Excluded again!

[justine1]

Hi all

My six yr old had been excluded again for two days after he bit a girl on the leg.He was very upset that he hurt her and he didnt wantto come home which was positive as previousley he didnt seem to care and didnt understand the reason why he had been sent home.He also cried alot as he missed out on the christmas party,it was heartbreaking to see him so upset but I think he has realised there is a punishment for his behaviour.

 

I am really stressed over this because it is the second time he has been excluded in a space of 1 1/2 months.The school had plenty of time to get him some support but they had claimed because he never had a diagnosis the ed phsych,autism specialist etc refused to help.Now he has a diagnosis they have agreed to come in to view/assess him but ed phsych is coming end of Jan and autism specialist end of March!So in the mean time he can continue to be excluded I was told today that many of the kids fear him and all the parents are angry and want to confront me,the school have said that a meeting may be arranged between me and those parents that want to talk to me,but I told the school that is unnessary because I will only be telling them what the school have already said and my son has been punished over the incident nobody is going to tell me to punnish him again.

 

I am now considering removing him from school if he harms someone again.I hate te fact that other children do not feel safe at school because of my son and he is only 6 My problem is (1)I am planning on going to uni next sept and in fact have a place,I am also studying at home now,so I NEED him to be at school and (2) he needs a statement because even if I decide to home ed and later he returns to school I will then have to start from scratch,and of course if he is at home it will be difficult to obtain a statement. So really I want to try keep him at school at least until Summer hols next July,the way things are going that looks unlikely!I want to give the school a chance to get him support and then see how he improves once he has that support.What should I do I am at a loss!

 

What makes things worse is the fact that my ex doesnt want to acknowledge my son has AS so he is blaming the school and not being supportive at all and therefore I cant talk to him about the options we have like home ed

 

Thank you all for any response you may have <'>

Edited December 16, 2009 by justine1

[Paula]

My son ..........16 in january.........has never had a diagnosis of aspergers syndrome........long story banging head against a brick wall no one could agree on owt gave up.............hes classed as moderate learning difficulties with features of possible aspergers...........he attended a mainstream school at 5 years old for aproximatley 1 year and was given 15 hores support a week............not nearly enough.Even with sup[port and even though the kids were only young wed all sorts of problems with bulying,kids being scared of him,parents utterly lacking any compasion or understanding and being hostile towards his needs............

 

I ended up pulling him out of the school through desperation.............id had enough........oh the teachers were hes got to come back ect ect............i said no he doesnt ........kids by law have to be educated but they dont have to be educated in school..that shut them up.I then procded to phone ever special school in the local directory of my own back and explained the situation ie his needs ect and asked if he was the kind of kid they admitted............to cut a long story short he was offered a place at a special school and we never looked back.My son though had a statement for special education.

 

Thing is and ive learnt from bitter experiance no one takes any notice of you unless you become a paine and lay it on the line...............,aybe withdrawing him from the school and "kicking" of a bit will hurry along the statementing procedure ect.Years of experiance has taught me that its the parents who shout the loudest who dont go away who are always on the phone demanding answers and action that get results.Otherwise they ignore you.

 

 

My latest battle is gettting reconition that my son is haveing a rough time dealing with adolences......no one listened untill it reached breaking point with himself harming and running away suddenly im top of the list and help will become available.

 

 

[JsMum]

 

 

Firstly they do not need to wait for a dx, if he was in assessments for AS then the school should of acted sooner, secondly I agree that the meeting the school want to set up for you so you can "talk" to the parents whos children your son is hurting is discrimination towards your son, your son has a disability and they are treating him unfavourably, they are also outcasting him against other children, I would not attend such a meeting.

 

I would contact ipsea as Im sure due to your sons dx and the lack of support your son has this is discrimination.

