munty13

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Hi. Thankyou to everyone who offered advice. I wanted to report what has happened so that if anyone else shall ever find themselves in the same position as I did, that they might be reassured by the appeal process. I won the appeal. Which is great news. I'm especially glad that I did not have to lean on the diagnosis of a paranoid personality disorder, and that I was able describe the problems I experience with people as something which is more symptomatic of me being on the spectrum. So, if anyone was ever to unearth this thread on goggle or whatever, I hope it offers them a glimmer of hope in pursuing the appeal process.

I've just been refused any futher payments of ESA. I've been on ESA for over a year now, but following a Work Capability Assessment, with one appointment with a doctor for a medical assessment, I score only a total of 12. The Asperger's is recognised, but the assessment does not take into account any of the problems I have with people. In previous jobs, my behaviour has proved to be pretty disruptive - upsetting work colleagues and customers - and not least myself. Sometimes I feel like I don't have the right to argue with the assessment. Maybe it's time I went straight into work. But I know problems will only be ignited wherever I go. I guess some of this is my fault. When I saw the pyschologist last year, he also diagnosed anxiety, and a paranoid personality disorder, but I tend not to mention that. Perhaps I should have said something about it. I don't like saying I have a paranoid personality disorder, because I feel it is labelling what I experience with people as being something I imagine, when in-fact these problems with people are very real, and distressing. I prefer to say that I am AS. I experience anxiety around people, but the anxiety is nowhere near as great as what it was 3 years ago. However, what has got a lot worse, is my ability to communicate openly with people. I have less anxiety, but I endure much more stress these days. After some outbursts with my neighbours, people in my community now see me as somekind of "monster" I am constantly pursued with dirty looks and insults which drives my anxiety further, and keeps me stressed. But how do I explain this to the appeal process without sounding nuts?! I get so fed up with this whole process. A year ago I had the same thing happen in the assessment, which I appealed against, and then I was rewarded ESA (after I sent them papers describing the saw diagnosis for PPD). Has anyone else been in the same boat? I wonder if all this sounds familiar at all?

Don't worry. For whatever reason, the forum dumps you into some idyllic part of the British countryside, and expects you to report from there.

Hi genie. I should imagine that if you see yourself in the diagnostic criteria for Asperger's, having spent years not understanding why you feel so different to most people, and the description of symptoms for Asperger's finally explains everything about your behaviour which you find puzzling, then there's probably a good chance you are on the autistic spectrum. I would say that it is important to trust yourself, and your own feelings about whether or not you fulfill the criteria for Asperger's. Chances are, you're the best person to ask whether or not you have the condition. It can be pretty frustrating trying to get a diagnosis from experts who tell you they are not totally sure you have Asperger's, and you have to set about trying to convince them. Sounds like you're not too bothered by needing an official diagnosis anyways, but I'm sure learning about Asperger's will give you a lot of answers to questions you might have about your behaviour, or your daughter's. I can't imagine there being that many people clambering for a diagnosis of Asperger's, unless they felt that they needed help managing the condition.

.Adrenal Fatigue Symptoms and Autism Is there a relationship between adrenal fatigue symptoms and autism?

