The Brief - tonight

[denise2]

I am not sure if this has already been posted butI Have just seen this in the paper at 9pm tonight on ITV, details in paper are as follows:

 

"When a boy with Asperger's syndrome is accused of killing his own mother, Henry is called on to defend him. Pleading his innocence and unable to lie due to his condition, the boy's story seems straightforward, but the case is compliacted with rumours of an extra-marital affair."

 

Denise 2

[Tylers-mum]

Thanks for the reminder Denise!!!

[lil_me]

Thanks for the reminder, looks interesting

[smiley]

I;m going to tune in.......bit worried about the whole 'Aspergers and Murder' bit though. Hope it's done properly.....

[faye]

Anyone watch it

[smiley]

Yes, i did Faye.

 

I saw a lot (bit too much if i'm honest ) of my son in the behaviour of Dan.

 

I think it was well made.

[Elanor]

I saw it - mixed feelings. If you're going to make a murder drama out of a mental health issue, then you're going to break some eggs, and some parts of this made me uncomfortable - and the dramatic ending really lacked real credibility.

 

All the same, it was clearly well-researched, and the portrayal of the young man with Aspergers was sympathetic (if a little pitiable). I am glad to see AS penetrating into mainstream media - twice in one week. At least other people are beginning to have heard of it.

 

Elanor

[Kathryn]

Immediate reactions after watching it- I was glad that the mother said her son was autistic (she flashed the autism alert card, did you see?) and that "autism" and "asperger syndrome" were linked throughout.

 

I thought the actor tried with the role but didn't quite nail it - his conversational style was too "NT" - can't put my finger on it but too tuned in, maybe too much subtle eye contact, too many expressions and too quick to get the nuances of interactions.

 

I liked some touches - moving him to another room because he didn't like the colour green, and his reaction when the fire alarm went off in court.

 

Not sure what the ending was meant to convey - he got 2 years in prison and was shown to be doing OK there (? )and his last interaction with his father where he smiled and touched fingers suggested that aaahh - he's normal after all.

 

There were bits that were quite painful to watch as they were too close to the bone. And like all such popular programmes it may have alerted a few more people to ASD, so I'll forgive the flaws!

Edited October 14, 2005 by Kathryn

[smallworld]

I watched this,I started off being annoyed but have to say I was totally sucked in. Then I was annoyed again by the ridiculous ending !!

I really think they could have made more of why he wasn't 'fit' to stand trial, or am I just being idealistic ? ( there would have been no show I suppose if that was the case, oops !)

Are asd young adults found guilty put into the usual prison system ? I suspect I already know the answer

 

wac

[Tez]

Very mixed feelings about this one.

 

I wonder why they always have to portray someone with AS as being so overtly odd. We all know, because it takes so long to get a diagnosis that the oddness is usually more subtle. I do think the writer tried to show this, there were moments when things were going well that Dan could appear almost normal, whereas when he was under particular stress either due to sensory input or when he was being questioned etc. he seemed very out of it; but the actors just didn't quite manage to convey this adequately, and I think that for the majority of people who don't live with AS the changes in Dan's ability to function, depending on his stress levels, were too subtle to notice, he'll just come across as a very odd boy and I think that many people will find it difficult to have any compassion for him or the situation because of this.

A year ago I would have thought the moments of nonfunctioning overplayed, at times Dan appeared retarded(sorry if this is a non pc word) now having a son who has been through just this I think it was spot on.

 

The ending where he is found to have been responsible for his mother's death I also have mixed feelings about. My son has severe sensory problems and one of the things that he needs is strong tactile input. He needs to be hugged really hard and he loves to squeeze you back in return. It is one of my very real concerns that one day this will go very horribly wrong and he will either goad some little bully into hurting him to get the stimulus that he needs or he will overdo the hugging and end up in a similar situation to Dan so I do feel the situation was plausible and realistic. However, I don't think that the actors had created enough understanding of Dan for the average person to fully appreciate that this was just a tragic twist of faith and that Dan was a victim. I think that for the purposes of the drama his oddness was over played and this made it harder for anyone with no understanding of AS to have any empathy or sympathy for him. I think that it will reinforce the public conception that people with AS are dangerous and not fit to be in society and this worries me.

 

Overall, I think it was a bit too close to home for me and I don't think that the general public will have gained a better understanding of AS it will just have heightened their prejudices. I hope I'm wrong.

Edited October 15, 2005 by Tez

[TuX]

I watched this,I started off being annoyed but have to say I was totally sucked in. Then I was annoyed again by the ridiculous ending !!

