Help???Where do we go from here-not happy with school!!!

[sarah2003]

Hi,

 

I posted on here a couple of weeks ago with regards to my dd who had been seen by our Paed who is treating her for her ADHD-and we discussed alot of her "odd" behaviours and her social skills and lack of friends etc-the paed went through several questions with us on a questionaire and said that dd was on the Austistic Spectrum and had Aspergers.

I have been today to the OT with DD and asked for the report to take to the GP and on reading this-all the way through the Paed mentions all the difficulties etc dd is having-then in the last paragraph says she had a phone call with her teacher at school(who is a part time teacher and only does 2 days a week-in a class of 30) and now due to the teacher saying she is "OK" at school-does need help socialising but once she has had the encouragement and help to do so-she is ok-that the Paed now says that due to her converstaion with the teacher she doesn't think she has Aspergers?????

I find this very odd-we as her parents spend allot more time with this very difficult little girl who has some strange ways that really do impact on her everyday life see these problems and yet her teacher can say what she has said and all of a sudden the problem no longer exsists???

My dd is adopted with siblings who all have similar problems so this is our concern as well.

My concerns are that school are not wanting to have to provide any further help (she is already on SA+) and I have told the SENCO that I would be thinking of applying for a statement-as it really concerns me that we need to get things in place-she is behind both acedemically and emotionally and socially-and now it makes me think that school might just be saying this to get out of anything???

 

What do you advise me to do-where do I go from here?

 

Thanks,

S

x

 

 

[chris54]

Am I right that the pediatrician pronounced that you daughter had Aspergers after some questions at the end of an appointment for something else. It could be that she realized that they were a bit hasty in making the diagnosis and has now backtracked a bit. A diagnosis for ASD is usually done with input from a team of people.

 

I don't know how thing are done where you live but am a bit confuse as to why you go to OT to get report done by Pediatrician to take to GP.

 

Pediatrician should have sent a copy of any report they did to you, to GP and any one else concerned with your daughter.

 

In the area where my so was diagnosed it was a Clinical Psychologist who did the final diagnosis along with a 12 page report..

 

This has stood the test of time and has been accepted without question by all others now involved with my son.

 

I was going to write a lot more but I have just been asked by son to go and play outside with him so I'm off.

[Sally44]

Teachers are not qualified to assess for an ASD, although their advice and experience of a child will be sought.

If I were you I would be asking for a multi disciplinary team assessment by professionals who have experience and expertise in diagnosing ASDs. It maybe that you have already seen some of those professionals. Usually they all do at least two appointments and observe the child in clinic and school or at home as well. Has she been seen by a Speech and Language Therapist, because they are the professional responsible for social interaction and play skills. If not then ask for her to be referred. School should have done this if she is on SA+.

As she now has IEPs, I would recommend you contact your local Parent Partnership at the LEA and have them come to all IEP meetings or any other meetings regarding your daughter. They can make sure the IEP targets are SMART and are identifying her needs and that school are recording any progress or lack of progress and are getting input from outside professionals.

I would also get some advice from the National Autistic Society through their helplines and also contact IPSEA.

If it were me I would want all her social interaction and language and play skills assessed and I would want to know what the 'base line' of ability was and I would want to know if that was considered 'ASD'. I think you should ask school or the paediatrician for a referal to a SALT who has experience in speech disorders and ASDs including Aspergers.

I would also want her social interaction and play skill needs to be supported in school and for there to be social and play skill targets on her IEP (or MEP - multi educational plan).

You can politely write to the paediatrician and disagree to the information the teacher has given out. Afterall you have known her for longer and spend more time with her. But what all of you need is 'evidence' from professionals rather than a teachers opinion. Although it does count for something, so does your opinion as well.

So start writing letters and getting responses in writing as well. You have to start documenting what is happening and what you are saying about your child's difficulties and what school and outside professionals are or are not doing.

You can google the DSM IV criteria for autism and aspergers and you can itemise her difficulties and how you think they are part of Aspergers.

