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      Depression, Mental Health and Crisis Support   06/04/2017

      Depression, Mental Health and Crisis Support   Depression and other mental health difficulties are common amongst people on the autistic spectrum and their carers.   People who are affected by general mental health difficulties are encouraged to receive and share information, support and advice with other forum members, though it is important to point out that this exchange of information is generally based on personal experience and opinions, and is not a substitute for professional medical help.   There is a list of sources of mental health support here: <a href="http://www.asd-forum.org.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=18801" target="_blank">Mental Health Resources link</a>   People may experience a more serious crisis with their mental health and need urgent medical assistance and advice. However well intentioned, this is not an area of support that the forum can or should be attempting to offer and we would urge members who are feeling at risk of self-harm or suicide to contact either their own GP/health centre, or if out of hours contact NHS Direct on 0845 4647 or to call emergency services 999.   We want to reassure members that they have our full support in offering and seeking advice and information on general mental health issues. Members asking for information in order to help a person in their care are seeking to empower both themselves and those they represent, and we would naturally welcome any such dialogue on the forum.   However, any posts which are deemed to contain inference of personal intent to self-harm and/or suicide will be removed from the forum and that person will be contacted via the pm system with advice on where to seek appropriate help.   In addition to the post being removed, if a forum member is deemed to indicate an immediate risk to themselves, and are unable to be contacted via the pm system, the moderating team will take steps to ensure that person's safety. This may involve breaking previous confidentiality agreements and/or contacting the emergency services on that person's behalf.   Sometimes posts referring to self-harm do not indicate an immediate risk, but they may contain material which others find inappropriate or distressing. This type of post will also be removed from the public forum at the moderator's/administrator's discretion, considering the forum user base as a whole.   If any member receives a PM indicating an immediate risk and is not in a position (or does not want) to intervene, they should forward the PM to the moderating team, who will deal with the disclosure in accordance with the above guidelines.   We trust all members will appreciate the reasoning behind these guidelines, and our intention to urge any member struggling with suicidal feelings to seek and receive approproiate support from trained and experienced professional resources.   The forum guidelines have been updated to reflect the above.   Regards,   The mod/admin team
darkshine

Forum Rules

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Any opinions?

 

I personally find the suggestion of no mentions of organisations to be a bit daft as things like the NAS are an organisation, as is Wikipedia.

 

Also brand names - sometimes people require ASD related things and brands have to be stated in order to recommend things.

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trekster   

Provided we werent directly involved with the organisation or charity or werent bashing them by name then i dont see the problem mentioning them. As a rule if i have something positive to say about a charity, college, university or educational organisation i mention by name otherwise i mention in vague terms.

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Any opinions?

 

I personally find the suggestion of no mentions of organisations to be a bit daft as things like the NAS are an organisation, as is Wikipedia.

 

Also brand names - sometimes people require ASD related things and brands have to be stated in order to recommend things.

 

I understand why such is done to absolve the website of promoting products or services over and above what other's might have to offer where the website could be accused of preferential treatment if a vendor chose to pursue the matter. But in practice people recommend through their experience, it is human nature to do so and most vendors accept this but there still remains the possibility of legal redress because everything is fair in business and so a website must protect itself from what it's users may recommend.

 

The trouble is you relax or stiffen up, either way problems will always come to light and with the current stiffening up, do we want to be reduced to describing an article as if it were a game of charades or plain not bother even attempting through the difficulty of the game, because if we do then what use is this pace if people cannot help each other by not linking to what might help them with their health or understanding ?

 

Personally I would look all over the net at other places and see what they are doing and there just go with the flow, through the principle; strength in numbers.

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Can I ask exactly why the sudden change? All that was really required was the mods be a little more involved in things like disputes and removing offending posts or threads. Some of them simply haven't got the time to be as involved as they would like due to being busy parents, students etc. So I was pleasantly surprised when a few new mods appeared.

 

I feel that while although there are a lot of good things in the new forum rules - there are also a lot of things that actually stop this forum from being a forum(a place to freely discuss ASD and other related issues - freely being within reason).

 

If we all adhered to the rules as laid out recently, that means that we can't talk about the goverment, benefits(which are directly related to the goverment), asd related organisations, types of medications, etc

 

There are existing threads, which have proved in no way to be harmful to any forum member, and in fact quite beneficial, which under these rules should be removed.

 

Mentioning a brand name in passing is not grounds for libel or indeed defamation. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defamation#United_Kingdom

 

Essentially the point I am driving at is that perhaps these rules should be revised?

