Have I been given accurate information?

[peaches]

I would be grateful if those of you who have been through the statementing / diagnosis processes could have a read of this and make sure nothing is being missed.

 

It is suspected that Raph has Asperger's /ADHD/ASD, he has problems at school, in reception year the Early Years Inclusion Service were involved. This year (Y1) is proving difficult, his behaviour problems have increased, school got an Educational Psychologist to see him. She did some IQ type tests on him and wrote a report for school. I met with the Ed Psych, class teacher and senco today and the Ed Psych thinks we should go for statementing. The SENCO said - "can we still do that ?"- the Ed Psych said there is additional funding attached to statements for exceptional cases. Exceptional cases are not defined. Due to Raph's difficult background, he has many experiences in common with a "looked after child" (i.e. one in foster care). Such children are given priority in our area and he may get statemented.

 

The Ed Psych said the SENCO should fill in MPA1 for statementing. This requests a Multiprofessional Assessment. The issues she should include on it are Behaviour Problems, Disruptiveness, Aspects of Social Communication. A request takes 6 weeks. I can speed up the process by writing to the SEN Dept of the Children and Young People's Service, our local council, and asking for a multiprofessional assessment of our child.

 

Initially I was told we would need to go to a specialist centre which is an annexe of the Children's Hospital known as Ryegate. But as I have already got a series of appointments with CAMHS for assessments, the two specialists at CAMHS can do those assessments in house. ie they can assess for a social communication disorder.

 

Is all this correct? Can you see any possible pitfalls that I can pre empt?

 

If the Educational Psychologist thinks he should be statemented who else needs to be convinced?

 

I see so many of you that have problems with the system that the meeting seemed too good to be true.

 

#Thanks, if you have read this far!

Edited November 5, 2008 by peaches

[pumpkinpie]

I would be grateful if those of you who have been through the statementing / diagnosis processes could have a read of this and make sure nothing is being missed.

 

It is suspected that Raph has Asperger's /ADHD/ASD, he has problems at school, in reception year the Early Years Inclusion Service were involved. This year (Y1) is proving difficult, his behaviour problems have increased, school got an Educational Psychologist to see him. She did some IQ type tests on him and wrote a report for school. I met with the Ed Psych, class teacher and senco today and the Ed Psych thinks we should go for statementing. The SENCO said - "can we still do that ?"- the Ed Psych said there is additional funding attached to statements for exceptional cases. Exceptional cases are not defined. Due to Raph's difficult background, he has many experiences in common with a "looked after child" (i.e. one in foster care). Such children are given priority in our area and he may get statemented.

 

The Ed Psych said the SENCO should fill in MPA1 for statementing. This requests a Multiprofessional Assessment. The issues she should include on it are Behaviour Problems, Disruptiveness, Aspects of Social Communication. A request takes 6 weeks. I can speed up the process by writing to the SEN Dept of the Children and Young People's Service, our local council, and asking for a multiprofessional assessment of our child.

 

Initially I was told we would need to go to a specialist centre which is an annexe of the Children's Hospital known as Ryegate. But as I have already got a series of appointments with CAMHS for assessments, the two specialists at CAMHS can do those assessments in house. ie they can assess for a social communication disorder.

 

Is all this correct? Can you see any possible pitfalls that I can pre empt?

 

If the Educational Psychologist thinks he should be statemented who else needs to be convinced?

 

I see so many of you that have problems with the system that the meeting seemed too good to be true.

 

#Thanks, if you have read this far!

 

[fallgyrl]

Hi Peaches

 

I think if you have the support of the Ed Psych then its one less hurdle. I really dont think we would have had a statement without such support as it directly influences school and LEA making the battle so much easier. As for a statement for 'exceptional cases' its my understanding that this means exceptional needs, i.e. cant be met by lesser non statemented funding such as ESAP. That being the case, diagnosis, or even childs background should not make a difference. Given that your Ed Psych has recommended the school to go for a statement (just as ours did), I would hope that they think you have every chance of succeeding.

 

Good luck and hopefully it wont be too much of a bumpy ride

Vicky

[Karen A]

Hi peaches.I will explain our situation briefly as Ben was in a very similar situation to Ralph and so I know a bit about the process.

When Ben was little I experienced serious mental health problems .

When he was seven school picked up that he was having difficulties.

Ben was then assessed by CAMHS and had a Statutary assessment which included input from EP,School,SALT and OT.

In our case even though the specialist SALT thought AS on the basis of an ADOS ,the CAMHS consultant had the final word.

Ben was diagnosed with dyspraxia and Social Communication Difficulties 3 years ago.

He has had excellent support from CAMHS which includes weekly individual psychotherapy fot two years.

OH and myself have weekly psychotherapy also.But Ben still has full time support in school and support from ASD outreach.

A couple of months ago the CAMHS team suggested that Ben have a 3di because he wanted to know whether he has AS.It turns out that he does have AS after all.