 

If the school feel he really is a risk to other children they need to be sharing this with the LEA to put in place emergency support 1-1 or looking at alternative education, it is not your responsibility while he is in school, they should be supporting all his needs, the way they acting this will erode all his confidence and self esteem, I understand actions needs consequences but if he has no support then they are setting him up to fail.

 

IPSEA are brilliant, also talk to the NAS Educational line too.

 

JsMumxxx

 

[justine1]

Firstly they do not need to wait for a dx, if he was in assessments for AS then the school should of acted sooner, secondly I agree that the meeting the school want to set up for you so you can "talk" to the parents whos children your son is hurting is discrimination towards your son, your son has a disability and they are treating him unfavourably, they are also outcasting him against other children, I would not attend such a meeting.

 

I would contact ipsea as Im sure due to your sons dx and the lack of support your son has this is discrimination.

 

If the school feel he really is a risk to other children they need to be sharing this with the LEA to put in place emergency support 1-1 or looking at alternative education, it is not your responsibility while he is in school, they should be supporting all his needs, the way they acting this will erode all his confidence and self esteem, I understand actions needs consequences but if he has no support then they are setting him up to fail.

 

IPSEA are brilliant, also talk to the NAS Educational line too.

 

JsMumxxx

Thank you so much for this post.Sometimes I feel so torn between defending my son and punnishing him.I still feel that ven though he has a dx the school think something more is going on at home like I am not taking responsibility for him or something.I have been on a parenting course and everything,I know I am not perfect but I am trying so hard to get him to understand his aggressive behaviour is wrong.I was thinking of calling NAS so I am glad you mentioned it and I will try IPSEA to.The school are claiming its not their fault he hasnt got the help they saying its the county and how slow and reluctant they are to give support.They have been sharing the info with LEA, with the recent incident LEA suggested a longer exclusion which would have meant he only returned after christmas,but the school managed to get it down to the minimum exclusion.However nobody has mentioned what we can do while we waiting for support,so I will definatley be phoning the above suggestions,thank you very much.Thank you to Paula as well sounds like you have had to fight alot to get support for your son,it is awful that we have to work so hard to get our children basic needs such as an education

[Kazzen161]

You are right.

 

There is a lot the school can do, without it even costing anything.

 

The school should have received the ASD IDP DVD - have all staff used it? It is supposed to be the minimum that staff should know about ASD. You can see it online at http://nationalstrategies.standards.dcsf.gov.uk/node/165037

 

Did they say why your son bit the child? There is bound to be a reason. They need to look at prevention at this stage - it will take your son some time to learn to walk away from something that is annoying him. (My son used to hit other children).

 

The school should be very careful about excluding him - as he has a disablity, they have to be sure that they have done everything possible to prevent such incidents happening, before they can justify excluding him.

 

The suggestion that you talk to the other parents in a meeting is disgusting. No way should they be putting you in that situation. They could ask you if you would like them to talk to the parents, or to send out some information on ASD, but to suggest they invite all the other parents in and expect you to "account" for his behaviour is not on. I am surprised they even told you that other parents are complaining and angry - that is for the school to deal with, but they should not be involving you.

 

Altogether, the school does not sound very supportive of you or your son.

[Sally44]

The only thing I would add, on top of the advice already given, is to get things in writing. It sounds like things are very strained at this school, not only between you and school but maybe other parents too. So, if they do say anything else to you ask them to put that in writing. I can guarantee that they won't. So then you can send in a 'clarification letter' stating what happened and what school have said to you. Keep all these letters on file.

After you have spoken with IPSEA, if they feel a letter to the Head of SEN at the LEA would be useful then they can advise you on the wording for that too.

My son did not have any support for a long time. I was told the autism advisory teacher needed a diagnosis before she could go in. So it took 18 months to get the dx. Then the AAT told me that she doesn't need a diagnosis at all!

So check everything you are told via organisations such as the NAS and IPSEA and post questions on this forum.

On a positive side, the fact that there have been a number of exclusions is going to work in your favour at the Statementing stage. There could be any number of difficulties at the root of his behaviour.

