O/T Jamie Oliver & School dinners

[007paul007]

Well what does everyone think on this issue then ? Do you agree or do you think there should be freedom of choice or is this another case bullying people into things they do not really want to do ? I mean lets face it jamie was brought up on a majority of the foods he is campaigning against according to an article in the press from his mum . Any Ideas ?

[lil_me]

Due to the restricted diet my son will eat I have had to remove him from school dinners as he would only eat 4 items from the entire 4 weeks menus. My youngest son is loving the new healthier options tho. I agree with his points that children should be provided with decent quality food, but the price has gone up and up and up. Our school doesn't have tuck shop any more, was removed at the parents request.

Edited September 28, 2005 by lil_me

[Surrey]

I must say I dont really see the relevance of what Jamie Oliver was bought up on. Personally I think the lunches I have seen at my childrens schools are pretty awful - I wouldnt eat them myself. I prefer to give them a healthy packed lunch, with things I know they WILL eat. I think Jamie is doing a great job for those that have to eat school lunches.

[mel]

I agree. The government have been harping on recently about too many obese children and putting a tax on junk food to help prevent this.........all my daughter gets offered at her school canteen are burgers, chips, pizza and more junk along those lines. last time she saw a carrot at school was 2 years ago.

[Viper]

Jamie Oliver rocks

 

There are so many children who go home to fast food for tea, if the school can at least provide one healthy meal for them a day then they have my full backing. How many children don't see a vegetable from one week to the next or even know what they are?

 

Maybe if parents of today had eaten better at school the country wouldn't have so many obese kids or adults now. School is there to educate and eating healthily is a good lesson to learn.

 

Viper.

[lorryw]

I worked as a lunchtime supervisor (dinner lady!) for a couple of years. Part of our wage was a free school lunch. After a few days I made my excuses and left without lunch. It was dire, including the dreaded Turkey Twizzlers, and I pitied the poor children having to struggle through it. It will be really interesting to see how the caterers cope with the new guidelines and what the children actually end up eating.

I felt sorry for our cook who when left to her own devices produced some really lovely food. But she had to use the stuff provided by the caterers who were only interested in profit margins.

[baddad]

Much as I find the Mockney gonk annoying as an individual, I've gotta say i'm 100% behind him as far as school dinners go, and let's be honest, apart from being a bit heavy handed with the lemon juice he can cook up a storm!

Fact is, school dinners ARE absolute cr*p, and justifying that by saying 'It's what the kids want' is a cop out. They don't consult the kids about the national curriculum, or the school budget, or what books to buy for the library - how come they're so keen to listen to them on the subject of school dinners?

Left to their own devices, many kids would live exclusively on burgers and twizzlers - let's face it, their being SOLD that rubbish between tv programmes every five minutes, with advertising every bit as persuasive and a damn sight more sophisticated than that which convinced millions of US to spend our pocket money on a 10 pack of soverein in the 70's and 80's...

When was the last time you saw an ad for fresh fish or fruit and veg between parts 1 & 2 of Ministry of Mayhem? ###### Ronald McDonalds there, though, EVERY TIME.

RANT OVER

 

PS: Given the option, who would you want on your team in 'Ready Steady Cook', Jamie Oliver, or Bernard Matthews? No brainer, ennit!!

L&P

BD

[something vague]

I've got to say that our school dinners have improved over the past year with the introduction of a side salad choice every day and raw vegetable sticks once a week. However the main food items haven't changed much, often the choice will be between meat pudding (suet) or sausages - 2 very fatty items. Also chips, smiley faces or roast potatoes are available every day. The cook prepares a few jacket potatoes (mostly for staff and a couple of my pupils because I insist they have the option) but these are kept under the counter and not on display! Once a week jacket potatoe with filling is freely available. I think the kitchen staff have to consider wastage, if the kids dont choose a particular food, it goes to waste.

 

One problem that we have is due to the fact that one of our kids has v restricted diet which includes a sandwich each day. The cook has switched to brown bread, our boy just wont eat it and will do without. The cook says that she can't provide white bread because of 'healthy schools policy.' A friend of mine queried this asking what is healthy about being presented with a dinner that you can't eat!

[007paul007]

Baddad it would have to be Bernard Matthews , there bootiful lol !

