Does having been referred to outside specialists

[Mother in Need]

My youngest (9, NT) is dyslexic, but also very bright. As is so common, his high level of intelligence masks his inability to spell anything but the most simple of words somehow, and it has taken me till he is year 5 for a teacher to listen and take a test (last Sep). There was great cause for concern in the test (but they hadn't noticed that without that stupid test) and he has since been referred to the Dyslexia Advisory Teacher and also to SALT, for speech problems that they 'suddenly' picked up on.

 

Having approached the school repeatedly as to what is done for him meanwhile, the answer is and remains: NOTHING as he is not behind in any subject and even in his spelling not as far beind as their tables say he has to be, for action to be taken; the fact that he is not reaching the levels he could reach and that his self esteem is greatly affected, is seen as totally irrelevant.

 

My question is: shouldn't he at least be on School Action or School Action Plus as he has been referred to those two services? And if so, shouldn't he at least have an IEP? The teacher has no clue and it seems neither does the SENCO........they simply say no, they don't have to do anything till they have received some advice.......they should have the basic knowledge to do this surely?

 

Must he be on SA or SA+ or can these referrals be done without? The SEN Code leaves me confused, 5:54 seems to say that they can act as consultants without being on SA/SA+ (that's how I read it anyway), but 5:55 seems to say yes.

[KarenT]

I'v been told that a child recognised as having Special Needs will first be on the register at School Action. At that point, known school based strategies will be used to provide additional support outside the norm.

 

Should this fail to make improvements, outside help will be sought from specialists in that Special Need (autism, dyslexia etc) to advise staff on how best to work with the child. This is when the status changes to School Action plus.

 

It's common for a child's status to fluctuate between these two labels depending on what help is being provided from outside school. There doesn't actually have to be a physical presence to justify SA+, but there does have to be a specialist on hand with the child on their caseload. If, for example, the Behaviour Support team are called in to assess the status will go to SA+, but if they find (as in our case) that their involvement is not necessary and no further action will be taken, the status will go back to SA. Then if another expert is called in it will go back to SA+ while they are involved with the child and on and on.

 

Statements should only be needed in the extreme cases when a child's needs can't be met at SA+, and ideally (if the system is working - ha!) SA+ should work for most cases.

 

HTH

 

Karen

x

[Mother in Need]

Thanks Karen. My confusion is that I am not even sure whether he is officially on SA or SA+, as he has never ever had any help, nor have things been done differently for him, and he even gets told off for his spelling constantly during literacy lessons.....

 

I have a meeting with the school about this on Tuesday, and would obviously like to know how far I can push them with the law, the Code etc. He has not got an IEP either, and his teacher keeps saying that 1) he doesn't need to have one because he is not 3 years behind, and 2) he hasn't got a clue what to put in it anyway as he hasn't got a clue how he could help my son, at least not till he has had some advice (which will take at least another month)....

 

Can they refer a child without that child being on their SEN register (SA or SA+)?????

Edited January 12, 2007 by Mother in Need

[pumpkinpie]

I would say he should be on school action plus - because that is when school has to bring in outside specialists.

In our school prospectus we list the various stages of support, it also to be found in the disability policy - have you got a copy of it, if not ask?

All school are required under the disability discrimination act to have a disability equality plan(in primary schol it becomes mandatory at the end of the year) Part of this requires schools to demonstrate how they liase with stateholder(parents and children) with disabilities and bring this into school plannnig etc.

 

Look it up on the internet I wonder what your school are doing?

[Mother in Need]

The answer to that, I think, is: not a lot. The problem here as well is that this son in question, is not disabled like my son with AS, yes he has health problems and is dyslexic (though I don't know if they would formally say that, they have only said that there is cause for concern), but disability stuff won't come into it.

 

Their web presence is minimal/pathetic, and I can't ask them at the moment as he is refusing to go to school due to bullying that they are not addressing in an effective manner, and I have told them I will keep him off school till the matter is sorted. I have sent an official letter to school AND the chair of governors about this, but (as before) have not had any response. I would really like to send him to a different school but apart from being somewhat impractical, it has taken me 2 years for them to recognise his dyslexia and refer him, and I don't want to lose all that............

 

To get back to my original query, if he indeed should be on SA+ or at least SA, then he should have an IEP and some sort of help with his spelling, whether he is 3 years behind or 2 ahead as he is in all his other subjects. Am I right in this? And what official rules back this up?

[Karen A]

Hi I am not sure what the Code of practice says re how far behind a child needs to be before they can access support.However I wanted to say it is possible to access support even if your child is not significantly behind.We applied for a Statement for Ben last year.We were able to show that he is very bright but was significantly failing to reach his potential due to DCD.He is now working at the level of the top group in his class with Support.I just wanted to let you know that it may not happen very often but it can be done.Ruth Kelly does not feel it is appropriate to wait while her child gets further and further behind-and the Government support her. Karen

[Karen A]

Hi I wanted to add that I am sure an IEP should be in place at School Action not just School Action Plus.If you request an Assessment later the School will need to demonstate what has been done at School Action and Action Plus.If they cannot provide evidence the LEA may refuse to do the Assessment and delay everything until input can be demonstrated.A child does not have to be having support at School Action if they are reffered to Eg SALT.Ben had speach therapy to help with a stammer but did not at that stage have any school SEN input because the stammer did not impact his learning.However in your case the school should have an IEP in place for the reasons I have stated previously.Karen.