Have you looked at any other schools within your LEA that have experience of children on the autistic spectrum?

 

 

[Kathryn]

Hi Justine,

 

Yuu can request a meeting with the governors to discuss the exclusion - they don't have to meet if the exclusions total fewer than 5 days in a term, but even if they decide not to meet, you can put your views in writing to them and it will go on your son's file. Although they cannot overturn the exclusion, you will be sending the clear message that this must not become an easy option for dealing with your son's behaviour.

 

The head should also offer you and your son a reintegration meeting on his return: you can request this. He has no right to ask you to meet with parents though - I cannot see how this would benefit anybody, least of all your son.

 

You might find the following ACE booklet useful.

 

http://www.ace-ed.org.uk/Resources/ACE/adv...ExclusionLR.pdf

 

K x

 

 

[Sally44]

Have you also involved the parent partnership? I know some are better than others, but this area is supposed to be their remit. You should phone them up and arrange a meeting with them to discuss the exclusions, and the fact that your child is not currently receiving any supports in school and (still has not been seen by the EP or Autism Advisory Teacher). Tell them about the schools suggested meeting with other parents who are not happy about your son's behaviour. Together they should help you plan a way forward. They can come to any meetings at school and are useful as note takers and witnesses of what is said and agreed at meetings.

If another placement becomes an option in the future, then everything that is in writing is going to be useful towards that, and involving the PP can help you ensure that all procedures are followed correctly.

 

[Frizz]

Hi Justine1. My DD age 9,with a diagnosis & a statement, spent much of the past 12 months being excluded! Firstly a day, then two & on & on until she managed 5 days, with over 20 in total! For the most part her exclusions were for aggresive behaviour.In short, after much 'outside' help & advice, the situation got no better & her school life was miserable. Like you, I swung between being angry with her & angry with the school, because they really seemed incapable of managing her & coping with her needs.

Eventually we moved schools. It was a difficult decision, but one we are happy to have made. it's early days for her yet, but she is so much happier & the agressive episodes have reduced dramatically. She is still in mainstream,but the school has a social & communications unit. It has,for my DD made a huge difference. We just pray that things continue as well as they have been.

Good luck to you.

[justine1]

Thank you Sally44 for your message,I have the details of the lady from parent partnership and she is really helpful,so I may contact her and see what she thinks of everything but that will be in the new year.

 

Thank you Frizz and thank you for sharing your story.I wish I could change schools but my son is in Yr2 and has already changed schools 4 times(though only three schools as I returned to the area we were before so the school he is at he was there last year),not because of his behaviour but because we have had to move three times.The school is more supportive then the other two were,saying that he was happier and less aggressive at the previous school I believe because it was much smaller so he had more 1-1 support.I do think his behaviour may be worse at another school because of all the changes and his older brother often calms him down.I also have two other kids at the same school and i dont drive so at the moment changing schools is not an option.I am going to consider it next yr though and will consider mainstream as well as special needs schools.Thank you again for your response.

[Sally44]

If your child has a Statement and the school placement is one that has ASD provision, then the LEA have to transport the child. My son goes to the only LEA maintained mainstream school that has an autism unit and expertise in autism. He is in the 'mainstream' part of the school, but in a class of 18-20 children - 9 of them have a diagnosis of ASD and the remainder are on school action plus. So it is basically a SEN environment.

Some parents have been able to secure a place at an independent ASD specific school if the child needs that kind of educational environment and their LEA has no schools or places available. But no-one is going to tell you that from within the LEA/school system. So find out what schools your LEA does have for SEN.

My son is taken to and from school by taxi which is paid for by the LEA. Before he had a statement I secured a place for him at this school as a typical mainstream child. They had places so they had to give one to my son. I was responsible for taking him to/from school. In the meantime he received a Statement and we were going to tribunal. The LEA lied to me and said that as he had a statement they did not have any SEN places available. But I told them that if they tried to remove his place I would use Disability Discrimination Law.