[Colin_and_Shelagh]

A former work colleague, now a teacher, told me it was a waste of time trying to teach after lunch because the kids are so hyperactive. The high school where Patrick started this term has a really long morning - 8.40 until 1.20 with only one lesson after lunch. We have heard that the reason for this is hyperactivity. Personally I wouldn't be able to function if I had to go that long between breakfast and lunch.

 

What Jamie Oliver's fantastic series helped demonstrate is that there is a link between diet and behaviour.

 

Without realising it, we had allowed Patrick's diet to contain more and more sugary food - he was having a sugary cereal for lunch, something sweet with his (otherwise healthy) packed lunch, as well as something after his dinner. Following advice, we restricted this to one sweet item after dinner and the result on his behaviour was dramatic. Almost immediately he was less hyperactive and he began to sleep for much longer.

 

I don't know if anybody here has been watching the American version of the Apprentice? There was one episode where the contestants had to come up with a marketing campaign for a new kind of coke. The otherwise calm and collected Andy began sloshing down cup after cup of the stuff and started behaving completely out of character! The link wasn't made on the commentary, but it didn't seem coincidental to us!

 

Colin

[lisa]

We live in Greenwich, and were one of Jamie Oliver's guinea pig schools. Our school did a taster session to give parents the opportunity to see for themselves the food being served up. The food is really good. I'm quite lucky as my kids didn't particularly like all the turkey twizzler junk that the school used to serve up but really enjoy the new menus. Initially it was a bit of a disaster, particularly as the cooks had to get used to cooking the new food and I don't think they were doing a very good job of it. A lot of parents weren't very happy and completely dropped school meals, sending in packed lunches. It's going really well now and the dinner uptake has steadily increased again with kids now eating the foods that they initially wouldn't touch. The children are encouraged to take home printed recipe sheets of meals they particularly like and the school also sent a recipe home every week for parents to try if they want.

 

Unfortunately my eldest two are now at secondary school, neither of which have been "Jamie Oliver-ed". In my son's school they have vending machines with fizzy drinks, they sell sweets, burgers lots of cr*p. They do have fruit and sandwiches which he does quite often choose but the majority of kids eat the junk. My daughters school isn't much better and she'd love to see the Jamie food brought into her secondary school.

 

I think Jamie Oliver has done a fantastic job and it's about time the government did something about it. BAN THE cr*p!!!

 

Lisa

[Canopus]

School dinners have been a national joke for decades. They started out as pig swill and ended up as junk food. Jamie Oliver is a national hero and has sent a shockwave through the system. The question now is whether improvements can be put into practice nationally because some schools and LEAs are locked into contracts with catering companies that serve junk and only take an interest in their profit margin.

[elaine1]

I do think there should be freedom of choice. We are rapidly turning into a nanny state - our kids need to have the freedom to choose what to eat. They do know whats good and bad for them, removing it from the menu wont help.

That takes away the reasoning part of life.

 

Some schools are now going through the lunchboxes and taking out crisps and chocolate - excuse me but havent the moms taken the decision to put htose in in the first place - what message is that giving the kids.

Its like saying your mother cant make informed or sensible choces so were making them for her!!!

 

Im on my soapbox now lol

[something vague]

It sounds like the school dinners issue is going from one extreme to the other. I think that it is brilliant that school dinners are being focused on. From an early age children at school were being offered fatty salty food with very few healthy options. I think that in some cases, children have been introduced to these convenience foods at school whilst recieving a more healthy diet at home. If chips are available everyday, there will always be a percentage of children who will choose them every day. This may be against the wishes of the parent.

 

After half term, our school will be offering more 'healthy' foods. Processed potato products (chips, smiley faces or roast) will only be served once a week. Our dinner time staff believe that a large proportion of our children will opt for packed lunch. I can't see our school checking people's lunches - I would guess that that is an infringement to human rights and an insult to the parents who have prepared the lunch. I personally think that something had to be done to redress the balance but these healthier options should be phased in more slowly so that children can perhaps try something new with something familiar.

[mel]

Our school has requested, no, it was more of a demand, that we do not put any crisps, sweets, chocolate or even yoghurt in our kids lunchboxes... yet they still serve chips. i sometimes feel im living in an alternate universe

[baddad]

Some schools are now going through the lunchboxes and taking out crisps and chocolate - excuse me but havent the moms taken the decision to put htose in in the first place - what message is that giving the kids.

Its like saying your mother cant make informed or sensible choces so were making them for her!!!

