is NT it still works for him.) How it works is they earn the things they enjoy,so if he has a game console or laptop he uses for games or watches a fav thing on telly he needs to earn this. We have a strip with thumbs,up for good down for "bad." This links with the visual timetable. Example at 3pm its snack time,if snack time goes well its thumbs up=10min of time on telly/laptop etc, then say 4pm-5pm will be play time on whatever it is,if they have earned the whole 60min they will get the whole 60min if they have thumbs down and lost 10min they will get 50min and so on.

 

If the negative behaviour happens after their "time" then it will be carried over to the next day. The key is to be consistent and make sure he has a clear structure. We find the unwind time after school works,always keep this even though its not working for you at the moment.

 

Has his room maybe got too much in it,prehaps instead of decreasing stress levels its making it wors as there is too much around him. My two with ASD have just a couple books,their beds and a couple of fav cuddly toys(my nine year old really needs these during a meltdown.) But they have no other toys,no telly or anything else that stimulating. You could maybe invest in calm lighting like lava lamp or similar.

 

He needs to be told whats expected,I have pinned up house rules with pictures so there is the visual key to remind them what is expected. Again they lose time if they break rules. We also have a jar which we put a piece of dried pasta for every good day,they do have one or two thumbs down but overall its thumbs up,once the jar is full they can chose a treat could be going bowling to the cinema,all depends on the child.

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Hi Sherbet

 

It sounds like you've trusted your instincts and made life as safe as you felt was right for your little boy. It's great that you now have definitive answers that you didn't have before and it's good that you can get the support you need for your son at such a crucial stage in his development. The teens are a very difficult time for kids with ASD - you are right, when hormones come into the mix it can get hairy. Some kids will channel their anger inwards and others outwards. Both can cause major problems if left unchecked.

 

What I would suggest is try to find out how ASD (which often includes sensory issues as part of the package) and ADD affect your son specifically. Every person with ASD is different, although there are common problems associated with the condition, anxiety being one of if not the most common additional problem. Anxiety can be associated with negotiating conversation, learning differently and having different/opposing viewpoints to peers. It can be connected to having to contend with noises, smells, visual stimuli and problems with touch daily that may not bother the majority of people in their day-to-day lives.

 

Kids can quite often feel their parents don't 'get' them and I think this may be magnified for those on the spectrum. You might have to consider a two-pronged approach with regards to your son's anger; you probably need to start recognising the signs that your son is reaching a point where he can't cope anymore (probably long before you think that is) as he likely won't recognise those signs for himself and then his 'threshold' anxiety levels may not be so high and secondly, there has to be an understanding that lashing out is not acceptable behaviour. Understandable yes but not the positive way to channel frustration. I know this is easier said than done because I myself can get frustrated and angry and shout and cry and slam doors even at my age and it is very much anxiety-related. However, it doesn't make it 'right' even though at the time I feel justified, as will he. It is a very important skill to be able to start recognising 'triggers' and to then find ways to de-escalate emotions but your son will probably need you to help him to do this. I would expect anyone else who is involved in supporting your son to help him do this too.

 

Good Luck

 

Lynda :)

Edited by Lyndalou

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Anger is an emotion just like any other and should be treated as an emotion and not anything other.

 

Meaning? It is all well and good to say anger is just an emotion that is if one can control it which the OP'S son prehaps cannot do so otherwise he would not be throwing things. Being happy is also an emotion but generally speaking people do not hurt others or become destructive when happy...they do when angry if its not managed correctly(as Lynda says.)

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I agree with you Justine people are generally angry if they are unhappy. I've seen this in my own son, which is very upsetting for any parent to witness.

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Meaning? It is all well and good to say anger is just an emotion that is if one can control it which the OP'S son prehaps cannot do so otherwise he would not be throwing things. Being happy is also an emotion but generally speaking people do not hurt others or become destructive when happy...they do when angry if its not managed correctly(as Lynda says.)

 

Then the answer is simple just like happy what leads up to that emotion of happiness the same should be asked what leads up to that emotion of anger as to stifle any emotion will cause that emotion to get the better of all safeguards put in place eventually. What is better small controlled largely inoffensive upsets or major blow ups ?

 

And yes frustration is one umbrella term used to explain away what leads to anger, but has anyone analysed what causes the frustration?

