How do people feel when a child is having a meltdown in public

[mygifts1306]

Just wondered how people feel when child is having a meltdown in public, or child is refusing to do what you tell them at Gp, or the Library

 

What do you do?

[trekster]

For meltdowns, it depends on their level of awareness. i guess you have to let them burn out unless they are hurting themselves or others.

Also ask people to politely "excuse me your stares are upsetting my distressed son further, there's nothing to see here".

 

Can you reason with the child who wont do as asked by the GP? Could you turn your orders into requests or even say "dont do x" in the hope

that reverse psych might help them? (only problem is they might be literal). For example one parent has said to her son "dont eat that it's (your brothers)" so he does.

 

 

[baranigirl]

DD3 still has tantrums / meltdowns which copuld be age related as much as anything else, I have been known to carry her under one arm, pick up shopping in the other and also welly boots she has kicked off at the same time and march out of the shop and plonk her in the car.

 

Now she is a bit bigger I would struggle with all that, but if she starts throwing a wobbly (as she did in Asda this morning) I keep walking pushing the trolley if I have one and ignore her behaviour. If she is so bad she is on the floor, then I leave her to thrash it out and just ensure she is safe from hurting herself. I know I get stares from other parents, but I just smile at them politely

[Suze]

It was something I found very difficult when my son was younger.I would pick him up and remove him from the situation as quickly as possible.He would usually lose it when other children tried to play with him , when he wanted something he could,nt have etc.Like most kids though a level of maturity and more understanding now he is older and he no longer loses it.He will just introvert into himself and refuse to speak and shut himself in his room.Alot of these behaviours could be attributed to being a tantruming toddler or moody teenager.But from parenting 2 other kids I know my sons reactions are alot more extreme.Even so I have found that both my nt kids and ASD son respond quite similarly to consistent and clear boundaries and rules etc.It isn,t easy when they react badly in public but hold your head up high , your a good mum.

[Sally44]

I used to feel embarrassed and judged by other people. And what was so frustrating was that it takes time for the parents to understand what is causing the child problems (ie. sensory issues, or language issues etc), or sometimes you have absolutely no idea what triggered it. And when it happened the worst thing to do was to try to talk to him or touch him as it just escalated it. When he was a toddler you could just tuck him under the arm and leave. And many times when he was older we have gone to places, arrived, he's had a tantrum about some aspect of the environment and we've just got straight back in the car and come home.

What I found harder was that as 'mum', it was usually me that had to deal with it because sometimes my husband could not and would just leave - whether it was the house or if we were somewhere else. Not always, but I do feel like I am the last resort and goal keeper, if you know what I mean.

It is harder when you are in a queue. That happened because the supermarket cafe had changed the names of their food eg. chicken nuggests became chicken chunks and fish fingers became fish nuggets. He just fell to the floor screaming and crying that he did not know what it was and started banging his head on the floor. Lovely! I think I apologised to the people behind me and said "I'm sorry, he's autistic" - but I felt bad doing that because that behaviour was not typical of him and I felt gave a very poor explanation of what autism is.

Now he is older he has got better. You do need to have clear consistent rules. And you do need to help them learn what they need to do when upset. For us it was to go to a quiet place and calm down. If it was at home that was his bedroom. If we were out it might be the car. He has got to a stage where sometimes he says himself that he needs to calm down. And we are now at the next stage where he is learning that 'sometimes' you just have to deal with it where you are. I think one of the hardest things about that is that parents, or other people want to talk to or touch people when they are upset. That, in my experience, is the worst thing to do because it is just more sensory input to be processed at a time when the system is not coping.

I'm not quite so embarrassed now. And I am fortunate that my son can communicate so I do feel that we can make progress, even if that is just discussing what happened after the event.

 

[justine1]

Hi

I havent had any trouble at the library or GP as they are both very quiet places,so Sam knows to be quiet.He does walk about(pace) and rock but no meltdowns. Shopping is hard as their is a lot of noise and many people going in different directions.He gets annoyed if people brush past him as he thinks they walking into him.The queus are the worst as he isnt very patient. I have sloved this problem by doing most of my shopping online and when he is at school.On weekends I try get there before 10am when there is less people and use the self service tills where often I can be quicker.I also make a list and know where everything is so plan where we going ffirst and let him know that way he feels he is helping when I suddenly forget something and we can get in and out ASAP.

 

Sometimes he goes to the front of the store and sits on the bench,at one shop where you can see the bench from all isles and the other shop he only sits when we get to the checkout which is when he needs to sit so again I can see him.

 

I am lucky in that he doesnt seem to have too many meltdowns when we out,though he was very "bad" from age 2-5.

The other thing I realised is he often got "crabby" cause he was hungry or thirsty so always made sure I had a drink and snack(biscuits or banana)at hand.I still do this now esp as we walk everywhere so he needs that extra boost.

[KezT]

well, my son is pretty much the same size as me, so picking him up is out of the question

 

TBH, now he's bigger, its sometimes easier to deal with as its obvious to most people that there is something wrong and I'm not just arubbish parent! The hardest things to deal with are when he causes damage or problems to other people trying to work etc. In those cases, I apologise to the people affected, but there's not a lot else that can be done!

 

We have worked hard on teaching him to follow direct orders even in meltdown - I can't order him to stop screaming (that doesn't work) but I can order him to "get out the library NOW!" and that way at least he finishes his meltdown in the street rather than in the library! Also we're much better at recognising the signs that a melt down is coming and can sometimes avoid it - or get to an empty place. but not always - sometimes he goes from fine to screaming in mach 3!

 

But at the end of the day, its just about ignoring the public stares or tuts and telling good doers to butt out! That comes with practise;)

[JsMum]

 

 

Definately embarrassed, especially now he is a teenager as he shouts out random names to strangers, kicks arles and knocks off items of shelves gets disruptive if we take longer than he can cope with.

 

J aviods like mad going somewhere like the supermall/market, bank, post office, he gets very hyperactive and his impulsivity increases due to been anxious, he dislikes the bright lights in many shopping areas, the noises all echo and are enhanced, and he cant anticipate where a person walks so often bumps into them, he gets very annoyed with the not knowing where a person is going to walk.

 

When J reacted with disruptive behaviour in the past I felt like an Imcomptent parent, small, very uncomfortable, shy, all of a sudden I cant talk, cant express Js difficulties, in the early days I didnt understand Js reactions and that they where due to sensory issues and I just thought he was having tantrums so I did often feel like a bad parent.

 

When J was a toddler in supermarkets he stripped to his boxer shorts, absaloutly everything came off, first it was his shoes, flinging arcross the floor, then his socks, then his tShirt, then his shorts, then he would run around in circles.

 

Back then I just didnt have a clue why he did this, but now I understand Sensory issues.