[MOSEY]

I'm imagining that you are from England which means my advice might not be as applicable as it would in Scotland where I live and teach, but this is what I'd do in your situation. I'd request a meeting with the head reponsible for your child's welfare. I'd then go on to ask for a meeting to be arranged with the educational psychologist linked to your school for an exploratory assessment. You should then be invited to a meeting where you can outline all of your concerns and allow them to assess whether further investigation be necessary. This is a separate service to your GP and will involve the school - you can pursue the issue based on how it is imacting upon dd's sleep, anxiety, behaviours which in turn, may affect how she feels about an performs in school, even if it is not immediately apparent in the classroom.

 

Some of your DD's behaviour could also be associated with attachment issues stemming from her early years which often present similarly to ASD, although I'm sure you'll know this already, so please forgive me if I sound patronising. A good educational psychologist should be able to assess what further investigations should be pursued. They may then decide to refer you on for further clinical assessment and their referral should carry more weight than a self referral.

 

I'd also pursue support from the social workers involved in the adoption process for your child/ren to request information about the l;ikelihood of early attachment disorders.

 

I teach a lovely but difficult kid at school who was presented for assessment for ASD and his issues have now been formally identified as attachment issues stemming from his babyhood. Help is now in place for him and he is coping really well now - his parents feel much more positive.

 

I hope this helps and doesn't confuse more due to differences in regional approaches!

Edited July 3, 2009 by MOSEY

[sarah2003]

Thanks so much for your reply-yes we are in England.

I am meeting with the SENCO this week anyway for a routine app that I have with her every 4-6 weeks just to see how dd is getting on.

She has been seen by every professional going-Ed Psyc, Clin Psyc, OT, Paed and the only one we've never been referred to is the SALT.

I am aware that some of her behaviour could be due to attachment issues but I just find it so hard to think that her teacher can say something over the phone to the Paed and all of a sudden the whole diagnosis of ASD is no longer the case-after a lengthly conversation with the Paed who said she def had it.

When she is at school she is medicated for her ADHD and if she is anything like she is at home when she has had her medication-she is quite, and just keeps herself to herself-not impulsive and silly as she is when the meds wear off-so yes the teacher has seen her confidence improve through the year as she has started on Meds in Jan and this has been increased x3 over the past 6 months.

 

Oh I just don't know where to go from here-I'm thinking I need to speak to the Paed again and see whether we can get her properly assessed for ASD-as I just don't want these things being left-she is 9 this year and has the behaviour of a 5 year old most of the time-and ticks all the boxes of ASD.

 

Thanks again,

S

 

 

 

I'm imagining that you are from England which means my advice might not be as applicable as it would in Scotland where I live and teach, but this is what I'd do in your situation. I'd request a meeting with the head reponsible for your child's welfare. I'd then go on to ask for a meeting to be arranged with the educational psychologist linked to your school for an exploratory assessment. You should then be invited to a meeting where you can outline all of your concerns and allow them to assess whether further investigation be necessary. This is a separate service to your GP and will involve the school - you can pursue the issue based on how it is imacting upon dd's sleep, anxiety, behaviours which in turn, may affect how she feels about an performs in school, even if it is not immediately apparent in the classroom.

 

Some of your DD's behaviour could also be associated with attachment issues stemming from her early years which often present similarly to ASD, although I'm sure you'll know this already, so please forgive me if I sound patronising. A good educational psychologist should be able to assess what further investigations should be pursued. They may then decide to refer you on for further clinical assessment and their referral should carry more weight than a self referral.

 

I'd also pursue support from the social workers involved in the adoption process for your child/ren to request information about the l;ikelihood of early attachment disorders.

 

I teach a lovely but difficult kid at school who was presented for assessment for ASD and his issues have now been formally identified as attachment issues stemming from his babyhood. Help is now in place for him and he is coping really well now - his parents feel much more positive.

 

I hope this helps and doesn't confuse more due to differences in regional approaches!

 

[sarah2003]

Thanks so much Sally for your replies-you are so full of knowledge!!!!

