Is Games & PE compulsory ?

[di30]

Hi all.

 

Myself, my hubby, went to the school meeting again to meet up with the SENCO, the LEA and the ED P, this time the 'Head of Games' attended too.

 

My son Daniel 12 in year 8 have not done any Games or PE since about last April onwards, as he could not cope, it was then arranged that Daniel to stay with the Head of year, as he was acting as Daniel's Mentor.

Before this Daniel used to skip these lessons and was mainly found hiding in the school toilets, as he was very distressed.

 

Anyway, at the meeting last Friday it was arranged for Daniel to start attending these lessons again recommended by them, but not to pressurise him (we said that bit), and give him that chance to put up his hand if he could not cope.

 

Before this Senco said both herself and the head of games would speak to Daniel to reassure him but to make sure he attends these lessons as from Tuesday - (yesterday).

We had spoken to Daniel about this afterwards and he did not seem to bad, but then Tuesday came and he was getting all worked up again about this.

I had to quickly write a note for him to take to the 'head of year' and to see what else they could arrange for now, as Daniel was getting so distressed he almost did not go into school.

 

The head was not available so as Daniel used to just sit outside his office as arranged until now, thats what he done, but did not think about getting the note to the head of games instead.

I am concerned that the Games & PE staff did not check up on this and they obviously thought he would be there and know his difficulties, as he has Asperger Syndrome, high anxiety levels and some learning difficulties.

The note is still in Daniel's school bag.

 

This morning I had emailed the LEA, SENCO and the ED P just to let them know about this and to sort something out.

I did receive an email back from the LEA who said both the Games staff and Senco were to speak to Daniel after our meeting last week.

Daniel has Senco for English and she has had the opportunity to discuss as this to him as arranged but so far nothing has been said or now resolved.

 

I am wondering now is it compulsory for our kids with ASD etc to do Games & Pe etc ?

 

Daniel is now under the 'Children's disability team' as he has just been referred, I requested this and I am hoping they can be of some help with this.

As he has only just been assessed I believe it will take some time for the actual referral to officially go through.

 

Daniel does not have a statement but we are on the point now of requesting an assessment for this but he has been on school action & school action plus from the age of 4 and IEP programmes, but don't feel his needs are being met, and words here are quicker than actions if you know what I mean.

Next year when Daniel will be in year 9, he will have to pick his options for the GCSE's, so all support now is very important, but really it feels like we are just going round in circles.

 

Does anyone else have a keyworker under the 'children's disability team' ? and how useful are they regarding education ?

 

Thank you and sorry this goes on.

 

Cheers Di x

[jb1964]

Hi Di,

 

I'm not sure whether it's compulsory. When our daughter hit comp. (she's 14 now and justed started yr10) - the anxiety levels were so big for lots of different reasons including PE - The deputy head and head of year both agreed at the time - to take PE straight out of the equation as it was one anxiety less - as there was no benefit at all from saying she had to go in fact the anxieties were so high that it usually ended up with her not going at all that day or perhaps even the day(s) before (they did this before she was diagnosed with ASD - I think even before she started attending the CAHMS unit).

 

At one of the review meetings after my daughter's diagnosis (12yrs) the CAHMS consultant requested that they remove it completely (she'd told us prior to the meeting that she would be requesting this - and it has never caused a problem before) - at the time she also mentioned that if needed she could be requested to miss other subjects (she was having terrible trouble in German & Welsh lessons - although she did eventually go to these).

 

Towards the end of last year we asked to withdraw her from Drama - as this was practically causing the same thing to happen again - she was missing so much school every two weeks when that lesson was coming up that there was no benefit at all - it was compromising all the other lessons.

 

She doesn't 'sit in' during these lessons either - as she doesn't want questions from the other children - she sits quietly in reception and reads or does her homework.

 

Hope you get somewhere soon with this.

Take care,

 

Jb

Edited September 19, 2007 by jb1964

[Flora]

di, they are not compulsory. My son was exempt (disapplied) from PE, games, music and drama when he started secondary last year. Some subjects are compulsory, ie. the IT teacher tried to get him on to a different more pc related programme but was told that it was a compulsory subject and that Bill had to do it (not sure if his advice was right or if he, and then I, was fobbed off). Lots of children with AS can't cope with PE/games for lots of reasons and end up having their time tables adapted to disapply them.