 

For I can tell you some ;

 

Being talked down to,

Being negated

Being told you are wrong

Being told you are too honest

Being told what to do

Being told you are causing trouble

Being told everything

 

Because you have ASD and so by definition, you don't know what you are talking about or doing.

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Isn't one trait of AS flash anger or instant rage? Guess this comes down to frustration...

 

For effective management of these distressing conditions one has to discover the cause not address symptom, for the band aid philosophy does not work and punishment for emotional outbursts can further exacerbate frustration leading to yet more of the same. Most AS have anger issues which should not be put down to simply they have AS and that's the end of it, each of the affected is different and should be addressed differently that being there is not a one size fits all.

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First of all welcome to the forum.

 

The red mist I love the description for it describes more than adequately some of the extreme emotions we can feel which become most apparent when we have bottled up many minor tensions. With me, there just comes a point and with me I recognise that point as a nauseous feeling where I start to tremble before all hell breaks loose and anything within reach gets it of which I always regret later. But it is not the destruction of the thing that salves my anger for I have found it is the physical grabbing of it that thing feels so good it is the source of the energy, what comes after, the destructive part actually dissipates the anger to be replaced by sorrow and some other pretty negative emotions.

 

People, I have never attacked people when I blow one, it has always been things and this I believe might be because I am more comfortable with things than people, I understand things better, but in work situations quite often I used to do the excalibur trick by burying a screwdriver deep into the work bench as believe it that dissipates anger using all the strength one has and so perhaps there is a clue turn the emotion into a physical exercise.

 

Another one that dissipates the energy is kind of negative and I learned it by accident because it was a minor accident that dissolved my fury for the fury put me into that situation and yeah pain dissipates anger too and why one may see people doing extremely stupid thing like punching brick walls and in my case a filing cabinet and I ended up paying for it because after I had finished it wouldn't open again, but I had to keep the damage to myself quiet as I broke fingers doing it. But where I worked was a high stress environment and it was not uncommon for people to lose it now and again and generally nothing was really said about it as long as we put right the damage we did, and didn't aim our frustration at the kit as three million pounds of inertial navigation computer it would not have gone down well if we killed one of those.

 

But the key in all this is to avoid the situation in the first place in which case perhaps people affected should be encouraged to vent aggression regularly even when they don't feel particularly aggressive as who knows what controlled aggression release actually does in practice and so here is a suggestion perhaps, install a punch bag and encourage boxing or even Thai boxing practice as one thing I do know about those that take it seriously, is that they go out of their way to avoid conflict.

 

But hormonal stuff common to puberty, I can only guess as I did not experience much in terms of that weirdness as I did not complete puberty

 

Thanks for your comments - i have pulled some good ideas from it, we will definitely look at venting aggression even when not feeling aggressive as then he might not feel so silly in doing it (i have said scream into a pillow and he feels silly doing it, doing it regular might help) We have bought a punch bag recently so hopefully this might encourage him to use it when feeling frustrated.

We tried kick boxing for a year, but he could never concentrate and become very dishearten when everyone around him achieved new belts - in the end he decided it wasn't what he wanted to do - but worth a try.

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Thank you for all your messages - i really appreciate all the supporting comments.

I know my son feels at times no one understands him, i nag at him, i talk to much, and like you said SA being told everything......

when he is feeling low I cannot rush my son as he will get cross, however getting ready for school in the morning can be a nightmare, when his time is up on the computer, its a nightmare and at times i feel we are all on eggshells as we know he could turn at any moment.

My son is an amazing boy but over these last 6 months he seems to be on edge more so - he seems happy with his friends, oblivious to the fact he is struggling academically, we are very close and when 'he chooses' we talk about how he is feeling, school, girls etc. Its just that he gets frustrated quicker with lots of things.

