keeping my son off school - where do i stand?

[bjkmummy]

joe has been sick 6 times today at school - he has been sick every day since monday and every day for the last month at school. we now have a vomiting diary for him. school have said they cant meet his needs at the recent emergency review. lea have now gone very very quiet indeed. his statement is for 20 hours but school said even with full time support they cant meet his needs. we have asked for a specialist asd school place for sept.

 

i have been very concerned about the sickness and when the teacher told me 6 times today it really concerns me - he is underweight and is seeing a dietican - he is on 2 milkshake supplements a day of 300 calories each. he saw a p ead a few weeks ago and she put it into writing that the sickness is anxiety based. she actually said to me that the sickness will only stop when he changes school though she didnt put that quote into her report but made it clear that the sickness not due to any other medical reason.

 

took Joe to duty gp today who has given me some medicine as he is concerned about how his tummy is coping with the vomiting. i asked him if he could sign joe off but he said wouldnt do it for a child but would make sure that today was documented so the evidence needed there if i need it.

 

so now im torn - do i keep sending him to school where they cant meet his needs and hes vomiting every day or keep him home which could be indefinately with how my lea are acting. i tried to contact the sen officer today but told she was out all day but i dont think she was . they said they would get her to phone me tomorrow but i dont believe for one second that she will. i suppose im worried taht i could make things worse for joe and that the lea would drag their heels even more or not at all and could end up with him out of school forever - hes only 8 years old.

[Sally44]

Are you under Clinical Psychology? Ask your GP for a referal.

 

Also tell your GP and IF you keep him off school the LA can involve the Educational Welfare Officer, which could result in you going to jail. As this vomitting is anxiety based it is a medical condition and so you need the GP to sign him off sick until he is seen by Clincical Psychology who should then be able to write a letter for you. Tell him that you need the written evidence NOW and ask him to put that in a letter to you that you can give to the school.

 

You really need to push the GP to get off the fence. Ask them what they are expecting you to do? Everyone is saying they cannot meet his needs in school. This poor child, with an ASD and anxiety is so anxious he is throwing up repeatedly every day. The consultant has said he has no 'physical' medical problem, and is also concerned about the number of times he is vomitting.

 

Go back to the GP and ask for the referal and sick note and sit in that office until he writes a note. Tell the GP that IF you have something in writing you are able to ask the local authority to provide something different for your child.

 

Also ask the school what you are supposed to do and what are they going to do in the meantime. If they cannot meet his needs are they suggesting you keep him at home - and if so can they put that in writing. If they are not suggesting that, can they please put in writing how they will meet his anxiety needs in school so that he is not repeatedly being sick. Put it in a letter saying something like "over the last xx months my son has deteriorated due to not coping in school. You have agreed that you cannot meet his needs. My son is now repeatedly vomitting in school on a daily basis. Today I have been told he was sick 6 times. This is simply unacceptable for a young child with an ASD and extreme chronic anxiety. Can you please put in writing how you intend to proceed since you have stated you cannot meet his needs. Am I supposed to continue to bring him into school for him to be repeatedly sick on a daily basis?"

 

This is where you really do have to start to get tough, and bat the ball back into their court to make everyone do what they are supposed to do and put it all in writing. Otherwise you will be left with no evidence, keeping him at home, and could get into trouble yourself, and still not get the outcome and placement your child needs.

Edited June 14, 2012 by Sally44

[Sally44]

If he is at home, the LA may say that they have no legal responsibility to provide home education without a consultants letter saying he is medically unfit to attend school [anxiety is a medical condition]. I don't know if that is legal or not. I would ask IPSEA. If it is a requirement that you have a consultants letter, that is even more reason to be referred to Clincial psychology.

 

When we were at this stage we went through months of everyone faffing around and trying not to commit themselves to anything. Make sure you minute any meetings that are held, or better still record them on a dictaphone.