 

Flora X

[oxgirl]

As jb says, it should be possible to opt out of lessons that are too difficult or not benefitial. Better this than have the whole day and other lessons ruined. My lad is in an ASD unit attached to a mainstream and he is able to dip in and out of lessons according to what is appropriate for him. The rest of the time he either comes home or joins in with the unit work. The mainstream have no problem with him missing art and PE because it just wouldn't be beneficial to force him to go.

 

Good luck with it. <'>

 

~ Mel ~

[di30]

Thank you all so much for your helpful replies.

 

Last term Daniel due to his anxieties he was skipping lessons such as you know Games/PE, Drama, music and whenever it came to oral tests.

There was an accasion when the school attendance officer rang home to say Daniel was not at school, but we knew he was as I take him there and back and always make sure he entered the building before I left.

I had to report him missing from school to the police, then all along he was stressing in the school toilets.

 

Since my other email regarding this earlier, as I emailed the school about him again missing this yesterday all personnel involved such as SENCO, the LEA, and the ED P have emailed back to inform me that as he has SENCO for English for 4th lesson tomorrow, she will speak to him and have arranged for the head of year to go to games with him for last lesson tomorrow and will stay with him for a while.

Not sure if this will work and I do think this is humilliating for Daniel.

 

I think this I will have to mention again if he can sit out of this, as this is affecting him badly.

 

As much as we have tried at every meeting to resolve this we are going round in circles, and nothing is resolved.

 

Daniel was only diagnosed this July with A/S, extreme anxiety levels and he has some learning difficulties.

CAMHS who diagnosed Daniel sent instructions to the school, as the school had requested this, and CAMHS will now be seeing Daniel about xmas time to see how he is coping at school.

It is coming to the point where we must request for an assessment for a statement.

 

For Daniel to sit these above lessons out, does he need a statement does anyone know ?

 

Thank you all once again. (at this moment of time - Daniel is stressing about games tomorrow as we have explained what they have arranged for this) for him to be prepared.

 

Cheers Di x

[jb1964]

Hi Di,

 

My daughter wasn't diagnosed til she was 12 -and she still doesn't have a statement (14yrs) - she was excused from PE (on our request) well before her diagnosis - and afterwards the CAHMS consultant requested this contnue throughout her school years - the school agreed on the basis that there was no benefit because the anxieties were causing her not to go to school for days on end - which meant other lessons were being compromised.

 

If the school are being unhelpful in this - can you get CAHMS to request his withdrawal from these lessons - our consultant told us that they frequently request it for ASD children because of the problems they have in particular with PE - and they've never had any problems in getting their request fulfilled.

 

Take care

Jb

Edited September 19, 2007 by jb1964

[Flora]

and have arranged for the head of year to go to games with him for last lesson tomorrow and will stay with him for a while.

Not sure if this will work and I do think this is humilliating for Daniel.

 

 

Cheers Di x

 

Di, that's ridiculous! do they think you haven't already talked to him for heaven's sake? Do they think they have magical powers of persuasion that will stop him being anxious about games and pe? Either that or are they thinking they can bully and humiliate him into submission? This is so not on. Try and get Dan to write/type something about how he feels about games. He might not be able to say WHY he feels that way but he'll be able to say how it makes him feel. I did this with Bill and was suprised at what he typed, all sorts of sensory issues were brought to my attention that he'd not been able to verbalise...

 

Honestly, I'm so fed up of some teachers and professionals pussy footing around with our kids. Why don't they just ###### well listen to the parents and the kids themselves? Perhaps if they took their heads out of their arses they might learn something!!!!

 

Phew! Think I'd better slink back to the break down thread

 

Sorry Di, but they are fobbing you and your son off and it's not right. <'>

 

flora X

[di30]

Thanks all for your replies again.

 

Daniel is due to see CAMHS again by xmas as they want to know about how he is coping at school.

 

I could always contact them earlier and perhaps they can arrange to see him earlier.

The actual consultant who diagnosed Daniel has now moved on elsewhere, but obviously there will be records kept on file.

 

CAMHS were aware of this problem before and sent advice and instructions to the school which was to encourage but not to pressurise Daniel into activities as he recommended that Daniel should try it out, and for all staff to be aware of his issues etc, so I think this may be what they are trying to do, but its not working at all.

So we have requested other suggestions such as just watching for now and see how that goes, or maybe do something that will be a benefit to him, such as in the IT dept etc.

