Chelation Therapy

[Steve_colour-se7en]

Hello everyone, seems to be a little early/late as the case may be, you must all be in bed as there is no-one about posting, I have just placed this over on my site and thought I would place it here also.

My personal opinion about Chelation therapy is that I would never allow it to be given to my children because I just do not feel that the practice is a safe one if you are not familiar with it :Chelation therapy is a recognized treatment for heavy metal (such as lead) poisoning. EDTA, injected into the blood, will bind the metals and allow them to be removed from the body in the urine. Chelation therapy is not approved by the FDA in America, to treat coronary artery disease, but some physicians and alternative medicine practitioners use it for this purpose. It now appears that the first docmented deaths due directly to this procedure and cardiac arrest in children have now been documented which for me gives even more cause for concern. What are your views surrounding the following news article titled :FDA links child deaths to chelation therapy

Drug used to treat lead, mercury poisoning; often used for autism -

use the link for the article http://msnbc.msn.com/id/11640868/

 

 

 

Steve..

 

I think the boy means well but he is distinctly inclined to be inattentive......

Tutor of Winston Churchill to Lord Randolph Churchill,

Winston's father

[call me jaded]

This is a very complex subject, but there was a drug error in the case of the boy who died in August

 

 

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/06018/639721.stm

 

I do it with my son, not intravenously though. It took me one year to do gfcf diet, three years before I started this. My son's old bus escort came to see us this week after a gap of 6 months and was amazed to see him. As it has co-incided with his change of school we will never be able to 'prove' from where the positive effects are coming.

 

I wouldn't recommend anyone 'just starting' this.

 

I'm having an early start BTW - good morning!

[on the edge]

After much research I am using a "natural" orally administered form of a chelator for my son which is supposed to be safe at any doses and I only give him a very small dose.

 

He has made massive strides since his first diagnosis, but it is hard to say what is working for him as in a rather desperate panic from when I got an idea he was autistic I have implemented everything at relatively short spaced intervals. He is on a GFCF diet - (which I think has made the biggest difference) has vitamin supplements, dietary enzymes, omega oils, I have de-toxed his environment, give him epsom salt baths and he is undergoing speech therapy- I am even using a homeopath to give me another alternative opinion

 

I don't think I could do chelation intravenously as my son cannot handle injections/blood tests, and like any parent I am of course reticent to do anything that could be the slightest risk to my childs health. But I do want him to help him and I think it makes sense for the medical profession to investigate this area further and find really safe chelation treatments that are properly overseen by experts.

[CarerQuie]

I don't think i'd choose that route for my son.xx

[Tilly]

give him epsom salt baths

 

 

 

My mother swear by epsom salts for everything and I mean everything, but can you tell me please what are the benefits for our children. I'm willing to try but I'd have to explain to dh why. I can't see it doing any harm.

 

Tilly

[on the edge]

Just found this to give you a brief overview..and non biased I think. Hope this gives you some idea.

 

http://www.dietaryneedsdirect.co.uk/cnb/sh...hantPageDisplay

 

There is loads off other stuff about it on the web of course

[jb1964]

Just found this to give you a brief overview..and non biased I think. Hope this gives you some idea.

 

http://www.dietaryneedsdirect.co.uk/cnb/sh...hantPageDisplay

 

There is loads off other stuff about it on the web of course

 

OTE - thanks for this post - never heard of Epsom salts before - definitely going to try the bath thing - don't know if she'd take it in a drink - what's it taste like?

[call me jaded]

No!

 

You put it in the bath! My son rarely tolerates it and gets out pretty quickly.

Edited March 3, 2006 by call me jaded

[Lucas]

Chelation in Autism is based on the idea that Autism is either caused by Mercury or Mercury in the body worsens symptoms. It's trash.

 

There isn't any evidence that Mercury causes Autism in any amount, however the recognised conditions that can arrise from actual Mercury poisoning are not helped by Chelation either as the damage done is not reversed; it simply removes Mercury. If Mercury did cause Autism, than the rise in diagnosed cases of Mercury poisoning related conditions would have proportionally rised with it. It didn't.

 

The only 'proven treatment' for Autism is ABA and that's only because whenever a behaviourists gets near Autism they change the definition of it to a purely behavioural entity. The proper cognitive definition of Autism means it is incurable and non-seperate from the very person it's attached to.