 

Now Im a lot more confident, more mature and I have worked very hard using visual aids to help J cope, he used time out cards which ment he could leave the supermarket to get fresh air, then we go back inside, over time we used planner to warn J of the impending supermarket visit, we gradually extended the time we where in the supermarket.

 

We use widgets to do a shopping list and this has helped him a lot.

 

A lot of it is timing it when he is calmer and not hungry, ensuring he is at a more stable mood to deal with the challenges of going out, we are defo able to go longer now, but he still does get disruptive, they for me are my signals that he is finding it difficult to cope with, Im very lucky that we have a fantastic sainsburys near us who know J and talk to him, they praise him when see him helping with the shopping, the shopping is vital for J because this is also corperated into his diet, as he chooses his ingredients for tea, so its essential he gets to pick them so he will go home and prepare them and eat them due to his sensory issues with food, so the two go hand in hand for us.

 

The last time we went to the Gp the hardest thing J found was the waiting time, we played tic tac toe, talked, but he became increasingly aggitated and really wanted to go, I kept saying we wont be long, I promise, the waiting room was getting fuller and fuller, he became more and more anxious, he turned his mp3 player on really loud and a really big man shouted at J really aggressively to turn it down, J just ingored him and continued, then the man got angry and said to turn it down, I explained that he had been waiting too long and he was doing it to go home, the man said well there is the door he can go home, I said no he can not he needs to see the gp reguarding his behaviour and he has special needs,the big angry man didnt show any understanding at all. then just as we were about to be at loggerheads full on Js number was called, as we went into the GP a lady said, there is poorly people here you know.

 

I just gave up, people dont see the disabilities our children have and I just had to deal with thier misunderstandings.

 

I do get annoyed at people for not understanding Js behaviour and his reactions to things he finds difficult.

 

When we got to the GP we explained what had happened and he was appauled with the patients waiting and said to ignore them they just dont understand ASD/ADHD.

 

Now when we have appointments we wait in a private waiting area away from the other patience, its sad in a way though because it just means me and and J are again isolated from normal society, but if it keeps J less anxous then it has to happen.

 

I have learnt over time to hold my head up high, not to be soo bothered what others say, though deep down I am, I just dont show it, I plan and prepare J the best I can and we have stratagies to support him, that is all I can do, the other option is not to bother going out at all, but then wouldnt be good for the pair of us would it.

 

JsMum

 

[lollypopz]

I used to get embarrassed by ds meltdowns in public,now I try to distract him or remove him from the situation&just let him get on with it as long as he isnt going to hurt himself/anyone.the best way I find of calming him down is to hold him face first to my chest and put my arm round his ears,I can feel his heartbeat start to slow down and feel the tension drain away from him.

in the past we have been stared at&ive kinda smiled politely&tried to shuffle out of the way.not anymore I let it run its course and if we get stared at ive been known to ask people if the would like a 'ticket' and they've soon walked on past

[simpsona]

What I found harder was that as 'mum', it was usually me that had to deal with it because sometimes my husband could not and would just leave - whether it was the house or if we were somewhere else. Not always, but I do feel like I am the last resort and goal keeper, if you know what I mean.

It is harder when you are in a queue. That happened because the supermarket cafe had changed the names of their food eg. chicken nuggests became chicken chunks and fish fingers became fish nuggets. He just fell to the floor screaming and crying that he did not know what it was and started banging his head on the floor. Lovely! I think I apologised to the people behind me and said "I'm sorry, he's autistic" - but I felt bad doing that because that behaviour was not typical of him and I felt gave a very poor explanation of what autism is.

 

Hi new on here but this is so similar to what happens to me Sally!! Hubby can't take it so just walks away leaving me with 3 kids in a supermarket!! I chased after him one day took the money and told him to go home lol! I still don't cope well with the stares mind, I hate it! I have done the same as you too by saying 'He is Autistic' and like you always kind of feel, should I have said that? A). Do they actually care and why should I explain to a total stranger! and . Does it give a good perception of Autism! You would think I would be so used to it by now as my youngest (4) and eldest (11) are both prone to a meltdown when in public it's just a guess to see which one it will be!!

 

Sharon. xx

[Mumble]

A question to parents: What would you like the public to do and how would you like them to react?

 

It's a natural human reaction to look at / turn towards something that is different / unknown / a potential threat so it's not necessarily staring in a negative way.

 

I've asked someone if they'd like some help before (I don't know if the kid was autistic, but they were struggling to get the pushchair with baby up a step with screaming kid under arm) and I got shouted at and sometimes when I haven't helped people have looked at me as if saying "well thanks for nothing" - it seems like a no win situation, so what would you like the public to do?

 

Aside from this, I have to say that in situations where there are rules about noise levels / conduct (i.e. libraries (but don't get me started on these as 'social spaces' :lol:) and GP waiting rooms) then having special needs shouldn't be a reason to allow the rules to be broken. If anything, there should be more impetus on enforcing the rules.

 

[KezT]

If a child is having a melt down, the public should leave the parent to deal with it as they see fit (unless obviously hurting or putting the child in danger). interferring with the trantruming child is never going to be helpful.

 

My solution of putting DS outside to scream it off works fine and reasonably fast unless there is a stream of interfering busybodies trying to cuddle him/ask if he is OK/ask where I am/why is he crying/who hurt him etc..... All of those will easily double the length of any meltdown (anyone see the programme on BBC where they left a crying child in a shopping mall and nobody helped? how come EVERY person who walks past my child stops & tries to help?). Equally DD2, who is still young enough to scream the place down on occasions, will stop much quicker if I just stand still and cuddle her immediately - idiotic shopkeepers telling her to "be a big girl" will just make her wail louder

 

In most cases the parent knows how to deal with things and should be left alone to deal with it - obviously its natural to look - but its also natural to pee, and most of us can control our natural urges!

 

However, if the meltdown is causing the parent difficulties with something else (ie cuddling screaming brat while trying to keep hold of squirming baby) it is nice to offer to help with the other thing ("shall I hold the baby while you deal with brat?").

[Tally]

I've asked someone if they'd like some help before (I don't know if the kid was autistic, but they were struggling to get the pushchair with baby up a step with screaming kid under arm) and I got shouted at and sometimes when I haven't helped people have looked at me as if saying "well thanks for nothing" - it seems like a no win situation, so what would you like the public to do?

Maybe someone who is stressed out and maybe feeling a bit sensitive that day may have interpreted your offer of help to mean, "you don't look like you are coping." Sometimes too, I think that many people are concerned about strangers coming into contact with their children.

 

I read a story once about a woman whose child kicked off in a shopping centre, and every time she ran after the child, the buggy tipped backward under the weight of the shopping hanging off the handles. Eventually an older woman came and took the shopping so the mum could get hold of the child and get him back into the buggy, and she was really grateful to the woman who helped. The mum viewed the woman as someone who had obviously been in a similar situation herself once and knew how to deal with it, perhaps because the woman was so assertive in taking charge of the situation. How she would have reacted if a man or a younger, childless woman had done the same thing, I don't know. Another person, another day, may have responded completely differently to that kind of help.

