Sensory issues....

[Clare63]

Anyone else come across this with their children. Having been administered local anaesthetic at the dentist has your child still experienced the pain and felt no numbness, could this be part of other sensory problems or has it not worked this has happened twice now ????

 

Thanks Clare x

[Mumble]

Wow - I thought it was just me who was wierd on this one (I'm an AS adult btw).

 

I've generally avaoided the dentist because of sensory issues - bright light in face and drill noises - eugh...

 

Anyway, couldn't avoid going last year as had a huge amount of pain and couldn't eat or sleep - was seen at the local dentist as an emergency as I hadn't registered since becoming a student. I needed a root canal treatment and was given the 'normal' dose of local anaesthetic - after however long it's supposed to take she told me it should feel very numb, but it just felt as it usually did so I told her this and was given a second dose. This was repeated three times and it still didn't feel very different and I could certainly feel what she was doing, but she said I'd had enough anaesthetic to send my whole face to sleep and there was no way it could hurt , so she continued with the treatment which involved the extraction of the nerve and I was in complete agony .

 

Two weeks afterwards, I was still in a huge amount of pain so I bravely went back only to be told that the nerve had been removed so there was absolutely no way it could hurt.

 

It settled down and I got used to the occasional throbing, but recently that same tooth and another have got worse - I often wake up in pain but there's no way I'm going to go back to the dentist - I really can't cope with the sensory input or with the pain. I'd be interested to know if this is an issue for others with AS/ASD, and if anyone's found a solution, because my toothache is worrying me at the moment and I don't know what to do about it.

[butterfingersbimbo]

omg thats horrendous!!!! ooooo sending you a big <'>

 

i am not autistic but didnt feel like the pain relief during labour was effective......had gas and air, which made me feel sick, then pethidine which was rubbish.....should have had an epidural but was terrified of needles so didnt......

[Clare63]

Thanks Mumble & BfB,

Mumble don't put up with toothache, that and earache are terribly painful and make you feel so miserable. Explain to your dentist the problems you experienced last time maybe they could do treatment under a general (hopefully that would work, but don't want to scare you but my question was originally generated because a friend asked me today of my son's experience with the dentist, her lad has sensory problems and has been in extreme pain in the past year after two visits to the dentist, she wondered because when he was younger and had his tonsils out under a general when he returned from theatre he was sat bolt up right, wide awake and absolutely terrified, at 3 years old he was unable to explain, but she has wondered ever since whether the anaesthetic actually worked ??? Like you say it would be interesting to know if this is an issue for others with AS/ASD.

Hope you get your tooth sorted out real soon. <'>

Clare x

[Cat]

I am not autistic - well no dx - but I have these issues with the dentist. Last week I had to have an emergency extraction of a wisdom tooth. I had six injections and still felt it being pulled As soon as the tooth was out the anaesthetic cut in I felt it rush through my mouth and my face, and I could not speak as my tounge was frozen for eight hours as was the rest of my face. This is not the first time this has happend, although it is always worse when its a back tooth.

 

Worse still and I know this will take some believing but it is true, I have also had 2 Emergency C Sections and although I did feel something with the fist I felt everything with the second although the anaethasist would not believe me at first, until I almost leapt off the operating table. They managed to deliver my son but I felt every stitch that they put in and then again afterwards had no feeling for hours and hours

 

Cat

[Mumble]

Thanks Clare, it's interesting to see that this isn't just a 'me' problem. And you're certainly right about toothache possibly making me miserable - I'm being a right grump at the moment - I just hadn't connected the two .

 

I thought about going back to the dentist and trying to explain, but she made it clear when I was there that she didn't believe me (after all, she'd followed the book so it had to work . . .) . I'm going to speak to my disability officer at uni instead - my uni has a dental school and large dental hospital, so they should be able to help me out or know someone who can . . . If that doesn't work (I'm a master of backup plans), I'm getting a mentor to help me with communication issues - well I think trying to make someone understand how I feel is a communication issue, so I'll see what he/she can do.

 

Cat - that sounds horrible - remind me never ever ever to have children!!!!!!!! As for general anaesthetics, I watched a programme once on people who were totally paralysed by the anaesthetic so they couldn't move or say anything, but they still felt everything and couldn't alert the surgeon or anaesthetist - and they were saying that this was quite common , and were researching ways of finding out whether the patient was actually still awake inside by monitoring stress levels - terrified me. However I have successfully had a general anaesthetic to have my appendix out, so hopefully this would be ok, and it's an option to consider.

[Clare63]

OOOh Cat that's awful !!!!

 

Mumble how about a valium drip ? I know a friends who has this cause she is so terrified of the dentist she says its wonderful !!!!

