Little bit weird...

[bid]

I've just filled in the application form for a course I'm doing through work via a univ.

 

Anyway, the form included a 'disability' section, which actually had a code for AS. So I duly ticked that, but indicated that I didn't need any additional support, other than a general understanding about my communication skills...

 

But it felt a little bit weird: this is the first time I've 'come out officially'

 

Plus I don't consider myself to have a 'disability'...but, I'm not ashamed of who I am either so I didn't want to not tick the box! I'm also quite proud of the things I'm finally achieving so think people should know that those of us with AS can do it too!

 

Just a bit weird

 

Bid

[Mumble]

Anyway, the form included a 'disability' section, which actually had a code for AS. So I duly ticked that, but indicated that I didn't need any additional support, other than a general understanding about my communication skills...

Yeah, it does feel a bit weird; I had the same for re-enrolment in September. The thing that such forms don't take into consideration is how reactive something like AS/HFA is to context and circumstances. In my own little world, doing my research, focusing on what I love, there's no way my AS is a disability - if anything it is enabling, but with some of the issues I've had recently, I would say that it was disabling, and at times quite substantially so.

 

If it's any consolation, statistics from these forms are generally anonymised and used for Government targets on widening participation - you may even find (though I don't know, and I guess it depends on the course) that the course tutors do not even have your disability status passed on to them.

[mossgrove]

<'> ><

 

Mixed feelings I am sure, but you should be proud of what you are achieving.

 

Simon

[pearl]

I know what you mean bid, it doesnt quite fit any boxes does it? I always feel similar when filling in forms for JP.

[bid]

.

 

If it's any consolation, statistics from these forms are generally anonymised and used for Government targets on widening participation - you may even find (though I don't know, and I guess it depends on the course) that the course tutors do not even have your disability status passed on to them.

 

I don't mind anyone knowing, it just felt a bit weird to be 'officially' ticking that box

 

It's a distance learning course which I'm really looking forward to getting stuck into, with only two workshops at the uni, so it should all be fine. And I didn't have any problems when I was at uni way back in the mists of time...

 

Bid

Edited March 13, 2008 by bid

[bid]

 

Posted twice by mistake!

 

Bid

Edited March 13, 2008 by bid

[Kathryn]

Well done Bid! <'>

 

L goes through phases of ticking and not ticking the box, sometimes she feels she doesn't want to be defined by a particular label - and so she doesn't. Sometimes she refuses to tick the gender box too - and argues with people about it.

 

K x

[baddad]

Sometimes she refuses to tick the gender box too - and argues with people about it.

 

K x

Predictably, I tend to be tempted to write in the 'SEX' box Yes Please

The other one that throws me is 'Religion' - I tend to put 'None' but then qualify it with (CofE)... dunno why - perhaps i'm subconsciously hedging my bets!? maybe i'll go with 'Jedi' next time...

Sorry, I digress (now there's a first!) WELL DONE, BID

 

BD

[FKlama]

I tiked that box recently too. Yes, it did feel kind of weird (not ticking it would have felt 'wrong' though), especially since all my differences just cannot be summed up by one box/label. Probably not even a set of labels.

 

I often seem to have trouble filling in forms, the 'gender' section is easy, since it can be answered by looking at ones anatomy.

 

The trouble that I have, is that I often do not fit into the categories or assumptions that are the basis of the form. I am just too different, my path in life has just been too different from the norm to fit into a form. Well, I still try my best, and the sections that I just cannot answer, I just leave blank.

 

 

I have also disclosed my AS to my tutor (one of the few people that I see on a regular basis here at University). Doing reserch now, instead of going to lectures has definitely improved my 'university experience', since I am much better at working things out myself, or just teaching missing skills to myself (possibly with a few pointers) while solving a (real world) problem than 'being tought'.

Edited March 14, 2008 by FKlama

[darky]

<'> Bid. If you are anything like me, you would have to tick the box whether you wanted to or not, just because it would be dishonest not to It must have been strange though, but good on you anyway <'>

[Mumble]

Predictably, I tend to be tempted to write in the 'SEX' box Yes Please

I wouldn't have expected any less ...

 

the 'gender' section is easy, since it can be answered by looking at ones anatomy.

:unsure: Not quite. I've had several debates on terminology - 'sex', 'gender' 'male/female' etc. within some of my research groups/seminars.

 

I think the thing to remember with most of these forms is that generally they're not actually interested in individuals at all, but in mass statistics. I know exactly what you mean about it feeling odd to tick the box and wrong not to, but actually in most cases, the powers that be couldn't care less about you as an individual.

[smiley]

Yay! Nice to be officially you isn't it?!