Basically I would think on the basis of what you have said here and in the other post CAMHS will want to do a full Assessment to rule out other factors as part of the assessment for ASD.

Where there are possible factors such as early childhood difficult experiences it is a very complicated process indeed.The fact that your family situation is so complicated makes it extremely important that all of the professionals have input but especially CAMHS.

Educational Psychologists do not have the level of training in children's Mental Health that CAMHS psychiartists do .So they may not pick up on early childhood factors such as the impact of Postnatal Depression or other difficulties on a mum's ability to cope.

It is a very personal view and I am sure some people on the Forum will take strong issue with me.....but is based on experience.

An AS Dx is only the best one if it is right.A premature AS Dx could lead to the loss of support that might help.

The last three years have been very tough but I do not regret for one moment all the work we have done in psychotherapy.

The professionals still cannot really agree on the Dx even now...but one thing is for certain Ben has made much more progress than had he not had the supprt which he would not have had in most parts of country with an AS Dx.

 

So basically after all that waffle.It is important to get the multi-professional assessment done,the CAMHS assessments done and keep the Statutary Assessment process on track alongside each other if you can cope. <'> <'>

It is very likely indeed from what you have said in the other thread that Social Services will need to submitt input for the Statutary Assessment too.

I worked out last week that we have worked with over 30 professionals in three years.We only have ourselves and one of our boys with a complex history.

So if I have any other wisdom it would be ask for a named professional ASAP to coordinate all the work and take care of youreslves.

In our experience it is a marathon not a sprint.Professionals can be very keen to get things done to time but it is worthwhile looking at what you as a family can manage. <'> <'>

 

I have spent the last couple of weeks mulling over our experiences in the last three years wondering what to do with all of the things I know. <'>

Young Minds have a very good help-line too if you feel it would help to talk to somone about some of the issues.

They will arrange for a professional to phone you back if needed.Karen.

[Karen A]

Hi again.I missed something.If the EP is saying that there is evidence that a difficult background and having things in common with foster children could lead to a Statement on exceptional ground as a priority then don't disagree.....regardless of the eventual diagnosis the Statement is worth having.Children can have a Statement where it is needed for Mental Health needs or EBD.In our case the AS Dx has not been added yet.

Following the ''Every Child Matters '' agenda all parties have a responsibilty to ensure that appropriate provision is in place for children considered to be in need.Also if Ralph is considered to be in kinship foster care with you he may be considered to be a child ''looked after''.In that case it is worth pushing for consideration as a priority.Karen.

Edited November 7, 2008 by Karen A

[Karen A]

Another thing....there is nothing to stop you writing to request a Statutary Assessment yourself.If school and the EP are supportive it may be quicker than waiting six weeks .I will find the draft letter for you on IPSEA Website.Karen.

[Karen A]

http://www.ipsea.org.uk/sevenfixes.htm#RequestingAssessment

This is the ipsea website.

[chris54]

Hi

First I would start by saying that the procedures differs from place to place.

 

A "child in care" gets priority over and additional funds than the norm. Have a look on your councils web site about this.

 

If the EP says go for statement then go for it.

 

I think what SENCO is probably thinking of is the policy to give more general support (Cash) to schools for SA+ and have less Statemented children. This may be OK for children with only small additional need BUT.

 

My own situation is that class teacher and SENCO are desperately trying to give the support my son needs under SA+, and are desperate to go for statement with full support of SP, But as he has only been at the school from September they are still getting all the evidence together before applying which should be end of year.We fully support the school in this.

Edited November 7, 2008 by chris54

[Kazzen161]

You should definitely go for the Statement - but do the request yourself, as parents have more power than schools to chase the LA.

[peaches]

Thanks everyone.

 

I have written to the local authority to request a multiprofessional assessment.

 

Now, what does multiprofessional mean?

 

Many different doctors or many different disciplines involved?

[Karen A]

Thanks everyone.

 

I have written to the local authority to request a multiprofessional assessment.

 

Now, what does multiprofessional mean?

 

Many different doctors or many different disciplines involved?

 

Hi.I think a mutiprofessional assesment should include all of the professionals involved and any that need to be involved but have not been yet.

In our case....[ben has dyspraxia,AS,mental health needs]...Psychiatrist and other CAMHS professionals,OT,speech therapist,educational psychologist,school input [sENCO and teacher].A paediatrician might also be involved.In our case Social Services were not involved because the Consultant psychiatrist was able to establish that there was no need and we were not know to them.If they are involved with a family they will have input too.

It might be worth thinking about writing to request a Statutary Assessment too as I mentioned above.The Statutary Assessment is a different process that can run alongside the multiprofessional asseesment.Statutary Assessment is the only process for obtaining a Statement of SEN.A multi-professional assessment does not replace it.I know it is very complicated.Karen.

