Prams

[Noskcaj86]

Hi,

Our 4 year old sons behaviour when were out is worrying, it seems he has no concept of danger. I understand hes only 4 but i think most 4 year olds would have some understanding of whats dangerous and also social awareness not to trust anybody. He will happily talk to anyone, and if they asked him to follow them he would :/ he also doesnt understands road safety and runs straight across roads if i cant grab him in time. He walks backwards a lot which isnt hugly dangerous although he could trip over doing this or fall of a curb but when he walks backwards he goes very slowly so it takes a long time to get anywhere and i spend my whole time looking behind me to make sure hes ok. He also runs off and doesnt always stop or come back when called so i have to abandon my double pram (with 2yr old and 7mth old in it) and run after him before he gets hurt or lost. He has run of in the supermarket to many times to count and we have had to get security to help find him. He once ran off while i was sitting on the grass near a river, one second he was running around next to me happily the next he was nowhere to be seen. that time I ended up having to call the police because he could have fallen in the river or gone over to the main road. Luckily he was found safe and sound! But basically what im trying to say is i cant take my eyes off him when were not at home, im so worried one day i might not catch him in time before he runs across a road and gets hit by a car or goes off with a stranger. Would you advise i get him a pram? Hes 4 so iwe would need a BIG pram for him and it would mean i couldnt use the double pram for my other 2 anymore so would need to use a sling and possibly a buggy board for 2 year old... but if it means my 4 year old is safe then i dont mind. Would like other peoples opinions though because of his age and the fact hes able bodied and very very energetic im not sure if it would be right for him to be in a pram or not? Thanx

[Shnoing]

We had the same problem here, and we got him a "special" pram (for up to 50 kgs) at (his) age 4. We had to arrange for a lot of training traffic situations etc., and he hasn't had to use his pram since he was 6 and a half.

We had a "special" tricycle with a handle (to keep him from crossing streets etc.), too.

[Noskcaj86]

Thanx for reply, What make pram was it? I need to look in to getting one I think, even if its just used for when we visit very busy places. Today we were shopping in the high street and again he ran straight out in to the road, a car had to stop and the driver didnt look impressed with me! I had told him to stop because there was a car coming but he didnt appear to hear me, not hearing me seems common with him! Today was a good day, only one incident, he didnt run off at all today

[Isobel]

Quick google search found these

http://www.specialneedspushchairs.co.uk/index.htm

[Noskcaj86]

Thanx for link, wow they cost a lot though! The umbrella fold maclaren is probably best for him/us, easy to get in and out of a car. But at £270 not sure we can afford one....! I wonder if there is any financial help we could get towards getting him one, i doubt it though.

[Noskcaj86]

Do you think its acceptable to have him in a pram at 4? Hes not diagnosed with anything other than 'perception disorder' but were pushing for him to be assessed for Autism as he has so many traits. So this is why i think we wont be able to get any financial help toward getting him a pram. We just want to make sure he is safe, and at the moment I dont feel he is. Im sure as he gets older he will become more aware (I hope) of the dangers around him and will be able to avoid them by himself but at the moment thats really not the case. He wont hold hands with me or his dad, he hates reins and wont hold on to the side of his brothers pram so this is really the last option

[Shnoing]

As I wrote: 6 and half. If he's autistic, he won't register the "weird looks". And you'll just have to bear it ...

Go for the second hand market (See PM).

[Mannify]

My middle son was in a pushchair at four. He would compulsively run into traffic and I had a small baby in a sling, and I just had to keep him safe. Once when I was heavily pregnant and waiting at a bus station he got out of the pushchair and ran towards the main road. It simply amazed me that people looked on but didn't catch him for me!! It was a regular pushchair and not the type of which Schnoing speaks. Shortly after that we bought a backpack with reins thing, and that worked well. He's 7 now and pretty safe around rounds so long as we're reasonably alert.

[justine1]

I would go for reins,as mannify mentioned.Only that I am guessing he has been out of a pushchair for at least 7mths(given you have a 7mth old) I worry if you get him back into a pushchair he may regress and end up in a pushchair for longer than intended. I did use a pushchair with Dan until he was almost four,I to had a double buggy and so he sat in that. It was an effort to push around as he was heavy,despite him being underweight,however in my case I did not push him around due to safety alone it was due to joint pain,which I now know is hypermobility.

