Lining up toys

[Stephanie]

Yes, me again, paranoid parent.

 

My 18 month old who has not really shown any traits so far (very different from my ASD son) apart from non heel striking and now a new one ... lining up toys!! Arrgghhh! I have just noticed him start to line up my other sons trains and books (like my eldest son used to/ occasionally does). He puts them all adjacent to each other in a line.

 

I know I do have a certain paranoia and am on 24/7 "trait watch" ... lol.

 

Do other kids line things up too, could this just be a learned behaviour, should I contact my Health Visitor about it?? Is it too soon for me to be worrying?

 

Of course if he is going down the ASD route (I don't think so ...???) I want to know ASAP as early intervention is so important.

[DaisyProudfoot]

Hi Stephanie

 

IKWYM about trait watch! However many children line things up especially little ones this in particular doesn't constitute a trait. If you are concerned design yourself a "trait" chart and tick stuff off if it comes forward, if nothing else then just to put your mind at rest

[LizK]

I get my moments with my 21mth old. He is developing very differently to his older brother, very sociable little chappy but his speech has been on the slow side and I do sometimes wonder about his eye contact and his love of doors !!! Then again there is so much about him that is very un-ASDlike. I don't know if I am just more hyperaware and would have ignored these things if I'd never had a child with ASD. He adores his brother so maybe he's just picked it up from his brother. I don't think he's got ASD as there is just a different feel about him though wouldn't be surprised if he does grow up with some ASD traits.

 

At Earlybird we talked about children lining toys up and how comoon it is. Apparently it's what they do when they line the toys up that differentiates ASD and NT. Even though my toddler is a bit door obsessed he will oftne play peek-a-boo around the door rather than just repetitively slam it like his brother did. Does your older son line toys up. Could your younger son be copying him. I would wait until your youngest is two and reassess him then. There is still too much variability in development and behaviour at this stage but you may have a better idea at that point

 

HTH

 

Liz x

[Bullet]

Do you mind me asking what the difference is between an ASD child and an NT child lining toys up? Ds1 will line his up for hours sometimes, he makes rectangles with them and gets very selfabsorbed with it.

[Jill]

At Earlybird we talked about children lining toys up and how comoon it is. Apparently it's what they do when they line the toys up that differentiates ASD and NT.

Liz x

 

Ds1 will line his up for hours sometimes, he makes rectangles with them and gets very selfabsorbed with it.

 

Stephanie

 

I think these are the two key points. My NT nephew lines toys up (he's 3) but when you ask him what he is doing he will say "parking my cars" or "we're getting ready for a race" so he is lining up toys with an intent, rather than just lining them up IYKWIM. BTW - even tho he sez he's parking his cars - it aint necessarily all cars that he is lining up, there will be other toys in amongst there that he is pretending are cars.

 

Also, he only does this for a short period of time before moving onto the next part of the game or losing interest entirely and playing with something else.

 

When The Boy lines things up, it is always the same sort of toy e.g. all cars. He also lines them up in size and colour order. The lines are very precise, he spends a long time doing this to the exclusion of all else & the whole purpose is to line the cars up as opposed to lining them up for a game.

 

It's sort of hard to explain, hope you get what I mean, but there are differences in doing this between my NT nephew and The Boy.

 

I can't stop you from worrying - you're a mum & it is your job to worry - but I don't personally think it's anything to get too het up about.

 

I think DPF's idea of a "Trait" chart is inspired. At the very least it's an obvious visual monitor for you to put your mind at ease.

[Jill]

PS I don't think you are a paranoid parent. I find myself looking for traits all the time in every adult & child I meet, so goodness only knows what I would be like if we'd had a second child!

[Bullet]

Thanks for explaining Jill . That's exactly what Ds1 does, he is very precise with it, doesn't want any interaction, doesn't seem to be lining things up other than to just do it and almost always groups things together.

[Suze]

I know how you feel about the paranoia, I was the same with both my younger two.I did note things down and discuss my worries with the health visitor, they both seem fine now.You never know whats natural development or ASD though .