[Kathryn]

He has not got an IEP either, and his teacher keeps saying that 1) he doesn't need to have one because he is not 3 years behind, and 2) he hasn't got a clue what to put in it anyway as he hasn't got a clue how he could help my son, at least not till he has had some advice (which will take at least another month)....

 

Can they refer a child without that child being on their SEN register (SA or SA+)?????

 

My daughter was referred to the autism advisory service and only afterwards was she put on SA+ because by that time I'd virtually memorised the COP and told the (new) senco this is what should be happening!! She hadn't had any formal SEN support eitherup to then - no IEP - nothing. But that's all in the past.

 

Leaving aside what should have been done - your son should certainly have an IEP now as the school are going to be providing strategies that are "additional to or different from" the normal curriculum (COP 5:50, 51). Children don't have to be x years behind. My son had an IEP last year and the targets were to improve his handwriting and to increase his concerntration - he wasn't significantly "behind" academically.

 

See COP 5:41 about what constitutes "progress". " The key test for action is evidence that whether current rates of progress are inadequate......A judgement has to be made in each case as to what it is reasonable to expect a particular child to achieve." The emphasis is on the individual and not on some "one size fits all" measurement of progress.

 

And yes, regular involvement of outside agencies and professionals suggest your son should be on SA+.

 

I don't know much about dyslexia but the cluelessness of your school astounds me: I thought support for dyslexia was routine nowadays?

 

K x

[Karen A]

Hi Thanks Kathryn.I thought I had read COP5:41 but could not remember where. Karen.

[Mother in Need]

Thanks ladies, I'll bring the COP and SEN toolkit with me to the meeting. I wonder if they have one? I think their main argument is going to be that according to them he doesn't need extra help as he is not that far behind, and therefore he doesn't need to be on SA or SA+, and least of all have an IEP. And I am still not sure if having been referred constitutes HAVING to be on SA or SA+.......???

 

The emphasis on the individual bit is real useful, because his teacher will not accept that if he is two years ahead in other subjects, and two behind in spelling, that really means he is 4 years behind his ability. Two is two according to him, and not three...

[Mother in Need]

I think their main argument is going to be that according to them he doesn't need extra help as he is not that far behind, and therefore he doesn't need to be on SA or SA+, and least of all have an IEP. And I am still not sure if having been referred constitutes HAVING to be on SA or SA+.......???

 

Could anyone shed some light on this, the meeting is tomorrow, and it would be VERY helpful to know?

[smiley]

Hiya,

 

These might help.....

 

School Action

School Action Plus

IEPs

 

Also.....

 

Cop 7;55..

 

Communication and interaction

 

7:55 Most children with special educational needs have strengths and difficulties in one, some

or all of the areas of speech, language and communication. Their communication needs

may be both diverse and complex. They will need to continue to develop their linguistic

competence in order to support their thinking as well as their communication. The range

of difficulties will encompass children and young people with speech and language delay,

impairments or disorders, specific learning difficulties, such as dyslexia and dyspraxia,

hearing impairment and those who demonstrate features within the autistic spectrum;

they may also apply to some children and young people with moderate, severe or

profound learning difficulties. The range of need will include those for whom language and

communication difficulties are the result of permanent sensory or physical impairment.

7:56 These children may require some, or all, of the following:

. flexible teaching arrangements

. help in acquiring, comprehending and using language

. help in articulation

. help in acquiring literacy skills

. help in using augmentative and alternative means of communication

. help to use different means of communication confidently and competently for a range

of purposes, including formal situations

. help in organising and coordinating oral and written language

. support to compensate for the impact of a communication difficulty on learning in

English as an additional language

. help in expressing, comprehending and using their own language, where English is not

the first language.

 

Hope that helps xx

[smiley]

Forgot to say - i had much the same experience as others with my sons senco..... i had to explain to her what her job entailed........

 

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[Mother in Need]

Forgot to say - i had much the same experience as others with my sons senco..... i had to explain to her what her job entailed........

 

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Thanks for the info Smiley , I have just printed off loads of it to show the SENCO...

 

And yes, I have already had to educate the LEA and the SENCO of my 13 year old's school, and now it's the next one. WE shouldn't have to police the system....

[Mother in Need]

Well, I've had the meeting but am still wacking my head on the wall.

NO he is NOT on SA nor on SA+.

They (the school) have no concerns whatsoever as he is already attaining the levels he should be attaining at the end of the next school year. Despite that his spelling and handwriting are illegible, that he misunderstands instsructions, and I could go on so, he is achieving and therefore there can't be anything wrong with him needing extra help of any kind. THAT is the school's point of view.