 

And whenever you are asked what you 'want' say "All I want is for my son to be happy to go to school without being anxious and sick on a daily basis, in a school placement that can meet all of his needs." Then bat it back to them by asking them "what do you suggest/intend to do." Don't agree to anything. Always ask for time to think about anything you are offered, and always visit any alternative placement that could be suggested.

Edited June 14, 2012 by Sally44

[bjkmummy]

Thanks Sally. I am going to keep him off today and tomorrow and then will get an appointment on Monday when I will take my husband who will happily say what needs to be said. He was sick last night at home as well. I checked his bmi - its 15.9 - I can't allow this to continue. He is still asleep even though he is normally up at about 6am - think his body is exhausted and tired. Rumour I have from parent partnership is that the lea are more concerned about our OT report and are considering whether to get their own before they do anything else so they are going to try and string this out for months. I just need that statement back so I can get onto tribunal

[Sally44]

There is a timescale within which the LA must finalise the Statement. So check to make sure they haven't gone over that date.

 

Do they know you are seeking a different placement?

 

Make sure you get something in writing from the GP, and also the referal, just to cover yourselves. You also need something in writing from the consultant who said it was not a physical illness [ie. due to anxiety], and that he was concerned about his weight.

 

To begin with my GP would not put anything in writing and said "you don't need a sick note for children, you just keep them home until they are better." But the whole point is that they are not getting better. It isn't a virus, it is due to a combination of chronic and actue stress.

 

When you see the GP again, have details of how many times he has been sick over the last month, and how many days he has been off school and sent home. Just make it clear to the GP that as his parents this is not acceptable, he is not coping in school and your child continue to be put through this stress on a daily basis. Say that the school have said they cannot meet his needs, and that you want him to be in a different school placement.

 

Is he showing any other signs of anxiety such as not going to sleep, headaches, stomach pain, any tics such as coughing, sniffing etc.

 

Is he compliant and agrees to go to school each morning, or is he refusing?

 

We had got to the stage where I had to physically dress my son, whilst he was crying and trying to take off his clothes. He would refuse to eat breakfast and so I would try to spoon feed him. Then he would be sick when the taxi driver turned up, or would be sick on arrival at school and I would have to go to fetch him.

 

When we had our meeting with Clinical Psychology I asked him "how much force should I use to get my son into school." I told them what I was having to do and said I felt very uncomfortable using that level of force to send him into a school that I knew could not support him and where he was not coping. They advised to me only use "gentle encouragement". I asked them to put that in writing, which they did.

 

I know that gentle encouragement was not going to get him into school. So I had an open and honest talk with my son and asked if how he felt about school. He said he could not take it anymore. He was genuinely sorry and upset about it. I told him that I would not send him into school if he could not take it. But that if he felt okay he should go into school. He didn't go back to school for nearly a year.

 

The LA did arrange for a special needs teacher to come and collect him twice a week, to take him to his school for a 2 hour session. This was held in the schools store room and he often was back home within the hour after getting upset and insisting he came home.

 

I taught him a sign language hand signal that meant home and I said that if he felt he could not take it anymore and needed to leave, he should make that sign to the teacher and she would understand what it meant and she would bring him home. Both Clinical Psychology and the LA EP were in agreement with this because they both said that he should not be 'encouraged' to stay longer than he could endure and he needed to understand that his attempts at communication were being understood and acted on.

 

I was also fortunate that on one occasion my son came home within the hour whilst I was on the phone to my advocate who was helping me prepare my SEND case. Because at the tribunal the LA said that my son had coped with the 2 hour sessions and had been happy! I said that was not true and my advocate could confirm that she had witnessed herself that he could not tolerate the full 2 hour session as she had heard him come home whilst we were on the telephone. Believe me, my LA told so many lies and tried so many tricks - so be prepared for them to saying anything at the Tribunal.