[jlp]

Hi

I have been going through really worried phases since my 2 and 3/4 yr old was about 6mth. DS#1 (6) has AS.

 

I did take a huge list to the Child and Family Unit but it was agreed we'd look at ds#2 again when he was 3. They said with 'classical' autism it was obviously possible to diagnose before 3 but with 'milder' (As etc)forms they couldn't really assess before 3.

 

Atm minute I'm quite happy with ds#2, he's happy and sociable, was a bit slow to talk but has made up for it and has just started nursery 2 mornings a week and is sooo happy to go there. It's such a change from when ds#1 started and was so upset and lashing out and we were always being called in etc.

 

Things ds#2 has done which concerned me were - getting tins out of the kitchen cupboard and lining them up, lining cars, trains up etc, not liking his hands to be sticky or wet, he was a very picky eater, hysterical at getting clothes and nappy changed and so on - all things that could be any 2 year old but more significant when you already have a child with problems (and when I think of the things ds#1 did at that age - I wonder why alarm bells weren;t ringing loudly). Hard though it is I think unless soemthing is glaringly obvious then we have to wait and see at least until they start nursery when any differences seem to become more apparent.

 

On the bright side - as I said I've had so many moments of being convinced my ds#2 has AS too and as time goes on a lot of the worries have went. I still get my 'worried mum' head on and I think that's normal.

[Zemanski]

I have a friend with 4 NT girls and every single one has been through almost obsessive lining up of toys - mostly farm animals.

All dropped it I think before school but they're all really organised kids - no trace of AS though.

 

funnily enough, my 2 didn't line things up but Com is now (in his early teens) very precise about where everything belongs, in the case of his dragon collection they have to be perfectly arranged to the milimetre

 

Zemanski

[oracle]

I have two with autism and they did everything differently to each other when they were little - and I do mean that. Eldest never lined anything up, youngest did. Eldest would hide his head up my jumper rather than look at anyone, youngest would talk to anyone who walked past the house, never mind friends and family. There are things now which I see them both doing but not when they were toddlers.

 

Try and enjoy your youngest and worry if and when you need to <'>

 

Oracle

[PinkSapphireAngel]

I am so relieved someone has started this thread.

My youngest is 3 and I am very aware he is always lining tpys up, he says he liks putting them in lines, he likes lines.

He is also getting obsessed with washing his hands and will spend ages doing it.

He has no speech issues but can get rude and aggressive to people.

He has just got out of nappies during the day but this is not a suprise as both my older 2 are dyspraxic and they are already querrying it with him.

 

My eldest has ASD.

When I take them all along for the eldest appointments with specialist I do see her watching my youngest lining toys up.

 

I am trying not to worry or read into things but its not easy is it?

[Stephanie]

No it's not and it gets worse when you read threads like this and realise how many parents have more than one child affected with something on the spectrum.

 

When I had my son and in hospital they said "it's a boy" ... my first thought was "oh no, ASD!" ... however, if he was to go on to be ASD now, I would handle it a lot better than I did with my eldest. I would be more knowing, more understanding and would have the tools in place in knowing how to get him diagnosed early and help him going forwards ... and I certainly wouldn't love him any less!

[PinkSapphireAngel]

I am always saying how I wish Luke had not been my first as I feel I might have known more and he might have got diagnosed and helped earlier (still fighting for that bit of course at age 11)

 

I have 3 boys

[bugbug]

It could be learnt behaviour. I had the same problems when my daughter was younger and you are overly aware of what your other children are doing when one is diagnosed but she's fine. She still hits herself in the face (not hard) though and giggles and lines up toys etc. Absolutely learnt behaviour with her though.