The ONLY reason that they have referred him to SALT and to the Dyslexia advisor is because of MY concerns, they are PURELY listening to MY concerns (the fact that the screening test showed great cause for concern was somehow not mentioned...).

 

This is the way they are holding off on anything and everything, and these specialists that were first supposedly coming in January (this month) but this has now somehow become February (with a quick 'should be' thrown in to cover themselves yet again).

 

You may ask yourself, what does it matter if he is attaining so well anyway, but the crux of the matter is it DOES REALLY AFFECT him on a daily basis, apart from having lowered his self-esteem, and his spelling is so bad you can barely read what he has written, and it slows him down hugely. How is he ever going to do any of those GCSE tests (and SATS before that), handwritten, if no-one can read it? This has to be formally acknowledged and he needs help with this and related issues.

 

I suppose there is nothing else i can do now till he has been seen, and then hope those specialists 1) know what they are doing and 2) do not have LEA quotas as to how many children are 'allowed' to be dyslexic ...

Edited January 19, 2007 by Mother in Need

[UltraMum]

You could apply as a parent for a statutory assessment ....

[Mother in Need]

You could apply as a parent for a statutory assessment ....

I know, I've been through that with my AS son, but my youngest isn't so bad he needs a statement, but what he DOES need is some help, acknowledgement of his problems, and maybe alternative ways of recording.

[Karen A]

Hi Personaly I would not worry whether your child needs a Statement or not.There is nothing wrong with applying for an assessment in order to get your child's needs assessed appropriately.At least it may force the school to put in some intervention or to explain to the LEA why they don't feel it is needed.As I have said before Ben does very well accademically in some areas.However if he did not have appropriate support it would have a huge effect on his ability to achieve and even remain in school.I think the school either do not understand the code of practice or find it convenient to pretend not to. Karen.

[Fagsandbooze]

my understanding is that as soon as outside agencies have been involved your child should be on school action plus.

In my experience having this label does not make much difference anyway.

I thought it would make things better/easier, but just made things even more complicated. I wouldn't waste my time if i had the benefit of hindsight!

[pumpkinpie]

I agree as soon as outside opinion is sort the child moves onto school action plus.

It sounds to me as if this school has very poor sen procedures and is not following the sen code of practice! the fact the governors are ignoring letters seems to point to them being a bit ineffective as well.

I would seriusly staRT LOOKING AT OTHER SCHOOLS AS i CANT SEE THIS POSITION GETTING ANY BETTER.

I would write a letter of complaint to the governing body as well as the lea, because they really should be kept informed.

Youi are not going to get the outcome you want with this school, at least with the present management structure, I would complain and complain whilst I was looking at alternatives!

[Mother in Need]

I see your point Pumpkinpie, but any other 'local' school involves driving and that is not always possible. It would also mean that I won't be back in time to pick my AS son up from the bus, and he is NOT able to walk home by himself (and even if he was, it wouldn't be safe as there are gangs who will pick up on the weak).

At the moment I am simply abiding my time, R isn't even at school due to the bullying issue that still has not been solved satisfactorily, and we are simply enjoying some quality time together, something of which he normally gets so very very very little. I am awaiting an assessment by a clinical psychologist (but you know how long those things can take), and for R to first heal emotionally. By that time, maybe those assessments have actually taken place, and we are/might be one step forward......

[hedders]

Hi i have been watching this thread with interest, if i can also ask a question please.

My dd is under ot and pead i have concerns that she may be on the Autisitc Specturm

now the Senco has said that she wont move her to school action plus and has refused her to see a ed psy despite her academic diffculties. And hasnt identified her individual needs.

the IEP has 2 targets for speech sounds and reading 7 keywords, this is her 2nd IEP and they refuse to change the stratagies

If the Senco had her way which she is trying to cover up her and the schools lack of knowledge and understanding by not identifying chldren under the age of 7 for SEN and saying to proffessionals they have no concerns and now wanting to stop her IEP, how can i get her needs assessed when im battling against teachers, senco and headteacher.

I do have a strong case as younger dd whos 3 is under same pead and have her support with my concerns.She is under SALT and Physio team and has an IEP in nursery one being social interaction

[Mother in Need]

Hedders, I would personaly say to first get that pead to address your concerns re autism. IF your child is indeed on the spectrum, then you'll get a report.

Show that to the school and ask them to cater for her individual needs, and apply for statutory assessment (with or without the school's willingness). The assessment will automaticaly involve the ed psych, and others, and show much clearer where her educational needs lie, and will hopefully get these covered.

 

I couldn't get anywhere with both schools my AS son attended, TILL he had the 'label'. School still refused to assess, and I approached the LEA myself (well, via a solicitor actually). Despite school saying he had no additional needs, he now has 32.5 hours 1-2-1 and is in a special unit (and my county is not known for its generousness re statements and help of any kind). School is now cooperating (well, after the LEA told the school's governors to ******** and get on with it!!!!)