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I would say you are looking at this from the wrong perspective. The question should be "Where is best for my son" or at least "where can meet his needs"? Note that as you have a statement (or at least a proposed statement) then if you want him in an ASD unit in a maintained school then you should get that (subject to space being available). I would recommend that you have a look round at any school in the neighbourhood that might possibly fit (or not) and see which you prefer. We are going through this process for our yr4 son as we are also at the proposed statement stage. Round here the decision is difficult - there are no ASD units in primary schools - only SEN units that are really aimed at MLD. However some mainstream schools are better than others at dealing with SEN so you may find a local mainstream school that is good with SEN children. I can strongly recommend the OFSTED reports as a first port of call. They include some useful information including how many children in the school have statements. Don't take the proposed 20 hours as the limit - if you want to stay in Mainstream you need full time and there should be no problem in getting that. Also don't let them get away with saying "A TA" - make sure that the statement makes it explicit what experience or qualifications they must have. FWIW we are probably going to try to keep our son in his present Mainstream school for at least another year to see how things progress once the statement is in place, but that is dependent on getting full time support and some of the other help he needs (pretty much exactly the list from Sally44 above). What is not clear to me is how that will be provided in practice within an MS environment, one of the huge benefits of a specialist school is that they are geared up to providing SALT, OT and so on as part of the school day.

It sounds as if we are in very similar circumstances - our yr4 son (9) is at the proposed statement stage, and of course the proposed statement is not worth the paper it is printed on (but that is another topic). I sympathise with you entirely. Our son sometimes shows aggressive behaviour towards school staff. As far as I can see this is always in situations that could have been avoided if there were a responsible/experienced/trained adult nearby to intervene at an earlier stage. These things never (or at least rarely) occur without warning and can usually be prevented by early intervention either to remove the source of stress or at worst to calm things down quickly. So as far as I am concerned these outbreaks are a sign that school (or more precisely the education service) are not doing their job properly and I would say that for the DH to repremand him again for what is essentially the school's failing is both morally wrong and totally counter-productive. If they can't manage the situation ask THEM what they propose to do about it. That said school itself is between a rock and a hard place - they have very limited resources and without a statement giving sufficient support they are in an impossible situation. If I were the parent of any other child in our son's class I would be very concerned about the impact of his behaviour - and the level of resources he absorbs. The key of course is to fight for a good statement - go for full time support from an appropriately qualified teacher. Also - at the risk of teaching my grandmother to suck eggs - make sure that you have a log of all these incidents. It could be crucial evidence during the statementing/tribunal process and I know our school is very poor at recording / reporting such events. And to answer the original question - yes I think we and our son do face disability discrimination that is technically against the law (even a crime) but there is not really a whole lot you can do about it.

I think you are certainly right to apply for statutory assessment - it sounds from what you right that he ought to have a statement but you may find the process of getting it rather slow. You are normally expected to go the School Action/School Action Plus route with IEPs and so on, and you will find if difficult to get an assessment, or a statement, until you have had a year or so with IEPs. But even if you don't the process of applying for statement should cause the authorities and school to look in more detail at his problems and hopefully become more proactive in putting provision in place within the scope of SAP. I actually found what you wrote compelling - and it should form a good basis for what you need to say in your form. I am becoming increasingly aware that there is a class of ASD children who are being failed by the LA education system. Ours is one, and your grandson is another. Children who are bright and who are capable of the doing the work required in a mainstream school but can't cope with the other pressures. As you have discovered you are in a bit of a Catch 22 with the assessment. The LA EP will only assess if they agree to a statutory assessment and you can't necessarily get them to agree without his assessment Eventually you will need to consider getting your own assessments done by independent EPs, SALTs and OTs - that is an expensive business but you will need it if you want to challenge the LAs decision.