 

I'm giving a talk to a group of peeps doing a course - have been asked to do it by the ones who dx'd me .

 

First time i'm official too.

 

Reckon they will think i have three heads??

 

<'>

[smiley]

BD - Jedi........ I was vairy tempted to put Vulcan on a form for monkey.............

[Mumble]

Reckon they will think i have three heads??

You don't have three heads? I always find that it's the tail that's much harder to hide

[smiley]

Think i should start with the ol' favourite...

 

'What's that elephant doing in the corner? And why is he looking at me funny..'

 

[FKlama]

'What's that elephant doing in the corner? And why is he looking at me funny..'

 

I don't get that one.

[Mumble]

I don't get that one.

Me neither

[bid]

Nor me!

[smiley]

 

Sorry guys! I'll explain.......

 

It's an old family joke - my mum suffers from a mental illness (AS is NOT a mental illness... that's not what i mean before i offend anyone!! ). People would have a stereotypical image in their minds of a 'mad' person before they met her.

 

It was a running joke in my family to make daft comments like that as people tend to already assume she would be 'mad', and sould say something like that to them.

 

Three heads / tail / - i was having a (very bad !) joke about peoples preconcieved ideas about how i would behave, once they know of my diagnosis........

 

Seemed quite funny at 1am this morning.....

 

As BD would say.

 

I'll get me coat.............

 

<'>

[Mumble]

So people would assume on knowing that she has a mental illness that this must mean she sees things (like elephants) because that's their view of mental illness and that she says things are there and looking at her that aren't there at all, right?

 

Maybe it was the elephant thing that threw me - I've always got confused with the 'elephant in the room' metaphor and despite countless explanations can't get my head around it at all

 

As to me, I do have two heads (at least). And I think one must be decorated with polka-dots and the other luminous blue and green stripes. That can be the only explanation as to why people look at me so weirdly.

[bid]

OR, do you mean that your AS is the unspoken element (i.e. the elephant) in the room? Conspicuous, but nobody likes to mention it, so they pretend it's not there even though it's so large it can't be missed??

 

Bid

Edited March 16, 2008 by bid

[alanm]

I've just filled in the application form for a course I'm doing through work via a univ. Anyway, the form included a 'disability' section, which actually had a code for AS. So I duly ticked that, but indicated that I didn't need any additional support, other than a general understanding about my communication skills... But it felt a little bit weird: this is the first time I've 'come out officially'.

Hello, I'm fairly new to this board, just posted an intro on the meets and greets page, and really identified with this thread. In the past I hadn't disclosed it as my own condition is relatively mild, but what highlighted that I really should have done was when I was temping with an employer who is a two-tick symbol holder. After I'd been temping for a while in a lower tier capacity, they put me into the "full role" on a fixed term contract for a year, but this full role entailed a lot more public contact where my lack of confidence showed. A month before the end of the contract I had an appraisal with the supervisor saying I "had to be resolute to improvement in my communication skills."

 

This really hit me as I knew I could not "improve" substantially, but at the same time on my medical form for that employer I had put "not disabled" and I realised that I couldn't defend myself against this requirement to be "resolute to improvement" by telling the supervisor my disability, as if I did I'd have been in trouble for not saying it on the form. At the time of doing the form I didn't consciously think of myself as "disabled" anyway, as I wasn't "Registered disabled", guess I had not been sure if Asperger really counted as a "disability" given its non-medical nature.

 

After the appraisal I didn't want the job permanently even at the point when I'd have been invited to apply for it when the employer was restructuring as I knew it wasn't right for me anyway. I reverted to temp status in the same department for a while, but later moved on to other temp jobs in other departments with the same employer.

 

When these all ended and I was unemployed, I too 'came out officially' for the first time on the Jobseekers Allowance application saying 'yes I am disabled.' I realised it could be especially beneficial while unemployed as Jobcentres have their Disability Employment Advisers (DEAs for short). I spoke to my local man for the first time, who clarified that Asperger definitely does count as a disability by legal definition, and the appraisal situation showed why I should declare it at the earliest opportunity.

 

 

L goes through phases of ticking and not ticking the box, sometimes she feels she doesn't want to be defined by a particular label - and so she doesn't.

Know what you mean, I chatted to an ex-colleague who was asking me how I was getting on, she made this point, but I now feel the possible 'stigma by label' is still outweighed by the possibility that declaring a disability to an employer could be much needed 'protection' against situations like the appraisal I've spoken of above. I didn't have a leg to stand on then but would now that I will ALWAYS state it, even though it is likely I will just not be considered for some jobs.