 

I remember as a kid my Dad having really bad toothache and was in so much pain that he hit himself over the head with a frying pan ??? years after the pan still does balance properly on the stove LOL

 

Clare x

[Mumble]

Well I tried to find a frying pan but then I remembered I DON'T DO COOKING!!!!! So if I'm to take that option it's going to have to be the (yes, the) saucepan, the kettle or a cheese grater . . .

 

Or your other option:

 

Mumble how about a valium drip ? I know a friends who has this cause she is so terrified of the dentist she says its wonderful !!!!

 

Can I buy these for everyday use?!!! Might make me less of a grump!!!

 

I'll add it to my suggestion list (and perhaps buy a frying pan in case whatever they suggest doesn't work . . . )

[Clare63]

Good luck with what ever opition you choose !!!!!

 

Clare x

[shortie]

I remember watching a documentory about the Jackson family and Luke was having surgery for tonsils or something but when they gave him the pre med instead of making him sleepy,he was bouncing off the walls and they had to give him more anasetic than normal!I dont think its just anasetic for teeth tho,my DD had to have bloods taken last year so they put "magic" cream on her hands and arms but she was HYSTERICAL so much so that the nurse refused to take any more and called the doctor a few names for putting her through it in the first place as they were only routine after DX! still think she could feel the whole thing and told them never again unless she had something life threatening!!

[TuX]

Am autistic and each appointment dentists always re talk to each other about the amount of anesthetic and iv sedation needed to work after reading the notes as they cannot believe it has little effect,they are sending me to hospital to be put asleep next time because the new SN clinic am at thinks it is too much when it is not even working well anyway.

[Clare63]

Thank you for your replies and comments, most useful.

Clare x

PS Mumble Hope you get that tooth sorted out real soon !

[Mumble]

Thanks TuX and Shortie. It's good to know that it might not just be a 'me thing' and that there is some truth in what I've been trying to tell dentists/doctors etc constantly but to no avail . Clare - I'm going to try and get it sorted in the new term once I get my mentor to support me.

[butterfingersbimbo]

oh mumble are you still in pain???? <'> <'> <'>

 

oh Cat...there's no words for that........ <'> <'> <'>

[madme]

Hi My son is as and adhd. He is 11. He took a lot of anesthetic when he had a general a few years ago- the anethetist was shocked. When having locals he also needs a lot- he nearly hit a dentist once after a local that didnt work. We have now been told that for any future local he will have to be seen at the hospital. Dont think its that unusual. As for toothache I would recommend cloves placed near the area- my son found it helped a little. Ive obviously got odd pain reactions as I hate needles and found it better to have root canal treatment w/o any anesthetic. Hope you get this resolved soon.

[Ian Jordan]

Not just anaesthetics vary in effect - drugs used in eye examinations may also have an idiosyncratic effect - moreso for those on the spectrum.

 

Sometimes they even work in the opposite way to that expected!

 

Extreme care is essential

[Mumble]

I read something very interesting last night related to this:

 

It was about the diagnosis of ASDs/AS, it went through the triad plus stereotyped activities and then went on to list secondary characteristics 'common but not essential for diagnosis', such as ... resistance to the effects of sedatives and hypnotics.

 

What it didn't say was why this was the case, which is something I would very much like to know, if only to help me to understand myself a little better.

 

This was paraphrased from one of Wing's papers, so I think it's a fairly reliable source. I'm certainly going to take it along with me (and perhaps try and get the original paper/research) when I see my disability support/GP/whoever in an attempt to get someone to listen to me about this.

[Clare63]

Its all very interesting, it would good to know "why this is the case". It would be good to get some firm evidence as again when this was raised by the dentist he bluffed his way out by saying the child was complaining about the needle going into the inner gum (less fleshy than the outer), but surely numbness would have been experienced and that horrible tingley feeling when it starts to come too.

 

Mumble good luck with your quest to get someone to listen to you and I hope its very soon so you can get that tooth fixed (as per your other thread having that also to deal with when you have to a presentation to do can't help)

 

Clare x x x

[madme]

Mumble is the paper that you found it in online? If so where can I find it? What is the title? Thanks

[Mumble]

Mumble is the paper that you found it in online? If so where can I find it? What is the title? Thanks

 

Hi Madme,

 

Most of the papers I've been reading are only available to online subscribers. I get free access to several thousand journals through my university (and several thousand more as print copies through the libraries). Unfortunately they are not available to the general public (at least not without paying a huge fee).

 

However, Olga Bogdashina uses Wing's papers well in her books, so it depends what you are looking for and how much detail you need. I would particularly recommend 'Theory of Mind and the Triad of Perspectives on Autism and Asperger Syndrome' (2006), as this contains multiple references to Wing's work, and is quite a useful reference on some of the aspects discussed in this thread.

 

Sorry I couldn't be any more help,

 

Mumble.

[madme]

Thanks Mumble