 

Im on my soapbox now lol

There's a boy in Ben's class who's seriously obese - not 'plump' or 'chunky' or carrying some puppy fat - seriously obese. He takes a packed lunch to school everyday. It contains a bar of chocolate, a cake, a packet of crisps etc. every day. [ben sits with him, and even Ben is appalled by it, though I've told him to keep his opinions to himself] When he comes out of school his mum waits for him with a �1.00 pick and mix of his favourite 'scooby snacks' (they even have a pet name for the 2000 calories of cr*p he manages to devour on the five minute waddle home) every day.

This boys mum is killing him in inches. He is already 'programmed' to comfort himself with food whenever he feels unhappy. He feels unhappy a lot because he can't do many of the things his classmates do. He's 8 years old.

Sorry elaine, Nanny state or not there are some mums (many it would seem, given the growing figures for childhood obesity) who can't make sensible or informed choices. On a saturday morning McDonalds sells it's burgers directly to kids in this age group during ministry of mayhem. There's a lovely 'new' health message included: 'Run around or do some exercise for at least one hour a day'. this is the same company that had a campaign running a while ago encouraging kids to pit their seperated parents against one another so they could get two lots of mcDonalds in one day... wonder why that got pulled??

 

Now THAT's what I call soapboxing!!

L&P

BD (who despite how this might appear really likes the poor little kid mentioned above, though he doesn't think a lot of the mum involved!)

[baddad]

Oh, and don't get me started with *&%$�"**& Cheese strings!!

[lisa]

I have to agree with Baddad on this one. It amazes me that with so much emphasis on healthy eating some people still don't seem to understand what's healthy and what's not. I have heard a parent at school counting a jam sandwich as one portion of fruit...hard to believe I know but she was convinced that the jam was a healthy option as it was made with fruit!!

 

Lisa

[KarenT]

We had a little boy here for tea last night (Yes! A play date!!) who opted for apple juice because "Orange juice makes me hyper". I told him that I didn't mean squash but proper juice (I only ever buy Tropicana now, don't even get concentrate stuff) but he was adamant. Yet I've seen this kid scoff Fruit Shoot and similar 'fruit drinks' regularly. I'd made burgers (steak mince, bit of onion and pepper) because he'd said he liked them and I wanted to make something he'd enjoy, but he didn't even try it, just pushed it to the side of the plate because it wasn't like a MacDonalds. He ate no veg, just the smiley faces I keep for friend visits (in fact, when I asked what veg he'd like he answerd "Smiley Faces").

 

And this is a boy whose mum insists he has only good food with no additives. Makes you wonder, doesn't it?

 

Karen

x

[007paul007]

Baddad

I see what you are saying. I would like to say about the mum with the sweets, say you are having a bad time with your child , I mean take the time when my son was just driving over the top , this was when they were about to put him on Respididone, some nights i felt like i would like someone to come him and give him an injection to knock my son out and give us recovery time. We all do things to keep the child happy at times and some of those things people disagree with, so perhaps this is this way of keeping her child happy, her way of dealing with things.

Her child is obese as you say, but who are we to judge, I know you said your child has thoughts, which he keeps to himself, but imagine how many people think things about autistic children when then see them and i know from experience how upset and annoyed i would get at people sstaring or maing comments.

Who are we to judge how someone brings up a child or treats a child, I would say she is most probarbly a lvoing parent like a all of us on this site. Don't judge a book by its cover, which i think goes on too much in the world.

[lil_me]

I have a son who is obese, and one who is underweight. Its very difficult with the youngest, he is controlled in what he eats, he has a seriously big appetite but has been Asthmatic from being a baby and his medication appears to affect his appetite. Having asthma he finds it extremely difficult to burn the calories off without being ill and having serious attacks. Its been a constant fight. My ADHD/ASD son eats more than him most of the time (even with a very limited diet), and definately more junk, calories and fat, but he's underweight. Youngest is going in for diabetes and thyroid tests soon.

 

I would never judge another child by their shape or size, as I know what a battle we have had with my 2 children.

 

What seriously upset me recently is my friends daughter is seriously bordering anorexia as they are on about doing an obesity test in school. She is now refusing to eat. These schools know how sensitive young teenagers are and insist on them putting them through hell.

Edited October 8, 2005 by lil_me

[007paul007]

Yes good point lil , perhaps they should also find out why the obese child that Baddad was on about was sad and really needed cheering up, perhaps if that was sorted out the mother would not have to bring sweets to cheer him up ?

