Think my son may have aspergers

[joybed]

I know you cant comment and that i need the advice of a professional but i am realy struggling with my 3 year old. DS1 has an autistic spectrum disorder he is now 11 and i can see some similarities betweeen him and his brother as a toddler the impulsive behaviour, frustration, aggression and obsessive routines but Piers has much better speach and does appear to have some imagination. The problems we have are that he has lots of temper tantrums every day, i am talking at least a dozen. When he has a tantrum you cannot get through to him and you may as well not bother to speak to him, he will not be consoled and lashes out, punches, kicks, bites, pulls hair and sometimes seems as of he is deliberatleey trying to hurt. This is generally accompanied by the words " don,t like mummy go away". He is very distructive and breaks all his siblings and our things as well as his own. He prefers to throw toys around than play with them most of the time although pther times plays appropriately. His speach is very good and and when I say he is imaginative I mean he will sit in a washing basket and play boats or get an aeroplane and zoom it around the room, but I am not sure if this is copied as he is a twin and goes to day nursery. Nursery say that although he is hyperactive they have known worse and are not concerned. His eyecontact is at times appropriate but sometimes he can have a full conversation and not look at you. He also drags you to things he wants and gets his use of pronouns muddled. I recently spoke to a mum of a child with aspergers and she said i was discribing her son as atoddler. i also have a friend who is a health visitor and she has suggested he has Aspergers. It has also been suggested he may have ADHD but he will sit and watch his current favourite DVd for a long time. He is also controlling in that if he wants to watch his favourite thing he will have a tantrum so his twin sister gives in to him. As a baby he was very colicky cried all the time and was generally unconsolable throughout his first year. He has a lactose intolerance and frequently gets diarrhoea. His toilet training isn,t bad just the odd accident but not yet dry at night althoguh at just 3 i am not worried about this. The problems have become more noticeable since our recent family holiday this is also what happened with his brother at the same age.the health visitor is coming to see us soon but I just wanted your opinion on this matter do you think he is too young to worry and this is an extension of the terrible 2s. Although I know instinctively that something is wrong. Thanks in advance

[Cat]

There is ten years between my two autistic sons and although there were similarities between the two when they were both 3 years old in some ways there were poles apart. However the similarities could not be ignored. Your three year old is a mixture of both of my sons when they were that age. My youngest son was the one who threw the tantrums, one after the other, while the edlest was very controlling when he was 3. The eldest had no speech delay while the youngest did. The youngest also punched kicked bit and threw his toys at us as opposed to playing with them. However he would sit in a washing basket for hours and pretend that he was driving a car. I knew that my youngest did not have ADHD because he to would sit for hours while he watched a DVD again and again and again. They were both obsessive although the eldest was never into routines in the way that the youngest was.

 

I think what I am trying to say is if you have doubts then go with what your gut it telling you. Someone once told me that no two people would bake a chocolate cake in the same way. Most of the ingrediants would be the same but some would differ and that pretty much sums up my two sons. The eldest has a diagnosis of AS while the youngest has a dx of HFA. Lots of similarities in some areas but there are also clear diffences. Because your eldest son has a diagnosis I would hope that your concerns would be taken seriously.

 

Hope this helps

 

Cat

Edited August 20, 2007 by Cat

[Bagpuss]

Hi Joybed,

 

If you have concerns I would discuss them further with your HV. Time will tell if it is the "terrible two's", and if you make your concerns known, he can be monitored.

 

Take care and good luck with whatever you decide <'>

[mossgrove]

I think you would be right to have your son asessed. To be honest at 3 years old it's probably too early to determine whether it is aspersers' or elsewhere on the spectrum, but all the available eveidence suggests that early intervention pays dividends.

 

There are only two years between our two Autistic boys . They are very alike and very different at the same time.

 

One silver lining to all this is than once we had one son 'In the System' we found it far easier to have our concerns taken seriously with the second, even though they prsented very differently. DS1 had tantrums, violent utnbursts and challenging behaviour. DS2 has significant language delay and was very 'withdrawn' throughout his early childhood and was causing concern because he was so passive.

 

Simon

[joybed]

Thankyou so much for all your opinions. my only problem now is my husband who refuses to accept that there is a problem with his son. My oldest son is his stepson and he has a difficult time dealing with his ASd and the challenging behaviour and I am sorry to say finds him very difficult to like. This obviously causes difficulty in our relationship and working together as a family. We have just come back from a disastrous family holiday where all DH and DS1 did was argue and frankly DS1 felt very unloved by his dad and dh is reluctant to have a family holiday again. The possibility of another child on the spectrum is too much for him to deal with and while I would rather have a diagnosis and all the support he would rather bury his head in the sand. He says that even if he is diagnosed as ASd he will refuse to believe it. Any tips on helping him come to terms with this, i have tried to encourage him to go to support groups and various professionals have offered to speak to him but he won,t listen and it is now affecting our marriage.

