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      Depression, Mental Health and Crisis Support   06/04/2017

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Elefan

Appealing part 4 Statement

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Elefan   

Hi,

 

I was wondering if anyone could guide me on whether there is any point in appealing for the LEA to name an ASD unit within one of their mainstream schools, if the unit is already full? Would it just be a waste of time?

 

My daughter has finally received a statement (for those of you who don't know,...she is the little girl behind us setting up this website!) but the only place we think is suitable for her is already full for the September 2008 intake. Is there anything we can do? Everything has been so last minute and she is due to move to secondary in September.

 

I don't see why we should have to try and come up with an alternative suggestion if it takes her far away from home and would cost the LEA more money anyway!

 

Your thoughts would be very welcome. :)

 

Take care,

 

Elefan

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Deedee   

Hi Elefan >:D<<'> I'm in the same position as you with regards to placement our ideal school is 'full'...

 

I spoke to IPSEA and they advised there are often 3 stages of full...

 

1/Token statement used if technically numbers are forecasted to be full in the coming term but there is room for tweaking..

2/Full but if offered extra renumeration space can be found...

3/Absolutely full dangerous for the children already there to increase numbers..

 

We have a meeting on 3rd March so will ask this same question sorry I can't be of more help immediately but hopefully others will have had this experience and can advise us how things went!!

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Deedee   

Will do Elefan I'm not giving in lightly :fight: I know this one would be perfect and even though it's 'full' someone I know has been told they are getting a place there in September in the year M is in .... bit cross to say the least as the school is primarily speech and language disorders and ASD specific,child in question getting the place has no SAL or learning probs but does have ODD ??

I feel I'm getting increasingly bitter towards the LEA at present their placements system seems all wrong.If they(OR the parents!!) are kicking off at school they are placed immediately in a base or special school but often not in the right type of school for their difficulties..whereas if your child is 'placid' at school they have to have a breakdown first before they consider them in need..sorry for the moan just a bit peed off with 'the system' at present,can you tell lol???

 

I think if the LEA name the school you want on part 4 the school have to prove it would be detrimental to the other kids there if a place were to be given..I have reams of legislation I have to wade through so will let you know if I find any more loopholes!!

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Hi Elefan >:D<<'> I'm in the same position as you with regards to placement our ideal school is 'full'...

 

I spoke to IPSEA and they advised there are often 3 stages of full...

 

1/Token statement used if technically numbers are forecasted to be full in the coming term but there is room for tweaking..

2/Full but if offered extra renumeration space can be found...

3/Absolutely full dangerous for the children already there to increase numbers..

 

We have a meeting on 3rd March so will ask this same question sorry I can't be of more help immediately but hopefully others will have had this experience and can advise us how things went!!

 

Sorry, I'm not the person in the know, but I'm in a similar position, so I'm watching this topic closely!

 

A major problem for us is that there are no mainstreams with units in our LEA, so if that is what a child needs, we have to go out of county. Of course, such settings in neighbouring boroughs are already full (with lots of places taken by kids from my LEA!), so it's a toughie.

 

We're going to tribunal in four weeks, so it may become clearer for us then...

 

Deedee, the Ipsea info is veeerrry interesting.

 

Hope you get the answers you need, Elefan and Deedee.

 

Lizzie xx

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baddad   

Hi elefan - and congrats on the statement BTW :thumbs: -

 

Pure guesswork, but i don't think it would hurt to name the school as your preferred choice whatever the situation re its intake. Neither you or DD are responsible for the state of educational provision locally, and you're just being asked to name your preference, which this school is... Additionally, circumstances change, and maybe 'full' in year seven won't be 'full' in year 8...

 

On the downside, if you don't name any other provision at all and the school is genuinely packed to the gunnells you may well paint yourself into a corner which gives the LEA carte blanche to place her wherever they fancy, while any other placement you DO name will be the automatic choice for them even if it's 2nd or 3rd for you :( . Be wary too, about your 'default' mainstream if you don't name one. For Ben, it was the worst school in the area ('Nukem High'), and a good distance further away than the school i would have chosen if mainstream had been an option...

I covered that one by getting as much evidence stating that mainstream was not a viable option as i could, and then included within parental evidence written details about why, and naming the school that would have been my preference if mainstream had been an option :wacko: (you might have to read that twice but it does make sense!)...

 

Not sure if by 'far away from home' you mean travelling distance or residential(?) If the latter a huuuuuuuuuuuugggge and scary decision for parents and kids, but sometimes one demanded by the nature of local provision or the needs of the child...