I think that's for the dads

I completely agree - missing PE lessons is a totally inappropriate sanction to apply under these circumstances. That sort of sanction should only be used for really serious mis-behaviour (if at all). Reading between the lines I suspect that school don't really understand his condition - or aren't taking it seriously. You should seriously consider asking the LA to do a statutory assessment. Also try to persuade them to get away from this "personal"/"behaviour" problems to seeing those as symptoms of the underlying condition. These are just symptoms of the fact that his AS is not being managed properly. As for the problems with work school should try to differentiate what he is asked to do to work within his likes and dislikes. Our son hates writing anything - and went through a term pretty much refusing to write a word. Allowing him to write of a different topic to the rest of the class made some improvement but it is still heavy going. Is he actually falling behind in Maths? If not then it is probably not worth worrying about him doing little work - let him use some at least of the time doing something else. If he is falling behind then they will need to find a way to present the work that he can relate to. We also find that strategies usually only work for a short period of time and then need to be reviewed - that is very frustrating as you find something that you think works, you appear to be making progress and then a few weeks later you find yourself back at square one

Certainly they are not following the rules. The regulations make it clear that they need to give the evidence 2 weeks in advance. However there is nothing you can do about that at this stage. I don't think the process necessarily matters provided that you get an appropriate outcome. If you are not happy then you can insist that they do things properly - but all that is likely to do is delay the whole process. If you feel confident to put your views across in the meeting you seem to have nothing to lose by going along. Probably ask them at the beginning why they haven't sought and distributed the reports. Then you can argue for the review you want, and if they don't agree then insist that they do it properly. It may be that the school has already decided to say that they are not the right place,

It seems that your psychiatrist has acted a little poorly in using such terms without explaining in detail. As I understand it the only way to get a formal diagnosis of Aspergers / ASD is to go through a set of recognised formal tests. If you haven't undergone those tests then you won't have been a formal diagnosis. So the psychiatrist may be sure that you have ASD but not having done the tests can't give a formal diagnosis. To be honest the diagnosis doesn't really matter. What matters is to have your needs identified and met, a formal diagnosis of ASD does not really help that very much although it can provide useful insights.

We have problems with our 8 year old son refusing to do some work. To us this seems arbitrary but it also appears to cause him genuine distress if he is pushed (so he is not just being lazy) - one of his problems is a dislike of failure, so he is very reluctant to attempt some tasks in case he fails. He also genuinely struggles to organise his thoughts to complete some tasks. We find that rewards are more effective than punishments - in fact I don't like punishments unless we are sure that he is being awkward and there isn't any underlying issue. We also find that it is better to pick which battles to fight. An AS child is different and to try to force them to conform in all areas can be very stressful. We encourage the school to let him "opt out" of areas that are not critical and reserve the pressure for those areas that matter (in his case literacy which he really dislikes)

It sounds interesting - we are off to see a Priory school next week - and a Cambian school in April - our son is almost nine so we are a couple of years behind you and we're not sure when we'd be looking to transfer if we think that it the right way to go.

Great news - well done. The LA are now on a tight timeline - I would imagine that you will hear from them before the end of the week - but that is likely to be a very simple request asking you for your opinion. They should then over the next 6 weeks arrange for him to be assessed by professionals (we had Ed Psych, SALT and Paediatrician). You should have a draft statement in your hands, or a note in lieu, in 12 weeks time. Beware that you are not home-and-dry yet, there is still a good chance that you will be going back to tribunal in a few months time either because they refuse the statement, or because the statement is useless. At some point you should consider getting independent assessments of your son.

Doing the timelines it looks as if we are likely to get to tribunal about Dec/Jan by which time he will be Y5. I often hear it stated that independent reports need to be less than 6 months old (but as far as I can tell there is no statutory basis for that), but is that from the date of appeal or the date of hearing? As there appears to be a delay of almost 6 months between the two it seems that we are likely to put in the appeal docs before we have all the reports. I suppose that gives us a good reason for updating the appeal in Autumn with updated Ed Psych / OT reports and so on. Then I could see tactical benefits in not appealing Part 4 until then (hopefully after LA have entered their response) but that may be getting a bit too tricky to use that as a deliberate ploy.

Could you explain the rationale behind that? Wouldn't it be normal for a tribunal in Y5 only to consider Primary - and what were the risks of taking secondary into account as well? If we take this to appeal (and we almost certainly will) we will certainly get a solicitor specialising in SEN, and if we want an independent probably a QC as well.