[Guest hallyscomet]

Over here they say its not just Mercury, they say that ASD children do not excrete metals from the environment like NT children and if you go to a naturopath, even GPs are for it they say you can do a simple hair test that will prove this fact. An ASD child or person gets overloaded with these metals; as their body doesn't excrete as I said earlier. The hair test shows no metals present in the hair in all tests done on ASD children yet the metals show up and are present in the hair of NT children, meaning they are excreting the metals.

 

Ask yourself this is 2006, what are these metals building up in their systems, doing to them.........research has found some benefits, and many parents are trying it, and many parents are seeing their children not free of Autism, this is not cure, but not so debilitated by some of the symptoms, turning the scale down a bit, making their lives more tolerable. I think we need to stop and listen....not judge, after all look at some of the improvements they are making with cancer treatments, why not help Autism and I am referring to the more severe types of Autism, low functioning, what harm can it do....if you see more smiles on your childs face.....then thats the reason you get involved and ....trust and give it a go.....don't just write it off as a lot of tripe.....

 

Therefore, and overload of metals in the system is making ASD children more severe, ie non verbal, intravenous is not recommended over here but more natural types are being used with success and ASD children who were totally non-verbal are making improvements......fact......!

 

I am seriously thinking of trialling this for my son, so he can have a better quality of life, as at the moment tablets are his cure, but I like to think and believe that metals in his system are making him sicker and sicker.....

 

H.

Edited March 4, 2006 by hallyscomet

[Lucas]

I want to see proof/evidence that:

 

they say you can do a simple hair test that will prove this fact. An ASD child or person gets overloaded with these metals; as their body doesn't excrete as I said earlier. The hair test shows no metals present in the hair in all tests done on ASD children yet the metals show up and are present in the hair of NT children, meaning they are excreting the metals.

 

You may either need to rephrase this to help me understand, or if it's accurate of what you were trying to say then I need to know who is claiming:

 

'There are not metals present in the hair of *all* Autistic children'?

 

I have never read anything making such a clear-cut, black and white claim except from the poisonous cr*p that comes from Generation Rescue.

 

Having been one of those unhappy low-functioning children, like those exploited in those misery photos used to make alarmist and hateful claims about Autistic people, I'm not particulary moved by emotive pleading. I want the evidence.

 

Do not end up emulating Dr Fox:

 

"It is scientific fact! There is no evidence for it, but it is scientific fact..."

 

I think I will judge: the accumilation of misleading, false and just plain bizzarre claims made about Autism since before I was born have had an effect on my quality of life and they will continue to do so.

 

And the reason why tests are done on hair, which is an inefficient, inaccurate and unreliable test for what metals are in the body(blood is better) is simply that: because it is such a wildcard that the result you get back is entirely dependant on the strands of hair pulled on top of the probability that washing habits can influence it.

 

This is why they argue that lack of metals in the hair equals lots of metals in the body: it misleads, it's using a biased sample(the hair). If a person has a very low amount of metal in body, it would show up in the hair as a low metal content, thus leading to the opposite conclusion that there must be many metals in the body. When did they stop taking the bunsen burners out of science lessons for so many people to not think about these things anymore?

 

The case is more likely that Autistic people have yo-yo metabolism(and many self-evidently do) and the amount of metals in at any one time goes from low to high but never middle. Metals build up and are then squeezed out in large quanitites. But on that bogus test it would always show up as low in hair therefore high in body.

 

The Mercury hypothesis has been thoroughly debunked, which is why the sellers of Chelation are modifying the theory on the fly to stay in business. A few years ago it was just Mercury, now it's metals in general and one of the latest doing the rounds is that metals weaken the immune system so that dreadful Measles virus from the MMR or single Measles vaccine gets a hold in the spinal fluid.

 

It gets better: they seized upon 'evidence' that Leo Kanner was guilty of 'gross neglect' when he failed to spot gold salts when they 'cured' one of his patients as a potential cure. Nevermind that years before this particular patient was prescribed gold salts for an unrelated condition Kanner had already docukmented the supposed 'miracle improvement' attributed largely to foster parents training the intrinsic Autistic strengths. Gold salts are of course made out of a significant amount of gold and gold in the blood just so happens to be way worse than Mercury as a neurotoxin, the GR crowd were still talking about it as an agent to get *rid* of toxic metals!