[Tally]

However, if the meltdown is causing the parent difficulties with something else (ie cuddling screaming brat while trying to keep hold of squirming baby) it is nice to offer to help with the other thing ("shall I hold the baby while you deal with brat?").

But would you really allow a stranger to hold your baby?

[Mumble]

unless there is a stream of interfering busybodies trying to cuddle him/ask if he is OK/ask where I am/why is he crying/who hurt him etc..... All of those will easily double the length of any meltdown (anyone see the programme on BBC where they left a crying child in a shopping mall and nobody helped? how come EVERY person who walks past my child stops & tries to help?).

But how would a member of the public know which of these situations they are dealing with - both look like a distressed child on their own, yet in one case helping is viewed as being an interfering busybody whilst in the other not helping is being uncaring and leaving a vulnerable child alone. The public can't win - they're wrong if they try to help, they're wrong if they don't help.

 

[justine1]

I agree with you Mumble I mentioned before that on a whole I have had very few bad experiences with people when any of my kids have thrown tantrums. I think the example that Kez gave is one I experience alot where people say "oh whats all that noise for your poor mum...." I always smile politley they only trying to help.To be honest it works with my youngest as he gets all shy/embarrassed and actually listens to them talk.

 

Today I experienced something that was not very nice,we were waiting for the bus and I let Eli out the pushchair he was running up and down(its a very open space not a station) and squealing as he was excited-he hadnt been let out for 2hours!!!! He was not bumping into anyone,not crying nothing,he was just a happy little baby. This women started tutting and rolling her eyes,I never said anything to her but said loudly "why do some people act as though they never seen a happy child before?"She looked in my direction and I aited for her response but she didnt which showed she knew she was being a stupid women!!!

 

Then the driver was the opposite Eli was now tired from all the running about and was crying he said "you got your hands full" I said yes I got four boys he then told me he was one of six boys and his mum had 10 kids he was very chatty and even though Eli was screaming he carried on very nice man indeed. Before that at the shops Sam was jumping to reach some cereal and a man said which one you want son and passed it to him,he even looked like he was in a rush but still took the time

 

As you say libraries,Gps and museums are examples of where its a no,no to make noise and can completely understand if any of mine were loud and someone asked me to leave,and I would except if its the GP as I only go for important things anyway.But I warn them when they go that they need to be quiet and they always are,a bit of bribery works at times.

 

I also offered help to a mum once and she said "whats your problem ugly cow" so now I dont bother.I think its sad as the culture of trying to help is fading away cause parents think others are interfering.I was talking about this with my eldest the other day and I said did you know that in the good old days if a neighbour saw you misbehaving they can clout you round the ears,he was surprised.But this worked in most cases,there werent as many yobs about.Not that I am pro smacking

Edited July 1, 2010 by justine1

[KezT]

But how would a member of the public know which of these situations they are dealing with - both look like a distressed child on their own, yet in one case helping is viewed as being an interfering busybody whilst in the other not helping is being uncaring and leaving a vulnerable child alone. The public can't win - they're wrong if they try to help, they're wrong if they don't help.

 

well, there is a difference between a distressed child and a trantruming one;) there is kicking and screaming and anger as opposed to worry, silent tears/sobbing.....

 

But I would think that the fact that I am hanging around attentively watching him would help a bit too.....

 

as to would I let someone hold my baby in that situation - yes! I would expect them to stay close by and in my line of sight, but the world is full of helpful and nice people. there are very few axe murderers out there and no more now than ever before (in fact statistically quite a lot less!). the media has got a lot to answer for.......

Edited July 1, 2010 by KezT

[baranigirl]

But would you really allow a stranger to hold your baby?

 

 

Yes in times of need I have done through no other choice, it involved in getting the bus outside my house, with a broken arm and an old unfriendly type of double decker, meaning I had to fold up my double buggy, deal with a toddler who is likely to run into the road and a baby who cannot walk...

[JsMum]

Aside from this, I have to say that in situations where there are rules about noise levels / conduct (i.e. libraries (but don't get me started on these as 'social spaces' :lol:) and GP waiting rooms) then having special needs shouldn't be a reason to allow the rules to be broken. If anything, there should be more impetus on enforcing the rules.

Maybe next time mumble you can take J to the gp for me, it was incredibly hard to contain J in a waiting room while we waited for the gp which we where seeing as J has been experiencing high anxieties and disrutive behaviour, at home and school, we where struggling to access a psychiatrist because of constraints of the fact he was residing in a residential school so making it absaloutly a nightmare to get a phsychiatrist to assess him, it took another four weeks, emergency gp call and an emergency gp visit before we where successful on a referal to a cams.

 

We are under a great deal of stress at the presant time and dealing with Js behaviour is leading to crisis, what else do you want me to do with him when I have consdierable concerns, ok I admit he shouldnt be playing his music, but it was a distraction he was using to aviod been in the crowded waiting room, he just wanted to escape, he couldnt wait anymore, if Im having difficulties with his behaviour at home, then obvosuly thats going to be so outside and elsewhere, I think you should be more understanding, condisidering your supose to work with children with ASDs.

 

JsMumx

 

[baddad]

Maybe next time mumble you can take J to the gp for me, it was incredibly hard to contain J in a waiting room while we waited for the gp which we where seeing as J has been experiencing high anxieties and disrutive behaviour, at home and school, we where struggling to access a psychiatrist because of constraints of the fact he was residing in a residential school so making it absaloutly a nightmare to get a phsychiatrist to assess him, it took another four weeks, emergency gp call and an emergency gp visit before we where successful on a referal to a cams.

 

We are under a great deal of stress at the presant time and dealing with Js behaviour is leading to crisis, what else do you want me to do with him when I have consdierable concerns, ok I admit he shouldnt be playing his music, but it was a distraction he was using to aviod been in the crowded waiting room, he just wanted to escape, he couldnt wait anymore, if Im having difficulties with his behaviour at home, then obvosuly thats going to be so outside and elsewhere, I think you should be more understanding, condisidering your supose to work with children with ASDs.

 

JsMumx

 

 

Hi j's mum -

I don't think it's particularly fair of you to have a go at mumble because your own child's behaviour in public places is unreasonable, even if the situation is difficult for you. Similarly, the crisis you now find yourself in may have nothing to do whatsoever with autism, but with the way you have handled the behaviours you have 'blamed' on autism to date.

Sorry - I think 'meltdowns' can have at least as much to do with the parent's responses as they do the impulses of the child, and that applies to all children, whether autistic or not. Children of two have 'meltdowns'... parental responses to those meltdowns help the child to understand the consequences of those behaviours. Autism can complicate that dynamic but does not change the underlying principles, and in either case (autism or NT) removing the expectation of 'good behaviour' and rewarding it by 'caving in' will lead to escalation. Parents of non-autistic children also make excuses for why they don't follow through on sanctions or discipline - usually that it just 'makes things worse' - but it's much safer ground for parents of autistic children.