Secondary around here is a bit tricky. The LA at present have just one support unit in a mainstream school - and that is so poor that it barely gives adequate support - several people have won appeals on the grounds that is it not an appropriate place for an ASD child. The LA have realised this and launched a consultation and as a result are massively expanding ASD provision in the borough. They are building two new schools )one primary, one secondary) targeted at what they call "Autism and Challenging Behaviour", both of which should be open in September this year. They are also adding SEN units to 10 mainstream schools over the course of the next 2 years. These are of some concern to me, I am not sure how one appeals against a placement at a school that does not exist - or one that has existed such a short period of time as to have no track record.

Certainly the two independent AS schools we might consider (Unsted Park and Southlands) both say they take children of his age, although we have not yet had any in depth discussions with them. Our LA is VERY poor for ASD support of any kind - they have one ASD unit in a secondary school and that is it. The LA EP says there is nothing more appropriate (within the LA) for our son than the school he is in now. It is still early days, but we intend to see those two in detail and if we like either/both then to take their advice on timing. As you say, assuming we need a tribunal we are 9 months to a year away. I don't think such a move is ideal but just at the moment we don't have anything else in mind. It would be good to find an independent primary for Yrs 5&6 but I don't know of one that is accessible. Those I know of are SLD/MLD and really not appropriate (as you say). I have a slight hope that two good years of targeted provision now might just bring about enough improvement that a mainstream placement (ASD unit) would be appropriate; but I think that is probably a bit optimistic and certainly won't happen in his current setting.

He went through a phase in yr 3 of it being very difficult to get him to school. However in yr 4 he has a new tactic - he goes to school and then refuses to do anything he doesn't want to He really gets almost nothing out of going to school and learns nothing in lessons. However he is very curious and an avid reader at home so he has "self-taught" to well above his age and comes out highly in assessments (when he can be persuaded to do them) All the independent experts who have been involved (independent in the sense that we pay for them - not the LA ) say he needs an AS school and think we have a good case, even the LA Ed Psych hinted he might be prepared to recommend on. I have no doubt that we could convince SENDIST that his present school is not appropriate (it isn't) but looking round I have found nothing appropriate in the primary sector for children like him - hence the fact that we are seriously considering an early move to a secondary AS school.

We've been debating whether to consider a specialist school at this stage or to wait until the usual transition. We are going to see a couple of the AS schools to see whether we like them, and what they would recommend. At present we are in a strong position because he is really struggling even in the small primary and really needs a quieter environment will smaller class size. It s hard to see him learning anything in class over the next 2.5 years and all the time he will be getting more and more resistant to the whole idea of school. With more support in primary he might struggle on but it is very hard to see mainstream being a realistic proposition post the transition from primary. There is an argument that the best thing we can do is push for an independent now, and that we are in at least as strong a position now as we would be in 2 years time

The LA refused to assess our Son back in September, so we applied to SENDIST. In the process of preparing for that we arranged independent SALT and EP reports. LA eventually agreed to assess before the hearing so we did not have to submit the reports as evidence. We have since forwarded the EP report to the LA EP - and feel that that was the correct thing to do. It has made sure the LA EP in on side. We are now wondering whether to submit the SALT report as part of our evidence. The SALT has written a very good report that highlights his needs well, so putting it in now could make the initial draft of the statement more appropriate. We have already seen the draft NHS salt report that is not particularly detailed but does have some good information in. Alternatively we can work on the assumption that we are going to need to go to appeal on the wording of the statement and hold back the SALT report until then to make our position stronger at appeal (which of course really means paying the SALT to re-report closer to the time as it is unlikely the appeal would be heard within the 6 months). Seems silly going into the process assuming that the statement will be nonsense and we will have to appeal, but that seems to be what many people are telling us. Their point of view is the more the LA know about your "case" the easier it is for them to counter it, so we should "keep our powder dry" and submit it as evidence to the tribunal at the last possible moment.

The route for our son was GP to Paediatrician, Paediatrician to CAMHS initial assessment and initial assessment to consultant (clinical psychiatrist) about 18 months in all (the longest individual wait being for the initial CAMHS appointment). The first few are very frustrating - they are really acting as gatekeepers and in each case the important part of the meeting was only a few minutes long - enough for them to see that he has problems and that he needs to progress to the next stage.