[Sallya]

D has grown up with a little girl who is ten weeks younger than him. She is 8 and in clothes that fit a 13/14 year old, and she is obese. Her mum is a close friend of mine, so I have seen what she has allowed her daughter to eat, and have seen her get defensive when her health visitor tried to give advice about healthy eating. I have quietly said that the HV might have a point, and had her blow up at me in my face.

The little girl eats what her mum gives her. Sausages, egg and bacon for breakfast, since she was a 2 year old, because her mum wants her to "get a good breakfast inside her" and has a "eat everything on your plate or no pudding" attitude.

Fizzy drinks, chocolate, big bags of pic'n'mix, the list goes on and on, the result is a little girl who is seriously obese, she doesn't have any other condition, apart from a loving and caring mum, who is VERY uneducated about what is a good diet, and because of her defensive attitude, hasn't been willing to learn.

I care about both of them loads, and even though I have tried to point her in the right direction, in a non-judging way, at the end of the day, it's her daughter, and she is the one feeding her child what she wants/thinks is best.

 

Those are the people that we are talking about, not the children -it's the parents who don't know any better, and need help to get it right. Healthy school dinners is a start, but isn't going to make any difference once the parents get them home. Hope that makes sense.

S

XXX

[007paul007]

One thing I would also like to add is , if there are bad diets like people have suggested and at the end of the day people make the decision on what that have read and learned, then how come the human race has lasted all these years. surely if the diet was as bad as what some people say then the human race would of nearly been extinct before all these so called experts came out suggesting your diet should be this or that.

In my book people can do whatever diet they want to do, but a particular diet should not be forced onto any one.

I think as I have said it is in the genes and if you are meant to be big, small, round or square and I think that is the case.

I eat all the junk food and I am a size 29 inch waist and still tall and slim, all my family are like that, so how do the experts explain that. Yes all family eat more or less the same and they are all ok.

But do the experts really know, for example my mother smoked 40 cigarettes a day and had a alchohol problem , she died at the age of 60. Nothing to do with smoking or drinking , she had died from a blood clot caused by a bang to the head. Do you know we donated alll her organs including her heart, liver, kidneys, and many more, not bad for a smoker of 35 years.

Now the reason I bring that up is in my opinion is that the experts are not always right and I was using this as an example.

[KarenT]

One thing I would also like to add is , if there are bad diets like people have suggested and at the end of the day people make the decision on what that have read and learned, then how come the human race has lasted all these years.

 

Because for most of that time the food consumed by the human race has been reasonably healthy with no added chemicals to make it look pretty or last longer which are damaging to a body. It's only in the recent past that we've been eating Frankenstein food, and nowadays it's hard to find much else unless you want to pay huge amounts of money for organic produce. Take a walk down Biscuit Alley in any supermarket and see if you can find anything without hydrogenated vegetable fat.

 

Karen

x

[007paul007]

Karen

I can walk down any alley or aisle and eat whatever I like without piling on the pounds or being unhealthy, besides I choose to eat what I want to eat. I am lucky it's in my genes LOL !

[baddad]

Paul/lil'me -

See Sallya's post.

The child I know hasn't got any sort of disability, or any medical condition contributing to his size. He's that size because he overeats the wrong types of foods, all of which he's provided with by his mother. He's not always unhappy, but when he is unhappy it is invariably linked to his size, or to the fact that he can't run as fast/do things the other kids do. When he's unhappy, he is given sweets/chocolate etc to cheer him up; I've seen this happen.

I think I said in my post, I like the kid. I wouldn't judge him by his size, but i am painfully aware that other people do and his parents are making it worse.

I don't 'value judge' people because of their weight; I'm no boney maronie myself, but i wouldn't view making your child ill as a way of keeping him 'happy' as either loving or responsible. She undoubtedly does love her son, but anyone who thinks that saying only 'yes' is an appropriate demonstration of love is heading for real trouble down the road

Lil me comments that her son eats more than her most of the time: Ditto Ben and I. Ben's 'hyper' active 90% of the time. Any extra fuel he's taking on he's burning off. Couple that with my cr*p metabolism (that's been that way since I was seriously ill at 11 and lived on a drip feed for 5 months), and it's perfectly natural given the circumstances. The difference is that Ben shows appropriate responses to food, and eats a good, varied diet. If he didn't, I'd be addressing that. Some kids will only eat 'junk food' I know, and I fully accept that changing those habits - particular where autism/adhd is a factor - can be nigh on impossible. You can't have it both ways, though, if they only eat junk food, and they're obese, not filling the cupboards with junk will help with the obesity. If they have to be pushed even to eat junk, they're not going to be obese, are they (unless there's something else going on)?