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Much to consider here, good points. I must point out that, the rules arn't new. Then new pin in the general disscussion is a clone copy of the rules that have always been here. Since they are hard to spot, i just posted them up as a point of reference. Nothing has changed.

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New brooms in the closet and new brooms want to clean up, it is expected sort of but they don't yet know the terrain, but they will learn, they will have to or as you said this place will become pretty intolerable and there is no point to a forum consisting of chiefs and no indians as will be inevitable if rules are imposed too rigidly.

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JeanneA   

The last thing any of us want is for this forum to become intolerable.

 

We want somewhere that we can go and post threads of interest to ourselves and others and not worry that our threads will be reported on/banned etc. We will be fair to everyone and we definitely don't want the rules to become too rigid.

I am a good listener or so I've been told in the past! :peace: Please PM me anytime, I will always try to answer any questions that you may have.

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oakers   

Perhaps the hard feelings have come from the fact that people perceived that the forum wasn't heavily moderated and then, literally straight after the new moderators were instated there was action taken.

 

I'm not really bothered who moderates the forum to be brutally honest, as long as they are fair. I did voice that I thought that AS would make a good moderator as I thought he seemed fair, but that was the only comment I made. What I can see though is that maybe there is some disharmony at the moment as people weren't aware of any vote or consultation with the forum members about who should moderate the forums.

 

Just my two pennies.

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And further I will say as of this evening I believe I have to watch my step through the very real feeling a certain moderator is being less than fair regards my posts and if this moderator continues unmoderated there will be a lot of problems here in the near future where people will be banned as I expect I will be for being an open and honest aspie on an ASD forum.

 

What happened was AS received support, next I heard half of the active members were also moderators with another making noises in that direction to which I thought no way. But what particularly interests me regards this sudden recruitment of moderators was what happened as the thread asking for moderators has been up for a good while now and no takers until suddenly yesterday.

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And further I will say as of this evening I believe I have to watch my step through the very real feeling a certain moderator is being less than fair regards my posts and if this moderator continues unmoderated there will be a lot of problems here in the near future where people will be banned as I expect I will be for being an open and honest aspie on an ASD forum.

 

 

I guess from any forum, take it or leave it. Personally I am not bothered as I take things as they come. If a topic doesn't interest me, then I don't read/comment on it. People have complained in the past that there have been no active moderators - now that we have one or two new moderators, people are complaining about their recent flurry of activity. One can't win. Does it really matter?

 

How open and honest do you want to be? If you really have an axe to grind, then surely this (or any other) should be welcomed as a topic for adult discussion (note the word adult as we don't want children to read some of this stuff) or you bite your lip and keep quiet.

 

Sounds like a bit of sour grapes to me - sorry

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trekster   

FTR there is being open and honest and there is blatant disrespect. Provided you can be reasonable about being open and honest, which includes bashing others then your posts are likely to stay unmoderated.

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I too was bullied all my life too, i..e at school and in the workplace. It lead me to suicide. Eventually I got a hold of myself. Then the few months before Christmas, I was at the low point of my mood cycle again as a new bullly emerged at work. So I know what its like, I can really empathise with you.

 

You have to deal with it - otherwise the bullies win. Ignore the posts - bullies don't like being ignored. .

 

If you are that concerned, as Suzy says, take the matter up with her and PM her. Personally I don't know what this OP has meant to have done/said to you - it's none of my business. Can't you just ignore the OP posts?

 

(edited for thread flowing purposes)

Edited by trekster

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Not when the person concerned who happens to be a new moderator starts questioning what you have said in previous posts via pm and when you suggest for them to ask on open forum in plain daylight they don't. So you may read what you wish into that.

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Suze   

If you feel you are being victimised or bullied please enlighten me via pm.I have offered twice now to listen to your concerns , both times you,ve ignored me.How is the forum and its mods supposed to help if you won,t engage with me and specifically tell me your concerns.Or is it me you feel is bullying you?I,m most confused about what you percieve is going on.As far as voting of mods.There was no voting taken.Any new mods are brought on board by Lufty who runs the show as it were.I presume he will have looked at the suggestions made on the board and the relevant thread and who would like to or make a good mod.He also asked myself and mossgrove who we thought was active on the forum and would make a good mod.If you disagree with this method of mod selection you,ll have to take it up with Lufty.But it has always worked fine in the past.Personally if it was decieded to vote all new mods in I would welcome this , I will happily step down and if I,m wanted on here be voted back on as a moderator, or not ,that is up to the members on here.