 

In the simplest terms, children behave like children until they learn not to. That has nothing to do with chronological age, but has everything to do with expectation and understanding - both on the part of parent and child. The child, as mumble rightly pointed out (with, IMO, a very realistic 'understanding' of the dynamics involved from your quote), may need more guidance than some in achieving that understanding and fulfilling that expectation, but that being the case it only places a firmer imperative on the parent to ensure that the message is delivered clearly. Not doing so can only make the situation worse. A parent in denial about the 'human' nature of their child - who places blame for perfectly natural behaviours on 'other' influences ( the NT parents cry is often 'he/she fell in with the wrong crowd')- just muddies the waters further.

 

Coming back to original question 'what do you do', it depended on the situation. Whether my son liked it or not there was a learning curve he needed to learn or otherwise face a life of compromises. So if his behaviour at (i.e.) the doctors was reactionary (i.e. based on 'fear' because he needed blood taken) I would do everything i could to help him overcome it. If it was 'controlling' - because he was bored, or wanted to be somewehere else or because he was directly 'challenging me' in a situation he felt made sanctions more difficult - then he would be sanctioned, even if it meant waiting a while (and while i agree in general with the principle that sanctions should be immediate it is not always possible... in that case, a late sanction with the reasons firmly explained is the lesser of two evils when compared to no sanction, or, to put that into context, the 'reward' of getting away with it). Yes, it can be difficult for the parent to tell the difference, but often that 'difficulty' is exaggerated purely because the parent doesn't want to admit the reality either to themselves or the wider viewer.

I'm with Ros Blackburn on this one (see purple quote below) regardless of whether the circumstances are queing at Disneyland or sitting in the doctor's surgery or doing the shopping or looking for books at the library.

 

L&P

 

BD

Edited July 2, 2010 by baddad

[JsMum]

Perhaps you just left it too late and the patterns of behaviour are already too well established? Not mumble's fault, though, and understanding is a two way street...

 

 

L&P

 

BD

 

 

Maybe your just too opinionated. and I know I have done my best with J, we are having difficult time of it at the moment and J has very high anxieties at present.

 

JsMumx

 

[baddad]

Maybe your just too opinionated. and I know I have done my best with J, we are having difficult time of it at the moment and J has very high anxieties at present.

 

JsMumx

 

 

I edited that post (before i saw the above) because it was far too flippant. I hope the edited version is clearer. I am sorry you are having a hard time with J but it doesn't detract from my opinion - and why is someone who disagrees with your 'take' on things opinionated? Mumble, as someone with AS, may have valid insight into the situation that you do not have. I, as a parent who has overcome most of the problems that seem to define your relationship with your child, may have some valuable insight into that dynamic. The thing is, opinions are like bummoles - everyone's got one. We are all opinionated.

 

L&P

 

BD

[Mumble]

JsMum - Please do not send me any more abusive PMs regarding this (or any other) topic.

 

In asking how ASD and ADHD could coexist, I was not being any of the horrible words you used, I was asking how the diagnosis, when at points the criteria are polar opposites, could be given together.

 

Yes I do work with children on the spectrum - please don't accuse me of lying and making such things up. But when I work with them, I don't let them get away with things because they're autistic, they still have to fit within acceptable behaviours that would apply to any child.

 

I stand by what I said about the GP waiting area - there are rules and these need to be followed, some people waiting may have been very unwell and having to deal with that disturbance is the last thing they need. If it was really as difficult as you say, there were other options - go when he's at school, phone the GP etc.

 

If you do continue to send me PMs despite me having done nothing other than have an opinion, I'll have no option but to report you to the moderators. I don't know why you're so angry, but I can't see that it's something I have done and perhaps you should examine your own issues before taking them out on other people. I am writing this here because I am not prepared to enter into a discussion via PM with you.

 

[JsMum]

JsMum - Please do not send me any more abusive PMs regarding this (or any other) topic.

 

In asking how ASD and ADHD could coexist, I was not being any of the horrible words you used, I was asking how the diagnosis, when at points the criteria are polar opposites, could be given together.

 

Yes I do work with children on the spectrum - please don't accuse me of lying and making such things up. But when I work with them, I don't let them get away with things because they're autistic, they still have to fit within acceptable behaviours that would apply to any child.

 

I stand by what I said about the GP waiting area - there are rules and these need to be followed, some people waiting may have been very unwell and having to deal with that disturbance is the last thing they need. If it was really as difficult as you say, there were other options - go when he's at school, phone the GP etc.

 

If you do continue to send me PMs despite me having done nothing other than have an opinion, I'll have no option but to report you to the moderators. I don't know why you're so angry, but I can't see that it's something I have done and perhaps you should examine your own issues before taking them out on other people. I am writing this here because I am not prepared to enter into a discussion via PM with you.

 

The ADHD/ASD bottom line is there is A LOT of children with both conditions, so they do actually co exist dont they,

 

Sadly Js anxieties do raise to the point his behaviour is unexceptable, and his way of COMMUNICATING that is he uses AVIODANCE behaviours, Distraction, Behavioural issues, it is not his fault either that he could NOT wait any longer and was no longer ABLE to wait in a Crowded waiting room, of which I was actually taking because of concerns over his own mental, emotional health and in the past his Anxieties have actually caused HIM TO BE UNWELL TOO.

 

The GP had no issues with Js reactions, he actually UNDERSTOOD, not like some here, which I thought was a forum where people understood but obvously they dont, just because you work with special needs doesnt actually make you more of an expert than me, just because Im a struggling parent doesnt make you better than me oK, you dont look after the children at work on your own, your part of a TEAM of people who have back up if it goes into kick off mode, here at home there is JUST ME.

 

I know his behaviour was unexceptable, but there was a reason to his behaviour, I am not blaming, using Autism, I actually used the words Anxieties, and special needs.

 

And yes it was very hard to get J even to the GP in the first place, as it is anywhere lately, even to the bank or other small tasks that I need to do, and NO I have not got the luxuary of leaving him with anyone when he is at home, if he needed a GP at shcool he would of gone to the gp at school, and the GP understand J cant wait in a crowded place now and we have a seperate waiting area so hopefully it wont happen again but J wont be under so much stress waiting next time.

 

As for the pm I did that so it could be sorted out between us privately, I hadnt realised you wanted it to be a open debate for all to see.

 

JsMumx

 

[JsMum]

I edited that post (before i saw the above) because it was far too flippant. I hope the edited version is clearer. I am sorry you are having a hard time with J but it doesn't detract from my opinion - and why is someone who disagrees with your 'take' on things opinionated? Mumble, as someone with AS, may have valid insight into the situation that you do not have. I, as a parent who has overcome most of the problems that seem to define your relationship with your child, may have some valuable insight into that dynamic. The thing is, opinions are like bummoles - everyone's got one. We are all opinionated.