Surely that is true now of any special school - and of many independents. I have been assuming that an AS school has better staff/pupil ratios than mainstream and teaches a highly deferentiated for each child. That certainly is what my son needs so I will be looking for the environment that does that best LancsLad - surely we've had far too much Government involvement in education over the years, through "comprehensive" education (which is neither comprehensive nor gives much of an education), through league tables, dumming down of qualifications, national curriculum. Surely education should be controlled by professional educators rather than left to the whim of whichever party is in power at the time

I would certainly agree that I would prefer the state sector to be providing the necessary provision - and even if they don't I would prefer free schools to totally independent. One of my "ideological" concerns about the statement is that in effect it writes a blank cheque and as a result we can force the LA to provide very expensive independent education which I feel is not necessarily good value for the tax-payer. I can't help thinking that a school could provide an education that is almost as good for half the price. We can simplify and say that every child (NT and ASD) lies on a "spectrum of need" (although in truth there are many dimensions to it) No school can realistically cover the entire spectrum. I think it is better for a school (any school) to focus on doing one area weill rather than trying cover too much and do it all poorly - to that extent I see choice in schools as being a good thing. Ideally you would hope that the LA would ensure that all needs were catered for, but realistically we know that that is not the case so it is reasonable for free schools to fill the gap. It would perhaps be an improvement on the "free for all" nature if a proposed school had to satisfy an external body that it was meeting a genuine need and setting it up would not unduly impact other local schools

That section was certainly there when I first looked back in September and is absolutely brilliant. When looking around I found that a lot of the advice tends to be very general and "wishy washy". While that is understandable and necessary in many ways - all children are individuals - it is very frustrating when coming in for the first time. I found the case studies very good in providing concrete examples and providing a benchmark against which to assess our own situation.

Sounds like a good day - I'm glad it seems to have gone well. I hope they order them to assess. Whatever happens I'm afraid that it sounds as if you are going to have to be a lot more forceful and direct in your dealings with school and LA.

We have a long and proud history of private/free schools in this country. Private education predated any form of state organisation by hundreds of years; and "Direct Grant" or whatever it is now called (?is it VA) still plays a major role in both primary and secondary eduction. Beyond secondary level education remains pretty much "private" in that sense. Also in the ASD field I am not aware of any LA funded AS/ASD type school anywhere in the country. I am unsure about the funding levels for free schools but as I understand it they are only a little higher than those in the state sector. Also as I understand it they have tightly controlled admissions criteria and so are really more like VA schools rather than pubic/private schools. I make no secret of the fact that my son (8) is too far along the Autistic spectrum to cope in mainstream (social communication skills below that expected of a 5 year old - below the 0.1% percentile) while cognatively he is very bright (above the level expected for a 16 year old. so over the 99th percentile) as well as having sensory integration issues. He will never learn anything in a class of 20+ pupils. Realistically the only current option for him is a Cambian/Priory School - which are private and which will cost the LA vastly more than a more local free school. Even leaving the ASD asside I am a fan of choice in all areas of life, including education. I think having a wide range of schools catering for all tastes and preferences and I don't any fundamental problems with that. Safeguards are required to ensure that other schools don't lose out. The only other thing I would say is that I would like to see it easier to move school 11+. The danger with any choice at that age is that there is a danger of betting his (or her) entire future on a single choice at the age 11 and it can be difficult to change your mind afterwards.

As a matter of interest what do you think would have worked better for you? At the risk of repeating what I've said elsewhere - as parents of a very bright yet Autistic son we face a terrible dilemma. I can see no likelihood of him surviving in any mainstream school within reach of where we live now. These days LA run special schools tend to be SLD or MLD at best, and I think that would be a terrible thing to do to a bright child. The best bet seem to be the few specialist AS schools but they are (a) A long way away and ( tend to be predominately residential. I fully understand AS parents looking for, and trying to start, a school that is highly specific in catering for ASD children of average to above average cognative abilities. If such a school existed locally I would definitely consider it and I would support anyone trying to start one in the area.

We used the IPSEA site for information and advice when we had to appeal against a refusal to assess a few months ago. Overall we found it a very good starting point and an excellent introduction to the process. LA eventually gave in before the hearing so the advice must have done some good