 

Hope that helps

 

L&P

 

BD :D

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Annea   

Hi Elefen,

I might have been given the wrong advice but this is what I was told <we are just starting our appeal process>

 

We have been told that to name a school, their has to be a place or a forecasted place for the time it is rquired, the panel apparently contact the school or unit to clarify this matter before the case is accepted!

 

In our position, (we are attempting placement at a specialist Aspergr Priory school) Our daughter has to got through the assessment procedure at the school, and the school has to accept her before we can name them as the school we want, they have already said their is a place available in September if she fits the criterior at assessment.

 

The LEA have told me they won't consider this school but two local schools one which has has satellite unit, however after speaking to the manager of this unit he has told me that she won't get a place their as it is already well over subscribed for September <so this is good for us> the other school has no special provision so I am meeting with the ENCO to try and build a case as to why this isn't suitable.....

 

I have been told that you need to name a school that has places OR the LEA's choice will be looked on more favourably.... so you may need to look at a second or third choice??

 

Again this is just what I have been told and it may be incorrect....

 

Good luck though... it looks like quite a few of us are in the same position!

 

Anne

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I believe that it depends if the school is an LEA school or an independent one The Tribunal can force an LEA school to take over their PAN up to a certain % (in my friend's son's case, the LEA was not able to tell the LEA special school to take over their PAN, but were happy for the Tribunal to tell them to so so). If there are only a few children in a Unit however, it would be harder to argue for. The Tribunal cannot force independent schools to take over their PAN, although the school my son went to ran two classes instead of one for his year, as they had so many children applying.

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Elefan   

Whoa,..interesting stuff! :D Thank you for the replies.

 

Why is nothing EVER simple!!!!????

 

My daugter had been out of school for most of 2007. She has been tentatively back in school since January, on her terms (part-time). I know that if they try to throw her to the lions and expect her to cope at a large secondary, with support, but in mainstream, she will vote with her feet and drop-out completely,...from school and any semblence of a happy life. I don't want to see her that 'broken' again.

 

Back to the drawing board,...

 

Elefan

>:D<<'>

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Deedee   

Right *cracks knuckles* been on the phone to various advisory lines and up to Camhs and in to see SENCO today :rolleyes:

Apparently it helps if you can 'prove unsuitability for a school suggested by the LEA' especially if you have professionals who are involved with your child backing this up...

 

I have also spoken to PPartnership who threw a couple of likely LEA suggestions at me today..neither of which his pro's or myself agree is suitable.BUT she suggested I visit them all to save time as I can then say at his review I've been there and its unsuitable due to X,Y and Z :whistle: then his pro's can also add their objections!

 

Elanten this may help you to say 'NO' to any they offer you in place of the one you need.I'm sure you have already got a wealth of evidence together to prove why your choice is the right school.

 

Quite how it works if there is NO suitable provision apart from the properly full school is something I have yet to find out,but believe me I'm trying!!

 

I've found a human rights law that says we have a right to family life *which we don't have at present due to the LEA's incompetance* and an education law that states his needs MUST be met..how that translate into real life when there's no spaces...I will let you know!!

 

 

Kazzen thanks so much for the info on the independent schools (all our 3 choices are I think!) :unsure:

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Suze   

Hi Elefan >:D<<'> ,............hope your o.k.

 

 

..............right here goes...my son attends a ASD unit at a high school when it opened it was only for 8 pupils, 3 years later demand (as it is so good ) has increased and so have pupil numbers.They now have 3 more staff and 15 pupils in the unit.So an LEA can let more kids in .........they can employ more lsa,s....pupils have also joined his unit mid term.Push your lea if this is the most suitable, closest placement for her it is the one she should have.Try to get some proffessionals to back you up on this.We had a very supportive outreach team and my sons primary school .Best of luck suzex

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Deedee   

Hi Elefan just to let you know they plan to actually name a school at our meeting on the 3rd and move him NOW!! *where's the fainting icon??* :thumbs:

 

If we get the one we want named we know its 'full' so will be able to advise on the LEA's stance on this then...hopefully!!

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Kathryn   

Elefan,

 

Just wanted to say I really hope you get what you want for your daughter. I understand what you say about not wanting to see her "broken". :tearful: As a parent, once you've seen it happen to your child, you'd do anything to avoid it.

 

Good luck,

 

>:D<<'>

 

K x

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Elefan   

Hi Kathryn and all,

 

Thank you for the messages. >:D<<'>

 

Deedee,...Blimey,...looks like you will soon know exactly where you stand!!! I will keep everything crossed.

 

Please let us know how you get on!

 

Elefan

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