So, even without a Statement or diagnosis, if there is a school in the area that is mainstream with an attached ASD unit or Enhanced Resource provision, you may be able to get a place there as a mainstream pupil. I know you've said you don't drive, but things can sometimes change in the future. So bear it in mind.

I think that you are at the beginning of the process, and maybe not aware of what is available out there. I'm not saying that it will fall into your hands because most parents do have to fight all the way. But if he has a diagnosis, and is not coping in school and is on School Action Plus and his IEP targets are not being met - then this will all be evidence you can use to ask for a Statutory Assessment towards a Statement. The school can start this process or parents can start it (and they can start it even if the school and EP disagree with you).

I would also recommend that you contact the National Autistic Society and ask them about Help seminars. And also ask if they have any specifically about the SEN process. It is worth going to find out how the SEN system works.

You can also download a copy of the SEN Code of Practice. It is worth reading about the relevent section to ensure that the school is doing what they should at each level.

Is your child on school action or school action plus yet?

You don't have to wait for school, you can be more pro-active. Having spoken with the NAS educational helpline or IPSEA - as I previously mentioned they might recommend a letter to the Head of SEN stating that your sons needs are not being met in school.

A diagnosis is very helpful, but not essential.

Parent Partnership can be very useful, even if they are just witnesses and note takers. But I found them not to be pro-active. So you may have to pump them for information or keep asking them what your options are. There are many things that LEAs do that are illegal ie. not even issuing Statements to anyone, not allowing children access to professionals to meet their needs - ie. just giving a telephone service to school, issuing illegal Statements that do not quantify or specify provision in them.

As you have a computer, go onto the IPSEA website and just have a read.

[cmuir]

Hi

 

I truly sympathise, having been in a similar position.

 

I'd urge you to think very carefully about taking your son out of school so as to prevent further issues. Legally the school and LEA have an obligation to identify and meet your son's needs. Removing him from school is the easy option for them and you could end up making a rod for your son back - if your son's at home, he might get to like being at home too much ie playing games, watching tv, etc. I battled with this notion when my son first started school. It was incredibly difficult wondering watching kiddo was going to do next and worrying about the other's mums bitching and gossiping. It's really stressful and upsetting. I note others have offered some good advice - just wanted to pick up on the above.

 

Best wishes. Hope things improve soon.

 

Caroline.

 

 

[Frizz]

I wonder if we use the same Parent partnership as we are very nearly neighbours! The LEA provide a taxi for my DD to be taken to & from school. She also left a sibling behind when she moved schools-It was hard for me to know he would remain there alone,but he doesnt appear bothered by it.I do so feel for you as I was so stressed by the school difficulties,it played on my mind all day every day. The frustration & despair I felt was unbelievable & it was making me ill. I was also cross that my DD behaved in this way. When I analised the history of her agressive behaviour,I realised it began when she started at that school (age7) & got progressively worse the older she got. I now feel that the schools inability to deal with her difficulties played a major part in this deterioration.I have since been advised by other proffesionals,that her reactions are extreme & are a learnt behaviour. She always has lashed out at siblings & other kids,but never at adults. At her old school she went for the teachers!! I hope that aged 9 it's not too late to to re educate her & teach her (along with all those other lessons & life skills!), that hurting people is not the acceptable response to feeling angry,stressed or frustrated! Hope you get things sorted soon. x

[Sally44]

My son is also now at a different school to his sister.

He was not making progress at his old school and I could see he needed much more input and support. I could also see that the chances of them remaining at the same school were so slim that I might as well give up on that, in the hope that moving him to a school that has experience of ASDs would help him progress. I don't regret the move either for my son or daughter. In some ways I think my daughter found it very hard as she was always having to get involved with his difficulties either in school or the playground. That wasn't fair on her.