 

You have all given me something to think about and realise we are being fobbed right off and its not fair for Daniel to be suffering like this, same for all of our kids.

 

I do think its a good idea too for Daniel to type up something, as he does find it difficult to explain his problems, so thanks for that suggestion too.

 

Now we had better get working on it, thank you all so much again, will let you know what happens.

 

Di xx

[Canopus]

PE is compulsory as part of the NC and the only legal way for a kid to avoid having to participate is on medical grounds or if they are officially diagnosed with a disability or SEN. Some schools require more convincing that others. It is also possible that kids with certain types of SEN will be allocated a different type of PE lesson if the school has facilities for it.

[Louisa]

Hi Di

 

We have been having the same problems with our DD. She has just started year 10 (but we cant get her to go back in).

 

The SENCO at her school has refused to believe there is anything wrong with her (we are awaiting diagnosis for aspergers) and has done nothing to help all year. One of her big problems was PE too and she kept hiding in the toilets crying and one day she walked out & turned up at my work!

 

Anyway we had a meeting recently with the school where the Deputy Heads sat in and dismissed what the SENCO was saying (that she was fine), and they have offered us everything we want, including missing PE for her totally. They have also said she can have a mentor and have a time out card for when she is feeling stressed; so schools do seem to be able to choose whether they make them do PE or not.

 

However like I said we cant get her to go back in. She says she is traumatised by school.

 

I think Daniel's school could and should make all the allowances, even without a statement.

 

Good luck.

 

x

[di30]

Thank you all again for all your very helpful replies, I am very grateful indeed.

 

I have sent Daniel in with a note to excuse him again from the Games lessons today, he was very distressed this morning and like last term he was excused due to medical reasons.

So due to this they should still understand.........more so now that they know he had his official diagnosis.

 

Daniel has his SENCO teacher for the lesson before and she was going to talk to him then, so hopefully they will not make him do this, especially now we have requested him not to do this for now.

I am going to contact CAMHS and hope they can give an earlier appointment, this cannot go on and something must be done once and for all to prevent this from happening every week (so twice a week really with games etc).

 

I will keep you posted of the outcome of this.

 

Thank you.

Di x

[Clare63]

Connor does not have to do PE at his school, the SENCO cleared it with the Head of PE and he goes to the SEN room for PE lessons he either does his homework, helps them out with jobs ie photocoping or works with a TA on some of his problems. Its made such a difference and his attendance has improved greatly.

Think you need something definate in place as this must be causing him great anxiety not know from one day to the next what is going to happen. Good luck and i hope you get ut sort out real soon.

 

Clare x x x

[Suze]

Sorry , don,t know if this has been suggested yet or not , but your son can be disapplied from PE.The senco should have the powers to do this.My son is disapplied from history drama, and RE ...so he can focus on literacy and maths.

[di30]

Thank you all much appreciated and have taken everything you have said into consideration, at least I do know going by reading all your posts there are plenty of alternative options..............brilliant, thank you. <'>

 

A message for Jb1964..........I have tried to PM you back, having problems with sending, so I think I have given you my direct email details, do you think you could email me ?, thank you as you want some details.

 

Otherwise I will try sending again later, cheers.

Di x

[julieann]

Hi di 30,

 

There is a piece in one of the Luke Jackson books where he was allowed to go to the computer room instead of doing P.E. as he became so anxious.

It really does seem to depend on the school. I support a child who isn't able to draw recognisable objects and she no longer has Art because she got so upset that the other girls could draw things and she couldn't.

Instead I have her 1:1 for learning support. The guideline is meant to be that if the stress of taking part in the lesson is more negative than anything positive or productive that the lesson might produce alternatives need to be found.

[di30]

Thank you.

 

Not too sure if they are giving Dan a choice at the moment.

 

 

I know we discussed this at a meeting with Senco, the Lea and the ED P 2 weeks ago to try to encourage him but not to pressurise him, but to be honest he did seem okay about it first then came off the idea when it came to the day.

 

Senco emailed and said she had a conversation with him about doing this and after her lesson of English was games, she said when she spoken with him about taking part he seemed to be positive and went to the changing rooms, got changed in his kit and taken part, she did unfortunately say to him as found this out too, 'we must try to make you take part' ! she also told him the 'head of year was there waiting for him to turn up for this and to check out if he is okay' !

So Dan had to go didn't he really with not an option, he said the head of year was there, he did see that Daniel turned up and then left.