Edited April 2, 2008 by alanm

[Kinda]

Hi alanm

 

You seem to have a lot of issues around your job so for me I think the disability label is not one you want to go for with an employer. I think the way to think about it is as a NT person but with a communication problem, hope this doesn't upset you but it allows you to see if you can do the job.

 

In other words if its a job that doesn't need face to face then guess that would be OK with you? However if it means lots of fact to face communication then you are not so confident?

 

I guess if I was you I would ask myself can I get a job that doesn't rely on much face to face communication and if not then can I improve communication or is it as good as it gets for me at the moment?

 

My son has some relationship/communication issues but he's in IT and I think he is labelled as a computer geek and so everyone expects him to be different!

 

I know this is a very simplistic suggestion but give it some thought and see how you feel.

 

What you write is excellent communication so for me (mostly NT) I struggle to understand how someone who can comunicate so well in the written form has problems but guess thats the whole AS problem?

 

Take care and don't give up!

[Kinda]

Bid

 

Sorry I have just read my posting and realised its your topic. Good luck with your course I spent many years doing an OU course and we used to call it the Loneliness of the Long Distance Learner (for those who don't know its a pun on the Loneliness of the Long Distance Runner which is a famous book). If you need any advice regarding studying I will help as will lots of others on the forum, who are probably a lot more qualified than myself.

 

Good luck and of course be comfortable with who you are, you deserve to be on the course and have every right to let others know of AS or not as YOU choose.

 

Take care.

Edited April 6, 2008 by Kinda

[alanm]

Hello to Kinda,

 

Thanks for replying to my post, also appreciate the compliment on my written communication as well. Just to break down some of your points and reply:

I think the way to think about it is as a NT person but with a communication problem, hope this doesn't upset you but it allows you to see if you can do the job. In other words if its a job that doesn't need face to face then guess that would be OK with you? However if it means lots of face to face communication then you are not so confident?

Can see where you're coming from, but did you miss in my first post where I'd said "In the past I hadn't disclosed it"? In effect I had been trying to "forget" having AS and being "NT with a communication problem" but this meant being told to "improve" in appraisals. Without stating I am "disabled", then such supervisers will by default expect improvement.

 

I guess if I was you I would ask myself can I get a job that doesn't rely on much face to face communication and if not then can I improve communication or is it as good as it gets for me at the moment? My son has some relationship/communication issues but he's in IT and I think he is labelled as a computer geek and so everyone expects him to be different!

If you hadn't seen my age I'm 36, so I think it is fair to assume my communication is "as good as it gets" now I've been of working age for approx 15 years. In that appraisal the superviser was quite sternly saying "Your feedback reads I will not improve (remember this was where I hadn't disclosed having AS). I want you to start saying you will try to improve." Well, I was always "trying" to communicate to the best of my ability, but that ability was clearly less than average. For her to tell me to "try to improve" did she expect me to go on expensive self-development coaching courses? I'll also clarify that in fact telephone contact is often what I find more difficult than face to face.

 

My skills were always mental rather than physical and I took to computers in my teens, so that for the most part lends itself to work like IT, a bit of something in common with your son then as I'd worked as a programmer until a redundancy in Sept 02, or financial work like ledgers and I have now had a few months of experience, both of these job types making better use of my overall mental skills than just general admin would, albeit that many adverts do ask for good communication skills. I need to fit in where it is a big enough team for there to be someone to handle the key telephone contact and pass work appropriately to me, and the employer appreciating that I do have a disability, while being able to offer a role that will make good use of my talent, hence why I feel disclosure is important at the earliest opportunity.

 

As for written communication, the great thing is I can take some time to put my reply together, proof read it, shuffle sentences around if needed, unlike having to respond on the dot when I don't know what to say and how to say it in a face to face or verbal situation.

[bid]

Well, letter at work last night to say I've been accepted on the course

 

And, after 2 car MOTs I have finally ordered my coloured uber aspie specs, so I feel confident about the induction workshop in June

 

AND, I have decided that if there is one of those 'introduce yourself' things at the induction workshop, I shall add that I have AS after explaining my professional background

 

Flappy and proud!

 

Bid

[baddad]

Well, letter at work last night to say I've been accepted on the course

 

AND, I have decided that if there is one of those 'introduce yourself' things at the induction workshop, I shall add that I have AS after explaining my professional background

 

 

Congratulations

Wouldn't it be spooky if you inspired one of those 'I'm Sparticus' scenes where you found out all of the other's were spectrumeers too?

[bid]

[bid]

AND, I have decided that if there is one of those 'introduce yourself' things at the induction workshop, I shall add that I have AS after explaining my professional background

 

OR, will that seem like showing off??