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This is getting way out of hand.

 

I think the new mods have just got excited over being able to help the forum work better and haven't really given the rest of us time to adjust.

 

Perhaps a bit of easing up on things might be in order.

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trekster   

I have been as fair and patient as I can, if a moderator asks why you have written something in a particular way you can either

explain your reasons or edit/delete your post. Public criticism of moderation needs to stop, either take it up with one of the mods

or change the subject.

 

i edit posts to take out offensive content and so the thread flows better if a post has been significantly changed before.

If there is a problem with what i have edited out feel free to discuss with me in private.

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I have been as fair and patient as I can, if a moderator asks why you have written something in a particular way you can either

explain your reasons or edit/delete your post. Public criticism of moderation needs to stop, either take it up with one of the mods

or change the subject.

 

I don't believe you understand the meanings of the word fair and patient as you have displayed none of either in relation to my postings particularly

 

And as to a moderator asking why one has written something why would a moderator do that in the first place, what are you, the police looking for a crime to punish ?

 

I will criticise authority in public because in the country I come from, ( UK ), criticism of authority is encouraged and long may that be upheld, as it acts to keep authority in check, without which authority will abuse.

 

I will further deal with you on open forum because I plain don't trust you, your actions over the last two days have caused that.

 

i edit posts to take out offensive content and so the thread flows better if a post has been significantly changed before.

If there is a problem with what i have edited out feel free to discuss with me in private.

 

No, you edit posts to take out what you don't like which amounts to anyone who dares to challenge you authority, so don't hide the truth behind ideas of threads flowing better, this is a forum of ASD individuals who communicate the best way they can, is that not good enough for you ?

 

And I will not deal with you in private through the fact as I have already said I don't trust you.

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Suze   

Can I ask that this heated debate stop now. please.Any issues can they please be brought to my attention via a private pm.This discussion is getting us no where as it stands .If it continues in this way the thread will be locked.

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Just wanted to clarify the fact that the forum rules are not new, they have been in place for several years and are not significantly different from the rules you will find on many Internet forums, it is not new moderators new rules as has been suggested.

 

The rule about not naming organisations has been in place all along. It is not aimed at organisations that are publically in the field of Austism, or helping people affected by autism such as IPSEA or the NAS, similarly referring to publicly available advice on the Internet is fine too.

 

It gets more difficult when we are talking about individual schools, doctors teachers etc. when mentioning individuals is not allowed for two reasons.

 

i. Confidentiality on private individuals on a public forum must be maintained, especially where mentioning a specific teacher or school may allow a child to be identified, and all such references will be removed by the moderators without exception.

 

ii. The forum is privately run by a small number of individuals who pay for all the costs of running the forum (hence no advertising anywhere on the forum and no subscription fees). Anything that may give rise to legal action against the forum owners (e.g. criticisms of organisations or individuals that may libelous or otherwise damaging) will be removed as the owners may be personally liable if they are not. Rather than deciding on a case by case basis whether or not a particular comment is sufficiently inflammatory for the reference to be removed and have endless debates about it we have a clear simple rule that there should be no naming if individual schools, doctors, children, parents, hospitals, teachers etc.

 

Feel free to pm if this is not clear!

 

Simon

Edited by mossgrove

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3. The messages express the views of the author of the message, not necessarily the views of this forum. Any user who feels that a posted message is objectionable is encouraged to contact us immediately by email. We have the ability to remove objectionable messages and we will make every effort to do so, within a reasonable time frame, if we determine that removal is necessary.

 

What counts as objectionable? What if we disagree? What if I take objection to discussions and nobody else does, does that mean you will remove posts because Darkshine has a problem?

 

I take massive objection to some of these rules? Will you remove them then? Will you change them? What if I told you I know other people object? What will you do? Ask them to step out here and back me up? They might not be willing to do that for a variety of reasons, they might not want to because they might be scared or want a quiet life, they might fear you will remove their account, they might not know how to step out and speak up for fear of retribution.

 

4. You agree, through your use of this service, that you will not use this forum to post any material which is knowingly false and/or defamatory, inaccurate, abusive, vulgar, hateful, harassing, obscene, profane, sexually oriented, threatening, invasive of a person's privacy, or otherwise in violation of any law.