 

L&P

 

BD

so just because you seem to be getter better results with your son, any of my attempts I do with my son where it doesnt actually work, or it fails it must because of parenting issues, Baddad I try my ABSALOUT best with J, you really do make me feel I should give up parenting J and that I should just put him in care because Im obvously too incapable of doing it.

 

I have to say his behaviour in the Gp waiting room HAS actually improved, in the past he would strip off, run around, switch off all the light switches on and off, knock into people, and generally cause havoc, the fact I have actually got him to a stage where he will actually sit down fully clothed and in a decent mood is a MASSIVE step.

 

I dont need to be made to feel any more crapper than I feel already badad about my parenting so what ever you say I cant feel any lower.

 

I cant see how this can be a forum where parents get support.

 

 

JsMUMX

 

[JsMum]

Hi j's mum -

I don't think it's particularly fair of you to have a go at mumble because your own child's behaviour in public places is unreasonable, even if the situation is difficult for you. Similarly, the crisis you now find yourself in may have nothing to do whatsoever with autism, but with the way you have handled the behaviours you have 'blamed' on autism to date.

Sorry - I think 'meltdowns' can have at least as much to do with the parent's responses as they do the impulses of the child, and that applies to all children, whether autistic or not. Children of two have 'meltdowns'... parental responses to those meltdowns help the child to understand the consequences of those behaviours. Autism can complicate that dynamic but does not change the underlying principles, and in either case (autism or NT) removing the expectation of 'good behaviour' and rewarding it by 'caving in' will lead to escalation. Parents of non-autistic children also make excuses for why they don't follow through on sanctions or discipline - usually that it just 'makes things worse' - but it's much safer ground for parents of autistic children.

 

In the simplest terms, children behave like children until they learn not to. That has nothing to do with chronological age, but has everything to do with expectation and understanding - both on the part of parent and child. The child, as mumble rightly pointed out (with, IMO, a very realistic 'understanding' of the dynamics involved from your quote), may need more guidance than some in achieving that understanding and fulfilling that expectation, but that being the case it only places a firmer imperative on the parent to ensure that the message is delivered clearly. Not doing so can only make the situation worse. A parent in denial about the 'human' nature of their child - who places blame for perfectly natural behaviours on 'other' influences ( the NT parents cry is often 'he/she fell in with the wrong crowd')- just muddies the waters further.

 

Coming back to original question 'what do you do', it depended on the situation. Whether my son liked it or not there was a learning curve he needed to learn or otherwise face a life of compromises. So if his behaviour at (i.e.) the doctors was reactionary (i.e. based on 'fear' because he needed blood taken) I would do everything i could to help him overcome it. If it was 'controlling' - because he was bored, or wanted to be somewehere else or because he was directly 'challenging me' in a situation he felt made sanctions more difficult - then he would be sanctioned, even if it meant waiting a while (and while i agree in general with the principle that sanctions should be immediate it is not always possible... in that case, a late sanction with the reasons firmly explained is the lesser of two evils when compared to no sanction, or, to put that into context, the 'reward' of getting away with it). Yes, it can be difficult for the parent to tell the difference, but often that 'difficulty' is exaggerated purely because the parent doesn't want to admit the reality either to themselves or the wider viewer.

I'm with Ros Blackburn on this one (see purple quote below) regardless of whether the circumstances are queing at Disneyland or sitting in the doctor's surgery or doing the shopping or looking for books at the library.

 

L&P

 

BD

 

So in a nut shell Js beahviour is because of my parenting is that what your saying, absaloutly nothing at all to do with the fact he has High Anxieties, ASD Needs, ADHD and other COMPLEX needs, his behaviour is the result because he is dealing with waiting, been bored, dealing with overload of sensory exct.....

 

I am alway giving J consequences for his actions, sadly his reaction is violence and aggression, the whole reason we where at the GP waiting for a long time in a crowded waiting room where he could not cope in that where due to his special needs.

 

 

LORDY GIVE ME STRENGTH.

 

JsMum

 

Edited July 2, 2010 by JsMum

[Mumble]

I cant see how this can be a forum where parents get support.

There is a world of difference between constructive support and the type of 'support' you appear to be after which may, on the surface, appear supportive to you (of the sort "ah, there there, poor JsMum, don't you have it tough, have a pat on the head") but that's not going to help you in the long run. A forum like these allows people to give other perspectives, people who are not so closely involved and can therefore give a more objective impartial view. Just because you don't like or agree with something someone says, doesn't mean that they (or you) are wrong or getting at you, simply that they have a different perspective.

 

I am not blaming, using Autism, I actually used the words Anxieties, and special needs.

Potato/Portaaartoe, Tomato/Tomaaaartoe :lol: What's that saying, 'A rose by any other name...' - you're still allowing it based on whatever terminology you use.

 

I'm afraid I don't feel we have anything to sort out (other than perhaps you apologising for the language you have used towards me). You clearly haven't actually read my posts correctly otherwise you would see that your (angry) reply doesn't answer them:

The ADHD/ASD bottom line is there is A LOT of children with both conditions, so they do actually co exist dont they

I've already acknowledged (I think these two threads have become confused so it may be in the other thread) that many children are dx'ed with both ADHD and ASD. I'm not disputing that. All I was asking, and which others have provided some non-personal replies to, is how the two can be dx'ed when some of the criteria contradict each other. My question was how not if.

 

[JsMum]

There is a world of difference between constructive support and the type of 'support' you appear to be after which may, on the surface, appear supportive to you (of the sort "ah, there there, poor JsMum, don't you have it tough, have a pat on the head") but that's not going to help you in the long run.

now thats just patronising and actually a heck of a lot of parents write on the forum of how much of a tugh time there having, I have actually supported a lot of parents who ARE INFACT struggling, are you enjoying this mumble, do you have children of your own with ADHD/ASD? its a lot different pareting them.

 

 

A forum like these allows people to give other perspectives, people who are not so closely involved and can therefore give a more objective impartial view. Just because you don't like or agree with something someone says, doesn't mean that they (or you) are wrong or getting at you, simply that they have a different perspective.

no but I am taking a battering over my abilities to parent J and that I give excuses to his behaviours, no that isnt nice, and I only recieve such post from a MINORITY of people here, usually you and Baddad because he is sooooo perfect.

 

Potato/Portaaartoe, Tomato/Tomaaaartoe :lol: What's that saying, 'A rose by any other name...' - you're still allowing it based on whatever terminology you use.

how comes his doctor understood his behaviour then, because he has special needs.

 

 

I'm afraid I don't feel we have anything to sort out (other than perhaps you apologising for the language you have used towards me). You clearly haven't actually read my posts correctly otherwise you would see that your (angry) reply doesn't answer them:

I have nothing to apoligise for. I havent done anything wrong.