When senco said that Daniel seemed to be positive about this etc, I emailed her back to let her know that I know different.

This was Daniel did get changed, but not in his full kit, and he only helped the games teacher out, as the games teacher did ask him if he wanted to take part and he said no and that was that.........no pressure from the games teacher.

 

I know it would be good for Daniel to do this, but they have been told by us (parents & CAMHS) not to pressurise him and for all staff to understand.

 

I have also found out that she was a bit offish with Daniel yesterday and I do think its because they know that we are keeping track too of everything.

 

Looks like another letter..................this will be the 50th now !!

 

They should not pressurise and I will need to contact CAMHS too for an earlier appointment, as they wanted to see Daniel again before xmas to see how he is coping at school.

 

Thank you all, as I said I will take everything into consideration, its all a big help.

 

Di xx

[bikergal]

My daughter, who's almost 14 now was disapplied for PE for a year. She does it now but is at a new school. There are lesssons/teachers that she really dislikes but I tend to deal with her problems as soon as they arise now. Luckily the school support worker is good at sorting out the kinds of thing that do crop up pretty quickly But it has been one enormously long and tiring battle. Dd1 does have a statement now with 15 hours of support and from this new school term the school have implemented support for her...and about time too I know you are fighting several battles at the moment, don't forget to take some time out for you. <'>

[Clare63]

PE is compulsory as part of the NC and the only legal way for a kid to avoid having to participate is on medical grounds or if they are officially diagnosed with a disability or SEN. Some schools require more convincing that others. It is also possible that kids with certain types of SEN will be allocated a different type of PE lesson if the school has facilities for it.

 

Sorry Di to jump in on your thread, hope you don't mind !

 

Canopus,

 

Please may I ask if you know where I can get more information on this.

 

I said earlier in this thread my DS did not do PE and things had been working well, at the end of this past week the school have decided its time for him to join back in, I reminded them that he should be introuduced slowly and given a timescale of how and what would happen, they wrote in his school/home book that 2 periods would be spent in SN's discuss it and talking abaout it as a social story, the next week 2 periods and the week after half term 2 periods he would go along and watch with a TA, one step at a time they said , "Great" I thought, well Friday he was asked where his PE kit was as they wanted him to join in, excuse me according to their plan thats not due for happen for at elast 3 weeks !!!! I have always insisted that I am kept up to date with their plans so that I am prepared to support my son with changes etc, well now they have done this we have taken about 100 steps backwards.... major meltdown Friday after school and now he is refusing to go back next week on days when there is PE, he tells me he hates everything about it, mainly getting changed, the nosie the shouting, the rough and tumble (they are supposed to be playing rugby), not getting picked for teams, people teasing him for the way he runs etc etc etc etc... sorry having a bit of a rant here. Anyway if you could supply any further info/links etc where I could read up on the compulsory/legal bit.

Thanks Clare x x x

[Canopus]

The information I quoted was provided by a number of different sources including the internet, people from the HE community, and people from the AS community including those that have kids at school and fully or partially exempted from PE. I'm not sure if it is 100% correct but it seems to be the way things are at the moment. Kids have been able to avoid participating in PE lessons for decades by having a doctor's certificate and this is legally binding. In more recent years SENCOs have been able to give the authority for exemption although I'm not sure if it's legally binding. Alternative PE lessons are often implemented as a personal favour either by the teacher or under recommendation from someone in SEN or the LEA, but are not legally binding and can be changed to what the rest of the class is doing at short notice. If kids are statemented then it might include a section about alternative PE arrangements that must be followed by the school.

[Clare63]

The information I quoted was provided by a number of different sources including the internet, people from the HE community, and people from the AS community including those that have kids at school and fully or partially exempted from PE. I'm not sure if it is 100% correct but it seems to be the way things are at the moment. Kids have been able to avoid participating in PE lessons for decades by having a doctor's certificate and this is legally binding. In more recent years SENCOs have been able to give the authority for exemption although I'm not sure if it's legally binding. Alternative PE lessons are often implemented as a personal favour either by the teacher or under recommendation from someone in SEN or the LEA, but are not legally binding and can be changed to what the rest of the class is doing at short notice. If kids are statemented then it might include a section about alternative PE arrangements that must be followed by the school.

 

Canopus,

 

Thank you so much for coming back to me on this. My son is not on a statement and I can see I am going to have a struggle this one.

 

Thanks again

 

Clare x