dm2010
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Posts posted by dm2010
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There is no excuse for this sort of behaviour as an adult.
AS does not prevent anyone exercising free will to speak and act reasonably on their own account. He should do so - rapidly.
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Hmm.
As an exam veteran (A levels in maths, science, degree in engineering) preparing like this for mock exams is a bad move. Reason being, the stress will be double when the real thing comes along. Mock exams do not matter - no one is ever going to know or care in later life what he scored on them.
Exam stress more than once a year isn't good. Best not to revise for mock exams, manyana ! When the results come in you then have an unvarnished record of how good he is or isn't at each subject. With the pressure off he'll do rather well I reckon. Then you can take a critical look at where the effort needs to go in to prepare for the real thing.
You say you want to let him do his own thing but can't for fear of failure. Well let him make that decision, failure is part of life and a mock exam is a pretty low risk way to learn about it. 4 years from now he will have to study alone at university so best to start learning how to do it now.
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I had a lot of interpersonal problems in my first job - before AS diagnosis.
But that place was a bad employer, so in retrospect I don't feel bad about it.
But there were a few things I do now to avoid getting into trouble. I have reputation as a pretty harsh but fair operator.
1. Wait 24 hours befor reacting when faced with bullying, bad behaviour or the like to think of a logical unemotional response. Exception is when someone swears at me directly then I just tell them to be quiet. Last time this happened those present reckoned it was just the right thing to do.
2. Don't be alone with someone who wants to give you a hard time. If they behave badly in public towards you don't react, in fact get them to repeat themselves - it helps build a blame free case. You also get points for not rising to it.
3. Try and be the last person to fall out with someone rather than the first.
4. If something unpalatable has to be said and you have clear evidence to back it up, then say it, in public if necessary. Criticise the work, not the person. "e.g. this document is missing key sections x,y,z and was delivered a week late." I call this approach 'killer facts', designed to kill criticism stone dead because no comeback is possible - apart from excuses.
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So the consensus is for us Aspies Earth is a great planet, it's just full of other people. Perhaps we should try elsewhere.
I've heard Gliese 581e is rather promising ?
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Short answer - yes and no !
I was not diagnosed until age 26. But it had already played havoc with school, university and my early career. At that stage I would have definitely said yes. I wasn't a successful or happy schoolboy, student or graduate in social terms, but I did deliver on the academics as I knew I had to.
But as time has gone on I'm leaning towards the view that in my profession - engineering - it's actually a distinct advantage.
Unfortunately people always judge me socially at first, and perhaps I have lost out in career advancement, at least superfically. I have chuckled when people have crashed and burned after a premature promotion - as they always do in the end. These days I get allocated the most difficult and critical work because people know I will deliver on it. And job wise there may be a big jump up the tree soon - watch this space.
I came to the latter conclusion 2 years ago thundering down a German Autobahn at night in my 2 tonne 4x4 at over 100 mph. God knows how much diesel I was using but I didn't care. I thought hey - things actually haven't gone badly in the last 10 years.
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Oh Shona, so sorry to hear this. It's hard to deal with meetings when it's an emotive issue for you as well. It may help if her dad goes to the meetings, either with or without you.
Have a look at the ACE booklet below, it's got useful advice in it, much of which you may have already done, but it may give you a few more ideas on how to get the school to tackle this.
http://www.ace-ed.org.uk/Resources/ACE/advice%20booklets/Tackling%20Bullying%202010.pdf
I don't think this is a good idea. Most schools have strict rules about using mobile phones, the misuse of which could lead to sanctions against the pupil, which would only add to the problems.
K x
I'm not up to date on mobile phone use in schools so I had a google on it. This is a typical policy and it includes all digital devices not just phones. Sounds pretty sensible.
http://www.royalhigh.edin.sch.uk/content/information/policies/Mobile%20Phone%20Policy.pdf
Basically states you are not allowed to make or receive calls or texts when in lessons, or physically use the phone in your hand. Also bans photography at all times. It stays in your bag with the signal switched off to avoid phones going off in lessons. Nothing to say you can't leave it in your bag as a passive sound recorder with the phone capability switched off.