I really think they could have made more of why he wasn't 'fit' to stand trial, or am I just being idealistic ? ( there would have been no show I suppose if that was the case, oops !)

Are asd young adults found guilty put into the usual prison system ? I suspect I already know the answer

 

wac

AFAIK,there are parts in a prison used for people considered vulnerable,disabled etc,I know this is true in America,but not so sure about the UK,they might even put autistic prisoners in with paedophiles (who are deemed vulnerable?) if there are no dedicated units here.

[Canopus]

The prison service is very behind when it comes to issues like AS and ASD. Many prison staff simply do the job because it pays the bills. They have no interest in weird medical conditions. Medical facilities in prisons are handled by the Prison Medical Service which is completely separate from the NHS. It has its own protocols and does not follow NHS policy, nor does it employ NHS staff.

[Suze]

, didnt like it at all, sorry but it just seemed another negative, I wish a person with Aspergers syndrome would be featured in a programme saving someones life or finding the cure for cancer!................thats the sort of programme that I,d enjoy. Why does AS/ASD always have to be a negative story? The autistic population are as diverse as the NT population , the media does,nt constantly portray the NT folks negatively , sorry did,nt mean to rant like this

[oracle]

I just got to watch this at my Mum's and I saw so much of David and also so much of another young man that I know well in this lad that I felt that on the whole the it was quite good.

 

I do not think that the programme was so negative, yes OK this lad killed his Mum, but he did not murder her. I could see David doing something to me that maybe I had taught him when he was younger. It all boils down to their literal perception. This lad knew how his mum had tried to keep him calm. He simply used her own methods on her. Again this is something that mine would do. I think that it had a very important message. Well if it did not then I have taken a message on board anyway. The message being that no matter how hard we try to teach someone with AS the 'NT' way of doing things they will only ever learn them in a literal AS way.

 

This lad had been taught how 'not' to upset someone. It did not come naturally to him. But never the less his Mum got there in the end. He had been taught that sometimes it was best to say nothing than hurt someone. That was not telling lies. Oh how I relate to this one. My two are totally obsessed with not telling lies and yes I have said things like this to both of them. This lad took this on board and applied it litearlly.He did not wish to hurt his cousin he was quite willing to go down for murder.

 

There are degrees of AS and while David has a great many social skills now then the lad we seen, he still very uch has his literal sense of looking and evaluating everything.

 

There were areas that were obviously in because it was a TV drama but I though that for people with little understanding of AS it gave quite a good picture if not totally acurate.

 

Maybe I found it so compelling because I have a friend who works with young people who have AS and are in prison. He has told me some of the horror stories at the way our young people are treat by the system. To be honest the show was very inaccurate with the way the lad was treat while going through the system. But it did give quite a good illustration of the condition, because of the way they they handled him. Just my opinion of course.

 

If it had shown someone with AS doing something wonderful then maybe you could argue that that would be gloryfying AS. The reality is that not many of the NT population ever manage to do things that change the lives of millions of people.Maybe this programme did show that AS is a disability and that I feel is what we need. Sorry

 

Carole

Edited October 15, 2005 by carole

[UltraMum]

I coped until the bit with the ear defenders - identical to the ones on the bookshelf opposite me - got a bit weepy after that...

 

It's so difficult to decide how 'outsiders' to autism would see the boy - the view is so very different when you're on the inside...

[smallworld]

Me too, do they only come in red ? !!!

 

wac

[Noetic]

Although of course it is a shame that this had to be done in the context of being accused of murder, I thought it was generally well done.

 

I really loved the way they tried to emulate the sensory thing, the fragmented vision, that sometimes occurs when we are overloaded (when he is in the green room that leads to overload).

 

Although, again, yes I am a bit disappointed that all the research went on a programme where an Aspie was linked with murder (althjough it turned out not to bemurder as such), I thought that it came across as exceptionally well researched (it kind of brought across what it feels like, the everyday stuff), even when compared to some so-called 'documentaries' like the one about the school earlier this year. (I didn't dislike that programme, 'Make me Normal', but felt it showed very little about Autism)

 

I completely agree with Carole though, something that glorifies AS and portrays AS as unnaturally positive wouldn't do anyone any good.

Edited October 16, 2005 by Noetic

[Suze]

It would have done the parents at my childs school some good to see AS /asd in a more positive light . This portrayal was wholly accurate in showing ASD , but there are many good and positive aspects to our children , and a dramatisation showing these would have been more up my street. I was,nt thinking of an unnaturally positive angle , but would it be so unusual to "believe" a programme about someone who has ASD being capable of a great deal ?