 

At the Tribunal the LA EP said that she was of the opinion that I was 'exaggerating' my sons anxiety. So I referred the Panel to the letter from the CAHMS Psychiatrist which stated he had serious self harm behaviours and had admitted to her that he had attempted to kill himself and that after talking with him for some time he promised not to do that again.

 

That is why you need everything on paper. You need to know your case inside out and back to front and you need to know what the LA can and cannot provide both within school and within the LA because at the Tribunal they will turn up and say that they will do everything needed to meet the Statement. If you can prove that they would have to buy all the provision in, that makes an independent or special school [that has those therapies and provision as standard] be the better option. The Tribunal Panel has to decide IF the LA can meet all the child's needs, and if they cannot they have to go with the placment they think can meet the needs. That should be your parental choice of school.

 

As awful as it sounds, it really helps your case if he is repeatedly off school. That he is being seen by Clinical Psychology and that he is quite seriously underweight. So do try to push to get what you need in writing. Don't push the school or LA to do anything, because it looks better on your part if they have not had any multi disciplinary team meetings about this and are just burying their heads in the sand.

Edited June 14, 2012 by Sally44

[bjkmummy]

parent partnershiphave phoned me - im really unsure about how independant they are. she is making a big deal over the private OT report saying that an OT report should have been asked during the stat assessment which end last nov and the LEA not happy that ive got a private report. she says the lea are completely right to now to go and get their own nhs report and i should sit now and wait whilst they do this. i wont get the statement from the ergency review back until they have done this. lea dont understand why i got a private ot report even though i gave them a letter showing that the nhs ot wouldnt do it. the referall to nhs ot was done by a member if the councils own staff! at a meeting in april lea woman agreed to emergency review and talked about getting evidence etc . joe was having huge problems with ot at school so thats why i got a report - unfortunately for the lea it raised huge issues for joe and thats why i think they are not best pleased. my parental view at stat assessment did mention his sensory issues, the medical report mentioned some motor issues - maybe i should have asked for ot during stat assessment but then surely the lea should have well! made second phone call to sen officer to call me back - still silence - major avoidance going on here i think. but as soon as school mentioned issues re sensory issues i did try and do something - is it really my fault the nhs wouldnt do anything and that a private report clearly indicates how complex he is.

[bed32]

parent partnershiphave phoned me - im really unsure about how independant they are. she is making a big deal over the private OT report saying that an OT report should have been asked during the stat assessment

That should dispel any lingering questions over her independence - just remember who pays her (ditto LA EPs and even Schools).

 

She is correct that the OT assessment should have been done during the stat assessment - but it is the job of the LA to get that done. I can also understand why the LA want an NHS assessment as well - if nothing more than to get information on what the NHS can provide.

 

It may be that submitting evidence of a substantial new need (such as OT) that was not considered during the initial assessment is really triggering a re-assessment rather than an normal review.

 

However delaying of the process seems to be par for the course for most LAs and you can expect them to use any and every excuse either not to reassess or to delay it. If they are getting an NHS report done - and so delaying the process - it might be worth making a formal request for re-assessment of his needs as this will give you access to SENDDIST if they refuse to amend the statement.

[Sally44]

The PP are employed by the LA, the very people that have to fund the Statement. So how good they are varies a great deal.

 

I would first recommend you get in touch with IPSEA and find out what timescale there is, if any, by which the LA must come to a decision, so that you can appeal.

 

This is also why it is VERY important that you time WHEN you have independent reports done, because if/when the NHS OT goes and assesses again, you can almost guarantee that she is going to say that she does not find the same level of severity of need as the independent OT. And that is partly due to the fact that IF they find that level of need, they don't fund the therapy to meet that need! So they don't provide it as part of the NHS.

 

Believe me, I have gone through all this myself before.