It would be crazy anyway to ban such use - many times at school I wished I had an audio recording to replay the contents of a lesson so I could better understand what was being taught after the event. Most teachers I know would be flattered if students audio recorded their lessons for playback later.
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These days it's easy enough to buy cheap audio data recorders based on a USB memory stick that can store the last 12 hours (or longer) of sound they are exposed to. Mobile phones often have such functionality too. I would recommend all aspies carry such live data recorders with them (or perhaps tape them to the underside of a desk) for use as evidence in bullying cases where it's verbal rather than physical abuse.
This can be used as police evidence to bypass the school if they won't cooperate.
Generally I think it's time to stop sidestepping this issue and expose it for what it is - offensive behaviour by individuals that is illegally condoned by school authorities. Such behaviour is not tolerated anywhere else, so why should schools be different ?
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The school has a legal duty of care to prevent bullying.
This isn't an 'ask nicely' issue. The school is breaking the law, because this personal abuse is going on during the school day on school premises.
Such abuse at work would result in grievance and disciplinary action. Because if they didn't the company would be sued for negligence.
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And this one too
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tciemb0Bkm8
Fabulous Films are bringing out the English version DVD soon, but this does ok. It is is German, but the characterisation is so good that a translation is not really necessary. This version is a much darker tale than I remember, mainly because the hilariously bad dubbing is missing. The production values and Patrick Bach's performance are first rate throughout - modern kids TV is rubbish by comparison.
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The trick is to find a productive activity to pursue independently to a high level - it can be anything as long as achievement, not people are the main focus. Achieve excellence in something - anything - and good things will happen socially because people respect you for your achievement, especially others doing the same activity.
To take a historical example, medieval craft guilds required a journeyman to produce a 'masterpiece' for examination by guild representatives to determine whether or not he could call himself a master craftsman. Note it was the crafted piece and not the person who was judged. The idea of 'teamwork' and 'people skills' being of overriding importance is a modern fad.
I chose the modern version of the master craftsman route. Few like me - and frankly I no longer care - but I do have professional respect in the activities I pursue. Very occasionally, that respect has turned into very productive friendships that have lasted decades.
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So full house on all points ! Perhaps I should call this Aspie bingo.
It does strike me that we now have official diagnosis, SEN help in schools, statements, meetings, more meetings, more statements yadayada . . .
But the fundamental issue of putting the right teachers in front of Aspie kids has not been solved. There's no mystery here, put a good teacher in charge and most Aspie 'problems' disappear like magic.
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Look at this from an Aspie child point of view. I was one once !
You have no friends at school, and your parents are worried. School says you need to socialise more. Bad mistake, it's like asking someone to grow a third leg - simply not going to happen. To solve this problem I believe that Aspies should pursue individual sports, which they will likely have success at. Team sports are a device designed to make Aspies feel bad.
I made a choice at age 14 to become a swimmer. Rather late as swimmers go, but I did persevere with it and got pretty good, by age 17 I was winning regularly and got full colours for sports at school, much to the headmaster's surprise. Not that the school was any help, since I didn't play cricket or rugby I didn't exist on their radar. Was it a panacea ? No - but it made things bearable rather than not. Didn't make friends as such, but generated a lot of respect. And I have always preferred respect to friendship in my professional life since.
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I guess I could summarise this :
Good teacher = progress
Bad teacher = disaster
Aspies do exceptionally well with good teachers and exceptionally badly with the bad ones.
The overall school ethos does make a small difference, but it's an individual teacher in a classroom that really makes things work - or not. What you describe here is unprofessional and unacceptable behaviour by a teacher who should know better.
My parents and grandparents were teachers so I know this from both sides of the fence.