 

 

I've already acknowledged (I think these two threads have become confused so it may be in the other thread) that many children are dx'ed with both ADHD and ASD. I'm not disputing that. All I was asking, and which others have provided some non-personal replies to, is how the two can be dx'ed when some of the criteria contradict each other. My question was how not if.

maybe because Im worried you have those views, questions when you work with children with a dx of both ADHD/ASD its the kind of comments old teachers use to say to kids with ADHD in past, oh well you can concentrate on a video game, you can concentrate on your work, with little understanding why the two are very seperate.

 

 

JsMumx

 

 

[baddad]

The ADHD/ASD bottom line is there is A LOT of children with both conditions, so they do actually co exist dont they,

 

JsMumx

 

 

Yes they do. My own son has the 'Holy Trinity' of Autism, ADHD and dyspraxia with all of the kinds of anxieties that go with them. He's a similar age to J, but doesn't continue to have the same kinds of problems (though he did when much younger). If I had found ways to justify all of those behaviours when he was younger I'm sure he would still have them now - something that we see demonstrated equally among the NT population of children whose parents justify rather than sanctioning behaviours. And it is irrelevent whether that justification is 'autism' or 'anxiety' or 'special needs' or 'sensory issues' - the underlying principle is the same. As I'm sure you will point out; 'all children are different', a point which I will agree with. I hope you will similarly agree that 'all parents are different' too. Your response to the OP was, effectively, 'give in and let him do it, and anyone who doesn't understand it is being unsupportive, judgemental and unreasonable'. My own response - and mumbles too, reading between the lines - is that ignoring it will just make the problem bigger. I'm sorry, I know you disagree with that and I have, on many occassions, offered to 'agree to differ' with you, but it is doesn't invalidate my opinions, nor make them unsupportive, judgemental or unreasonable, and I see no reason why they should be considered so offensive that they should be so aggrssively challenged every time i - or anyone else - should voice them. And your hyper-sensitivity regarding your parenting abilities doesn't come into it, either, regardless of an CAPITAL LETTERS you might insert in your posts. They are your problem, not mine, and have nothing to do with expectations of reasonable consideration being offered for other users in a GP's surgery and/or the possibility that a child being inconsiderate may be having that behaviour reinforced rather than sanctioned by his/her parent...

As you so aptly put it:

 

LORDY GIVE ME STRENGTH.

 

L&P

 

BD

 

PS: Having seen the above... I'm not 'battering' your abilities to parent J. As I have said many, many times to you in the past, I don't know you or J and have - to quote the last PM I sent you when you PM'd me over what you felt was a 'personal attack' - reassured you on many occassions that i don't doubt your intentions in any way:

 

Just wanted to add to that last PM that I have no doubts whatsoever that you adore your son and are doing what you believe is best for him. I can identify with that completely, because I have exactly the same feelings and exactly the same motivations towards my son. If I've ever given any indication to the contrary please accept my apologies, because that is defintely not one of the things I disagree with you on.

 

L&P

 

BD

 

You may well think that's 'patronising' or 'judgemental' or whatever - but the reality is simply that I disagree with you about some things and you find that unacceptable. I'm sorry if that comes across as 'sooo perfect', but other than being bullied into not expressing my opinions (not often i use that 'b' word, but I'm getting increasingly sick of having to justify my every opinion) I'm not sure what you expect me to do about it?

Perhaps what we should all do now is let this thread get back onto the topic raised by the OP? I think we've all made our opinions clear, and any 'difference' in those opinions is now just a distraction?

 

BD

Edited July 2, 2010 by baddad

[Mumble]

maybe because Im worried you have those views, questions when you work with children with a dx of both ADHD/ASD its the kind of comments old teachers use to say to kids with ADHD in past, oh well you can concentrate on a video game, you can concentrate on your work, with little understanding why the two are very seperate.

You really aren't bothering to read or comprehend what I write at all. These are not views, it's a genuine question I have that hasn't been answered. Maybe once I have an answer, I'll be able to form a view. I'm afraid I'm not going to waste any more of my time trying to explain what I am saying if you are not prepared to listen.

 

I have nothing to apoligise for. I havent done anything wrong.

If you can't see what you have said as wrong and feel it is acceptable to send abusive PMs, then I'm beginning to see where you might be having problems in parenting a child who can't tell right from wrong.

 

[JsMum]

Yes they do. My own son has the 'Holy Trinity' of Autism, ADHD and dyspraxia with all of the kinds of anxieties that go with them. He's a similar age to J, but doesn't continue to have the same kinds of problems (though he did when much younger). If I had found ways to justify all of those behaviours when he was younger I'm sure he would still have them now - something that we see demonstrated equally among the NT population of children whose parents justify rather than sanctioning behaviours. And it is irrelevent whether that justification is 'autism' or 'anxiety' or 'special needs' or 'sensory issues' - the underlying principle is the same. As I'm sure you will point out; 'all children are different', a point which I will agree with. I hope you will similarly agree that 'all parents are different' too. Your response to the OP was, effectively, 'give in and let him do it, and anyone who doesn't understand it is being unsupportive, judgemental and unreasonable'. My own response - and mumbles too, reading between the lines - is that ignoring it will just make the problem bigger. I'm sorry, I know you disagree with that and I have, on many occassions, offered to 'agree to differ' with you, but it is doesn't invalidate my opinions, nor make them unsupportive, judgemental or unreasonable, and I see no reason why they should be considered so offensive that they should be so aggrssively challenged every time i - or anyone else - should voice them. And your hyper-sensitivity regarding your parenting abilities doesn't come into it, either, regardless of an CAPITAL LETTERS you might insert in your posts. They are your problem, not mine, and have nothing to do with expectations of reasonable consideration being offered for other users in a GP's surgery and/or the possibility that a child being inconsiderate may be having that behaviour reinforced rather than sanctioned by his/her parent...

As you so aptly put it:

 

 

 

L&P

 

BD

 

Whos to say if you had a child like my son you would of had simialir success to your own son, my son is very uncoperative, challenging, defiant, violent, he has a need for constant power/control over situations, dont you understand he was only playing the music loud because he wanted to go home, it was his way of getting that, if things had of esculated it may of been we would of had no other choice but to go home, but he then wouldnt of been able to see the gp about his needs, which we are trying to access support in the holidays, because last holiday it ended in crisis situation with his reactions over sanctions.

 

We are in a very stressful place right now and I dont need you or mumble making me feel worse.

 

JsMumx

 

 

 

[JsMum]

You really aren't bothering to read or comprehend what I write at all. These are not views, it's a genuine question I have that hasn't been answered. Maybe once I have an answer, I'll be able to form a view. I'm afraid I'm not going to waste any more of my time trying to explain what I am saying if you are not prepared to listen.

 

 

If you can't see what you have said as wrong and feel it is acceptable to send abusive PMs, then I'm beginning to see where you might be having problems in parenting a child who can't tell right from wrong.