 

So find out if you can push the LA to finalise the Statement so that you can appeal. And I would send a well worded letter to the LA Inclusion Officer detailing what you have said previously. That they did not commission a report from the OT originally. That your independent OT has given a true and accurate reflection of his needs and the provision needed to meet them. And that their insistance of having a further OT report is simply a delaying tactic being used at a time when your son is seriously ill due to anxiety.

 

In any case, the LA can still finalise the Statement so that you can appeal, and they still have about 4 months within which they could re-assess. Or you could contact your independent OT again and ask her to do an update on her report to describe his deterioration. And if she did that the NHS OT would not be able to re-assess him because it would be less than 6 months since an OT assessed him.

 

If the Independent report was carried out less than 6 months ago, the NHS OT cannot repeat any of those assessments anyway, as it is not good practice to repeat assessments inside of 6 months.

 

Or you can let her go and assess and see what she says, and then lodge the appeal and hope you have a further opportunity to have your OT go in and re-assess before the actual tribunal date, so that she can state that the 'improvement' detailed by the NHS OT were not evident during her assessments etc.

 

They are playing a game and keeping you on the runaround.

 

Is the PP person the head of the department? If they are not I would speak with the Head of the department and state that you do not think the PP person who has been responding to your requests for help is impartial or knowlegeable from the information she has given you. The fact is that an emergency review was called because your child was not coping. And what is the LA doing? Trying to delay any decision even further by insisting on further reports being done. How is your son being supported in the meantime?

 

You could try to stop any further assessments being carried out by also putting in your letter that your son is so anxious - vomitting 6 times yesterday due to anxiety in school - that he is not in any fit state to undertake any further assessments at the moment and that you are waiting for a referal to Clinical Psychology, who should be able to advise you further about when he is able to cope with any further assessments.

 

You have to appear as being very cooperative whilst at the same time being saavy, and sidestepping any moves they try to make. Don't be rude or confrontational or refuse things, because they will paint that picture to the SEND Tribunal of you being uncooperative etc.

 

Forget about the LA being fair and having your child's interests at heart. Wake up and smell the coffee and start defending your corner - whilst still appearing as being cooperative. Say something like "I am not opposed to further assessments but my son is not in any fit condition to undergo any assessments at the moment and due to his severe deterioration and everyones agreement that he is not coping I would like you to finalise the Statement so that no more time is wasted." Then see what they do.

 

Make sure school are aware that you do not give your parental permission for him to be assessed or seen by anybody in school without prior notice in writing. Because they will send someone in without even asking you. They did that to me. The LA EP refused to assess my son for months, but as soon as the Inclusion Officer wanted her to re-assess she was in school the next day and saw him without my knowledge. I lodged a formal complaint about that.

 

I'm just sorry that you're going through it at the moment.

Edited June 14, 2012 by Sally44

[bjkmummy]

thank you sally as always - that is very good advice - i am still waiting for the sen officer to phone me since yesterday - phoned her again today to be told that she was out all morning - shame they didnt tell that to me yesterday when i phoned and they specifically said we will get her to call you in the morning. we are thinking about returning him to school on monday to see how he goes - if the sickness continues next week then we are going to ask for a part time timetable although the other part of me thinks that as its only 5 weeks maybe just bite the bullet and keep him off - no sign of sickness today although i thought he had been sick last night as i found sick in teh bathroom sink this morning - spoke to dh and he leaves for work at 5.30am and he says it wasnt there then so sounds like hes got up very early this morning and been sick then before i woke up - would explain why he slept in today. parent partnership as far as i can see is just her - dont think she has a boss at all. it is clear the lea have spoken to her. i will phone the lea again tomorrow as i need to hear it from them that is what they are up to as so far it is only from the parent partnership - its all irrevelant anyway as even without the OT report he was still struggling at school and they would still say they cannot meet his needs so they would still have to do something but i think its because the OT report recommends specialist placement - and we all know that a NHS ot is never going to do that as its going to be so generic - the advice in my report is coming true - that he will struggle to cope

[Sally44]

Before you can appeal you need them to finalise the Statement. I would be pushing for that because any appeal is going to be 4-6 months after you have lodged your appeal, which is bringing you into the next academic year. Whatever placement you are after maybe full - have you talked to the school you think he should be moved to?

