Statementing and SEN in Hertfordshire

[flipper]

It's early days for us, so we're still finding our feet and working out what to do.

 

We've had a couple of meetings with the school (C starts in Reception in September) to discuss his needs - such things as what happens at lunchtime (he doesn't seem to like noisy places) and playground supervision etc.

We also discussed whether the school would be applying for a Statutory Assessment - as recommended by the educational psychologist. Their response was no, that was for the parent to do - but it probably wasn't worth it because Hertfordshire were changing the way the treat and fund Special Needs. In fact, they are no longer referring to it as Special Needs, but rather Exceptional Needs - and apparently ASD isn't exceptional enough!

 

We were told the school has �5000 p.a. to spend on all their SEN pupils (I forget how many they said they had under that category - though only C and one other are ASD/Autistic).

I had thought that the whole point of SEN funding and assessment was that the school received whatever help (be that funds, resource or people) were necessary based on the assessed needs of the child?

 

Has anyone else any experience of this new Hertfordshire approach? I've checked the LEA website, and can find no reference to changing their policy (in fact, it very much mirrors the DFE website policies - which our head teacher said was a waste of time as the DFE have virtually no power over LEAs!)

 

Thanks

Phil

[annie]

Hi Phil ,

 

We also discussed whether the school would be applying for a Statutory Assessment - as recommended by the educational psychologist. Their response was no, that was for the parent to do - but it probably wasn't worth it because Hertfordshire were changing the way the treat and fund Special Needs. In fact, they are no longer referring to it as Special Needs, but rather Exceptional Needs - and apparently ASD isn't exceptional enough!

 

Schools or Parents can apply for a Statutory Assessment. It is not just down to parents. Your LEA may be changing the way they treat and fund Special Needs, but they still have to follow the SEN code of practice, not make it up as they go along .

 

We were told the school has �5000 p.a. to spend on all their SEN pupils (I forget how many they said they had under that category - though only C and one other are ASD/Autistic).

I had thought that the whole point of SEN funding and assessment was that the school received whatever help (be that funds, resource or people) were necessary based on the assessed needs of the child?

 

Schools are allocated SEN funding, but if a child is issued with a Statement this ensures that their needs are met and the school is allocated with the appropriate funding to meet those needs.

 

It would be worth speaking to IPSEA. I think that they would be pretty alarmed to hear the information that you have been told. They do tackle LEAs that act illegally . IPSEA will be able to give you lots of advice, they helped us and were absolutely brilliant. Please keep trying the helpline, they are very busy but it is worth the wait.

 

IPSEA

? England and Wales (freephone):

0800 0184016

Mon to Thu 10--4 and 7--9;

Fri 10--1 and 7--9

During school holidays times are reduced. Please ring for availability.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Annie

xx

[pumpkinpie]

Please contact ipsea about this asap you are being fed a load of .....

Dont let them con you!

[pumpkinpie]

Check this out........

http://www.ipsea.org.uk/lewishamcomplaint2.htm

[Kathryn]

Hi Phil,

 

Welcome to the forum.

 

There are several of us here from Herts. I'll pm you with some useful links - there is info on the council website about the new policy but it does take some finding. Anyone would think they didn't want parents to find it.

 

Another LEA is being challenged over the legality of a very similar funding policy, and I know IPSEA are already taking a very close interest in what's happening in Herts.

 

K x

Edited August 2, 2007 by Kathryn

[aro]

It's disappointing to hear this. I grew up in Herts and did my teaching degree and practises there. It was a very wealthy LEA (certainly compared to Bucks where I worked) I'm surprised that they are cutting funding like this. I guess it's a sign of the huge population growth in Herts.

Hope the IPSEA puts a stop to this.

Similar moves are happening here in Wales, a very worrying time!

 

A x

[mum22boys]

Hi,

 

I'm from Herts and before the kids broke up from school i approached both the school and M's Autism Advisory teacher about statutory assessment. The school weren't necessarily opposed to it but did try to talk me out of it, saying he might not get anything or only a few hours. I told them I would fight, which they know I will. The funding system may have changed but you can still apply for statutory assessment. The fund for exceptional needs has nothing to do with it. That 'pot' of money is not really there for children like ours that may require ongoing support. It is only granted to a school(if granted at all) as a one of amount of money, not a yearly sum. So if a child moved from one school to another and that child was for instance in a wheelchair and the new school was not adapted then the school would have to apply for the exceptional needs money. They would if sucessful be granted the one off sum to widen doors, put ramps in etc but the LEA will assume the one off payment will cover the childs needs.

 

You are entitled to apply for statutory assessment, although I think having the schools backing will make life easier. M's AA teacher has said she is now concerned about his behaviour in class and when she visits in October she will back our request if there is no improvement with how he is in class.

 

The funding system may have changed but it really only changed significantly for children with earmarked funding. If a child has a statement they still have that statement and the hours on it.