In analysing my own behaviour as a child and young adult, I can see that a lack of social skills has led to rejection from my peers. This fear of rejection, and the pain of rejection, has then fed my anxious state. Repeated failure over many years meant that the anxiety turned into a bit of a monster. Previously, I assumed that the lack of social skills came first, followed by rejection, followed by the fear of rejection. In this way, the anxiety is seen as being only the direct result of having poor social skills. Anxiety is a symptom which is glued on at the end of the assembly line, as it were. In trying to build an equation, I find that I am at a bit of a loss as to why I lack social skills in the first place. Assuming all the parts of my brain are indeed here (even though throughout my life I've felt like large parts of it were missing) it would suggest that, for whatever reason, the brain does not utilise the parts of my brain responsible for the social niceties of life. Something is inhibiting the social part of my brain. There is some evidence that hormones have a direct impact on social skills. Do I have no social skills, because something is drowning out the social hormones? In observing my social skills, I notice that they are limited by a lack of social imagination, making them rigid, repetitive, ritualistic, and compulsive. These are not the typical displays of a social animal, such as a chimpanzee, but more the displays of something far more cumbersome, such as a dinosaur. It appears that my social behaviours are more dominated by the reptilian brain, the oldest part of the brain. In other words, the reptilian brain is in someway dominating the part of my brain responsible for social imagination - the neo-cortex. In looking for a mechanism powerful enough to over-ride the social part of my brain, one obvious culprit, a mechanism capable of over-riding every aspect of my being, is the fight-or flee response. Is it possible that something, somewhere, is producing the flight or flee response without me being consciously aware of it? It is not so acute these days, but not so long ago, when meditating I noticed that a lot of my thoughts, angry thoughts, were derived from a pain centre in my solar plexus. From the meditations, I developed an awareness of the pain having been present, in various degrees, throughout my entire life. In my childhood however, it was notsomuch a pain, but a throbbing anxiety, like butterflies, or somesuch. Looking back, I realise just how difficult this made it for my mind to relax - what emanated from my solar plexus was instrumental in with-holding my mind's ability to relax. Nowadays, I find that to socialise (and the only persons I can comfortably do that with is my wife and kids), one needs to be INCREDIBLY relaxed. Up until very recently, I assumed that the emanations were only a product of my social anxiety, but now I wonder, is it possible that they were present beforehand? This would mean that my solar plexus was in someway responsible for inhibiting the social part of my brain. According to Yogi teachings, the solar plexus is a being an important part of the nervous system, and a form, in one way or the other, of brain. Below, is an extract taken from Yogi Ramacharaka's book, "Science of Breath": "The Yogi teachings go further than does Western science, in one important feature of the Nervous System. We allude to what Western science terms the "Solar Plexus," and which it considers as merely one of a series of certain matted nets of sympathetic nerves with their ganglia found in various parts of the body. Yogi science teaches that this Solar Plexus is really a most important part of the Nervous System, and that it is a form of brain, playing one of the principal parts in the human economy. Western science seems to be moving gradually towards a recognition of this fact which has been known to the Yogis of the East for centuries, and some recent Western writers have termed the Solar Plexus the "Abdominal Brain." The Solar Plexus is situated in the Epigastric region, just back of the "pit of the stomach" on either side of the spinal column. It is composed of white and gray brain matter, similar to that composing the other brains of man. It has control of the main internal organs of man, and plays a much more important part than is generally recognized." The "abdominal brain" has been described by some, such as the respected physician Byron Robinson, M.D (born 1854; died March 23, 1910) as being the "centre of life itself"... "In mammals there exist two brains of almost equal importance to the individual and race. One is the cranial brain, the instrument of volitions, of mental progress and physical protection. The other is the abdominal brain, the instrument of vascular and visceral function. It is the automatic, vegetative, the subconscious brain of physical existence. In the cranial brain resides the consciousness of right and wrong. Here is the seat of all progress, mental and moral ... However, in the abdomen there exists a brain of wonderful power maintaining eternal, restless vigilance over its viscera. It presides over organic life. It dominates the rhythmical function of viscera....The abdominal brain is a receiver, a reorganizer, an emitter of nerve forces. It has the power of a brain. It is a reflex center in health and disease.... The abdominal brain is not a mere agent of the [cerebral] brain and cord; it recieves and generates nerve forces itself; it presides over nutrition. It is the center of life itself. In it are repeated all the physiologic and pathologic manifestations of visceral function (rhythm, absorption, secretion, and nutrition). The abdominal brain can live without the cranial brain, which is demonstrated by living children being born without cerebrospinal axis. On the contrary the cranial brain can not live without the abdominal brain...." (Robinson, 1907, pp. 123 -126) There's no doubt that the abdominal brain is awfully close to the adrenals, and the agents responsible for the fight-or-flee response. If, for whatever reason, the abdominal brain was creating stress, and anxiety, then there's a good chance it will affect digestion. The body digests food far better when it is relaxed. A large percentage of those on the autistic spectrum are thought to be affected by gastointestinal symptoms including diarrhea, constipation, abdominal pain, reflux, gaseousness and foul smelling stools. In summary, is it possible that some sort of malfunction in the abdominal brain is the root cause of my AS? In that, it in some way, it has released hormones which have sabotaged the development of my neo-cortex, thereby leaving me stranded without social skills?