 

Why can we not talk about things of a sexual nature? AS is a development condition, sex might be a really important area of growth – but tough luck guys, you are just gonna have to struggle your way through it, be celibate, doesn’t matter if you were raped or abused of course, doesn’t matter if you are gay/bi/lesbian/transgender – tough luck, lock it up inside and if you get depressed and slash your wrists, oh well, your responsibility not ours, doesn’t matter that there are people out there who can talk you through it cuz 'little whoever' can’t handle talking or reading about that stuff.

 

Sex is a part of adult life, sensory issues are a part of AS, sensory issues can interfere in an adult mature sexual relationship – why on earth is this ignored? Even people not on the spectrum can have sexual issues as they explore their sexuality – are we in the middle ages here guys? Do we live in the repressed society where sex is hush hush – doesn’t matter if you want a sex life with your partner or girl/boyfriend or husband/wife or whatever – just get on with it and it doesn’t matter if you are psychologically and emotionally harmed then – obviously.

 

And how exactly does that help people?

 

What happened to the adult section?

 

6. Any posting that the moderators consider to be insulting, abusive, obscene or inflammatory (often known as flame baiting, flaming or trolling) will be removed immediately and the member warned, placed on restrictive posts or banned. In extreme circumstances we will report the poster to their ISP and ask that appropriate action be taken.

 

Inflammatory – again – what I have said here could be deemed as such even though I see it as my honest, truthful and open opinion.

 

Even though I am not looking for a fight and I am trying to raise serious points here – what if one person decides that because they find it hard to talk about depression or sexuality and removes my post – does that mean they are right and I am wrong?

 

7. This forum is for the benefit of all of our members and all posts should be both polite and respectful to the views of other members. For the avoidance of doubt the moderators reserve the right to err on the side of caution and moderate posts which might be impolite or disrespectful to the views of other members.

 

Again, some may see my post here as disrespectful to the forum team and the rules, but am I really being disrespectful or am I raising serious and valid points?

 

8. Personal attacks on other forum members will not be tolerated. The moderators will intervene when a discussion starts to turn into a heated debate or argument. If the situation continues then the thread will be closed and hidden from general view without further notice and the offending member formally warned.

 

And how do we learn conflict resolution? If we create a cushioned safe and cheery little bubble, how exactly do we relate that to “real” life – should this forum not display real life? Or should I go outside, get attacked and go “help, where are the mods to save me?”

 

Depression, Mental Health and Crisis Support

 

Depression and other mental health difficulties are common amongst people on the autistic spectrum and their carers.

 

People who are affected by general mental health difficulties are encouraged to receive and share information, support and advice with other forum members, though it is important to point out that this exchange of information is generally based on personal experience and opinions, and is not a substitute for professional medical help.

 

However, any posts which are deemed to contain inference of personal intent to self-harm and/or suicide will be removed from the forum and that person will be contacted via the pm system with advice on where to seek appropriate help.

 

In addition to the post being removed, if a forum member is deemed to indicate an immediate risk to themselves, and are unable to be contacted via the pm system, the moderating team will take steps to ensure that person's safety. This may involve breaking previous confidentiality agreements and/or contacting the emergency services on that person's behalf.

 

Sometimes posts referring to self-harm do not indicate an immediate risk, but they may contain material which others find inappropriate or distressing. This type of post will also be removed from the public forum at the moderator's/administrator's discretion, considering the forum user base as a whole.

 

And in my opinion this is negligible, because you warn people for anything on these terms even when there is no risk!!

 

What is 'risk'? Somebody seeks help, they ask for it, they are desperate and they really need to know that people understand, they really need that or they might go over the edge, and what do they get? They get warned, they get edited, they get their post removed and what then?

 

Oh well, the forum doesn’t get blamed so its all alright then isn’t it?

 

Tell that to the poor sod's family when they’ve topped themselves cuz you’ve all shut them right down in their hour of need.

 

Death will happen to all of us, it isn’t something to run away from and fear, the grim reaper isn’t going to knock on your door for it – but because some people feel a little uncomfortable then it doesn’t really matter if someone kills themselves because there is no room at all to talk.

 

I have a lot of advice for self harmers, I understand a fair bit, I have experience.

 

I understand a fair amount about depression, I have had it since I was a child, I have experience.

 

I understand aspects about gender, sexual and sexuality issues, I didn’t suddenly learn how to have a healthy sex life and nor have I reached a position of complete understanding now, I wish to talk about this, to understand others experiences and give and receive help and have a healthy attitude to such things.