[Tez]

Has anyone watched Monk? I haven't but my husband has and he thinks, although he has criticisms of it, that this is the best portrayal of AS that he has seen on television. There are lots of moments when he says I wish they hadn't done that or that wasn't quite right but it's the nearest he's seen to anyone getting it right. He's uncomfortable about the way Monk is portrayed as a comic character even though Monk he is accepted by the characters within the drama but says that he thinks it is probably a true reflection of how AS people are viewed by those around them.

 

If you've seen it, should I be watching it because I tend to avoild programmes featuring AS characters.

Edited October 16, 2005 by Tez

[call me jaded]

I fell asleep before the end. Did he or didn't he? What was the link to the cousin.

[Tez]

He was responsible for his mother's death but he didn't murder her. His cousin had told his mother that her mother was having an affaire with Dan's father. There was a bit of a tussle hence the ring marks. Once his cousin had left Dan tried to comfort his mother and prevent her from hurting him or herself in the way she had always used with him, with a restraining hold from behind, but it all went horribly wrong and with her struggling and the pressure he exerted he ended up killing her. There was no intent.

Edited October 16, 2005 by Tez

[Zemanski]

I like Monk

 

not perfect but positive, sometimes very poignant and often endearingly funny

 

Zemanski

[oracle]

How we portray any condition comes with a double edged sword. I do not want either of my two sons to be portrayed as potential murders. But this lad was not and I did feel it gave a good insight into how our kids understand the things that we input into them.

 

If we are going to portray ASD as a positive wonderful thing that is 'not to bad' then we may as well put the boxing gloves away now. We cannot go battering away on doors fighting for the correct provision for a condition that is 'not to bad' That is why when our children grow up and become adults we find that provision is dire, that is if there is any provision. We have AS being taken out of provision at government level. Is that what we really want? NAS have never liked to portray the violent side of ASD and I understand why - parents would be most uncomfortable with that. I would myself. But we can not have this both ways. We either tell it like it is or we shut up and put up. Sorry if this is sounding aggressive but being in the position of fighting to keep as ASD specific school open in our Authority at the moment I am seeing total desperation in parents. I personally would love to make everyone in our Authority watch this programme just to see how the sensory issues really do impact on our AS people.

 

This programme actually gave me hope. Hope that there are people out there who do understand and are willing to help us show what ASD is really like.

 

Sorry if I have ofended anyone.

 

Carole

[lil_me]

I'm with carole on this one, I did find it worrying in some ways as to what can happen in that type of situations, but if Autism was always put across as all sweetness and light, we'd have even more of a fight on out hands with society.

 

I thought the programme was researched well and they kept point out key issues with ASD, and also relating it to Autism, as sometimes people do not realise Aspergers is part of Autism, until my son was diagnosed with ASD I had no idea myself.

 

I think also giving him imprisonment for this crime will also make people aware of how unfair the british justice system can be especially when dealing with specific health issues. I know several friends of mine with limited knowledge of ASD said they felt as if they knew a bit more about the condition and how it affects people than they did before and disgusted that someone who was only doing as he thought was right was put in prison. But as some have said unfortunately this is quite real and it does happen, few of my family members are ex prison service and I know they have dealt with people on the spectrum they felt shouldn't be in prison.

[Hectorshouse]

... I found the drama both poignant and informative, and have been reading this thread with real interest.

 

Before I watched it I had been preparing myself for a negative experience and bad portrayal of autism. At first I was uncomfortable with the portrayal of Dan and someone to be afraid of until the mum rescued him with her Autism Alert card, but the way it was flashed was all a bit bemusing and over dramatic .. anyway not totally relevant .. but it was the presentation of the sensory difficulties that caused Dan so much physical discomfort that I thought was excellent. For once portraying it from the autist viewpoint, the green and the pen writing on the paper, the inability to focus on the voices of the lawyers, and the way Dan's eye contact was used through the camera angles was great. I could go on ... but don't worry I won't

 

There were so many similarities between Dan and T that at times I did feel emotional, his literal interpretation, precise blunt speech, and dropping into a perfect rendition of an advertisment or information about a certain thing that has caught his interest .. (the pen bit). But sadest of all was the 'hold' technique, something that I have used with T, but was taught to me for A when he was younger, after his father died he became aggressively emotional and this was used to protect him and me, now perhaps I may have to think of the consequence of that practice .. not one I have had to use now for about 3 years, but still .. it makes you think!