 

Sam,who also has ASD,has issues with running off he always has done and is 9years old now,whilst he still does it he is more street wise now. I personally think if you can rather explain things to him with pictures about safety and do role play in the garden of how to walk safely,try do some short journeys as practice with the reins and reward the good behaviour. I always think if a child is capable of walking why take that away? The pushchair will solve the immediate problem and make it easier for you but what will it solve long term,what age will he be when he learns how to cross a road safely? Just an idea.

[Noskcaj86]

We have try'd reins, but he either refuses to move and sits on the pavement or screams and cry's until they come off, Also they are now pretty tight around his waste and he knows how to undo the clips so has escaped a few times (ive try'd a few different makes but all tight around his waste). Have been looking for a stronger pram that's not a disability one but they all seem to only go up to 15kg which he's already quite a bit heavier than so will look in to the 2nd hand ones, thanx everyone for your help

[justine1]

What about wrist reins or like suggested the backpack reins? Also there are some buggy boards for children up to age 5 which may be a little easier with your other two.

[Noskcaj86]

We have a buggy board but have difficulty getting him to stay on it, he jumps off when he feels like it, sometimes in the middle of a road! And have also try'd wrist reins but he can wriggle his hand out, ive done them up really tight to stop him doing this and it eventually gets lose but also we have the same scraming issue where he wont calm down untill they are off! Thats why im thinking pram is proably the next step. We have just had a few good days with him so im start thinking to my self what was I worried/complaining about, but then well get a bad day again and I'll quickly remember! Thanx for tips

 

P.s I also have 4 boys... but no girl yet!

[Shnoing]

We have try'd reins, but he either refuses to move and sits on the pavement or screams and cry's until they come off, ...

Maybe a shot in the dark, but that seems to be a sensory integration issue, where he can stand only pressure on his body when it has a certain (very small range of) intensity, and probably the pressure needs to be on a certain minimum surface. You might read up something of Temple Grandin about that.

[Lyndalou]

This one is a real toughie but I'm tempted to say that if you do find a buggy large enough for your wee boy that you are not tempted to use it at all times. My son has never tolerated reins from when he could just walk. He would have screaming fits and throw himself onto the ground. We could also not use wrist straps and he would wriggle free from having his hand held. When my daughter was born, I intended to use a buggy board in order to walk along to Playgroup with the kids but we found that was no use as my son couldn't tolerate the vibrations through the buggy board and he likes to free to climb and explore. As a result, my compromise was that I chose to drive the short distance to the Playgroup but it is possible that I would have had to consider some kind of double buggy (I couldn't wear a baby sling due to my own sensory difficulties) if I didn't have access to a car. However, at all other times myself and my husband have tried to walk with my son as much as possible, at first keeping mainly to paths and side streets and doing it when we were able to take our time, eg. on my husband's days off so we could go together to the playpark or build in some other 'reward' or 'enticement'. Over time, we found that my son started to be happy to hold our hands and by allowing him freedom to do certain things, like climbing on walls or stopping to explore grout, he was much more willing to walk this way as he was more relaxed. Up until this point I was getting him to wear a hooded jersey and was gently holding onto it to hold him back from moving too far away. There were times when he was going too close to the road and times when he did run into the road. On those occasions I had no choice but to grab him and on more than one occasion I had to frogmarch him as quickly as possible to where I was going because as I saw it, it was either a short period of distress or him getting killed. In recent months, I have started talking to my son about traffic lights, ie. what red, amber and green signify and what the red and green man are for. In the car, we've made it into a game. In the street, we got to the point when I could walk with my son to the shops without being anxious that he would wrench his hand free and run off and we always go to the crossings so he can press the button to wait for the green man (we used the 'We're off to see the Green Man' song on 'Show Me, Show Me' on CBeebies) which we sing or I say 'What does red mean?' and he shouts 'Stop!' so we wait at the edge of the pavement. I do think a lot of it is about finding ways to make these everyday experiences enjoyable or at least far less stressful for everyone. My son still does not have road sense as such but he knows that we go to crossings to go over the road and we are all not in a high state of anxiety every time we leave the house like we used to be. You'll find your own way through but it may take some time and a lot of patience. If a buggy helps in the short-term then go for it but a child with ASD will only learn if they are given opportunity to learn.