 

Bid

[Guest Lya of the Nox]

no it will not!!!!

use the glasses as explanation: i wear these for perception issues and see if anyone bites!

 

tired nuts r us

<'>

[Kinda]

Hello to Kinda,

 

Thanks for replying to my post, also appreciate the compliment on my written communication as well. Just to break down some of your points and reply: Can see where you're coming from, but did you miss in my first post where I'd said "In the past I hadn't disclosed it"? In effect I had been trying to "forget" having AS and being "NT with a communication problem" but this meant being told to "improve" in appraisals. Without stating I am "disabled", then such supervisers will by default expect improvement.

 

Mmm sorry I now understand your dilema, I wouldn't give up on the communication yet I'm 56 and it wasn't until I started my OU course at 52 that my written communication improved but realise you know better with regard to this. For me it would depend on the consequences of not improving communication, some organisations just go through the motions on appraisals and others like my own use them for bonus calculations. I find appraisals very stressful as I totally disagreed with my supervisors views and unfortunately it ended in me getting very angry and stressed out. I'm now trying to negotiate not having them on the basis of the stress associated with them. If I could have had some empathy with what my boss was saying then it may have been different, basically we employ a lot of consultants and they were asked to deliver x by me and they didn't so I was blamed.

 

If you hadn't seen my age I'm 36, so I think it is fair to assume my communication is "as good as it gets" now I've been of working age for approx 15 years. In that appraisal the superviser was quite sternly saying "Your feedback reads I will not improve (remember this was where I hadn't disclosed having AS). I want you to start saying you will try to improve." Well, I was always "trying" to communicate to the best of my ability, but that ability was clearly less than average. For her to tell me to "try to improve" did she expect me to go on expensive self-development coaching courses? I'll also clarify that in fact telephone contact is often what I find more difficult than face to face.

 

Perhaps you could explain your difficulties without raising AS. If you "come out" then its a risk whether it affords you some protection or whether it will go against you in the future and I think only you can decide this and its what you are comfortable with as well. In my sons case while he has been diagnosed and dyspahsic we have never approached him with AS since he just wants to be "normal" left to get on with life and so if he did he had traits of AS he would never raise it at work because that's what important to him.

 

My skills were always mental rather than physical and I took to computers in my teens, so that for the most part lends itself to work like IT, a bit of something in common with your son then as I'd worked as a programmer until a redundancy in Sept 02, or financial work like ledgers and I have now had a few months of experience, both of these job types making better use of my overall mental skills than just general admin would, albeit that many adverts do ask for good communication skills. I need to fit in where it is a big enough team for there to be someone to handle the key telephone contact and pass work appropriately to me, and the employer appreciating that I do have a disability, while being able to offer a role that will make good use of my talent, hence why I feel disclosure is important at the earliest opportunity.

 

It sounds like you are saying that its the telephone calls that are an issue in which case why don't you try and negotiate this aspect out of your job either through the AS route or not dependant on how much you tell them?

 

As for written communication, the great thing is I can take some time to put my reply together, proof read it, shuffle sentences around if needed, unlike having to respond on the dot when I don't know what to say and how to say it in a face to face or verbal situation.

 

Thinking positively then if you think about it your communication problem as related to the immediacy required by telephone calls and perhaps this is a route to negotiate with your supervisor, in other words your communication is fine but need help with telephone calls because of their immediacy and deflecting it away from a communication issue. Hope I've explained it OK and I realise you may think its a mute point but the supervisor may accept this way of thinking about it not being a communication issue but related to say the stress of having to react quickly and that may give you the option of not revealing AS.

 

Just a few thoughts and hopefully it will help you clarify in your own mind how you want to approach it.

 

Take care.

Edited April 11, 2008 by Kinda

[alanm]

Thinking positively then if you think about it your communication problem as related to the immediacy required by telephone calls and perhaps this is a route to negotiate with your supervisor, in other words your communication is fine but need help with telephone calls because of their immediacy and deflecting it away from a communication issue, but related to say the stress of having to react quickly and that may give you the option of not revealing AS.

 

Hello again, haven't been on for a few days. Thanks for your further thoughts, I will just clarify though that at present there isn't a supervisor to negotiate with, as I'm unemployed at the moment, I'm no longer in the post where I was having the appraisals I mentioned before, I guess that wasn't clear from my earlier posts.

 

Now I'm unemployed and applying for new possible jobs, one thing about being upfront about having a disability is that I can advise companies that the Jobcentre does a grant, the "Job Introduction Scheme" for disabled people. The Disability adviser at my local office had suggested I could include his contact information if I enclosed information on this scheme with applications.

[smiley]

Flappy and proud!

 

Bid

 

I likey!! <'>