 

Mercury is constantly derided as 'the second most toxic known substance', which is also misleading. It depends entirely on the form it comes in. I myself was suprised to read a post from someone I know on another forum talking about how in school the science teacher showed them a big bowl of Mercury and let them play with it- with their ungloved hands just as long as they didn't swallow it, throw it or anything else moronic. Let us turn our attention to the most dangerous element on the periodic table to all carbon life: Cyanide.

 

I'm seeing more adverts for that vitamin B12 now. It is also being trumpeted by the same crowd as an Autism treatment. It just so happens to contain many times more Cyanide than any vaccine does Mercury. If you're not supposed to eat tuna fish during pregnancy because of Mercury, how many deformed babies will be born before they slap a health warning on B12?

 

I am not impressed with alternative medicine. It shouldn't even be called that because it is rather more literal: an alternative to medicine. Complimentry therapy is good, but those replacing science with junk have taken leave of their senses.

[Malika]

Hi to all.

 

Lucas completly agree with you on that one, the only thing I give to my son is now extra vitamins A, C, D, E because he had such a bad winter with all sorts of cols and flue and his immune system was down.

 

I have tried few things in the past like magnesium an vitamins B with no results except the one to upset him when he had to swallow the stuff the fact is that my son seems to have good months and bad one without explanation, beside on an already fragile "biological" systeme anything may create an unbalanced which is not helpful, I had try other things in the past with my daughter because of her severe allergies but nothing worked ,however I tend to use basic natural ingredient like olive oil for a nasty caugh and sore throat honey or fresh fruit to help the immune system and not to use agressive medication.

 

Even the diet excluding gluten and milk proteins seems unsound to me except if there is a good reason to suspect an allergy or sensitivity which is determine by doing a diary for at least 3 months I had to do this for my daughter to help her with severe asthma and it worked, she eventualy started to eat milk chocolate when she was 10/11 and had some episode of sickness but eventualy her allergies stoped and now she can even eat eggs which she could not even touch (talking here about skin contact) when she was little.

 

As for my son I have seen that any disruption to his body like colds or stomac upset lead to some difficult time and I think that this is due to sensory issue as ASD children are more sensitive. In general I think we parents have to be careful about being exploited in the hope to "cure" our children and everything we try should be very light may be to help them coping with sensory issue without getting any extra chemical in their already sensitive body.

 

Take care all. <'>

 

Malika.

[call me jaded]

Blood tests are absolutely no use whatsoever for testing excretion of heavy metals. What's happening is that the metals are passing out of the blood stream by crossing the blood brain barrier (BBB) and sitting in organs of the body. Mercury, being attracted to fat deposits in the brain, this being something like 90% fat.

 

The hair tests are pretty crude. Look up Amy Holmes if you're interested. The only real test would be a brain biopsy and I don't think you could find ANY doctor willing to do that. I recommend everyone does their own reading on this. I like Andy Cutler. He spends many hours interpreting hair test results and shares his knowledge freely - his hair test counting rules are on the net.

 

http://home.earthlink.net/~moriam/HOW_TO_hair_test.html

 

There is a massive forum with 1,000s of members called Autism Mercury with a very high volume of posts. I read it every day for two years and still learn things when I hop back.

[sue1957]

Mercury is constantly derided as 'the second most toxic known substance', which is also misleading. It depends entirely on the form it comes in. I myself was suprised to read a post from someone I know on another forum talking about how in school the science teacher showed them a big bowl of Mercury and let them play with it- with their ungloved hands just as long as they didn't swallow it, throw it or anything else moronic. Let us turn our attention to the most dangerous element on the periodic table to all carbon life: Cyanide.

 

I'm seeing more adverts for that vitamin B12 now. It is also being trumpeted by the same crowd as an Autism treatment. It just so happens to contain many times more Cyanide than any vaccine does Mercury. If you're not supposed to eat tuna fish during pregnancy because of Mercury, how many deformed babies will be born before they slap a health warning on B12?

 

I am not impressed with alternative medicine. It shouldn't even be called that because it is rather more literal: an alternative to medicine. Complimentry therapy is good, but those replacing science with junk have taken leave of their senses.

 

 

Well, I'd sooner give my children a B12 supplement than let them play with a bowl full of mercury. Presumably this person quoted the science on the safety of skin exposure rather than swallowing?

 

B12 is a nutrient. Some of the possible deficiency symptoms might be a factor in some of the health problems of autism. A B!2 supplement isn't cyanide. You can overdose on nutrients, and sometimes they are better not taken singly etc, but that doesn't make them poisonous at the right dose and in the right circumstances.