 

Our reason for wanting statutory assessment is to plan for M's educational future. i want a choice when we have to choose secondary schools as the way things are now he will not cope in mainstream, I want the choice as to whether he gets into a special school. M's school appreciate this and I think will back us.

 

If you want statutory assessment then apply, it is your right.

 

mum22boys

[josie h]

I also live in Herts and am lucky enough to already have a statement for me son. I am at a bit of an advantage as i work in a playgroup and so have some 'internal' knowledge of the new system in Hertfordshire schools. Students who already have statements will not be affected by the new rules. Those who don't will. Basically, schools are required to tell the LEA at the beginning of the school year, how many children with additional needs they have on the role. They are then given a 'pot of money' to use for these children in whichever way they feel neccesary. The statement is only now issued for children with severe difficulties. when i questioned what was described as severe, i was told that it would be a child who required full time assistance. The schools then have to put forward their case and 'bid' for the funding for the child! The schools that can prove their child has the biggest need will get this additional 'statementing money', as well as the other SEN funding they already recieve. My other question was how would the LEA monitor the use of this money, and was told they weren't sure, but expected that schools would use the money in the correct way. Al i can say is that i am glad i already have a statement for my son and really feel for those of you in Hertfodshire who don't. I would suggest that you talk to the Parent Partnership if you a very concerned. I have found them very helpful when i was having probelms regarding exclusions with my son. They are there to support the parent and not the school. You should also approach the school again. This is a new type of funding and i am sure the schools and SENCO'S are also just coming to grips with the way the new system works. I am not sure how it will work, but hope you all get some help from this. They do say that this should be a better way of woking, but we will have to see. In the playgroup i work in, we have had problems getting support funding for children with SEN, as they only met one area of need, which was langauge based. This, as you will all be aware, has a knock on effect of all the other learning areas as well, however, this was not seen as a problem! if anybody needs the contact numbers for the Parent Partnership in Herts, post on again and i will try to find them and put them on the forum.

 

Good luck to all of you!

[BusyLizzie100]

Hello, another Herts mum here, waiting to find out what the full impact of the changes to SEN funding will be.

 

DS1 was awarded Earmarked Pupil Funding (which basically funds 4.5 hours of support) in January, which of course was then abolished in April. Doh!

 

DS2 has a Statement of 12 hours, which the school makes up to 15.

 

The idea is that both of the above fundings are now included in the school's overall SEN budget, and it is up to the school to deliver the support according to their budget. The budget is set on the basis of three criteria: the number of children qualifying for free school meals, attainment levels at the Keystages, and prior knowledge of who has SEN, ie DS2 has a Statement so they know they have to include that in the budget.

 

The experience of schools is that some budgets have gone up, but many have gone down, despite the fact Herts LEA is apparently putting more money into SEN funding.

 

As already mentioned, Ipsea is watching Herts LEA closely. I've heard that some HTs locally are already very twitchy about having any more children with SEN - there is huge concern that the budgets will not cover present needs at some schools, so if any further pupils with SEN apply to the school, the welcome may prove hostile! Obviously that has yet to be seen...

 

DS2's school applied for 'exceptional needs' for him, which means that the school is applying for him to have more than 15 hours on his STatement. The LEA funds the school directly for any child with a Statement of more than 15 hours a week, and the school is not required to fund support for the child out of its SEN budget. At a recent panel in my area, 23 cases were put forward as having exceptional needs and only 3 were approved; none of them were on the autistic spectrum.

 

I have no idea if DS1's support will continue; the school has been cagey about this so far. The school will have to fulfill the support of children with Statements first so, if there isn't enough left in the budget, DS1 could find himself without support.

 

However, it definitely still is worthwhile applying for a Statement. Don't be put off by ANYONE telling you that you don't need a Statement any more, unless it's for 'exceptional needs'!!! A Statement is a legal document and should identify all the needs of a child with SEN. Above all (and this is what Ipsea are watching closely), if a school says it is unable to provide the Statemented support out of its budget, then the LEA has a legal duty to provide it.

 

Ooooooooaaaaaaaaaarrrrgh! This gets me so mad! But hope that helps.

 

Lizzie

Edited August 2, 2007 by BusyLizzie100

[flipper]

Wow! Thanks everyone - both for the support and information, which I'll study closely and follow-up as appropriate.

I'm a bit of a dog with a bone when I get onto stuff like this, so I won't let the LEA/school off easily!

 

Many thanks again.

 

Phil

[Kathryn]

Everyone's said it all already, but it bears repeating:

 

The statement is only now issued for children with severe difficulties. when i questioned what was described as severe, i was told that it would be a child who required full time assistance.

Which is contrary to the Code of Practice and against the law. The need for a statement is not based upon the category or severity of difficulty but the ability of a particular school to meet a child's needs from its own resources.