[krystaltps]

I think siblings can show some traits, but not have ASD. My eldest was recently diagnosed, but my younger son shows some real ASD traits - he lines everything up, and it takes him two hours to eat a packet of fruit pastilles because they all need to be lined up and follow some system that only he knows before they can go into his mouth. He does it with coins, cars, cards, chess board pieces, etc. He also counts everything - his favourites being a packet of millions sweets or the little white checks in gingham tea-towels. But he has no social problems, no language problems, and is a happy, confident and popular wee boy. He's also extremely competitive at school - have just won first prize at sports day, and he's quite image conscious. Yes, he is obsessive, but I have no concerns about him, because he does not have the problems in everyday life that his brother has.

[Stephanie]

That helped Sheena, I have some hope to cling onto now!

 

Your son must be very patient doing all that counting - wow!

 

My little one is still lining up all the trains side by side and doing the same thing with farm animals - they must all be standing up shoulder to shoulder. I was thinking yesterday about taking the toys away and putting them in the loft - just to stop him. Then I thought about it, he is only just 18 months .. I need to give him longer.

 

I also have the other two areas of concern, he is a fussy eater and walks with his heels hovering the ground, much like my other son. I called and left a message with my HV today (she went through the whole assessment process with me before). I will see what she says.

 

On the other side, he is so unlike my other son as a baby, he is really on the ball with everything.

 

Oh bless he just walked in wearing his new wellies - on the wrong feet and not on properly, he is as proud as punch with them and cant walk without watching them. Ha ha.

 

Paranoia!?!

[LizK]

My little one is still lining up all the trains side by side and doing the same thing with farm animals - they must all be standing up shoulder to shoulder. I was thinking yesterday about taking the toys away and putting them in the loft - just to stop him. Then I thought about it, he is only just 18 months .. I need to give him longer.

 

I'm not sure that would really help!!! If he's doing it because he's autistic removing them won't make him unautistic and if he's doing it just because he's a toddler he probably won't be very happy!

 

 

On the other side, he is so unlike my other son as a baby, he is really on the ball with everything.

 

Oh bless he just walked in wearing his new wellies - on the wrong feet and not on properly, he is as proud as punch with them and cant walk without watching them. Ha ha.

 

Paranoia!?!

 

I still wonder about my youngest. Like yours he is incredibly different to my eldest, there is so much about him that is not autistic but I do wonder about his speech and his eye contact at times. I keep having to remind my self that no two autistic kids are alike and that just becasue he's not like his brother doesn't mean he's not on the spectrum though I think he would not be so greatly affected. I've noticed when I go to toddler groups he seems that much more immature than his peers and I remember that feeling with Adam and get a horrible sense of deja vu. He's still Daniel a little person I think is fab whether he is on the spectrum or not and nothing will change that and that makes me feel better

 

Sheena's point is interesting as as well as hearing about families with more than one child on the spectrum you also hear about siblings with just dyslexia, dyspraxia or slow speech. I do wonder if my youngest son may have some autistic traits without having ASD

 

Out of interest did you MMR your youngest?

 

Lx

[Stephanie]

Hi Liz

 

No to the MMR - we have ruled it out totally.

 

I am looking into the measles single vaccine, not the other two (rubella, mumps). There is no way on this earth I will let him have the MMR.

 

My eldest didn't have his MMR booster either.

[cmuir]

Hi

 

I don't think you're being paranoid. I think if anything you're far more clued up and know what to look for. I started to doubt myself and felt like I was analysis every little thing my son did. I think you get a gut feeling and there are moments you doubt yourself. I think you should flag up your concerns asap. Don't mean to be negative, but chances are that you'll be told not to worry. I was told this repeatedly. In fact, I was categorically told by several people (health visitor/GP/paediatrician) that my son didn't have AS. I knew there was something wrong and wouldn't let it go and kept on at them. Because I was consistent in what I was saying for such a long time, they took notice eventually. In addition, they seem not to pay much attention until a child is three simply because it becomes easier to spot things. Best of luck.

 

Caroline

[PinkSapphireAngel]

We didn't give our youngest the MMR and he won't have booster (we will get a blood test to check his immunity and then just get the ones he needs boosted)