 

http://www.westonaprice.org/basicnutrition/vitaminb12.html has an article on B12 as a nutrient, with a list of potential deficiency symptoms, and factors that can lead to deficiency.

 

According to this website there looks like there's going to be some trials on B12 and autism.

http://www.clinicaltrials.gov/ct/gui/show/NCT00273650

[Malika]

Hi Sue,

 

Sorry but the first web site you give contain not only too many "may" but as well most references are 30 to 18 years old and many are from food supplements manufacturer. Even the family in Whales use as evidence of Alzheimer was only one family so many studies have been made about Alzheimer that if vitamins B12 in any form could bring a cure it would be use the problem with disease like MS and Alzheimer is that their development is so uneven that it makes it very difficult to reasonably attributes a progress to a certain treatment except if the progress continue for a long period of time may be 5 years and even so MS for example has long period of remission making the result due to treatment even more hazardous in any case I have not seen any references of long time treatment in the first document.

It would be interesting to know however what are the clinical finding following the trial in the university of California.

 

In another hand the reason as well why so many warning have been given about eating lot of liver during pregnancy is because of the risk to consume too much vitamin A which has been proven to lead to birth defect.

 

Malika.

[call me jaded]

Methyl B12 is central to the mercury in vaccines question.

 

Richard Deth has written a paper which was presesnted to the Committee for Government Reform (a Republican organisation):

 

http://reform.house.gov/UploadedFiles/Test...y%20%20Deth.pdf

 

I would like to write more, but my children are jumping round me.

[curra]

Hi

It looks like a very dangerous drug and I wouldn't give it to my son. Besides, there is no/little scientific serious evidence that it helps autistic children, just anecdoctal evidence . Malika, I agree with you, I only give supplemets to my son to strengthen his defenses which are quite weak because he doesn't eat any fruit or veggies. The best source of B12 for a 12 year old is milk and yoghurt.

I'd like to know more about the calcium theory (too much or too little?) and its relation to autism, but so far I haven't found anything convincing on the internet. Does anyone have a good link?

 

 

Curra

[Zemanski]

I think there is something in the idea that people with autism often have a different body chemistry and can sometimes be helped with supplements and diets but again each is different, what works for one doesn't work for another.

 

just a little word of warning though, if you have auto-immune probelms in the family this can cause problems with vitamin supplements as they can affect the uptake and the impact of them on a person's body.

For example if there is sarcoid or interstertial disease in the family you should avoid vitamin D because the condition makes the skin photosensitve and this is increased by vitamin D in most cases causing the condition to become more aggressive and possibly triggering the condition in previously unaffected people (my father's illness seems to be traceable to a bout of severe sunburn and sunstroke which probably increased his vitamin D levels and triggered sarcoidosis, our whole family has been advised to steer clear of Vitamin D and to take extra care to avoid sunburn).

 

Zemanski

[LizK]

I think there is something in the idea that people with autism often have a different body chemistry and can sometimes be helped with supplements and diets but again each is different, what works for one doesn't work for another

 

That's the whole thing with ASD though. I doubt very much there is one cause, one trigger. Often seems to be a genetic predisposition plus 'something else' and is that 'something else' environmental or just luck of the draw? That 'something else' seems to vary from child to child. I've read such conflicting things about mercury I don't know what to think but seeing as my son like most current 3-4yr olds ended up having DTP vaccines without mercury (they ran out of them!) I think this is unlikely to be a trigger factor in his case. Then you read about other children who seem to have made dramatic improvements not just with chelation but reducing aspartamine, GF/CF diets and other biomedical approaches. Then there are others for whom it makes no difference. DS is on a dairy free diet in view of the fact there is a family history of dairy intolerance. Whether he would benefit from GF diet I don't know. Blood tests have shown he's deficient in iron presumably through his loose poos and I wonder what other trace elements he's lacking so have recently started him on mineral supplements. Whether it will make any difference to him physically or in terms of his ASD I don't know but have done the diet and minerals on reasonably sound scientific reasoning

 

The varied nature of what helps some but not another leads me to wonder if we are talking about different conditions lumped together as 'ASD' through common symptoms. Makes research into effectiveness of interventions harder as it's harder to isolate the subgroups which would respond to a particular approach

 

Liz x