 

The schools then have to put forward their case and 'bid' for the funding for the child! The schools that can prove their child has the biggest need will get this additional 'statementing money', as well as the other SEN funding they already recieve.

The local authority are still ultimately responsible for assessing, statementing and providing resources for a particular child, regardless of how they choose to divide up and distribute the contents of the SEN funding pot.

 

My other question was how would the LEA monitor the use of this money, and was told they weren't sure, but expected that schools would use the money in the correct way.

This is scary, isn't it. No ring fencing, no accountability. No comment!

 

Your perspective as a parent and from "the other side" is interesting Josie, and the answers you were given are very revealing. I'm not terribly optimistic about the new system, I'm afraid. Some schools have actually had their SEN budgets cut as a result, one by as much as two thirds.

 

K x

Edited August 2, 2007 by Kathryn

[josie h]

Hi Kathryn, I just wanted to let you knwo that i quite agree that the new system is wrong. I do not agree with what they have done at all and was shocked when I found out about it. As a playgroup, we were told at a meeting before thee changes, that the priority was going to be good links between settings, and better funding to aid the transition for children who had received support funding at plagroups, but were not 'elligible' for statementing. We have had a number of children who we referred to the advisory team, only to be told that they did not met the criteria for transitional funding to give them 5 Hours a week support for the transition from playgroup to nursery. Bearing in mind these children left our setting, having had full support, due to the number of sessions they were doing, to having only two members of staff in the nursery. Many of these children now have statements, and some are even in specialist schools. As we are not classed as 'profesional' people, i think because we have no teaching qualifications, we seem to get pushed aside. I feel we have more experience than the advisory teachers, as we work closely with the children and know exactly what their needs are. After being told that the transition was going to improve, we were then told that the support funding criteria that we could aply for had been changed. It is now almost impossible to get additional support for pre-school children. We were then informed of the changes to the funding arangement in schools! We were devestated! I must also say, that my manager is fighting to have the support funding for playgroups looked into, as we cannot provide adequate provision for children with additional needs, if we can't get any funding for them. At the same time, we feel that all the hard work we do, to make progress with the children who are lucky enough to get funding, is quickly undone when they go to nursery with no support. It's very frustrating, and i am not sure if there will ever be a balance betweent he children who need support and those who get the support they need. we are currecntly waiting to see if we get an increase in C's statemented hours, as the 10 hours we have are nowhere near enough to give him the help he really needs to get him through school. Lets hope that if enough schools come across the same difficulties, and enough parents voice their own concerns with the new system, that the LEA will reconsider their position!

[Kathryn]

It must be tough to work in that environment, josie, and there is no let up, as you're facing similar battles as a parent.

 

One day there may be enough pressure for change if enough people are dissatisfied with the system.

 

A group of schools in another LEA are making an official complaint to the Secretary of State over a similar funding scheme which has disadvantaged them. It will be interesting to see what comes of this. See here.

 

K x

[pim]

Hi,

 

I'm also another Herts mum.

 

Ds has a statement with 15 hours. The school and ourselves have been fighting to get more. He was put forward to exceptional needs, which he didn't qualify for. Two of the criteria is that the child needs to have a rare condition, which ASD is not. Another was that the condition should be severe in what the child has. Yes if DS was severely autistic then he would most likely need to go to a special school.

 

Even though DS has 15 hours written on his statement, it doesn't mean from next April hat the school would provide it as the school would no longer receive the transistion money to cover this. DS school budget has drastically decreased since the new SEN funding came in.

 

We were having problems with DS school and I had been looking at other schools for him. They were all even the ones who have very good SEN records advising me that they did not want my child. This was all said in a very nice way. BAsically they could not afford to have him as all their SEn budget has been allocated and if I decided to move him they could not offer any 1 to 1 support, even the 15 hours specified in his statement.

 

That's our story. I know other parents who have recently got statements with no hours specified. The school has then said we can only give 4-5 hours when both the school and parents know the child needs 15+ hours.

 

I think even if a child has a statement it doesn't guarentee that the school can offer the support a child requires.

 

It just makes me so mad.

 

pim

[josie h]

Yet another reply to the comments you made Kathryn. Yes it is hard to be working in the playgroup environment as well as having the difficulties we have at home, but in some ways it has helped with both. Working in the playgroup, I have become a much stronger and more confident person. Having C, has also made me understand exactly what all the parents with children who have additional needs are going through. From the first moment that it is mentioned that there may be something 'different', or 'not quite the same as the other children', I know from my own experience what they must be feeling and I think this has helped me alot. I think it has also helped my manager as she has seen things from my side, with all the problems I have had. So it has it's plus points and it's minus points. I love my job, as i feel i am helping give the children a good start, and as i want to be there for my kids, it's great coz i can take them to school and pick them up and be home for the holidays as well! What a great life! Still really frustrating though!