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Sherbet, does your son have obsessions? I ask this because (and this may sound strange) I personally, am ONLY really truly happy when allowed to focus entirely on my interests. We are different. We have different agendas to the rest of humanity. We feel that what we have to do is important, and get frustrated with having to fit in all the time and live by other people's rules, and do what other people feel is important. It can seem like a waste of precious time, purely to please other people. We are usually incredibly driven to follow our own interests and have little time for anything else...I personally feel a huge sense of urgency to learn what i feel pushed to learn at any particular time, and it usually makes sense to nobody but me. Other people's schedules get in the way. If they try to disrupt what i'm needing to do, i get angry. If they try to make light of it, i feel insulted. My mind is always busy. Following what feels natural for me to do at any given time is what calms that business and sense of urgency in my mind. Following obsessions is extremely important business for a person with aspergers. If he's forced to do other things which don't relate to his current passion, just be aware that he's only doing it to please you and to fit in because he knows he should. He's showing his love for you and doesn't want to disappoint. It takes a huge amount of energy to put your `normal` mask on...and with all the will in the world, we cannot keep that mask on all the time. It's too exhausting. I'm fine if left to my own devices. People think they have to create routines for those on the spectrum. We love to develop our own own routines, but hate other people's routine's being pushed upon us. We need to understand rules before we feel we can abide by them. And no matter how hard anyone tries, sometimes it's all too much and no one can help ease the confusion, over stimulation and frustration. You see, to me, the world makes no sense at all. I've been waiting all my life for someone to tell me EXACTLY why i'm here, why I exist, why the world exists, and the reason for it....the reason why nothing feels real, the reasons why everything is confusing and unnatural. Even the clothing against my skin is a constant source of irritation. At times, i've been so unable to cope that i've ripped my own skin to shreds with my finger nails, hit my head against walls, broken windows, pulled my hair out....as someone else pointed out, at the time you feel justified. You feel like the whole world should know your anger....because just maybe someone might turn up who is able to tell you what it's all about....but you realise that no one can...that they don't know any more than you do...and also, it's not something they even worry about. Most people are content with just living. The world doesn't feel foreign and uncomfortable to them. They are content to simply exist without needing to know the answers to absolutely everything. Then you realise that you are different and therefore alone no matter how much people love you, they can never understand...at least that's how growing up was for me.

Have you considered home schooling? It's not a possibility for most, but he is probably quite capable of leading his own education through following his interests, which change and grow as people do. I guess the aim really is to make people with autism fit into normal society....but it's like trying to make a dog behave like a cat...if the dog doesn't perform, it fears it will lose your love....but it's an incredible pressure and burden for a young person to bare...High functioning (The ability to appear normal) is the optimal result (for everybody else). But for me, it's like my true self is kept in a cage.

Remember, he probably only appears to enjoy being with his friends because he knows he's supposed to. I still do it now and i'm 32. I don't really know why I have to have friends, and i don't enjoy seeing them. I do it because they've grown attached to me over the years, and because i know it's the normal thing to do. Even if we can't express ourselves perfectly verbally, we are very deep and intelligent people, and all i wanted while growing up, was for someone to have a little faith in the fact that i could see and understand things in a way that they couldn't, and that my need to follow my own path in my own way was an absolute necessity for my health and well being. ....also i guess, i wanted a little appreciation for doing all i could to fit into their world to make them happy....instead of being allowed to follow my own quest or mission in life. I mean, it could take an entire lifetime to figure IT ALL out. Time feels like it's going to run out too fast, before you've completed that hidden thing.... So it's a huge sacrifice to literally put that compulsion aside and be what other people want you to be. You do it even though it's not directly asked of you. It's a way of showing your family that they're important to you....more important than following your own path...your own journey. You accept that they can't see it, and so you have to give it up, or try to fit it into the small chunks of time that they allocate for you..

If you're only trying to ease the anger, all you're doing is treating the symptoms, not the cause. Whatever you do, he will always get angry, but let him know that he only has to be `normal` in certain situations, and don't expect him to keep that up for longer amounts of time than he can cope with. Thank him for doing it for you. In his spare time, let him do whatever he needs to do...let him follow his interests above all else. Let him be as anti-social as he likes. It doesn't mean he doesn't care. He just needs a lot more time to himself than you do. It's a way of calming his mind from all the over-stimulation...and remember that for him, a 2hr session of fitting in, might require a 10 hr period of `down time` to recover from it. He will never be like you, but he can pretend to be whenever it's required if you just trust that he knows more about what his own journey requires than you do....be an enabler...help him have access to the tools for learning that he needs. Be a personal assistant rather than a boss and you will see a different child...i think. Of couse, i'm only speaking from my own experience so i may be wrong, i certainly mean no offense!