[Wardie]

Thankyou so much for all your opinions. my only problem now is my husband who refuses to accept that there is a problem with his son. My oldest son is his stepson and he has a difficult time dealing with his ASd and the challenging behaviour and I am sorry to say finds him very difficult to like. This obviously causes difficulty in our relationship and working together as a family. We have just come back from a disastrous family holiday where all DH and DS1 did was argue and frankly DS1 felt very unloved by his dad and dh is reluctant to have a family holiday again. The possibility of another child on the spectrum is too much for him to deal with and while I would rather have a diagnosis and all the support he would rather bury his head in the sand. He says that even if he is diagnosed as ASd he will refuse to believe it. Any tips on helping him come to terms with this, i have tried to encourage him to go to support groups and various professionals have offered to speak to him but he won,t listen and it is now affecting our marriage.

 

My heart goes out to you. It's difficult enough to have a child with ASD, let alone two - certainly 2 parents pulling in the same direction makes things a lot easier - both so you have someone to talk to as well as the clear messages your sons need. <'> <'>

 

However, not getting your younger son diagnosed won't solve your marital problems, and it won't help you handle your son. It could be your DS2 is just reacting to your older son's behaviour - but a professional will help you work it through. If you get a diagnosis, your husband may accept from a professional what he won't accept from you, I think you need to pursue it anyway becuase if your son is aspergers he will need all the help he can get and in my experience, that is mostly forthcoming when there is a diagnosis - especially when he starts school.

 

I can see how hard it is though to do this on your own, I hope you find a resolution that works for you all.

 

Wardie

[mum22boys]

Hi joybed,

 

I agree you need to discuss the problems with the HV. Although i don't have the large age gap I am in a simular situation to you. My eldest is 7 and was diagnosed ASD in April after a 2 year battle to get to the bottom of his behaviour. We knew it was autism, in fact my husband had been saying it since M was 2, I just couldn't accept it. By the time M got to reception even I agreed we needed help as we just hadn't come out the terrible twos! During our wait for M to be assessed we started to noticed things with his younger brother. R has just turned 4 and from the age of 2 until he was 3 we 'studied' him. I just felt I couldn't go along to the Hv again with another child. At this time M hadn't even been diagnosed and I was saying R's behaviour isn't right also. I felt it was my fault. As I said by the time R had turned 3 I was convinced things weren't right and I went to the HV. I had a list of his behaviours and she agreed things needed to be looked into. That was a year ago now and we have been told R will be assessed in Dec. He has been seen by two pead's who agree he is showing signs of autism although he does have some good signs.

 

No two children are the same. Mine really are very different but both display different levels of severity in their problems. This is what made us seek help for R, the fact that the things R was doing was not the same as M. He wasn't copying. M has terrible tantrums, can't cope in new places and has no imaginative play and very poor social skills. R however has severe anxiety problems but can cope with change as long as he's been made aware first. He can have bad temper tantrums but not as bad as M. He has imaginative play but it's repetitive.

 

You need to find out for definate. I think from reading your post you know deep down he may have it, just like we know R may. As for your husband, I agree maybe he will come to terms with a professional telling him. I didn't have the problem with my husband as he identified it first but I will say i think he found it hard understanding all M's problems and behaviours. The best thing we did was go on the NAS help programme for the day. It taught my husband a lot and made him understand M a lot more. Is there any course you can take your husband along to? Even if you tell him it's to support you.

 

Good luck, I know how hard it is to do the journey twice.

 

mum22boys <'>

[llisa32]

Hiya, I just wanted to add a small bit of experience for you. My husband is my son's stepdad and quite often just through J being J he will say the most hurtful things, but without meaning them as such.

 

One incident that always sticks in my mind is from way back 4 years ago when we took J on our first 'family' holiday - just a short 4 day break at centreparks so J and hubby could bond a bit more.

 

The very first day we got there J was still young enough to want to walk down the path 'swinging' ie one hand in hubbys hand, one in mine, and we swung him back and forth as we walked. Out of nowhere came the following comment from my son 'People will think you're my daddy....but you're not!' OUCH ! - I cringed and felt really bad for my now hubby, but all J was doing was stating a fact...even at that young age and way before I began thinking about aspergers. I had to explain to hubby that it was not personal, and that sometimes as well as not taking things personally he really needs to pretend to be a kiddy to get on his wavelength and try and understand what makes J tick. The biggest thing for my hubby was what he felt were the personal attacks/comments...now he understands through my explaining, and through stuff I've given him to read he's soo much better at understanding him and getting on with him - they do now have 'fun' together.

