Flora Report post Posted September 7, 2005 In the summer hols I made a parental request for stat assesment for my 11 yo AS son. Spoke to the Head today and she said that she is organising a meeting between me, her, and the ed psych. So far so good.... however she then went on to say that she didn't think my son needs a statement and that you don't need a statement to access extra help anyway I'm totally confused now! How do I get round this? Also, could she be right???? I find it very hard to believe (judging by past experience) that when my son goes to secondary school there will be a host of help and resources just waiting to spring in to action when needs must! If the head teacher doesn't think he needs a statement how on earth am I, the parent, going to convince the LEA that he does?? This is the first time I've used this particular smilie but that is exactly how I feel now in abundance Now I can understand (though not condone) the LEA wriggling out of assesment when ever they can. But why the head teacher?? Surely she would think it was in everyone's best interests that a boy who has had to repeat year 6 gets an assesment even just to make sure he doesn't fall any further behind. I literally could scream, in fact I think I just might... my youngest ASD DS is actually screaming and shreaking in the garden as I type.. think I'll go and join him. Any view point would be most welcome (again Lauren Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tez Report post Posted September 7, 2005 (edited) Lauren, the LEA will consider all advice and evidence put to them and you can ensure in your parental advice that they are left in no doubt that your child needs extra help and support. Try to show that their problems are of long standing and that despite having extra resources thrown at them they are still struggling. If necessary send in additional evidence to the LEA now before they make their decision. Spell out explicitly why you think your child will not be able to cope without a statement. It takes a long time and is very draining but it is very important that you put your child's case strongly. I have recently sent my parental advice off to the LEA and they have agreed to assess my son despite the school's SENCO making it quite clear that she disapproved. You know far more about your child than the school could possibly hope to know. I had some great help from the people on this site who agreed to look at my parental advice and gave me some pointers. If you think it would help you to see it PM me (before Friday PM as I go away Saturday) and I will email you a copy. Edited September 7, 2005 by Tez Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Suze Report post Posted September 7, 2005 I agree with Tez, load yourself with as much evidence as pos and send it to the LEA. My son,s school did,nt think he,d get a statement but he did!!!.......I had to find visual and audio /hearing specialists to prove his sensory disfunction, myself and it cost but made a difference I think.Good luck keep fighting. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
phasmid Report post Posted September 7, 2005 I agree. By-pass the school and make the request directly to the LEA. They have to respond. They may come back and say that they believe that there is nothing to assess if they take the heads advice. You can circumvent this by, as suze says, sending in as much of your own evidence as possible. Copies of IEPs and anything else you may have. Just because the head doesn't agree with your request does not allow him/her to block a parental request for assessment - it IS against the Code of Practice! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
helenl53 Report post Posted September 7, 2005 Hi Guys, I hate to be the one that trashes the HT - but if they have a statement in place, then they have to conform to the provision disclosed at part 3 and normally meet this provision from their own budget. How much better would it be, to get the same funding but not have the provision for a child become legally enforceble (this is what the statement does) and to be able to be able to be a little more in charge of what HT considered to be special needs spending. Being a complete cynic let me be an HT - I need liposuction, a complete designer wardrobe and botox. Sorry, but no one defined what special needs were - I am only a HT - these are MY definitions of Special Needs. Best wishes HelenL Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
phasmid Report post Posted September 7, 2005 Your right Helen, but the issue of funding is the heads problem. They may not like it, probably don't, but they still do not have the right to decide unilaterally to not put forward a parental request for assessment of SEN for a statement because it may mean extra provision but no extra funding for it. This appears to have happened here, so, take them right out of the equation and send it to the LEA. The lack of funding if a statement is issued is an issue between the school and the LEA - it should not be an issue for the parent (I know it wil be but, that is a seperate battle). Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nellie Report post Posted September 7, 2005 Well said Phasmid Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
