General publics idea of "socially awkward" people?

[dekaspace]

I am on another forum and this guy mentioned he knows someone but isnt that friendly with him who asked him what he is doing tonight and was told that he is going out so his friend replied that could he come and was told no so texted and rang 7 times.

 

The person then goes on to say that the person is a dork and socially inept and very clingy, and how he is pathetic for asking to come out with him.

 

Seems the person who started the thread is a user as he mentions he only goes for a drink with him after work sometimes.

 

He gets loads of replies which are quite cruel about his friend saying he sounds like a psycho, a dork, a weirdo and how he must have a name like derek or trevor and he must have major issues or hes a stalker or a freak etc and a few people posted pictures of ugly people with rotten teeth and big old fashioned glasses saying he must look like them!

 

It really reminded me of me as I got called everything the OP thought of his friend myself though aboit 90% of my issues are that I am left out or just shoved in the deep end and nothing goes at my pace.

[Tally]

It sounds like some people have made very unpleasant and uncalled for comments about this man, but from the point of view of the person who has posted, this man is annoying him a lot. Maybe he thinks he is doing the man a favour by going out with him occasionally, and is not actually trying to use him in any way. If someone phoned and texted me seven times after I'd said I didn't want to go out with them, I would find that very annoying and upsetting, and might call them names too.

[Sally44]

I find the original posting interesting on a number of levels.

Those on the spectrum tend to have social interaction and communication difficulties.

Those who are NT are supposed to have 'empathy' (not saying those on the spectrum don't).

But what I find time and again is that there is some kind of 'unspoken' social hierachy and behaviour. So you would not be insulting to someone else you considered of a higher social standing, or maybe who was present in the room. But it is perfectly okay to say and do anything you want to someone else who is somehow viewed as being 'below' par in the eyes of the norm. That kind of behaviour is considered normal. And it isn't nice.

Having said that, this is a different situation and Dekaspace, you must not read yourself into that situation. I know you said you see similarities between your experience and this one. Which to some extent maybe true. But this also involves totally different people whom you only know via the forum. So don't take these posts and apply them to yourself and make yourself feel bad about it.

But there is a hierachy. In victorian times it was fine to go and gawp at people with all kinds of physical disabilities at the circus. That was considered normal. Even now we have many TV programmes about someone with some kind of gigantic growth, or too many arms and legs etc.

Believe me. I am not on the spectrum, and it is hard to understand it myself sometimes.

We also keep animals, and they too always have a hierarchy, and there is always one at the bottom of the social ladder. There does seem to be this strand of nature that isolates and excludes those that are different, or treats them less favourably. However evolution means that some of that 'difference', sometimes is the change the whole species needs to take a new direction and survive. I'm all for diversity. But I think most people find solace in company where people are similar to themselves.

I think all someone on the spectrum can do, if they are able, is to almost write a checklist of what to do to certain responses. As Tally says, if you find yourself contacting someone frequently, and they are not replying - then maybe you are becoming overbearing.

And humour - well that is even harder to grasp sometimes. Those on the post may not necessarily be posting and saying the things they are doing because they 'mean' it. It maybe considered a darker kind of humour, whereby in actual life they would not behave like that themselves.

For example, after any disaster there always appears a number of jokes about it.

[baddad]

I find the original posting interesting on a number of levels.

Those on the spectrum tend to have social interaction and communication difficulties.

Those who are NT are supposed to have 'empathy' (not saying those on the spectrum don't).

But what I find time and again is that there is some kind of 'unspoken' social hierachy and behaviour. So you would not be insulting to someone else you considered of a higher social standing, or maybe who was present in the room. But it is perfectly okay to say and do anything you want to someone else who is somehow viewed as being 'below' par in the eyes of the norm. That kind of behaviour is considered normal. And it isn't nice.

 

Hi sally/dekaspace -

 

I agree that the natural trait mentioned above isn't nice, but from the wording I get the feeling you're saying 'NT's should know better because they are supposed to be more empathetic' or suggesting in some way that groups of autistic people don't make such value judgements... And that's just not the case. Group dynamics like this exist at all levels of society and within all sub-groups of society. Additionally, it has little to do with social standing, but has a great deal to do with peer group identity and standing which is also pretty much another 'universal' factor that applies to all sub-groups. (Trying to think of an example; most people would consider a high court barrister to have a higher 'social standing' than, say, a bricklayer. But if you put a HCB in a room full of bricklayers he would be, regardless of social status, the odd one out and the butt of any 'jokes' that were going around.)

Believe me, i'm not defending the actions of the guy who seems to be making negative judgments about dekaspace's friend, and I acknowledge it's not 'nice'. But it's not uniquely 'NT' behaviour and it's entirely reasonable to not like someone even if they are 'different' in some way. Where it becomes discriminatory is if you dislike someone only because of their 'difference', and while that may be the case here for the third party posters the actual bloke involved does seem to have a valid reason (repeated annoying phonecalls) for feeling aggrieved.

As for those third party posters: well that, sadly, is human nature too and you'll find it on the boards of this forum as you will on any forum. Just find a post where someone is upset by the actions of an LEA officer or a teacher or something and you'll find plenty of posters who are willing to make judgements about them based purely on second-hand information from a (by definition) less than unbiased OP.

In fact, dekaspace's own post highlights that by making a judgement that the person he's talking about is a 'user' because he is sometimes willing to go for a drink and sometimes not. Without knowing the dynamics, it's entirely possible (as Tally pointed out) that on the occassions he does go for a drink he is trying to be 'nice' rather than a case of him being 'nasty' when he doesn't.

Hope that makes sense, and going back to the OP the best thing i can suggest for dekaspaces friend is he finds a drinking partner who is a bit more consistent, because regardless of whether the intentions of the man discussed are good or bad the reality is that it is an unfulfilling friendship.

 

Hope that helps

 

L&P

 

BD

[noogsy]

i read this and my heart sank,people are so unkind.

we cant all be cool and with it.

i come from a family of oddballs.

but on a good day they would do anything to help anyone.

noogsy x