I have decided I need to discuss this with the Paed this week-as I cannot believe that her teacher can have a 5 min conversation with the Paed and all of a sudden everything we have said/discussed with Paed is out the window!!!!!

I will also contact the NAS this week and seek their advice.

And I have been in contact with PP and will email her with the latest.....she has been fab with lots of help and advice.

DD has been seen by every professional going-all except SALT!!!!

 

Oh I just feel I have such a fight on my hands.................

 

Thanks,

S

 

 

Teachers are not qualified to assess for an ASD, although their advice and experience of a child will be sought.

If I were you I would be asking for a multi disciplinary team assessment by professionals who have experience and expertise in diagnosing ASDs. It maybe that you have already seen some of those professionals. Usually they all do at least two appointments and observe the child in clinic and school or at home as well. Has she been seen by a Speech and Language Therapist, because they are the professional responsible for social interaction and play skills. If not then ask for her to be referred. School should have done this if she is on SA+.

As she now has IEPs, I would recommend you contact your local Parent Partnership at the LEA and have them come to all IEP meetings or any other meetings regarding your daughter. They can make sure the IEP targets are SMART and are identifying her needs and that school are recording any progress or lack of progress and are getting input from outside professionals.

I would also get some advice from the National Autistic Society through their helplines and also contact IPSEA.

If it were me I would want all her social interaction and language and play skills assessed and I would want to know what the 'base line' of ability was and I would want to know if that was considered 'ASD'. I think you should ask school or the paediatrician for a referal to a SALT who has experience in speech disorders and ASDs including Aspergers.

I would also want her social interaction and play skill needs to be supported in school and for there to be social and play skill targets on her IEP (or MEP - multi educational plan).

You can politely write to the paediatrician and disagree to the information the teacher has given out. Afterall you have known her for longer and spend more time with her. But what all of you need is 'evidence' from professionals rather than a teachers opinion. Although it does count for something, so does your opinion as well.

So start writing letters and getting responses in writing as well. You have to start documenting what is happening and what you are saying about your child's difficulties and what school and outside professionals are or are not doing.

You can google the DSM IV criteria for autism and aspergers and you can itemise her difficulties and how you think they are part of Aspergers.

 

[MOSEY]

I hope things work out for you, Sarah. It's so frustrating having to battle for basic rights for our kids. Teachers opinions should only be taken into account, never seen as the be all and end all of things which is why you have a right to see your ed psych who will be far better placed to suggest an assessment. Best of luck to you! Mo

[Sally44]

It can be very confusing, and it did take me a while to understand that there are two pathways ie. through education and through the NHS. Both should be working together, but often they don't. Most areas do have a 'centre', usually under the NHS were they have experience of diagnosing ADHD/ASD etc. Their diagnosis tends to hold more weight than through Education. For example my son was seen by a Clinical Psychologist (NHS), and Educational Psychologist (Education). And Different pathways have different onward referring options, and I am not familiar with all of them.

 

I did find it helpful to actually write down a 'tree' with branches to help me remember who did what. Your local Parent Partnership can also give you advice on the 'systems'. And the NAS and IPSEA are also good places to get information.

 

But whatever her difficulties they do need to be assessed to rule anything in or out. If there is the possibility of attachment disorder then that needs to be looked at. But I also think a SALT can rule in or out any speech or communication disorder or play and interaction skills that are weak or missing due to an ASD. And unless you know which one it is, or even if it is both, then any supports or therapies might be the wrong ones if they haven't correctly identified the 'cause'.

 

In my own case, I did find that I had to do alot of reading up and researching myself to actually put the questions in writing to professionals to get them to do what they should be doing. There are many completely different difficulties that can give the same or similar response. For example a speech disorder, auditory processing disorder, sensory integration disorder, can often have similar responses, but you need to identify if the child needs speech therapy or visual reinforcing or changes in the environment to improve the response or behaviour. But it is getting the professionals to do the assessments that I found the hardest.