 

It's like water off a ducks back now to my hubby...even now when J will still make similar comments in public to anyone...explaining how hubby is 'not his real daddy' etc ..(without them asking!

 

I just wanted to let you know that with a bit of work and understanding on all sides your situation with hubby and son will hopefully improve...I've occasionally had to tell my son to not be so cheeky and to act more grown up, and tell my hubby to act more like a kid! - hopefully then they find a middle ground for most of the time.

[joybed]

Thought I would fill you all in I spoke to my health visitor who said she thought he was just being a typical boy and was very rough and tumble and trying to get attention in any way he could. She also gave me tips for handling his behaviour which are all the things you would do anyway or I do. To begin with I felt reassured but the doubts are creaping back in. The tantrums are stilll very bad last night he screamed solidly for afull hour because i took of his socks and he wanted to keep them on for bed. I tried to put them back on but he was disgusted I had removed them in the first place and wanted another pair of socks of course I couldn,t find those and he screamed until i found a pair he would wear (they had to be green, stripey ones). He was sat on the toilet at the time and wouldnt let me near him every time I attempted to touch him he lashed out and kicked, bitm scratched anything to keep me away. Woke up this morning in the same mood and only came out of it early afternoon. He is waking at night again and Lydia cant cope with the stress of 2 brothers having tantrums and is crying most of the day. I am so stressed and tired and am about to start 3 early shifts in a row. God give me strength.

[madmumof5]

Thought I would fill you all in I spoke to my health visitor who said she thought he was just being a typical boy and was very rough and tumble and trying to get attention in any way he could. She also gave me tips for handling his behaviour which are all the things you would do anyway or I do. To begin with I felt reassured but the doubts are creaping back in. The tantrums are stilll very bad last night he screamed solidly for afull hour because i took of his socks and he wanted to keep them on for bed. I tried to put them back on but he was disgusted I had removed them in the first place and wanted another pair of socks of course I couldn,t find those and he screamed until i found a pair he would wear (they had to be green, stripey ones). He was sat on the toilet at the time and wouldnt let me near him every time I attempted to touch him he lashed out and kicked, bitm scratched anything to keep me away. Woke up this morning in the same mood and only came out of it early afternoon. He is waking at night again and Lydia cant cope with the stress of 2 brothers having tantrums and is crying most of the day. I am so stressed and tired and am about to start 3 early shifts in a row. God give me strength.

HI Joy ,I have spoken with you before on another site, not sure if you remember,think it was about cloth nappies ?? Anyway I have had concerns about my DS2 since he was 3 ,at the time I was told it was because he had just started nursery ,then it was down to him starting reception, then I was told it was because DD2 had been born,then conflict of personalities between us and so on and so on.After 5 years of being fobbed off I have finally been listened to and we are now on the long road to hopefully getting a DX for him .It took a year for a pead to actually take me seriously and it was due to seeing a different one that I actually got things moving along.

No one knows your son like you do, you know him best so be firm ,I gave up with my HV years ago and just plodded on thinking maybe they were right . Last year I couldnt take anymore and after reading up online and being told by some forum users that he may have Aspergers I went straight to the doctor and told her I wanted him referring, firstly for his bowel problems (she told me to stop letting him have fruit ) as they are having a massive effect on his everyday life (and ours, as it is very restricting ) and his behaviour (his obsessions and routines mainly but now its the violence and self hate )

 

I am noticing similar traits in my DD3 so I have a close eye on her, shes only just 2 so its too soon to tell yet but i sure as heck wont leave it as long this time!!

 

Viv xx

[LizC]

Hi I just wanted to say, yes he may be young but you as a parent can usually tell if they are 'different'. I wanted to say that my son now 7 has aspergers and adhd, he was very much like you descibe your son. at 3 he went to nursery, but they were so busy with all the kids they always said he was fine (despite the daily tantrums on the floor) I knew he was different always on the go, had obsesions, tantrums, hyper etc etc he too would sit and watch a movie if he was interested in it and play it in spanish or german too lol but then the rest of the time would be his usual hyperself again, and never would and still doesn't settle on a night. was hard going really when no one takes you seriously and other mums would comment saying it was just a boy thing! grrrrr. anyway at 4 1/2 I too him to our gp who referred him to ours cahms team. they diagnosed asperger syndrome just after his 5th birthday and the adhd was dx just recently at 7. if you feel this could be the case for your son I would keep at it and take him to the gp.

 

just read your other message. HV dids not help at all either. they gave me loads of info on behaviour etc. they really didn't have a clue!! that is why I ended up going to the GP

Edited December 1, 2007 by LizC