 

Finally, before this turns into an essay ... the mother .. the lack of support she had received and was to proud/or afraid to do anything about, her self presribing anti depressants, her committment to her son and the difficulty this placed on her marriage ... all sounds very ###### familiar.

 

I think it is not actually the outcome of the trial that is important, but the vocalising of autism and describing it in a way that NT people could understand.

 

HHxx

HHxx

[lil_me]

That was very much the feedback I got, they made things much more understandable, you got a real sense of how the young man felt. How his mother had struggled, maybe thats why someone came up to me and said 'I never realised what parents of children with Autism go through until I watched that' Many traits I seen in my son, which is when it does tug on the heart strings, and I have been shown a similar technique but never used it and I am quite pleased I haven't now. Every time I watch something like this it makes me more determined to get the support we need as a family and for my son.

[Suze]

My feelings on this programme are based on what my son has been going through at school at present . He displays as quirky and a little odd,and fellow classmates have picked up on this and have been winding him up .The result was he lashed out and got into touble. Several parents wrote letters and complained to the school.This situation became very difficult he has been through hell this week.Several parents believe my son is an aggressive, violent bully . I know he isn,t this at all ,but having ASD made him lash out at the teasing and provoking he was suffering. Watching The Brief on fri I was so wishing that this story could have in someway showed those parents at my childs school(they call him a nutter ) that ASD isn,t all about inadvertently /hurting, lashing out , violence....whatever you want to call it. I don,t think ASD is a "not to bad thing" I was,nt trying to infere that at all infact at the moment ASD is sending me to the edge , but at the moment the place I am in with what has been happening lately and everything else I believe my son is more than anger, violence, (intentional or not).He is a very loving boy , who does great impressions and makes his family laugh ,can sing really well ............my current state of mind just makes me think that just for once could,nt the other side to ASD be shown ...........am I making any sense , really did,nt want to go on about this I know the struggles we all go through.

[oracle]

Suze I was in no way having a go at you and yes I 'DO' understand where you are coming from. Actually I think the programme did show why your son is maybe lashing out and it is not for the reason that the other parents would think. All the way through it was based on the lads perception and how his sensory issues impacted on him. This is something that we need to understand ourselves.

 

Our kids do change as they grow older and maybe that is why I could identify with the programme so much. David at 8 was a little odd and quirky at 18 he displays very much like the lad in the programme. Not in every way as he is much more social but when you touch base with him his understanding of something is usually not mine of the person to whom he has been talking.

 

<'> I hope that we are still friends because really I do understand

 

Carole

Edited October 16, 2005 by carole

[Canopus]

I think also giving him imprisonment for this crime will also make people aware of how unfair the british justice system can be especially when dealing with specific health issues. I know several friends of mine with limited knowledge of ASD said they felt as if they knew a bit more about the condition and how it affects people than they did before and disgusted that someone who was only doing as he thought was right was put in prison. But as some have said unfortunately this is quite real and it does happen, few of my family members are ex prison service and I know they have dealt with people on the spectrum they felt shouldn't be in prison.

 

I came within inches of a prison sentence for an assault with a weapon when I was 13. The police firmly stated that the law does not take things into account such as provocation and stress from the environment I was in - which was probably worse than prison anyway.

 

Nowadays there are these "kids prisons" that offer a more comfortable environment than ordinary prisons such as individual rooms with nice furnishings. They also offer education and kids can take GCSEs. I would probably have wanted to be sent to one rather than the school I attended. Sadly, they didn't exist in 1991 and back then under 18 year olds could be sent to an adult prison and forced to live alongside people twice their age under the same regime and regulations that applied to adults. There were no educational facilities apart from very basic skills and no opportunities to take GCSE exams. I can vaguely remember watching a 12 year old being sent to an adult prison on the news during the late 1980s.

[Kathryn]

I wish someone would write a drama which included a girl with ASD. I have yet to see any fictional portrayal of girls or women on the spectrum - does anyone know of any?

[Suze]

Carol, <'> sorry I,m sore at the moment, just wanted to feel a bit more positive about ASD, your right though , thought about this , this afternoon.My son is 10 and I realise in 8 yrs he,ll be older , taller and stronger than me.I have,nt quite woken up to the complexities I,ll be struggling with then. ASD in a young adult like Dan is,nt something I,ve had to cope with yet, my own fear made me uncomfortable with this programme. Still on a big learning curve with this, I hoped for myself there would be a happy ending to Dans story, it,s what we all want isn,t it.