Fact is, there are millions of people out there with unhealthy 'relationships' with food, and there's masses of research to say that those unhealthy patterns begin in childhood, and that they are often contributed to by parents who have similar problems. 8 year old girls grow up watching mum yoyo diet, binge eat, and, sometimes, (as on a documentary only this week) forcing themselves to regurgitate.

I can't understand what the real debate is here... If parents do have a healthy attitude to food and want their children to be the same, why would they object to an initiative to promote that? It's not those parents who need 'nannying', is it? Or their kids that are going to be taking the chips'n'chocolate option every day?

If some parents need help to appreciate that message, I think that's worth the intervention.

Also, I think there are some instances where parents may need to be 'told how to bring up their children'. Not saying this is one of them, but the fact is not all parents are good at all aspects of parenting, as anyone working in the care, teaching, medical, police, social work professions etc will tell you. I'm sure any dietician faced with this child and the fact that he has (at least) a pounds worth of sweets bought him every day would consider re-educating this mum as a matter of some necessity, regardless of any judgements, positive or negative, about the rest of her parenting skills.

One final thing: the problem in schools was not that there was cr*p on the menu's; it was that there was ONLY cr*p. The argument about freedom of choice is, for the most part, a valid one, but the reality before Jamie Oliver etc was usually Turkey Freekin' Twizzlers or nothing. The answer, I guess, is to have a real middle ground, and to enable (educate) kids to make informed choices.

 

L&P

BD

[lil_me]

Buying a child sweets will only cause these 'downers' where he's sad as his sugar levels will be up and down like a yoyo.

 

I definately am not a snob but make sure I buy 'the best I can' for my family. We do comprimise on some foods with them but the latter of what I buy is fresh, organic and with as few unneeded additions as possible.

 

When my son started tipping the scales for his age I threw out the deep fat fryer, and replaced it with a grilling machine and spray oil and other such things. I cleared out every item from my freezer and cupboards and rethought the way I shop. I didn't put him on a 'diet' just changed my attitude and his, and made more time to make his meals from fresh etc.

 

There is no excuse for muting a child by feeding them sweets, but I can appreciate how families must struggle on a low budget feeding their children due to the high price you have to pay for quality. Some of my friends call me a snob because of what I buy, I just see it as giving my family the best I can on the budget I have. I spend a lot in farmers markets and direct from organic farms, a local shop which is dedicated to good quality fresh food, and the best selection of organic produce I have found so far is Tescos. My only snobby thing I suppose is my fresh juices, I won't buy any made from concentrate , and have just bought a juicer so we can make our own

Edited October 8, 2005 by lil_me

[007paul007]

BD

You raised some good points here , the reason I started this thread was to see what people thought and personally I don't like the idea of things being forced on people , the freedom of choice should be there.

Both my children eat a variety of food and my son could eat for England no matter what it is LOL, I am a junk food person, sausage, egg and chips at leats 5 times a week. Now we are all thin as I have said in my post thats why I think it's in your Genes.

Regarding the mother with her obese son , may I put it another way, if the child was thin and was still unhappy cause he may of wanted to put a bit of weight and his mum still did the same with the sweets everyday, would you still be thinking the same thing ? Love is blind in many respects and yes some times what people might do for the love of their child might not be the right thing but to the parent it seems right. How many people have done things for the sake of their child and have been wrong afterwards, as I said i went through a dark period with my son which at times we jsut let him do what he wanted because we could not cope and we needed peace to recharge again, yes I went to social services and couldn't get help. But we made it through the bad times in the end and fingers crossed all is well now !!

[baddad]

Regarding the mother with her obese son , may I put it another way, if the child was thin and was still unhappy cause he may of wanted to put a bit of weight and his mum still did the same with the sweets everyday, would you still be thinking the same thing ?

Hi Paul -

Sorry to be pedantic about this but yes!!

If it went the other way and the kid needed to gain weight, I think a controlled high protein diet or even weight gain supplements would be the right way to go about it, not to shovel in loads of high sugar/no nutritional value sweets that were going to rot his teeth and send him hyper!