Hi Lisa. As a newborn I had a complication with my gastrointestinal tract which caused projectile vomiting. The condition is known as pyloric stenosis. An operation was needed to relieve the blockage created by the thickening of the pylorus "gate" muscle. Don't worry though, it's highly unlikely that this condition is directly related to your child, however, it looks like the vomiting in both cases is down to some malfunction in the stomach. I wonder if the way in-which the malfunction is produced is in someway relevant to both cases? The pylorus receives sympathetic innervation from celiac ganglion. The celiac ganglion are two big nerves located in the abdomen, and they overlook and communicate information about the digestive system. The celiac ganglion are located in the solar plexus. A ganglion is basically a knot of nerve endings. We're all familiar with the feeling of having a "knot in our stomach" when we are nervous, or anxious. Below, I've included some extracts from an article on the location of the solar plexus which I found interesting: "In the human body, a complex collection of nerves of the nervous system in one specific location is known as a plexus. And this is exactly what the solar plexus really is. It is a location where a number of nerve endings meet, and this increases the sensitivity and the functionality of this specific region. The general location of the solar plexus in a human being is in the back of the stomach, or the upper abdomen, and it is also referred to as the celiac plexus by doctors and medical experts... The exact location of the solar plexus can only be displayed visually and physically, but you can get a general idea. The area that is above your stomach, and just below your chest is your solar plexus. You can try applying a little pressure in the straight line that runs down your chest, and move down slowly. Just before you reach the stomach you will find a spot that is more sensitive than others, and this is your solar plexus. To get an idea you can apply a bit more force to the area right under the spot where your ribs end, but do not apply too much force. In Hindu mythology and in the Sanskrit language, Chakra represents a wheel of energy. This information was used for medicinal purposes in ancient times, and there are apparently 7 such Chakras in the body. The Solar Plexus Chakra is known as the Manipura or the Manipuraka, and it is associated with the digestive and metabolic processes of the human body due to the Solar Plexus location. The symbol of this Chakra is a downward pointing triangle enclosed in a circle, and bordered by 10 flower petals. Even Tibetan Buddhism propagates the concept of these Chakras, and they have a symbol for the Solar Plexus Chakra as well. This Chakra is also said to correspond with feelings of fear, anxiety, introversion, personal power, opinion-formation and spiritual growth. With so much known about the solar plexus location, there is still a lot of mysticism and spirituality associated with this part of the human anatomy. Its vulnerability to physical blows is well known, but its real significance runs much deeper than that." I wonder, is your child's vomiting related to their anxious state? I realise that this is probably a bit of a bloated reply to what you were asking for, but I found it a little difficult to hold back. I personally, am intrigued by the solar plexus/gastrointestinal tract, and its relevance to the autistic spectrum. I think this area could hold keys to answers which can help dispel some of the mystery surrounding autism.

Looks like I'm in the same boat as you, Violet. Pretending to be nice to people makes me feel fake. It just feels so unnatural. I get the idea that people are nice because they are trying to sell me something - themselves. Well, I don't particularly want to sell this idea of myself to other people. I just want to give them me. It's just a bit unfortunate that right now, I'm a twisted, cynical indivual, and not a lot of people want that! That said, I know I need to work on being more polite. It's reassuring to hear stories, such as Tally's, where they have found ways of making social ettiquette feel more natural.

I remember the shakey feeling very well, and have done, up until very recently. I knew that I would rather be outside the body, than inside the body experiencing it. My mind would try to run away from the body, and it's taken a long time for my mind to relax, and feel comfortable in my body. I think that the shakey feeling is induced by hormones from the anxiety. Anxiety is a natural response by any person (or animal) to what is a percieved threat. It seems that NTs have a greater awareness of it being anxiety, and therefore accept it. This helps the anxiety to dissipate. For an indivual with AS however, the anxiety is an unknown, highly confusing, quantity. It is something which takes over the being, and there seems no logical way of dismissing it, or even reducing it. The harder the mind works to resolve it, the more the anxiety increases. What happens is that after a while, the anxiety itself becomes a percieved threat, and a negative cycle ensues. I personally, forced myself to meditate as the shakey feeling took over, and tried, and tried to surrender to it. To sit in my body and let the fear take over. Gradually, the anxiety loses its power. This was when I was in my thirties. How do you explain this to a 6 year old? I really don't know. From this forum, I'm learning that for parents of kids with AS, life is very tough for them aswell. I know I like logical explanations of things. Talking about "feelings" does not make a lot of sense. However, understanding a machine that uses hormones to communicate to itself, continually running diagnostics, and that sometimes these malfunction, was a lot easier to understand. Maybe using diagrams of the body and stuff, might help de-mystify things for him.

I think anger management is a good idea. Anger can be so detrimental for relationships, and budding friendships. It amazes me how few times I see NT's display aggression. For them, aggression is taboo. I think that an anger management course should provide lessons on why it is that other children (and adults)like to wind each other up, and suggest ways of dealing with it. I would never suggest a kid with AS to try and mirror the behaviours. I am particularly good at winding people up, but lack the necessary humour to pull it off - so I come across as a total ######. My posts were more directed at baddad than anyone else, and his thoughts on crime and punishment. I find the whole mentality of "do the crime, do the time" very black and white, when everything is really more a shade of grey.

I guarantee that boy, once he calmed down, felt terrible remorse for his behaviour. I would go on to argue that remorse and guilt are not particularly constructive. Speaking from my own experience, what happens is that the next time there is an outburst, the following remorse and guilt only get worse. The effect can be tortuous. Unfortunately, torturing oneself with guilt does not prevent the behaviour from happening again. Indeed, it will probably increase the amount of stress felt in the next situation. What ensues is a vicious circle. Personally, being told-off in the normal way, did not work for me. I don't think it works for anyone with autism. Looking back, I was so ###### stubborn I'm not sure what procedure would have worked for me. I just know being spanked and shouted at does not work. Far worse however, the thing which drives me to despair, is a whispered insult. Today, now I'm older, I like to have things discussed. Rather than someone being abusive, with no explanation, I prefer them to say that they are upset by something I did, and I should be aware of it (without the need for remorse.) This worked a treat for me. Obviously, for someone to admit that you have hurt their feelings, probably asks a lot - it makes a person feel terribly vulnerable.

