So Sick of School

[lotty]

Why are teachers so incapable, I cant understand. one of my boys today is very clumsy and is being assesed( i you are probably aware) and i have said before how they wont make sure he eats at lunch time, and today he got shouted at because he went to pick up a map from a pile as asked and he knocked them over, so he picked them up and he got screamed at, even though he picked them up. why could she not have said, thankyou for picking tem up. I hate the way kids at school only get told off and not rewarded for doing things right..i know its only a small thing but i am getting really irratated especially since there part they played in his refusal for dla.. we have been considering home education for 2 years now. i dont know wether i will mage to keep them in until the end of the year

[PinkSapphireAngel]

I have felt this way most of the time for as long as I can remember and still do not understand what some teachers problem is hun

 

They wonder why we are always either having to write letters or get in their faces, if they all just did their jobs in the first place we would not have to, after all we all have better things to do than police them.

 

Yes there are some good teachers out there, but from what I see they are too few and far between.

[justamom]

All we ask for is a bit of understanding thats not too much to ask and in your case lotty and bit of

manners.

 

Its not really a small thing lotty, if you dont nip it in the bud now it may turn into a larger problem.. I do hope you sort this out, maybe talk to the teacher and point out his/her behaviour towards your son is

not acceptable....

[aro]

ex-teacher here!!!! I worked with some lovely teachers, and we were always taught to praise and reward the positive! Stress positives not negatives eg, never say "don't run" but "walk please"

I should also point out (although I appreciate as a parent it's not of concern with regards to your child) that in 2 years I knew 6 teachers go off long term with stress, if they cut the paper pushing and let good teachers teach it would be better for everyone!

Ok, will sneak back behind my sofa

Anna x

[PinkSapphireAngel]

I appreciate that and as I said there are some good teachers out there,

problem can also be the management of a school, no matter how good a teacher might be if the head is useless and uncaring it means nothing.

Teachers need more training specifically in asd etc so also need to be willing to learn.

[Suze]

my son has had some fantastic teachers and some (one in particular) bad ones.Currently he has lots of positive feedback and encouragement lots of praise etc.

[gladysmay]

lotty, just dont let them get you down, you are doing your best on your time, you will know when a line has been crossed and you are ready to keep him off - my son missed a lot of school because of misdiagnosis, beuracracy and sheer lunacy of the system and yes the ###### minded of sencos most definately. Today I feel like I'm sick of everything, the whole damn lot, I'm mad about the car not working, the continual bickering and whinging from my other teenagers, the failure get replies from letters and emails, I could go and on.... so here I am whinging to strangers and I think how desperate am I, well enough to reach out anyway and I guess that has to be better than burying my head in a pillow and crying, we all get those moments, so I do know exactly what you are feeling.... 'b***** the philistines and all that.

[lotty]

ex-teacher here!!!! I worked with some lovely teachers, and we were always taught to praise and reward the positive! Stress positives not negatives eg, never say "don't run" but "walk please"

I should also point out (although I appreciate as a parent it's not of concern with regards to your child) that in 2 years I knew 6 teachers go off long term with stress, if they cut the paper pushing and let good teachers teach it would be better for everyone!

Ok, will sneak back behind my sofa

Anna x

hello teacher, my kids school has 24 kids in the whole school, thats about 14 in the whole juniors, they really shouldnt be that stressed

[Flora]

There ARE good teachers out there, but sadly it's the bad teachers that seem to have the biggest impact. William has had a fairly even mix of both good and bad teachers over the years but the damage done by the bad ones has only served to make him remember the good teachers as a wistful memory. He has no confidence, low self esteem, is totally unmotivated and school phobic and it would take a whole troop of excellent teachers to enable him to get back on his feet again. One bad teacher for the past two years at school has gone a good way to blighting any happy childhood memories for him.

 

There is nothing that makes me more mad than listening to teachers harp on about the stress. I'm sorry, but they are adults who CHOSE that career and they have a duty to the children to do right by them; how about a nurse or a doctor giving patients hell and not caring for them properly because of stress? Their feet wouldn't touch the ground that's for sure.

 

Lauren

[aro]

Except lotty, that in a small school every subject in the curriculum has a coordinator who writes the policy, plans (daily, weekly, halfterm and yearly) and checks resources for that subject in keeping with guidelines,(the paper work for government is the same ) If that is being done by just one person, it is stressful! In a bigger school subject coordination is shared out, even can earn more to be a coordinator! Plus in a village school you cover several keystages and their appropriate subject threads in one class! Plus all the records and reports for each child, on top of marking! I wouldn't want to do it!

 

As for SENCO, again, in smaller schools that person probably has no more specific expertise than any other teacher, in larger schools they may pay for specialist to work there.

 

But I do agree that alot depends on HT and govenors as to the morale of a school!!!

Anna x

(have to admit though, I was going to home school my DD in preference to sending her to the local school we used to live near )

[Canopus]

I had enough bad teachers at school. It was more a case of which ones were good.