If you're lucky enough to be getting away with the sausage egg and chip diet and not suffering any sort of effects from it, good for you. That's not the case in this scenario, and she really is making her littlun unwell. At some point he will probably be very unhappy with the way he looks and feels - far more so than at present- as the usual imperatives kick in at around 12 or 13. He's probably not going to thank his mum then, and any habits he's picked up at this point are going to be harder to quit.

One other side issue - overeating and/or poor diet doesn't always equate to obesity. Some people stay thin, despite having cholesterol levels that are sky high. Sometimes large people with medical conditions have lower cholesterol levels because they are more active in eating foods to combat high cholesterol...

There are no easy answers for anything, and while I'd agree in general about rights and choices, it's not the kid in this scenario who's making the choice... He's just doing what many eight year olds would do given the option and a complete lack of understanding about the full implications.

 

L&P

BD

[Colin_and_Shelagh]

The problem with the freedom of choice argument is that is it difficult to make informed choices. How many people thought turkey twizzlers were made out of wholesome chunks of turkey before Jamie Oliver's series? And if it is difficult for us as adults then it is impossible for children.

 

Furthermore, if diet does affect behaviour then schools are right to be concerned about what children are eating while they are at school. After all, cigarettes are banned!

 

If you are concerned about the food on your plate then I urge you to read Felicity Lawrence's marvellous eye-opening and scary book 'Not on the label'.

 

Read about it on Amazon

 

Colin

Edited October 8, 2005 by Colin_and_Shelagh

[KarenT]

I can walk down any alley or aisle and eat whatever I like without piling on the pounds or being unhealthy, besides I choose to eat what I want to eat. I am lucky it's in my genes

You may not be putting on weight and you may believe that you're healthy, but you won't always be if you continue to eat a junk diet. The effects are cumulative and you will see this in time. My point about hydrogenated vegetable fat (for one example) is that it serves no nutritional purpose and is used only to extend shelf life, yet it's everywhere. The body cannot digest it and it builds up over the years to have adverse effects on the heart and digestive system (unfortunately I can't remember the research but it was enough to make me avoid it like the plague, which imo it is).

 

Even medicines contain artificial sweeteners and colourings that do nothing but make them taste nice and look pretty - hayfever pills contain Sunset Yellow, for heaven's sake. I'm not against additives if they actually improve foods but these days they're just put in at the drop of a hat with no thought to the consumer's health. As a nation we truly are living on frankenstein food, and that has only been the case in the last two or three decades. We used to have a choice about what we ate but now we don't.

 

Karen

x

[007paul007]

Karen

Thanks for your reply, I am on the same diet as my mum and dad were, ok my parents have both passed over and both their deaths were not related to smoking, drinking alchohol or their diet. I have a medical annually and have always passed with flying colours, so I think i will have to disagree with you on the with the fact that I will see the bad effects with time , but then I cannot fortell the future. My I also had that the other members of my family that have passed away also were not related to any of the following reasons I have said at the start of this reply.

People will get things wrong we can all refer to things like and I believe it is in the genes and some people can put it on easily than others.

 

Baddad

Just a quickie about the teeth thing, when I was a wee boy I ate lots of sweets and hated brushing my teeth , in fact in got so bad that at the age of 11 I saw a dentist and he said that I would lose my teeth by the age of 30 , i am now 40 and still have my full set of teeth, still love the junk food like chocolates, crisps and sweets on top of my sausage egg and chips. so there is one instant of a professional getting wrong , another one is I remember all these specialists telling me my son would never walk, guess what hey presto, I proved them wrong and got my son to walk and we are talking about people with letters behind their name.

I was skinny as lad , just the same as I am now really and I was always trying to put on a bit of weight at school , people taking the mick and making feel down but in the end I just got on with it, what I am trying to say is that a thin person can suffer just the same as an obese person with how they feel about their shape etc and sometimes that is overlooked . Not all kids go hyper with sweets though, it can very on a number of things, for example take Orange juice, pure or the diluted drinks you get, Oranges are supposed to be good for you, I give my son that and he gets so hyper he could break the 100 metres record LOL

 

 

Colin and Shelagh

 

You mentioned about the diet effecting behaviour and mentioned smoking . Well one thing I would like to pint out is , Alchohol effects behaviour in everyone, some can be extremely violent , some can be down right silly, some can be anti social, some can be sick, people know this and so does the government, then tell me why is this not banned everywhere and why do people who are supposed to be adults drink it still when they know these effects and lets not forget the damage that does to your body. How many people on here drink alchohol ?

