Is autism a 'learning difficulty'?

[BusyLizzie100]

Got a feeling this may open up a can of worms, so I'll get my views in fast!

 

When ds2 was dx at 41/2 (he's now 61/2), the diagnostic team said ASD and also possibly additional learning difficulties. They weren't able to be definite on the learning difficulties because they couldn't get an accurate reading of his cognitive skills on that day (he got so far then he'd had enough), and suggested it would be an appropriate thing to do when he's seven.

 

But when I discussed this with ds2's nursery teacher, she dismissed the idea of additional learning difficulties, saying 'well, autism is a learning difficulty anyway.' I disagreed with her, mainly because the dx team had been so clear in suggesting potential learning difficulties as a 'something else', but two years later I've got more of an opinion and wondered what others think.

 

I think autism is a 'learning difference' rather than a learning difficulty. Autism may make learning difficult, but 'learning difficulty' implies so much more, especially when you take into account Specific Learning Difficulties such as dyslexia, dyscalcula (sp?) etc.

 

Some people might argue that autistic learning is better suited to some things, such as computers/maths etc, more so than NT learning is, yet that same autistic style of learning can make accessing other subjects or areas really difficult - and that's what often leads to the typical uneven profile of many autistic children, ie they can be pretty good (or brilliant) at some things and really struggle with (or find impossible) other things.

 

At 61/2, ds2 is reading brilliantly (letters and the alphabet are his thing), yet his comprehension and inference, ie working out what is happening or what may happen, are very poor. His numeracy is very poor - he can count etc, but using the numbers and numeracy concepts just sail over his head.

 

So what do you think??

 

Lizzie

[phasmid]

I think you're spot on, I like that desrciption: Autism is a 'learning difference' rather than a learning difficulty.

 

I think sums it up very nicely indeed!

[Bullet]

Yes, I'd agree with it being a learning difference. Tom is very bright in the way he'll study things to see how they work and they way he'll work out how to do peg puzzles and the way he can read numbers - written down and some letters. But because his understanding of language is so poor many people make the mistake of thinking he's just a bit slow.

[gladysmay]

yes agree, learning difference suits my understanding also, brings me back to why the college offered another level one course to my son once they tested his numeracy skills.

[Flora]

me too! That's not to say that children with autism can't have learning difficulties aswell, my youngest has complex learning difficulties but William hasn't. However, another question to add, does it have anything to do with the difference between AS and HFA??

 

Lauren

[Zemanski]

It is more common for HFA kids to have additional learning difficulties but not necessary so it isn't a difference between the two in diagnostic terms.

 

I agree that autism is a learning difference but I also think that it does imply a learning difficulty; a social learning difficulty rather than an intellectual learning difficulty.

 

AS people are not considered to have a learning difficulty unless there is a comorbid one, in fact it is one of the main reasons that adults get so little support - there are 2 main services for support for adults, the mental health services and the learning disability services.

Neither sees AS as its responsibility; mental health because it is not a psychological disorder but a neurologically based disability so they say learning disability services should take responsibility even when a person has comorbid mental health problems but they in turn say that AS is not a learning disability.

 

I think that if social learning difficulties were recognised, as they are in New Zealand, then adults would have more chance of getting support.

 

Zemanski

[lynyona]

I agree with what everyone as said. Kieran was statemented with learning disabilities at 9 and it was only when he was 16 i questioned that has there had to be more than the learning disabilities.he was dx ASD a month before his 18th birthday.

[TheNeil]

I was getting all ready to go ballsitic but I think you've nailed it with 'learning difference[/]' - a big difference to 'learning difficulties'. I like to think that it's just a different way of understanding and viewing the world and this, naturally, extends to how receptive ASD people (both adults and children) are to teaching and 'learning'

[sarahjane]

I agree H has as but also has learning difficulties in that he is dyslexic, although there is a link between the two they affect him in different ways. H is quite severly dyslexic whereas most children with as aren't and some are v advanced in reading and writing. I thing it is important to try and distinguish between different diagnosis even if linked because they will require different interventions to help.

[jb1964]

Hi,

 

I can also agree that my daughter definitely has a 'learning difference' rather than 'learning difficulties'. In many subjects she struggles with the way a teacher may approach it/concepts etc - and providing you specifically explain in a certain way she will pick things up almost immediately - but even though I know more than most what makes her tick I still get it wrong - so I can understand it would be difficult for a teacher to know how to approach it without causing her anxieties.

 

Unfortunately, because mainstream schools are not well equipped to deal with children on the spectrum and their 'differences' - she is therefore definitely having 'difficulties in learning' through the normal teaching process because of this (if that makes sense).

 

Take care,

Jb

 

Personally I couldn't care less which way round its said - just as long as the education process helped and understood her better.

[BusyLizzie100]

Thanks, guys, for your replies.

 

The Neil and JB, that is exactly how I feel. Like you, the words just need to be appropriate, but itwas ds2's nursery teacher's blanket approach to the phrase 'learning difficulty' that disturbed me. I wondered if most teachers see autism as a learning difficulty rather than a difference.

 

My ds1 is struggling more and more with the style of learning that he is expected to use at school (he is dx Asperger's). He says he hates school because he 'knows it all already' (well, he is very bright and very knowledgeable) and hates having to learn everything a different way.

 

And I can see ds2 just switching off as demands at school increase, ie as he moves up through the years. And that's with Statemented support. Makes you think, doesn't it.