Therefore my counsel would be this - the situation will not improve unless the bad teacher(s) your son has to put up with are replaced with competent professionals, which you will need to assess by speaking to them personally. That probably means changing schools, but don't hesitate if that gives the right result. The SEN stuff won't help unless it solves this fundamental problem.
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Hello,
Just a note on bullying. Do you not have a saferneighbourhoods team in your area? Not sure where you live, but all of England and wales have Saferneighbourhood teams allocated to local areas, specifically for that area, which are made up of Police and community police support officers dealing with local issues. In my area they have a police community support officer attached to schools and do talks and keep a check on bullying and other behaviours in schools, so work closely with schools to help stop bullying.
If you know what I mean by this, then perhaps you could speak to them about it and if they are not doing anything like this in your area to perhaps request it. There shouldn't be any need to move schools anymore for this kind of behaviour.
When there is physical violence involved police should be called immediately and the incident treated as assault with those responsible taken through the courts. These are serious criminal matters - it should NOT be within a school's discretion to handle it internally, in fact I was advise any parent to simply inform the headteacher that police action is being taken, with crime number references as appropriate. This on its own might well bring immediate improvements whether or not a prosecution is brought.
One of the key developments over the last 30 years is CCTV cameras in schools, public transport and the like. This evidence can be obtained and used in court.
Unfortunately, this cannot address the non physical bullying that goes on. But it is progress, hopefully the deterrent of having police called when violence occurs will shame schools into doing more to address the culture that encourages it.
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Arrived in Lanzarote yesterday for 2 weeks hols and act as race support for a friend doing a 24 hour endurance race. He will be on the course 24 hours nonstop. Nuts.
But I'm here to do a spot of sightseeing too. Anyone remember that hilariously badly dubbed kids TV series from the 80's - Tim Tyler ? It's actually a corruption of the German 'Timm Thaler' and much of it was filmed at the artist Cesar Manrique's house in Mirador Del Rio, Lanzarote - and is open to tourists.
Also doing one of my favourite activities - open water swimming.
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The problem is always how to get through the day. The memories are still raw even after 30 years. Short answer is that there is no magic bullet here and I realised that at the time - hence my long term strategy swimming plan. But there are a few things that can be done :
1. Some places in school are safer than others. Libraries for example are excellent - and you can get academic work done too. You might consider collecting him directly from the school library rather than the gate.
2. Get into a routine of things to do each day at a certain time, regardless of what the bullies do. Structure does help.
3. There will come a time when your son has to defend himself physically and win. But he has to pick his time - The Duke of Wellington always said "don't offer battle unless you think you can win". If he's physically fit, he is likely to be successful. A key incentive perhaps to motivating him.
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Hi again
Thank you, that is really good advice. I have tried a number of things, but he seems to lack the intinsic motivation to want to do any of it - I think that he has the potential to be a really good long distance runner, but I cannot get him to run with me or on his own on a treadmill. How can I motivate him? What motivated you?
Juls
He needs someone else to start him off. Someone who he only sees for that activity. I take the rowing machine as an example, because it's the easiest to control. How about :
1. You tell him that Uncle / cousin / grandparent / etc (circle as appropriate, someone he admires as a mentor but sees infrequently) has something to show him at his house, which he's going to visit for a weekend.
2. The Concept II machine is duly revealed. Your mentor figure demonstrates it, selling the idea that this is something that your son could be really good at. All he has to do is train alone on it. Your son has a go on it and after 2 minutes feels like throwing up.
The response is -
"painful isn't it - but you decide when to stop, no one else. You're safe on that machine and it tells you exactly how well you've done, no bias or opinions."
3. Your mentor figure says farewell, inviting him back for next week. This time round he gets to 5 minutes before stopping.
Hopefully after a few visits your son will be pestering you to install the machine in your garage so he can train on it.
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Here's a few specifics to start with. Based on my own experience with hindsight.
Find an out of school endurance sporting activity - or in school if they offer it - that doesn't depend for its success on social interaction. Avoid team sports like the proverbial plague, and try and pull him out of doing them if possible - this might give an immediate improvment. A couple of suggestions, if only because I've done them all at some point. It's no coincidence that these sports are very demanding physically.