helenl53 Report post Posted September 7, 2005 The problem is Phasmid - the organ grinder and monkey are in bed together on this one and it is very hard to get them up! HTs like to be left well alone. LEA's prefer not be involved at the grubby end - so they have an unwritten agreement not to get involved in each others business - unfortunately - along come us parents to spoil a rather cosy little arrangement. Funding is not our concern but the only way we are going to get these people up and out of bed and smelling the daisies is to rip the ###### bedsheets off. If we do our kicking at the HT level - then we are only giving the monkeys a kicking. We need to give the organ grinder a kicking - but don't forget the monkeys are protecting the organ grinder - he gives them their daily nuts! THE ULTIMATE LEGAL RESPONSIBILTY FOR MEETING THE NEEDS OF KIDS WITH SEN RESTS WITH THE LEA. Sorry guys, but most of us have only been back at school less than a week and the same old cr*p is being thrown in our face. Best wishes HelenL Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
phasmid Report post Posted September 7, 2005 In a nutshell: The system stinks! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
UltraMum Report post Posted September 8, 2005 (edited) We went down the parental referral route, unbacked by the school, and ended up at Tribunal. We lost the case as the school turned round and said that they had put 25 hours of support into the class three weeks prior to the hearing. We were so gobsmacked by this that we didn't think to clarify how much of this was for J. The tribunal gave the decision against us as they said that the school need time assess how this support would affect J. We wrote to the school when the report came out and it took three months for them to confirm in writing that the support was in place - it turned out that the support was a classroom assistant for the classroom in general and most of it consisted of withdrawal of small groups for booster lessons - in which J was not included as he was academically ok! Guess what I'm trying to say is: it's a tough route so arm yourself with as much evidence as possible - especially if the head is batting for the other side. We had a private Ed Psych report, SALT report and OT report done. (Thank the grandparents!) Stood us in good stead, despite the expense, as the NHS SALT said J had a 'slight' pragmatic disorder and the private SALT said 'severe' pragmatic disorder - the LEA used the NHS report for the statement and ignored the private one totally. More fool them - this enabled us to query the report with the NHS and so the clinical SALT manager re-assessed J (I think she was thinking litigation!) and concurred with the private SALT, whilst pointing out that the NHS did not have the resources to meet his needs. This confirmed our opinion that most reports from 'public' bodies are increasingly based on the resources available and not the actual needs. Edited September 8, 2005 by MotherEve Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mossgrove Report post Posted September 8, 2005 (edited) We applied for a statement for our 5 year old despite the school saying that his social and academic abilities were within normal range for a child of his age and that he had no special needs over and above any other child and he was coping fine. (This was wrong so many levels!) We had the support of some excellent professionals and we got a stament and a special school place at the first time of asking with no appeal and no tribunal. I know we were very lucky, but many parents do get statements when the school has said they are not needed, so it is worth persisting. Simon Edited September 8, 2005 by mossgrove Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mother in Need Report post Posted September 8, 2005 My school refused to statement as well, even though I officially requested it. I finally contracted a solicitor who managed to get the LEA to take note and we are now on stage one; considering it took me a year to get to this stage, I am quite pleased!. The solicitor also threatened legal action to social services who were completely ignoring loads of official requests for assessments, and it seems like they too are now sitting up and taking notice, though they're still not doing things according to those guidelines, but my solicitor has made them well aware of that. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Helen Report post Posted September 23, 2005 (edited) Hi Guys, I hate to be the one that trashes the HT - but if they have a statement in place, then they have to conform to the provision disclosed at part 3 and normally meet this provision from their own budget. How much better would it be, to get the same funding but not have the provision for a child become legally enforceble (this is what the statement does) and to be able to be able to be a little more in charge of what HT considered to be special needs spending. Being a complete cynic let me be an HT - I need liposuction, a complete designer wardrobe and botox. Sorry, but no one defined what special needs were - I am only a HT - these are MY definitions of Special Needs. Best wishes HelenL It wasn't so long ago that a female headteacher (a former nun) was found guilty of stealing �500,000.00 from her school. Quote: "XXXXXXXXX Crown Court heard that in a display of greed that "would have made Imelda Marcos proud", the headmistress' love affair with footwear alone cost �7,000. Her lavish lifestyle included sunshine holidays and a journey on the Orient Express." Edited September 23, 2005 by Helen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