 

Lizzie

[TheNeil]

My ds1 is struggling more and more with the style of learning that he is expected to use at school (he is dx Asperger's). He says he hates school because he 'knows it all already' (well, he is very bright and very knowledgeable) and hates having to learn everything a different way.

 

I don't know what to suggest on this one as I don't have kids and it's a long time since I went through school (and ASDs didn't 'exist' back then (if you know what I mean) so I was just 'the bright but quiet kid'). I always found it frustrating that things that were/are 'obvious' seemed to be trawled over so slowly (I almost felt as though it was to let everyone else 'catch up' - that sounds bigheaded but believe me, it's not meant to). With me I seem to remember that life got a bit better after deciding which subjects to study in the third year of secondary school (don't ask me what that is in 'modern' terms - year 11? 12? I dunno) as I could drop a lot of things that didn't interest me and focus on those that did (generally - I still wonder how the heck chemistry works even 15 years later). Are there any subjects that he really enjoys? Could you try to channel him down those routes?

 

Sadly schools have changed lot since I was there but I think that the key is to find that spark that ignites him - whether it's pushing him to learn new things or look at what he does know in a different light (i.e. learn it the 'boring' way). Of course how you do that I don't know (the only idea I can come up with is to have some 'expert' (real or not but certainly someone from outside his usual circle of people) in his preferred subject have an informal 'chat' and try to open his eyes a little, expand his horizons and maybe make him feel a bit special (in a positive way) - you know "Keep studying at this and you can become a world expert but to do that you've got to know it inside and out and, sadly, that means we sometimes have to do it the 'dull' way just so that we don't leave everyone else behind"). Or I could be talking rubbish, I don't know

[BusyLizzie100]

Thank you so much for that, TheNeil. What you have said is really helpful. I love the idea of making my son feel special in a positive way - I do try , but I don't feel I've got it right in a big way yet. Part of the issue is that he doesn't understand yet. In some ways he is so grown up and clever but in others he is still very immature, emotionally mainly, so any kind of discussion along these lines is met with shrieks and tantrums.

 

Interestingly, TheNeil, you say you were known as the 'bright but quiet kid'- I think my son's probably the 'bright and noisy kid'! He doesn't quite know how it all fits together, so he tends to overdo things like socialising and 'joining in' until he cracks, gets upsets and withdraws in tears. If the teacher raises her voice, he's convinced that he's being told off.

 

I think it's a great idea to get him involved with someone outside his regular circle - I just need to get him motivated!

 

As for ds2, he has his own agenda so is even more unlikely to 'adapt'. He can't even tell me that he hates school, despite talking well - he just can't use the right words to communicate - but he usually makes it obvious by hitting me as he steps out of the classroom door at school pick-up time!

[darky]

i agree that its more a learning difference. many of these children just need the right aproach and in some cases it can be a learning ability rather than a difficulty. the problem lays in how they are taught, not how they learn. in my opinion.

[TheNeil]

I think it's a great idea to get him involved with someone outside his regular circle - I just need to get him motivated!

 

It sounds a bit weird but if your mum or your dad tells you something then you just kind of switch off (well I always did) - that's no reflection on parents but is kind of how kids see their parents (i.e. deeply uncool) and if mum/dad does something then it's just 'normal' (even if it is isn't - to kids 'special' quickly becomes 'normal' if it's what they encounter every day). If a teacher tells you something then you tend to either rail against them or just ignore them (or was it just me). If it's someone 'outside' of his little world though then it could be that he sees a mentor figure or someone who, if you like, really speaks from experience. It's a bit like meeting God I suppose (don't worry, this doesn't get religious)

 

"This 'expert' has taken time out to speak to me and he/she must think I'm worth talking to". The 'expert' doesn't even need to be an expert (although it probably helps) - the fact that, if you like, an 'adult' who (supposedly) hasn't been aware that I have a problem is paying attention and talking to them at an adult level can do wonders in getting someone motivated. Can you imagine the buzz kids would get from meeting a racing driver? Or an astronaut? Or anybody who's actually done something...big! Sorry, probably showing my age now

 

If my parents had organised for me to go somewhere/join a group then I would probably have freaked out so you might find that just a one off chat is enough to get him motivated (or even just knowing that there are people/groups out there). Now that my sieve of a memory has kicked in I can remember that my dad did once get me the phone number of one of the UK's leading Artificial Intelligence experts (I was into that kind of thing at the time) and we did actually talk for a few minutes - inspired me no end. This was kind of how my parents worked - if I showed an interest in something then they'd encourage me but never pressure me

 

Glad to help BTW

[LizK]

Very interesting post Have enjoyed reading it!

 

I was asked last week when filling ina questionaire about DS whether he had a learning difficulty. I said no, then 'I'm not sure'. He doesn't have a global learning difficulty and his IQ as much as we can tell falls within normal limits which seems to be the medical definition of a learning difficulty but he does have some specific difficulties in learning. I like your suggestion of having a learning difference as I think that describes him very well in many ways. For example he is struggling to learn to read phonectically but doing very well learning by sight, it's just a different way and fortunately his school understand this. His ways of tackling problems and puzzles can be quite novel or he will approach it from a different viewpoint which is refeshing. However I do think he does have some specific difficulties learning mainly socially as Zemanski's reply illustrated. He also has a receptive speech delay and difficulties with auditory processing which impacts on his ability to learn and things take longer

 

I think about 30% of autistic children have an associated global learning difficulty in addition to their autism

 

Lx