[gladysmay]

Except lotty, that in a small school every subject in the curriculum has a coordinator who writes the policy, plans (daily, weekly, halfterm and yearly) and checks resources for that subject in keeping with guidelines,(the paper work for government is the same ) If that is being done by just one person, it is stressful! In a bigger school subject coordination is shared out, even can earn more to be a coordinator! Plus in a village school you cover several keystages and their appropriate subject threads in one class! Plus all the records and reports for each child, on top of marking! I wouldn't want to do it!

 

As for SENCO, again, in smaller schools that person probably has no more specific expertise than any other teacher, in larger schools they may pay for specialist to work there.

 

But I do agree that alot depends on HT and govenors as to the morale of a school!!!

Anna x

(have to admit though, I was going to home school my DD in preference to sending her to the local school we used to live near )

 

paperwork!!! I have mountains of it, boxes and boxes of it, being added to every day, my contract with my son does not include holidays, a pension scheme or anything remotely like that, it is made of love, humanity and is forever and I do not insist on conditions of any kind to do it, I do not question it.

 

I am aware there are some very open and caring staff out there - I just have not met them, I haven't met a yetty either!? :)

[lotty]

Except lotty, that in a small school every subject in the curriculum has a coordinator who writes the policy, plans (daily, weekly, halfterm and yearly) and checks resources for that subject in keeping with guidelines,(the paper work for government is the same ) If that is being done by just one person, it is stressful! In a bigger school subject coordination is shared out, even can earn more to be a coordinator! Plus in a village school you cover several keystages and their appropriate subject threads in one class! Plus all the records and reports for each child, on top of marking! I wouldn't want to do it!

 

As for SENCO, again, in smaller schools that person probably has no more specific expertise than any other teacher, in larger schools they may pay for specialist to work there.

 

But I do agree that alot depends on HT and govenors as to the morale of a school!!!

Anna x

(have to admit though, I was going to home school my DD in preference to sending her to the local school we used to live near )

 

my eldest has a statement and that means a teacher for him, this was the headmistress that was being horrible, there seems to be five teachers in the juniors and the head teaches aswell. the teachers in juniors are part time- i feel i am going to have to go in at lunch times because noone will check my sn has eaten his dinner.

the boys used to go to a large school in manchester, they seemed able to report what where and when they did anything which was great, my brother is a junior scool teacher in london at a school with 60 percent special needs. i was going to do teacher training in sept to teach juniors, but with my whole family having special needs i am going to concentrate on them.. when there grown up tho i want to teach and would love to be senco..

[Ian Jordan]

There seems to be two major problems with education

1 everything is cost driven

2 there is a belief that special needs does not matter

 

This results for the school in

 

poor training

inadequate funding

short term objectives are to "tick boxes" not sort problems out

long term objectives keep changing

poor morale

stress

 

It is not just ASD - look at dyslexia, dyspraxia, ADD, ADHD, gifted children. These have the same problems as those with Aspergers and ASD. The whole of special needs is idiosyncratic with the fortunate getting superb teaching, the majority adequate but a significant minority an inadequate service.

 

I sometimes wonder if the organisation ie fragmented throughout the LEAs with different organisation and an inability to compare nationally mitigates against the children. Tribunals and appeals are difficult / complex and very expensive - they seem to always work against the parent, yes you may win them , but they take years, they are extraordinarily complex and quite frankly poor value for taxpayers money (the cost of a tribunal is around ?10 000!).

A complete rethink of system / organisation is required

[Canopus]

There is also the possibility that the state education system was a disaster from the outset. It has always worked as a one size fits all system.

[lotty]

There seems to be two major problems with education

1 everything is cost driven

2 there is a belief that special needs does not matter

 

This results for the school in

 

poor training

inadequate funding

short term objectives are to "tick boxes" not sort problems out

long term objectives keep changing

poor morale

stress

 

It is not just ASD - look at dyslexia, dyspraxia, ADD, ADHD, gifted children. These have the same problems as those with Aspergers and ASD. The whole of special needs is idiosyncratic with the fortunate getting superb teaching, the majority adequate but a significant minority an inadequate service.

 

I sometimes wonder if the organisation ie fragmented throughout the LEAs with different organisation and an inability to compare nationally mitigates against the children. Tribunals and appeals are difficult / complex and very expensive - they seem to always work against the parent, yes you may win them , but they take years, they are extraordinarily complex and quite frankly poor value for taxpayers money (the cost of a tribunal is around ?10 000!).

A complete rethink of system / organisation is required

you are right, i have all the above beging with 'd' and i failed misserably there, i have spent the last five years at uni getting somewhere now with lots of support, i feel like i have redone the whole of the seniors, only in my favourite subjects

[aro]

hmmm am I the only teacher here?

Ok just a couple more points, appreciate you've all had lots of bad experiences,

 

Ian actually high lights the problems of comments like, why aren't teachers trained for ASD? Well why only ASD as you see there are so many conditions that effect learning that the teacher training would take forever, ASD itself has many differing problems for different individuals. Obviously most teachers respond to the needs of the child in their class and look for advice from trained professionals in SEN.