Hi Bid. I am by no means an expert in the field of schizophrenia. I was trying to convey something about schizophrenia which had been aroused by my own personal experience. As far as I can ascertain, clinically, an anxiety disorder does not simply develop into schizophrenia. The differentation between an extreme anxiety disorder and schizophrenia is based, at least as I understand it, on the strength of the delusions and psychosis. I found this guy talking about his experience with anxiety/OCD (I found it on a forum so I hope the guy doesn't mind me using it as an example) He makes the point that "OCD just LOVES to latch onto your worst fears and torture you with them." Certainly, I've been there, reaching for some kind of switch to turn the mind off. Apparently, the guy does not have schizophrenia. He seems to have an awareness that his thoughts, though powerful, are only delusional. I wonder, is it possible that if the anxiety is never abated, and that a person is tortured long enough by their own thoughts, can the strength of those fears somehow "break" the mind? Persons with AS are notoriously prone to being literal, and believing everything that they are told. Well, what if that person, throughout their life, was only ever told horrible things - especially about themselves? Is there a chance that person would go onto believe it?

I feel like I've really seen some things due to my AS. I've definitely been low. Been in somekind of hole. But I think that the experience may have allowed me to come back with greater insight into how the mind works. Lately, I've been thinking more and more about how we treat paranoid schizophrenia. I don't know a great deal about schizophrenia. I knew a guy once, a friend of my brother's, who had it. That's it. But in terms of personal experience, I figure that a few years ago, if I'd told a doctor about some of the symptoms I was experiencing, I would have come close to recieving a diagnosis. These included hearing voices (mainly insults), constant anxiety - exacerbated by social situations, and a general fear that everyone was out to get me (Catch-22 anyone?) It seems to me that the modern treatment of schizophrenia is that it is an illness, like flu or something. I get the idea, and I could be wrong, that it is treated like somekind of disease. Going by my own personal experience, the schizophrenic-like symptoms were a culmination of the effects after a lifetime of anxiety. These symptoms did not appear like a virus, or somesuch. They formed as part of a process, beginning with my inability to socialise, or follow social norms. Frequent displays of overly aggressive behaviours, born from sheer frustration, have led to years of being ostracized, and disliked/feared by my peers. I used to imagine that if they fear you, they will leave you the hell alone. This in-fact is not true at all. If someone fears something, the chances are they will want to close it down. Society has all sorts of ways to deal with something they don't like - most of these tactics could be regarded as "underhand." They are most certainly not blatant, making it virtually impossible to discuss them, without sounding paranoid. I read an article in Natural Holistic Health, entitled Anxiety Treatment Schizophrenia which states that schizophrenia can be accompanied by a social phobia, or social anxiety disorder (SAD). "Clinicians now estimate that anywhere from 6 to 42% of those who suffer from schizophrenia also suffer from SAD." Intriguingly, SAD is very much seen as a component of AS. What came first? The anxiety, or the inability to follow social norms correctly? Seems to me, it makes sense to think of the anxiety as only being secondary to what is the most important factor - the lack of social skills. Given enough years, repeated failure in social situations, and being subjected to enough scorn (for no apparent reason), will eventually lead anyone, regardless of who they are, to experience anxiety in the next social situation. If this fear was allowed to grow uninhibited, immersed in confusion surrounding as to why social interactions fail, it seems only logical that this will develop into paranoia. I personally don't regard AS as an illness. It's very much a part of who I am. AS makes me - for better or worse - me. I wonder about schizophrenia. Is it really an illness, or is it more likely a symptom of someone on the autistic spectrum?

It's the first time I've heard of PDA. Surely though, PDA should be recognised more as a coping mechanism for AS, rather than being a syndrome in its own right? Considering myself to be AS, I can see a lot of my symptoms described in PDA. At the last company I worked for, the boss told me people considered me as "weak," and this is why I attracted bullying from my colleagues. In my mind though, I always imagined myself as strong, because of the amount of inner strength I needed, on any given day, to haul my ass out of bed in the morning, or answer the phone, or answer the door, or go to a cafe to order a sandwich and coffee, or walk down the street, or get on a bus... Every day was a fight with the anxiety. Everyday turned into a battle with people. Makes me feel sad thinking about it. Surely though, it's human nature to want to avoid anxiety? I hope the diagnosis for PDA does not take over from AS. I think it will make things even more confusing for everybody.