 

Please speak to or email IPSEA for information about deadlines within which the LA must finalise the Statement after an Emergency Review.

[bed32]

Please speak to or email IPSEA for information about deadlines within which the LA must finalise the Statement after an Emergency Review.

I don't believe that you have the right to appeal against a refusal to update the statement following an Emergency Review, as far as I am aware an emergency review is not covered either in the code of practice or the legislation. You probably need to request a reassessment - and you can appeal from a refusal to reassess. The problem with that is that it is a two stage process - you need to appeal the refusal to assess (5 months) and then would need to appeal the assessment(another 5 months).

[Sally44]

This is why a phone call/email to IPSEA is needed for clarification. If an emergency review has been called, and has happened, there has to be an outcome to that. If the outcome [whether that is to amend or not] does not give the parent the right to appeal, then the OP needs to ask the LA for an immediate re-assessment of the Statement, and therefore needs to hold off getting any further independent reports, as they would be a waste of money at this stage.

 

So this needs clarifying URGENTLY.

[bjkmummy]

or do i just wait again until the annual review in november? will try and contact ipsea - makes the whole theory of emergency review pretty pointless then really doesnt it - should have just moved to a reassessment of his needs in the first place rather than going to emergency review.

 

things getting worse - trying to contact the sen officer for 3 days - she has they say been constantly out of the office. joes paperwork sent back to lea day after emergency review on 1st june - lea now say they have never received the paperwork back which is pretty poor - it was definately sent so im pretty angry that they have lost it all. thing is regardless of anything the school have said they cant meet his needs so hes got to move school - they cant leave him there so they will have to amend the statement and surely if tehy amend it i should have the right to appeal as they could name any old unsuitable school. my head is literally spinning!!!!

[bjkmummy]

right spoken to sos sen - i do have the right to appeal as although we all go round calling it an emergency review it is an early annual review so the the normal rules apply and i need to the statment to be amended or not as the case may be - the law was updated a couple of years ago to give us this right - there is apparently something on the sos sen website so im off to go and find out about it. the review did follow teh exact procedure of an annual review ie reports etc so i should be okay - the only problem is of course that there is no timeline attached to how long the lea can take.

[Sally44]

That is what I thought.

 

Also the law changed recently so that whether the LA amends the Statement or not, you still have a right to appeal.

 

And your right to appeal is about ANY part of the Statement, not just the bit that was amended or not amended - if that makes sense?

 

So you can appeal parts 2, 3 and 4.

 

So how many weeks AFTER the emergency review do they have to come to a decision as to whether to amend or not?

[Sally44]

or do i just wait again until the annual review in november? will try and contact ipsea - makes the whole theory of emergency review pretty pointless then really doesnt it - should have just moved to a reassessment of his needs in the first place rather than going to emergency review.

 

things getting worse - trying to contact the sen officer for 3 days - she has they say been constantly out of the office. joes paperwork sent back to lea day after emergency review on 1st june - lea now say they have never received the paperwork back which is pretty poor - it was definately sent so im pretty angry that they have lost it all. thing is regardless of anything the school have said they cant meet his needs so hes got to move school - they cant leave him there so they will have to amend the statement and surely if tehy amend it i should have the right to appeal as they could name any old unsuitable school. my head is literally spinning!!!!

 

 

This is another deliberate act. Losing the paperwork. How many times have I heard that one!

 

Regardless of the fact that they have or haven't lost the papers, they are working to a legally binding timescale. If they don't keep to that timescale you can involve the Local Government Ombudsman.

 

I would advise that you phone SOSSEN again or SEND themselves and ask them how many weeks AFTER an emergency review the LA has to issue their decision. Also ask what you do if they do not keep to that timescale.