helenl53 Report post Posted September 23, 2005 Hi Helen I am glad we are on the same wavelength. I am going to have to make sure that I sign myslef with the HelenL so people can differentiate between us. Good name though - eh! Best wishes HelenL Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Helen Report post Posted September 23, 2005 Hi Helen I am glad we are on the same wavelength. I am going to have to make sure that I sign myslef with the HelenL so people can differentiate between us. Good name though - eh! Best wishes HelenL Hi HelenL53, I had a lovely invitation from one Krismite to meet up during the summer holidays, unfortunately I didn't get her message until a few days ago - my fault not hers I wouldn't have been able to meet up anyway as I live too far away from her. Then I began thinking... had she contacted the right 'Helen', so I asked her - she got back to me saying that she had made a mistake and that she had meant to contact you instead! The secret member - you know who you are , if you're prepared to pay for my return train fare and a few nights board at a luxury 5* hotel next year, then I'll be VERY happy to meet up with you. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LKS Report post Posted September 24, 2005 Helen53 I have to completely agree with you on this. I've always wondered why heads seem to have become more reluctant to support parents when they want a stat. ass. for their child. When my son was due to start the juniors 5 years ago and I asked the head what support they could offer him he replied he will get no extra help unless he is statemented, so that is the route we took. Fast forward to now most LEAs class ASD as a high incidence condition meaning as far as they are concerned this condition is common therefore the school get no extra funding to meet these statements. If the child has a statement however the school are obliged to at least be seen to follow it. You can see why they might be reluctant. Many people have said on here that funding is not an issue for parents to become involved in. Can you begin to see the reluctance that the schools may have. I have yet to see any evidence that LEAs take any interest in kids on SA or SA+. Come to think of it I'm waiting for evidence to see that my LEA takes any interest in children that are statemented! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
helenl53 Report post Posted September 24, 2005 Guys you have to be very watchful of this situation. LEA's have already delegated funding and responsibility to schools - and it is not working!!!!!!!!!! I think that what is happening is turning out to be almost as bad as the old institutions. We would be horrified at a return of them - but hey - what is happening to our kids in the name of inclusion. We have been at Tribunal this week and one of the pieces of 'evidence' presented by our LEA in support of moving my child out of a school where he is being supported and into one of their own, was that they had been very successful in supporting a child from reception to year seven. Under some very intense questioning my myself, they admitted that this child had only been in the classroom for the last six months, in preparation for secondary. When we asked where he would have been educated ordinarily, we were told "in an area adjacent to the classroom" - that would be the corridor!!!!!!!!!!!!! and folks, I visited this school and the corridors are not much wider than in our homes. My husband was absolutely horrified and stated to the Tribunal that in his opinion, this was cruel and disgusting and did not represent inclusion - six months max out of seven years spent in a classroom with his peers. Sorry guys but this to me is worse than institutions. Fight with every breath in your body to get a statement - I have a feeling that in five years time, they will be like the old pounds shillings and pence gone. Best wishes HelenL Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zemanski Report post Posted September 24, 2005 Com's head teacher actually asked us to request the statement because she knew the LEA would not listen to her because he didn't meet their criteria for assessment given that he was unmanageable in a classroom because of outbursts, unable to be left unsupervised because he was trying to kill himself, unteachable because his response levels were zero and a danger to himself and others even when he wasn't trying to kill himself we had her backing but we still had to go to tribunal. this could be another reason heads don't want to be involved - the LEA doesn't listen to them either! Zemanski Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