Cycling
Rowing - indoor rower or single sculls, not multicrew boats
Swimming
Running
One of the easiest to start is indoor rowing on the Concept II machines you will have seen at any gym. These can be leased at home for a modest cost. You can also use it yourself - the whole family can all get fit at the same time.
The trick here is to train alone for months, improving fitness and personal confidence in a safe home environment. Once the times are looking good he can enter one of the regional races with only the stopwatch determining how well he does. Might give him the confidence to try a real boat ! This won't go un-noticed at school, you will find that situation will ease as he gains the respect of the sports players who command influence in any school. May well gain friends too, which as any Aspie knows are like gold dust.
I actually took the swimming route. Effective, but with hindsight, I think the above would have worked better and more quickly. I do recommend open water swimming in the sea though, no bully can get you when you're 500 metres offshore.
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Thank you so much for that reply - I will certainly look into those links. I am also interested to know something - many books and blogs and sites talk about teaching children with Asperger's coping skills and social skills, but nobody actually tells you how or where you can access such groups/ classes in your area. Any ideas??
Thanks again
Juls
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Hello All,
This is the first time that I have had the courage to use a forum. I am a stay at home Mum of 3 boys. They are 3,11 and 12, the eldest was diagnosed with AS about 2 years ago.
It has always been tough, but now I am completely at a loss as to what to do. We have changed school once because of bullying and now it seems that it is happening again at his new school. The difference is that he wont talk about what it is or who is doing it. In fact, he will not talk about any of the issues at school at all. He simply gets in the car with a face like thunder and barely speaks or responds at all. I am desperate to help him and am considering home schooling, but I am not sure that would really help him.
Does anyone know of any face to face support groups for me and also social skills training groups for him in the area around Bracknell/Windsor?
I look forward to hearing from anybody!
Juls
My parents were both teachers and I had the same issues at school (I'm now 40). So I've been there done that, and might be able to offer some useful advice. Does this forum do personal messages - be easier to discuss in detail that way.
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Hmm. Battles with the school. Do any of the following phrases sound familiar :
"He brings it on himself"
"He doesn't really fit in here"
"We can't make a special case"
"It's not our problem what happens outside the school gates"
You get 10 points per matching phrase. It's code for
"this isn't on our radar and nothing you say will change that".
Don't feel bad, my parents had the same thing 30 years go. Goes with the territory I'm afraid - but there will be others who are more helpful.
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Welcome to the Aspie world. Or perhaps we should call it Engineer's world.
I found out about my own Asbergers when I was 26, I'm now 40. I am happy to report that I currently hold a senior engineering position. But it wasn't easy getting here, that's for sure.
Undiagnosed Aspergers played havoc with my education and early professional career. But engineering is one of the more egalitarian professions long term and real achievement does win out eventually. It always feels good to see the many machines I am responsible for chugging away happily and profitably.
But I feel there is a lot to be done educating employers. Existing recruitment systems especially those based on personality profiling shut us out. Your employment prospects should be dependent on achievement, not personality. Good employers to their credit are well aware of this. To quote a favourite film of mine (take a guess):
"You are what you do. A man is defined by his actions, not his memories."
Hi everyone
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You're ahead of many. My parents didn't know until I was in my mid-twenties.
My advice is actually the same as it would be for any parent especially with secondary school coming up : Put good teachers in front of your son. I found I did exceptionally well with the good ones and exceptionally badly with the bad ones. Everyone knows school is important but it is doubly so for us, because we have NO chance of achieving career success via the social route.
Aspie kids are NOT able to make up for deficiencies in teaching because their brains shut down when they feel that the teacher isn't making much of an effort, or worse is unwilling or unable to understand them. Telling an Aspie to try harder at school when the teaching is poor is like telling a diesel car it's got to run on petrol. You won't get very far and will do a lot of damage in the process.