 

This is a great debate though

[Colin_and_Shelagh]

Paul

 

You make a fair point about alcohol but it is also worth remembering that many studies have found that, in moderation, alcohol can be good for you.

 

Most people are aware that alcohol abuse is bad for the individual and, because of the behaviour it encourages, bad for society. I think 24-hour licensing is wrong. However much of the food we buy and eat is garbage, and people are not aware of it. Remember the Sudan 1 food scare a short while back? We are at the mercy of food companies who lace our food with God knows what.

 

Colin

[007paul007]

Colin

 

Thanks again for your very good comments.

 

Studies in this day and age, do they really mean anything and are we always told all the facts or just what they want us to know . I mean scientists could prove that an elephant could hang over the side of a cliff with his tail tied around adaisy when in reality we all know that could not be true. Food companies etc only let us know what they want us to know !

 

I know that you most food that we eat and but today is garbage and no one knows it, take for example sugar free drinks , which are supposed to be good for you , they contain Aspertame, which keeps raising its head and is not all over the press like the Jamie Oliver food campaign was for example.

 

Your point about being Alchohol being good for you in moderation in the long run, I fail to see how it can be good for you, I mean you can't drive a car under the influence of a certain amount of Alcholol , but you can drive it after having a good fry up.

 

One thing we can tell from Alchohol is for exmple someone might start feeling drunk after a glass of wine , some might after 10 for example everyone is different. Just how all babies walk at different ages , they all talk at different ages and that is like dieting , we are all different , some can put in on easier . Some can not put it on at all, I think it is in the genes .

[gvce]

As long as its healthy!!!

 

Thats what I say

 

[007paul007]

I think we are moving away from the main reason I posted this thread , it was basically about freedom of choice , I mean some parents have sent in crisps for example in there kids lunch boxes and the teachers have removed them, despite all the arguements as to whether you agree that the meals should be changed or not at the end of the day, people should have a right to a choice without things being enforced on them .

[KarenT]

If schools are to monitor children's lunch boxes then they will have to bear in mind that some children have eating issues which dictate what they can have for lunch. I give my son a very health diet generally but the Lunch Police would be horrified by what he takes to school every day: small pot of chocolate coated peanuts, small pot of pretzels (still salty but not no other cr*p, unlike other similar snack foods), a cut up apple, a slice of buttered wholemeal bread, a Ryvita and a homemade cake or biscuit (no HVF, you see), and a carton of juice which is always returned intact. However... I have learned from experience that if I vary from that the food won't be eaten. Eg he eats nuts and seeds by the handful at home but if they go in his lunchbox they instantly become foods of contempt and he won't touch them again for weeks. The upshot of this is that I have had to accept that I can't control his eating while he's at school so I give him enough to get through the day, and concentrate on good foods morning and evening to ensure he gets a proper balance.

 

Not all children are perfect little darlings who will take to carrot sticks and smoothies with relish. Those with eating issues must be considered or they'll starve.

 

Paul, I fully agree with you on Aspartame. I'm the odd-parent-out who goes into boots asking for liquid paracetamol with sugar rather than sugar-free. I know where I am with sugar but the jury's still out on Aspartame.

 

Karen

x

[007paul007]

Karen

Yes this Aspertame debate will go on , but imagine that it comes that there is a major problem with Aspertame , then the companies have lied to us yet again, but this would not be the first time.

For example take the MMR and autism link that was everywhere, well The government then tell parents that the MMR is much safer than the single jabs and that there is more risk with the single jabs that the MMR jab.

Well I read this another way, The single jabs that were to people long before the MMr came along were not safe and were a risk and the government never really said anything, so how can you trust what they say about the MMR jab.

I am just using that say that they will only tell us things they want us to know.

 

As for problems at school with the dinners , my daughter started high school last year and for the first three weeks unbeknown to us until the teachers contacted us, my daughter was not eating at school. They were having the healthy sendwiches, alot of it with brown bread and my daughter was not taking any because she didn't like it and at the time the vending machines had broken down. The problem was eventually sorted and my daughter eats ok now, but prefers the vending machine.

That is another problem that could happen, if kids don't like it they won't eat it.

[smallworld]

I too ask for the sugar loaded calpol rather than the sugar free version. How about one with no colours in either ? !!! Is that too much to ask ?

As for anti-biotics, why are they always full of colours ? The strawberry fishoil we have is colour free, so it's not an impossibilty !

I can do packed lunches without too many nasty additives, but I have no control over meds..

 

wac