Sorry i went on a bit....

Edited by Merry

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Thank you

 

Yes he does, they change all the time.... Sometimes they last a few months others years.

 

I have never looked at it that way and realise that I am adding to his frustration by limiting his time he can spend on his obsessions..... It's difficult because at times you feel putting a time limit on his current obsession would help him do other things but I know he isn't happy when not doing what he wants to do.

 

In some ways routine is good as he knows what is expected of him (I.e the morning routine before school) but if he doesn't want to do it he won't. Brushing teeth can be a nightmare, at times a 2 Minute job can take half an hour, he just sits there looking at his toothbrush... I have tried all sorts to get him moving, games, money etc but he isn't motivated by things like that. Then rushing him causes anger....

 

S.

 

 

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he just sits there looking at his toothbrush...

 

......Then rushing him causes anger....

 

 

 

Hahaha, I know both of them !

 

The former, I'm my own boss now and the latter still applies and people have learned not to.

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.....One more thing...if you can possibly afford it, give his as much of an organic diet as possible. Maybe consider cutting out gluten also. You will see a big difference. With diet and therapy, people are saying there is actually a cure for autism, and i can certainly say it helps to ease a lot of issues. If you like, i can find out some of the books written about this recently and there are videos on utube which show these apparent `recovery stories`

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Just remember that he is following your routine and the routines of his school, not his own. it is not easy for him at all. Sometimes, my husband still has to force me to brush my teeth! Most of the time, i have to participate in things i don't like...but when it's my free time, i expect to be left alone and not disturbed. that's what helps us cope with the rest of life when we have to. And as he has to conform at school, you'll probably miss out...because he'll need all the free time he can get to recover and be able to face another day, without burning out or becoming increasingly unable to cope.

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Great ideas - thank you

 

Being on here is definitely given me a better understanding of it all..... Free time and space are very important to my son (as long as he knows i am in the background he is happy)

Maybe i should buy some of those finger tooth brushes, so days when i know are on 'go slow' then i could miss out bits i.e brushing his teeth at home and do it on the way to school in the car, he might find it fun.

 

We did have an organic diet for a few years, but as he has got older i have relaxed it as he wants what his friends eat.... he now has school dinners and loves it - this makes him happy and feels more in than out (if that makes sense)

 

Thank you for your ideas and advice, it is very much appreciated and it gives me a better understanding on how he is feeling inside

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So glad to help sherbet...it was really useful for me actually to reflect a little on how i felt growing up....i love the finger brush idea. Good luck with everything.

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Oh Sherbet, I really recommend you watch the video i just posted about Jacob Barnett. He is an amazing young lad with autism, of a similar age to yours who followed his own path. It might really help. I hope so.

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I just want to say a 'big thanks' to you Merry for your posting. I can relate to entirely all you said, as my son Glen is just like that, I have learnt this through the years, it took a while though! I found your posting so interesting. Thanks again

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Hi, I don't come on here that often now, I joined many years ago when my son was 3, he's 12 now gosh. As always when I do pop on, I find someone has posted with a similar problem, and read really interesting replies. My son Max is 12 and loosing his temper. I know some of its personality, some ASD, some teenage hormones. I have found the answers really interesting, and I should remember to allow him to be just who he is when he needs to be instead of guilting that I don't do enough with him. Merry your post was so interesting to me as a Mom, gives me great insight into Max. Thank you all so much.

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Thank you Merry

Hi Im a new member on here and just wanted to thank merry for your insite into what i can only describe as my own daughters mind. She is 9 and always tells me she hates her life and just cant fit in with her friends, I try to tell her that it doesnt matter and to just be herself. As she is getting older her friends have outgrown her and she gets really frustrated. When she starts having a meltdown I usually send her up to her bedroom along with our golden retriever as our dog seems to have a calming effect on her and what she cant express in words to me I usually hear her telling to our dog.

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Hi I'm not very good at taking compliments but felt i should say thank you to those who have said thank you to me. It's quite an emotional thing to realize that something i've written has helped other people. That's all I really want to do. The help we all get here from other members is so important. It's a really nice feeling to be a part of it. Best of luck to every parent and child affected by aspergers. If there's any way i can help further, feel free to contact me.

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