 

When you know what the date is write to he LA saying something like.

 

"I have tried several times to contact xxxxxx the Inclusion Officer dealing with xxxxxx case. I have repeatedly been told they are out of the office and my phone calls are not being returned.

 

I have today been informed that you have apparently "lost" all the paperwork relating to this emergency review. Which as you know, was called due to my son not coping in school. His health is deteriorating and we are being referred to Clinical Psychology.

 

I would like to remind you that having called an emergency review, you are under a timescale by which you must issue your decision. This date is xxxxx. If I have not received your Decision by that date you are acting illegally and I will refer this as a complaint to he Local Governments Ombudsman."

 

Or something similar - unless you can take some other course of action too.

 

I would also copy that letter into your local MP.

 

Start to get them running around.

[Sally44]

Also, having learnt the same lesson as yourself. I now always send correspondence via tracked mail or recorded delivery and I always get a receipt for the letter sent detailing the postcode it was sent to.

 

Infact, I hand delivered all 5 lever arch files of my Appeal to the LA Inclusion Officer personally.

 

Keep your chin up. And make sure you put everything in writing from now on, and file all correspondence away, because this is all going to be part of your evidence for any appeal.

 

What type of school placement are you looking for?

[bjkmummy]

They say now they received it on weds. The paperwork was sent by the head- she sent it via the school courier system so it was collected on 1st june - last day of term. Lea say that then after being collected by school courier it wouldn't come into the lea until after half term so where exactly did it then go for a week? No one can explain that and even then it's taken until weds to get to lea. Sen officer has called and is still in meetings - she is looking at the case next week. Head is now chasing lea as it parent partnership (although we know what she is like!) I will speak to SEND on monday and try and find out how much time they have. Regarding the lea getting upset about private OT report - in my parental report in June last year I talk at length about the sensory issues Joe has plus also tried to get paediatric referral in sept which I have in writing then the next referral in nov so I can show I tried every way I could. Parent partnership says my OT report is very good . School placement needs to be asd specific special school. There is a maintained one 30 miles away or an independent one 35 miles away -we have no special schools in county so will have to be out of county

[Sally44]

Have you been in touch with either of them to see if they have any places?

 

You need to visit both of them, because you are going to have to name your parental choice of school in the appeal.

 

And how long would the journey take if he went by taxi every day?

 

Are either of them boarding schools, or day only?

Edited June 15, 2012 by Sally44

[bjkmummy]

both are day schools - the one i want and the one lea most likely to go for does have places - its about an hour in a taxi.

 

He has after having thurs and fri off school last week been signed off by the gp this morning for a week due to anxiety. last night was horrific = he must have been sick 20 plus times easily. i have a meeting with the head tomorrow morning at 8.30am to discuss what will happen for the rest of the term. gp wants to see if he can go to school part time ie mornings for the rest of the term.

[Sally44]

Get the GP to put that in writing. Then it has come from a medical professional, and isn't just something mum asked for.

 

An hour is quite a long taxi drive. Does the independent one do boarding?

[bjkmummy]

Yes got it in writing from the gp. That's the problem here - as we have no schools in county the kids have to travel to the neighbouring counties so the travel distance is always going to be long. He's too young at 8 for residential

[Sally44]

Does the school have other 8 year olds residential?

 

Plus realistically, he could be nearer to 9 when this is all over.

 

Talk to the school about that. Do they have other pupils that travel for such a long distance.

[bjkmummy]

no - no residential kids at all - he is 9 in september so he will be 9 by the time its over - quite a few children in county go to the same school and travel this distance. my best friends so started there at 7 so did the same travelling. we are a very small county - we only have 40 children with asd who have statements and out of this 12 go out of county and i would say about 8 of them go to this school.

[Sally44]

Okay, if there are already other children making the same distance, the LA cannot argue it is too far.