Edited November 9, 2008 by Karen A

[peaches]

Oh, no! Have I asked for the wrong thing? I asked for multiprofessional assessment, but did it thinking it was for the statementing process. This is what I was told to do at the meeting with the Ed Psych. Has the Ed Psych got this wrong then? Should I write another letter?

 

By the way, I have no idea what SALT is.

Edited November 9, 2008 by peaches

[Karen A]

Oh, no! Have I asked for the wrong thing? I asked for multiprofessional assessment, but did it thinking it was for the statementing process. This is what I was told to do at the meeting with the Ed Psych. Has the Ed Psych got this wrong then? Should I write another letter?

 

By the way, I have no idea what SALT is.

 

Hi again.SALT is the speech therapist.A speech therapist will probably need to do an assessment of Social Communication Skills as part of an assessment for ASD .However CAMHS may well do an initial psychiatric general assesssment first and then request a SALT assessment if they need one.

I think that the Multiprofessional assessment is more likely to be related to either part of the process for ''Every child Matters '' or part of diagnostic assessment.In my area I think sometimes they do the diagnostic assessments first and then decide whether to request a Statutary Assessment of SEN.

However this could result in a long delay in getting Statutary Assessment under way.If things at school are very difficult it may be worth pushing to do the multi-professional assessment and Statutary Assessment alongside each other....that is what we did.

Personally I would be enclined to phone the Ed Psych and ask for clarification.Do go ahead with the multiprofessional assessment because you will need it anyway but consider writing to the local Authority Children's Services [education SEN section .....probably I think...ask the Ed Psych for a name] to request for a Statutary Assessment yourself too.

It may be that in your area they now have a system in place to co-ordinate mult-professional assessment and Statutary Assessment but it would be a new thing if it is the case.

There have been lots of changes this year.It is worth making sure that the Statutary Assessment has not been forgotten.Karen.

 

[peaches]

Thanks Karen. The local authority have written back and in their lengthy letter they refer to Statutory Assessment many times but not once is multiprofessional mentioned, so I guess we are in for a Statutory one.

 

Apparently I need to submit written evidence as to why he should or should not be assessed. Ive asked the senco for help in what to put, because I presumably have to say, school are doing this and it isnt enough.

[Karen A]

Hi.That is good news re the Statutary Assessment.

 

I think basics to include in your written evidence...

This is what the child's needs are as you see them.....

This is what the school have done already...

An argument regarding why support and input that is needed is more than school can provide from the recources provided already.

An argument regarding impact on the child and family of help not being adequate.

The difficult part is to word the letter in such a way that the panel do not just refuse to assess on the grounds that school have not done enough to sort the issues out.

I do not know how much you know about the system.The panel first has to decide that there is a good enough reason to do an assessment.Lots of cases get turned down at that stage.

It would be worth enlisting the support of any professionals who know the family and asking them to support Statutary Assessment.

Parent Partnership may be able and willing to help.They are the department who support parents with SEN issues.Unfortunately how good and independent they are does vary.

It is hopeful that the EP is saying Statutary Assessment is needed though.

Regarding the multiprofessional assessment it may be that that is in the pipeline too but it may well be being handled by somone other than education.For example CAMHS or child development team or a paediatrician or a group of professionals will still need to do medical assessments etc if they are thinking about a possible Dx.

I know it is very complicated.I Karen.

[Karen A]

http://www.nas.org.uk/nas/jsp/polopoly.jsp?d=1763&a=3232

This may be helpful.See ''considering request for Statutary Assessment''.

[NobbyNobbs]

one piece of advice from experience with our ASD foster kid. the linking to looked after children is a double-edged thing. it will help get things through faster BUT... they may use it as an excuse for passing off his behaviours as linked to his life experiences rather than an ASD that needs specific educational support rather than behavioural support. we couldn't get a diagnosis for N for 2 years because SS (who would be the ones to refer to camhs for assessment in her case) insisted that it was just behaviour problems from her neglect and abuse. obviously you're not dealing with SS but be aware that it might be an issue and dont let them get away with it!

even now camhs wont give a diagnosis to N beyond ' definitely an ASD probably AS' because they can't work out what bits are from that and what bits are from the trauma. she gets no educational support.

[peaches]

one piece of advice from experience with our ASD foster kid. the linking to looked after children is a double-edged thing. it will help get things through faster BUT... they may use it as an excuse for passing off his behaviours as linked to his life experiences rather than an ASD that needs specific educational support rather than behavioural support. we couldn't get a diagnosis for N for 2 years because SS (who would be the ones to refer to camhs for assessment in her case) insisted that it was just behaviour problems from her neglect and abuse. obviously you're not dealing with SS but be aware that it might be an issue and dont let them get away with it!

even now camhs wont give a diagnosis to N beyond ' definitely an ASD probably AS' because they can't work out what bits are from that and what bits are from the trauma. she gets no educational support.

 

Thought this might be the case. Will keep at 'em.