 

I understand a fair amount about suicidal thoughts and have had some really extreme experiences, both myself and within my family and also other people I have known – I am not afraid to talk about them or advise or hear about this, and if me visiting dark places to understand someone else and potentially saving a life helped, then I will do that any day.

 

But I am not allowed to discuss these things because oddly enough getting a warning or a massive disclaimer kinda makes a lot of people avoid the topic, and a load of sensitive people who can read the topic title and choose not to read it report the posts abnd they get edited and locked and removed.

 

How is that open people? Please tell me how.

 

These are my thoughts, I hope they are respected and not edited and not removed, and that this post is not locked – because I have a right to an opinion based on my life, as a member of this forum, as a part of this community and for what its worth, whether people back me up or not, whether people agree or not – my thoughts and opinion are valid to me.

 

Darkshine

 

Edit spelling mistake

Edited by darkshine

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Suze   

I,m shocked by your post Darkshine.I,ve been a member here for over 7/8yrs.In that time this forum very rarely gets moderated.Check some other forums and sites out believe me, I have always felt this forum had a very welcoming and friendly feel.Your post criticises the rules laid down by the administrators of this board.I,m hurt you could infer what you have.How often have you seen any of these rules you have cut and pasted and commented on actually acted upon.Once a week?............Once a month maybe ?............infact if you look in the last 12mnths I can find less than 5 threads that have been locked, I can give you examples of some pretty disgusting posts I have deleted by members ...........believe me they would definitely come under the obscene title , We have had one thread in the last 12mnths that was moderated due to sexual content........in this case the references to oral sex breached forum rules.I don,t think these rules will be changing anytime soon.As they have kept this forum a safe place for over 10 yrs.There are other forums out there that can perhaps discuss more openly the issues you feel are moderated on here.For now I believe this forum should stay how it is.

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I,m shocked by your post Darkshine.I,ve been a member here for over 7/8yrs.In that time this forum very rarely gets moderated.

 

There are places out there on the web where this forum is mentioned by ex members who say they left because of excessive moderation and these boards are not ASD specific although they deal with such through the fact the boards are to do with education as in learning programmes and environments where I understand from some of the topics I followed, these people commenting are teachers and other educators.

 

Now given the policy of this website where people cannot actually quit except in rare circumstances, no doubt these that say they have quit will still be registered, but whether they come here any more is wholly different matter.

 

And I agree this place needs an adult area perhaps screened so adults can talk as beyond adolescence implies children and there are adult ASD here.

 

Because if we can't talk and work things out we will forever suffer in silence and the question has to be asked in the desire for this website to be 'fluffy', is it ignoring the realities of what ASD is for many of it's captives ?

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Suze   

I disagree this forum is not excessively moderated,, how is it so, when as I stated before so few threads have been locked over a 12mnth period.

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This topic has got way out of hand, so before I go any further I need to explain a few things about this forum.

 

Out there on the internet there are many Autism-related forums. Some are relatively tightly moderated, some are not. The ones that have very little moderation are full of arguments betweem mods and posters, and between the members themselves. Many have had to shut down as the arguments became to intense and the forums became so dominated by them that they were unable to serve the purpose they were orginally created for.

 

This is a privately run forum, run by it's owners who pay all of the costs themseves. The owners have an absolute right to runthe forum as they see fit, but having said that they barely intervene at all on a day to day basis. The forum has rules which are no different in character from those found on a great may forums. Ths forum is tightly moderated when necessary so discussions can take place and members can find support. If anyone wants to argue the philosphy of whether or not a forums owners and moderators have a right to have rules and apply them, please find another forum to have that debate on.

 

The ban on discussions about self-harm and suicide is in place because people in danger of suicide or self harm need immediate professional help that this forum cannot provide. This ban is not negotiable and will not be changed, so there is not purpose to be served in debating it. If you desire to discuss such issues on a forum please do not do it here.

 

Finally I find the idea that this forum is over-agressive in it's moderation ridiculous. There have been periods of several weeks at a time when no posts have been modified at all. The moderators here have busy lives and have better things to do that finding posts to moderate as some kind of ego trip and the idea that we are obsessed with over-agressive and inappropriate moderation is very wide of the mark.

 

This thread will now be locked. If you have concerns about any of the forum rules, please undertake that discussion via pm. I will not allow this forum to sidetracked by people who wish to engage in unproductive debates about whether or not the forum should have rules, or whether the moderators have the right to moderate.

 

Simon

Edited by mossgrove

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