 

 

I didnt say anything wrong but because of that, you now feel you have the right to bat me the line well I see where you might be having problems in parenting, Im not having problems with parenting, Im having problems with J because the way he is reacting to situations that place him in an ammense stress, why is it sooo bad J couldnt handle waiting in the gp room, how is that learning right from wrong, all I see in these post is you and baddad totally pulling me to bits like in the past and I left not long ago because of that, looks like I really am in the wrong forum.

 

JsMumx

 

[Mumble]

I see where you might be having problems in parenting

I do find not having children to be a barrier to effective parenting...

 

[JsMum]

I do find not having children to be a barrier to effective parenting...

Its the hardest thing Ive ever done, Ive been a cadet instructer, been in the army, a nanny, summer school teacher, and loads of other roles looking after children, but been a parent is the toughtest yet.

 

JsMumx

 

[justine1]

Jsmum dont leave the group <'> Your viewpoints are valid maybe not to everyone and maybe not all the time but thats part of being on a forum to get all different aspects.

 

I have answered the OP already as did others and feel its turned into something else.I dont know about what has been said as it appears it was done via PM but I do know that nobody should be making attacks on anybody.Dont PM people unless its to give advice not to critisize their point of view,we are all entitled to that(not directed at anyone just a general observation) Give someone advice and you experience and leave it at that,they can chose to take it or leave it.

[Sally44]

I don't understand why these discussions always have to deteriorate to this level time after time.

Baddad and Mumble: I think that everyone agrees with your principles and what you suggest and aspire to. And if it is working for your child that is great. For other parents it simply may not work. That maybe something that changes with time, or a different approach etc. But it is a fact, otherwise we could bottle what you say/do and sell it and become millionaires. I know you worked at it to get to the stage you are at, but don't assume other parents are not also working but that it may not be getting the same results. We are dealing with people not a recipe for a cake.

No parent enjoys being in a situation where they feel their child is not listening, responding, behaving appropriately.

I agree that some parents may not be doing it right and none of us can claim to get it right all the time. But a gentle suggestion is better than a battering over the head and being made to feel totally useless (no reference to your parenting skills JSMUM).

I feel I am fortunate that my son does not show alot of problems in this area. Some that he does have are dealt with as they arise and he responds well.

Some things are typical of the diagnosis and if another child with a diagnosis does not have that problem it does not mean that therefore no other children have those problems.

My son always talks with quite a high volume. He cannot whisper and even if you keep reminding him to lower his voice it is right back up there within a couple of words. We've talked out it. He understands. But in practise he just cannot monitor his volume level whilst also trying to monitor what he wants to say and what I am answering. Sometimes that annoys people in the library. We're not there often. I feel that overall he does brilliantly and I know that if I tried to stop him talking he would get more upset. It has to be give and take. If my son could appear as any other NT child then I would question his diagnosis. That does not mean I accept bad behaviour because I don't.

My son also fiddles with switches, buttons etc and is very impulsive. Sometimes I have to hold his hand and sometimes we we have to leave. Sometimes we can go back inside, sometimes we have to go home. He knows why and he understands why, but the impulsiveness remains.

The fact that he himself came up with the solution of "staying in the car and not going into shops because I cannot control myself" shows that he does understand what the problem is. And as he is growing up his 'control' over himself is getting better.

Would we be having this same discussion if it were a child with tourettes in the library? Is the impulsiveness and compulsion of tourettes different to what our children experience?

[Sally44]

Its the hardest thing Ive ever done, Ive been a cadet instructer, been in the army, a nanny, summer school teacher, and loads of other roles looking after children, but been a parent is the toughtest yet.

 

JsMumx

 

My hardest job was being a holiday rep. People/alcohol/foreign destination = utter chaos. I have never worked so hard for so little pay! Working with people justs never ceased to amaze me. I've had people die in resort, births in resort, domestic violence, drunk and agressive/abusive etc. I've had people extradited and banned from the country. I've had people jailed. I've had burglars, arsonists, the list was endless. Infact, when considering the original OP (and my experience of things like birthday parties etc) the SEN children were usually better behaved than the other kids!

[baddad]

Whos to say if you had a child like my son you would of had simialir success to your own son

JsMumx

 

And who is to say I didn't have a son like your son? There is nothing J does now that my son didn't do or try to do. As I said, had I responded in the same way you still do (i.e. letting him play his music loudly regardless, and then finding some way to justify it) i'm sure he still would be behaving the same way. Why would he stop if it was working for him? I'm not 'pulling you to bits' and I never have in the past either - I just fundamentally disagree with you! Are you 'pulling me to bits' by disagreeing with me? If so - stop! And you actually are name-calling.

 

I didn't post to 'attack' you, but to say that you having a go at mumble was unreasonable. Of course, that was interpreted as me 'having a go', but hey ho... I'm sure this won't be any better received either, but as I say I'm sick of being 'attacked' every time I post the idea that kids who can behave badly (and adults too) will behave badly, for believing that human nature is part of the autistic spectrum too.

 

Sally 44 - I am perfectly willing to accept that 'every child is different', but also think it's important to acknowledge that 'every parent is different' too. IMO, in a parent/child dynamic I really do believe that fundamentally in most cases it is the parent who steers, and who should steer, the boat.

 

I don't know where you get the idea that a parent is being subjected to a 'battering over their head' for their parenting - other than from the assumed role of victim being taken by one parent. If you re-read my intital post in this thread I'm sure you'll see that the 'battering' was in the mind of the reader and not the intent of the writer. I have tried, for years, to deal with j's mum's 'sensitivity' in this area but it really is her problem, not mine. I'm just tired of being accused of 'attacking' her all the time purely for holding contrary opinions, and I'm tired of explaining that... At worst that makes me unsympathetic - a charge I am willing in this case, after years of such exchanges, to admit too - but it's not a 'battering' and it's not reasonable to dress it up as such, regardless of how comforting it might be for the party posing as 'victim'

 

L&P

 

BD

[JsMum]

And who is to say I didn't have a son like your son? There is nothing J does now that my son didn't do or try to do. As I said, had I responded in the same way you still do (i.e. letting him play his music loudly regardless, and then finding some way to justify it) i'm sure he still would be behaving the same way. Why would he stop if it was working for him? I'm not 'pulling you to bits' and I never have in the past either - I just fundamentally disagree with you! Are you 'pulling me to bits' by disagreeing with me? If so - stop! And you actually are name-calling.

 

If I remember rightly I did ask J to turn it down but he was defiant, he ignored both my request and the mans, he didnt want to turn it down because he knew it was a quick ticket to going home.

 

your always pulling my parenting to bits, not once have you ever praised me for the things I do for J, not once have you ever been positive about my comments, and I dont pull you to bits I stand up for myself because not many do on here who disagree with your opinions.