Lynda

[Noskcaj86]

Thanx Lynda,

 

I have been thinking it over and i think if we do get a pram for him it will be used only for situations where were not use to surroundings of where there are a lot of people. Hes ok when we go somewhere such as a park for a walk, I like to take him to places where he's free to run about and its safe. But i cant drive so i do have to take him on the bus. We live out of town on a main road and there is no bus stop so we stand next to the main road to wait for the bus, this is worrying for me as he wont stay still! The bus its self is a challenge because he wont sit still on the bus and climbes about on the seats or runs up the isle, the bus has had to stop in the past because of this... him being strapped in to a pram would really help here! I also have to go to town shopping which is where the running across road incidents have all happened. I worry a lot about his safety every day. Its so hard to keep him safe, its a constant struggle! My partner drives but he works full time so isnt home much which means a lot of buses and walking everywhere. I will struggle on for now, and keep searching for prams on ebay thanx

[Lyndalou]

Does your wee boy have a diagnosis? I'm wondering if you should attempt to get referral to your local Social Work team. We were referred through our HV some time back and I had a Social Worker from the Children with Disabilities Team out to assess our need for services. Among the things that she has highlighted is our entitlement to having someone to the house to either look after my son OR my daughter to free me up to do other things, on my own or with my son or my daughter. If you explain your situation, perhaps you could get someone to provide care in your home to look after your son on his own or take care of your other children while you go out with your son? Again, this is likely to take some time as our referral took a number of months but in your situation you might be able to argue that yours is a priority case. Perhaps too, you may be able to get some advice about managing these difficult behaviours?

[Noskcaj86]

No diagnosis yet, really pushing for one now as im so sure its autism. Only diagnosis so far has been perception disorder, speech and language delays and motor skill delays. But he shows so many autistic traits. He's been tested for numerous metabolic conditions that cause delays and also has had eeg's as they thought he may be epileptic but the 1st eeg was normal and we get the 2nd eeg results wednesday. Weve had help from the disabled children's team and have been offered rest bite care from HV and also having someone to the house to help as you said you have been offered too. Hes been going to a language unit october 2011 until july this year. Weve been seeing speech therapy with him since 1 year for originally for feeding problems, speech therapist then picked up other delays.... And its been an ongoing struggle to understand what's going on with him since he was 1! About time we had some proper answers I think!

[Lyndalou]

I really hope you get a definitive answer! Things won't change very much in terms of the problems you are having but you could possibly tailor strategies better to your familiy's needs... That's great that you've been offered the help you have - I would take anything they offer you. What I was thinking was that you could maybe use some of the care offered in order to go shopping or do errands without the stress of constantly watching your son? Even if it was just for the food shop or something?

[justine1]

As he has other diagnoses have you tried getting DLA?

[Noskcaj86]

We got told about a year ago that we could apply but would be unlikely to get anything... so we didnt bothered applying for it. I think that as his 'delays' are still obvious and hes not caught up and will be starting school full time that we may apply. I think the woman who said we were unlikely to get DLA was under the impression that he would have caught up by now, but personally I think his delays and behaviour are getting more obvious as he gets older.

[Lyndalou]

I was told by another mum today that she was able to access a buggy for her 5 year old autistic child because of the danger aspect of going out and about with her (she is classic autistic and non-verbal).

 

She accessed it through a charity called 'Fledglings' - if you look this up online you can see what they are all about - and some of the costs were met by the Family Fund. I don't know if Family Fund is available in England or Wales but in Scotland you can apply for money from this fund for equipment for disabled children.

 

Might be worth considering?

 

[Noskcaj86]

I was thinking again today that we could really do with a buggy after he decided to stop right in the middle of the road when a car was coming towards him. I had to turn back and grab him to get him to move, Thanx for that, ill look in to it. But maybe they only help people who have a diagnosis, so may need to wait until hes had assessments done and a result. Ill look in to it and see