[Noetic]

Has anyone watched Monk? I haven't but my husband has and he thinks, although he has criticisms of it, that this is the best portrayal of AS that he has seen on television.

The way The Brief showed the sensory fragmentation in "the green room" reminded me a LOT of the Monk episode set in NY (Mr. Monk goes to New York or Manhattan I think), although of course Monk is a pick & mix of the DSM (and "officially" has OCD, not AS).

[Guest flutter]

we like monk

[Noetic]

I wish someone would write a drama which included a girl with ASD. I have yet to see any fictional portrayal of girls or women on the spectrum - does anyone know of any?

Although it didn't feature prominently, an episode of Holby City this year (I think it was this year) featured a young woman with AS who was quite well portrayed. Although I felt at the time it was ludicrous that - as the storyline implied, as he was nearly sacked for not realising this - the gyno surgeon "should have spotted that she had AS" (in spite of not having access to her med records at the time). If only it was that easy to diagnose people

 

She was "clinging" somewhat obsessively to facts and her books on pregnancy, and had issues with touch. What I loved was that she was portrayed as able to have a relationship (married, her husband had to explain she had AS) and appear quite "normal".

Edited October 17, 2005 by Noetic

[mikesmum]

Although I felt relieved that the boy hadn't murdered his mother, it's a moot point because he did in fact kill her. In fact, it showed AS as creating behaviour which is aggressive, out of control and a danger to life. I was hoping for something that would help me open a dialogue with people who don't yet know about AS. It also demonstrated AS as something very visible to the eye - things didn't 'look' right about that young man in the film. I'm sorry I missed the Holby City episode.

 

Before we knew about AS, my son's aggression started to get channelled into something a little more positive via martial arts. It was his choice. I wasn't keen to begin with (he might get hurt!) but I recognised quite quickly that it teaches good attitudes and positive use of aggression. He threw himself into it, earned several sashes and learnt that he could defend himself. That gave him self-confidence so he expresses the aggression less in physical terms although I am aware that he still thinks in terms of physical aggression as a response to most hurts.

 

The way the sensory issues were demonstrated was great : how he could be totally different according to his environment (he looked like a totally different young man in the neutral room).

 

We love Monk - all of us. That was before we knew about AS. Looking forward to a new series and wondering how we will react to it with our new perspective! I don't think of the AS folk in my life as having OCD but there's so much I realise I never realised that nothing is certain any more!!!

[call me jaded]

Tell me more about Monk. I've never heard of it.

 

I thought that what I saw of the Brief was pretty much the real deal. Our children do end up in trouble with the law. A good friend of mine works with Young Offenders. A large number of them are learning disabled.

[Noetic]

Tell me more about Monk. I've never heard of it.

http://www.usanetwork.com/series/monk/

 

It's a show about a man with OCD (officially), he also has some AS traits though. It's a lovely show and was on on Saturday afternoons on BBC2, but BBC2 are a bit erratic in their scheduling. However Series 1 and 2 are available on DVD.

[Lucas]

I ###### love Monk!!(not literally).

 

Monk! Monk!! Monk!!!!

 

MONK!!!!!

 

*Bounces*

 

The story is that he developed OCD after his wife died, but I reckon he is simply an Aspie that fell back on his stims to cope but has been misdiagnosed. He certainly does not personally suffer from his obsessions, a vital component for OCD. He's an Autistic Obsessive-Compulsive Personality.

[Noetic]

The story is that he developed OCD after his wife died, but I reckon he is simply an Aspie that fell back on his stims to cope but has been misdiagnosed. He certainly does not personally suffer from his obsessions, a vital component for OCD. He's an Autistic Obsessive-Compulsive Personality.

Definitely not just a post-traumatic thing - in later series you see 'flashbacks' to when his wife was still alive and he has a lot of rituals etc. already. (Be that OCD or AS-related, he definitely didn't just "suddenly" develop it)

 

I get the impression he was Aspie-ish to start with and the more severe OCD stuff (the stuff that stopped him being able to work) and catatonia were what started from the trauma. The character was (according to the producers) devised not with just one specific disorder or picture in mind, but as a sort of "pick and mix" from the DSM (they compared it to randomly pointing at diagnoses in the book), but there's no denying that the character overall does have strong AS traits. Guess that just goes to show how much AS resembles a varied mix of traits!

Edited October 20, 2005 by Noetic

[Lucas]

Yes but the bottom line is MONK! Monk is great!!