 

Someone mentioned holidays and that being a parent is fulltime, yes it is and most teachers are trying to do that job too!!!! You don't have to believe me, but it is standard practice to be in school setting up by 8am and preparing and marking till 10pm each night and I used to try and keep one day at the weekend free for friends and family!

(also would love DR's pay!!!! as we are being compared)

 

Amongst the personal reasons I left teaching was that I felt the actual job of teaching was coming second place to all the paperwork, even now the government are trying to put LSA's at the front of the class and teachers in backrooms feeding the LSA notes Most teachers starting their training are driven by a desire to help children reach their potential! Not to fill files with paperwork that only inspectors look at!

 

off me soap box now and back to being "I"s mum!

Anna x

(and yes I had some c**p teachers too but I had some really wonderful ones too!)

[phasmid]

No your not the only teacher on the forum, there are others. There are also specialist TAs here too - including yours truly .

 

Please don't throw 'the decline of education is down to LSAs into the argument' . Some of us have got many years experience behind us as well as qualifications that mean we CAN do whole class teaching, planning and joint lessons - I even got to spend two hours today filling in some of the paperwork you mention as well, lucky me! But then I am a 'Teaching Assistant' and not a 'Learning Support Assistant' - very different roles!!!.Time to get off my soapbox

[Flora]

Phasmid.... what is the difference between a TA and an LSA? I'm interested because William will have a TA full time at secondary and I wondered if there was a difference.

 

Lauren

[phasmid]

In many LEAs it's just the title. However, in my opinion, a teaching assistant is trained (or should be) to assist the teaching, planning and lesson presentation. Their (my) role is to support the teacher as well as the pupils. A LSA is employed to support a pupil or pupils directly their role is to support that pupil not the teacher. It is, in some cases, only a subtle difference but there is a difference.

[aro]

Phasmid, I certainly didn't mean to blame LSA/Ta's for the problems, in my own experience they never had to take the class, but equally the LSA's I worked with were mums with no formal training (though as I left teaching a new course was being introduced) and they are paid so little and only in term time in most LEAs.

The point was teachers who have trained for 4 years to teach children will no longer be expected to do so! Can't see that helping with teacher recruitment!

In the case of LSA's for one to one support I do think it would be great if they had training in the condition that child has, I knows "I"s statement says the support will need training from the health authority (for CP and EP issues)

Anna x

[gladysmay]

I feel I have had to learn a lot of new things and to learn how to change my thinking and become 'AS friendly' - I did not receive any special training for this.

 

It is self taught and comes out of a need and willingness to engage with the issues and to engage with my son. You dont need any special qualifications to do this.

[lorryw]

Hello Anna,

I am an LSA/TA/SNA, the title has changed over the years but the job remains the same.

My job has changed dramatically over the past five or so years. The range of special needs within the classroom is huge and I would say impossible to cope with. Physical disabilities, emotional problems, learning disabilities and NT children all in one room. I wouldnt be a teacher for a million pound.

Working in class I feel pulled in different directions. Do I help child A who is calling for me to help her go to the loo and leave the child Im working with who will get up and wander around the classroom as soon as I move? Do I help the group who cant read the written instructions and are sitting waiting patiently. Or do I listen carefully and gently prompt the little boy who is crying softly in the corner to tell me what happened to cause him such distress (Mum is a drug addict and prostitute) although I know that he will never say because he is terrified of going back into care.Someone is complaining of feeling sick, another child is prodding anyone in reach with a ruler. All in a mornings work.

My school has over 50% special needs and the number grows larger ever intake. I love my job and the children I work with but I despair at the direction so called education is taking. How on earth are staff expected to help and teach such a diverse group of children?

[gladysmay]

Why are teachers so incapable, I cant understand. one of my boys today is very clumsy and is being assesed( i you are probably aware) and i have said before how they wont make sure he eats at lunch time, and today he got shouted at because he went to pick up a map from a pile as asked and he knocked them over, so he picked them up and he got screamed at, even though he picked them up. why could she not have said, thankyou for picking tem up. I hate the way kids at school only get told off and not rewarded for doing things right..i know its only a small thing but i am getting really irratated especially since there part they played in his refusal for dla.. we have been considering home education for 2 years now. i dont know wether i will mage to keep them in until the end of the year

I have found that when my son eats makes a huge difference to how it impacts on behaviour, he has to eat regularly, if your child needs to eat then maybe it needs to be seen as a 'real' issue and not just faddy behaviour. of course some thing will always be missed and as parents we cannot intervene all the time with everything, if they can survive it then all well and good but some things are a must.

[lisa]

This kind of thing makes me mad all the time and it's not just with SEN kids. Why do some adults think it's ok to shout and scream at a kid if they drop something, knock it over or fall over? You wouldn't shout at an adult if they accidentally dropped something so why a child? If the teacher knocked something over she may say to the class "oh silly me", she wouldn't expect the LSA to start shouting at her to "now pick it all up!"

 

It's downright bad manners, bullying and intimidation in my opinion.

 

Lisa

[Canopus]

Many of the teachers and carestaff at my residental school used to shout at kids at the top of their lungs and every other word that came out of their mouth was a swear word.