 

I didn't post to 'attack' you, but to say that you having a go at mumble was unreasonable. Of course, that was interpreted as me 'having a go', but hey ho... I'm sure this won't be any better received either, but as I say I'm sick of being 'attacked' every time I post the idea that kids who can behave badly (and adults too) will behave badly, for believing that human nature is part of the autistic spectrum too.

what I posted to mumble wasnt unreasonable, all I did was offer her that she take J to the gp next time if she is so good at managing behavioural problems. and I gave an explanation of our circumstances that they where tuff, for her to then be patronising to me.

 

 

Sally 44 - I am perfectly willing to accept that 'every child is different', but also think it's important to acknowledge that 'every parent is different' too. IMO, in a parent/child dynamic I really do believe that fundamentally in most cases it is the parent who steers, and who should steer, the boat.

obvously not everyone is as good as you at stearing the boat, and as I said I am struggling with the stearing bit because the way J is reacting to situations/sanctions, by going to the gp I was getting guidance, referrals, support, so at least Im facing the situation and he didnt have any judgement that it was my parenting, rather that I required support at home when J was home from resi school.

 

 

I don't know where you get the idea that a parent is being subjected to a 'battering over their head' for their parenting - other than from the assumed role of victim being taken by one parent. If you re-read my intital post in this thread I'm sure you'll see that the 'battering' was in the mind of the reader and not the intent of the writer. I have tried, for years, to deal with j's mum's 'sensitivity' in this area but it really is her problem, not mine. I'm just tired of being accused of 'attacking' her all the time purely for holding contrary opinions, and I'm tired of explaining that... At worst that makes me unsympathetic - a charge I am willing in this case, after years of such exchanges, to admit too - but it's not a 'battering' and it's not reasonable to dress it upas such, regardless of how comforting it might be for the party posing as 'victim'

you really love the word victim dont you, why is it when a parent on here who feels ostrisized by your views they somehow they dont warrent feeling like a vicim, thats exactly how you have made me feel in the past, because the words and views you have, and the way you go on about having problems with me for years youd think I was the only one you had problems with especially my sensitivity, Im just sick to death you always bringing me down, thats not been too sensitive.

I am not playing victim by the way in the post not once. but you have somehow got it in there that I am.

 

JsMumx

 

 

[baddad]

If I remember rightly I did ask J to turn it down but he was defiant, he ignored both my request and the mans, he didnt want to turn it down because he knew it was a quick ticket to going home.

 

your always pulling my parenting to bits, not once have you ever praised me for the things I do for J, not once have you ever been positive about my comments, and I dont pull you to bits I stand up for myself because not many do on here who disagree with your opinions.

 

what I posted to mumble wasnt unreasonable, all I did was offer her that she take J to the gp next time if she is so good at managing behavioural problems. and I gave an explanation of our circumstances that they where tuff, for her to then be patronising to me.

 

 

obvously not everyone is as good as you at stearing the boat, and as I said I am struggling with the stearing bit because the way J is reacting to situations/sanctions, by going to the gp I was getting guidance, referrals, support, so at least Im facing the situation and he didnt have any judgement that it was my parenting, rather that I required support at home when J was home from resi school.

 

 

you really love the word victim dont you, why is it when a parent on here who feels ostrisized by your views they somehow they dont warrent feeling like a vicim, thats exactly how you have made me feel in the past, because the words and views you have, and the way you go on about having problems with me for years youd think I was the only one you had problems with especially my sensitivity, Im just sick to death you always bringing me down, thats not been too sensitive.

I am not playing victim by the way in the post not once. but you have somehow got it in there that I am.

 

JsMumx

 

j's mum - you seem to think it entirely reasonable to say what you feel about me/my circumstances/my parenting, and to point out that other people feel ostrisized by me voicing an opinion that is contrary to the 'popular view', so I hope you will view that as a recipricol arrangement rather than viewing any response as an 'attack'...

No, I hate the word victim - because people who ally themselves to that word think it justifies anything and everything, whether they are presenting their children as victims or adopting that posture themselves by saying things like:

 

We are in a very stressful place right now and I dont need you or mumble making me feel worse.

 

or

We are under a great deal of stress at the presant time

or

we are having difficult time of it at the moment

or

just because Im a struggling parent doesnt make you better than me oK

or

Baddad I try my ABSALOUT best with J, you really do make me feel I should give up parenting J and that I should just put him in care because Im obvously too incapable of doing it.

or

I dont need to be made to feel any more crapper than I feel already badad about my parenting so what ever you say I cant feel any lower.

 

I cant see how this can be a forum where parents get support.

or

So in a nut shell Js beahviour is because of my parenting is that what your saying

or

now thats just patronising and [...] are you enjoying this mumble,

and

but I am taking a battering over my abilities to parent J and that I give excuses to his behaviours, no that isnt nice, and I only recieve such post from a MINORITY of people here, usually you and Baddad because he is sooooo perfect.

and

all I see in these post is you and baddad totally pulling me to bits like in the past and I left not long ago because of that, looks like I really am in the wrong forum

or

your always pulling my parenting to bits, not once have you ever praised me for the things I do for J

and

for her to then be patronising to me

and

you really love the word victim dont you, why is it when a parent on here who feels ostrisized by your views they somehow they dont warrent feeling like a vicim, thats exactly how you have made me feel in the past, because the words and views you have, and the way you go on about having problems with me for years youd think I was the only one you had problems with especially my sensitivity, Im just sick to death you always bringing me down, thats not been too sensitive.

I am not playing victim by the way in the post not once. but you have somehow got it in there that I am.

 

... No victim there then...

 

I do fully accept that your GP wouldn't seem 'judgemental'... I don't think any professional you came into contact with would, and suspect that any who did would very quickly come to regret it. If you give this much grief to people who say something you take the hump with on an internet forum I think the chances of you responding reasonably to a professional who suggested anything you disagreed with are very slim indeed.

 

I can't recall off hand whether I've ever praised you for anything you've ever done for J, but can assure you that if you have done anything that (IMO - which I fully accept may be wrong before anyone jumps on that as patronising) deserved praise I would have done so. I really don't hold grudges, and anything you (or anyone else) might do that improves things for J and offers him more opportunities in life will get a big from me.

 

Again, I would ask that you recognise how impersonal this post is, despite what amounts to several pages of provocation, and a direct request on my part to allow this thread to get back on track. It wasn't about you in the first place, and the fact that you took exception to something mumble posted really isn't a food enough reason for making it so. While I haven't directly attacked your parenting, I would also ask you to consider that whatever my opinion it matters not a jot! If almost everyone on the forum agrees with you and only a tiny minority disagree why let it get to you? Surely it's much more frustrating, emotionally draininge, stressful etc to be on the other side of the fence? To be in that small minority who can't get a fair hearing no matter how reasonable, logical or sensible the point they are trying to make?

 

L&P

 

BD

 

 

 

Edited July 2, 2010 by baddad