PinkSapphireAngel Report post Posted March 30, 2006 I recently asked my MP to ask the education department whether me home schooling Luke in September will affect his name being on the waiting list for the secondary school we wanted him to go to as they were not giving me straight answers, only threats (They threatened to get the Education Welfare Officer involved) Well yesterday I got a letter back from my MP along with a copy of a letter he got back from the head of my LEA, it is total nonsense just going on about it being their "Statutory duty" to offer a place to a child at the nearest secondary school with a vaccancy clearly with absolutely NO regards to the childs special needs AT ALL! He says as far as he knows home schooling or accepting a place at another school should not affect Luke's place on the waiting list for our 1st choice school. I am writing back to him to ask him how and WHY the only school they offered was a school their OWN ASD specialist and their own primary school staff say is NOT appropriate for a child with Luke's needs, how can that be meeting their statutory duty? Then once we have the tribunal's decision I might hopefully have even more ammo, I am also thinking of copying the letter I send to Ruth Kelly and the Government Education Department. I am so sick of this LEA thinking they can do what they like and get away with it, they need to remember they ARE answerable to people too. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PinkSapphireAngel Report post Posted March 30, 2006 Can anyone suggest who else I should copy this letter to? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PinkSapphireAngel Report post Posted March 30, 2006 Obviously this thread is not of interest to anyone but me as I am the only replying to my own thread. Never mind, I deceided to get proactive (again) and I have emailed the head of the LEA about this and have included a copy of a letter my sons SENCO wrote saying why the secondary school was not appropriate for a child with my sons complex needs. I have also sent a copy of this and the email to my MP as he has been pestering the LEA on my behalf too. Will see if this gets things moving while we wait for SENDIST decision (still no post today ) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mother in Need Report post Posted March 30, 2006 Oh yes this thread is of interest to people, someone will come along who can give you some good ideas etc. I am sorry to hear of all this stupidity, as you say they seem to be soooooooo ignorant and 'all-knowing' it drives one up the wall... There have been other threads about how ignorant and biased many people 'at the top' are, and this is all so wrong. We've had the EWO involved, and to be honest he is just another total not understanding type of person, but he did not actually pester us into anything, and let matters be; he is certainly not a person I would ever be afraid of anymore, as a matter of fact he is the one who managed to get me re-imbursed for driving my son to school every day (though at the same time obstructing the process of the LEA supplying a taxi and escort). Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PinkSapphireAngel Report post Posted March 30, 2006 I did find the email address for our EWO and emailed them myself as I am not having the LEA trying to threaten me or have anything over me, but EWO never replied. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PinkSapphireAngel Report post Posted March 30, 2006 Got a automatic email saying that the head of LEA is out of his office till April 18th! but that his P.A reads his emails, well I don't want her dealing with it I want the organ grinder himself, why is everything always about waiting even when its so important. GRRRRRRRR Still no post here today so I am left waiting for the tribunal letter, its a week today! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Flora Report post Posted March 30, 2006 PSA. Please don't think nobody is interested in this thread. I can only speak for myself, but I'm reading all your threads with great interest. The only reason I didn't reply to this one is because I didn't think I could offer you any advice, only sympathy and understanding. I have a similar experience to yours in that I should have been at tribunal on 22nd March but I cancelled it because I felt that there were avenues that we hadn't explored within mainstream and that would have gone against us in the tribunal decision. I intend to request statement again after William has had a term at secondary school (that is if it doesn't work out, and I have every reason to thing it won't, it's a long story which I won't go in to here). Even the EP and LEA officer who are against assessing William have agreed that if the plans we have for secondary don't work out then there really is no where else to go other than stat assessment. I really hope you get a decision from the tribunal sooner rather than later. I really appreciate and can totally empathise and sympathise with the frustration you are going through dealing with these people. Sometimes it's hard to offer advice, especially with someone like yourself who is already being very proactive. I think you are doing everything possible to help your son. Lauren Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PinkSapphireAngel Report post Posted March 30, 2006 <'> thanks hun, I hope it does work out for you with secondary and that either way your child gets all the help they need. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tylers-mum Report post Posted March 30, 2006 Sorry, no advice unfortunately but I can give you lots of <'> <'> <'> . Hang in there and go get em girl!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
col Report post Posted March 30, 2006 Have fun ripping the stuffing out of them, when your finished can you pass any little tip bits so that i can have your left overs!! Got 2 statement reviews coming up and DD7 transfering to a junior school so am worried that they will try and cut back on her LSA' support. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jen Report post Posted March 30, 2006 Pinksapphireangel, It is not no one is interested in this thread but you need to give people time. Normally I can only get access to the forum in the evening (so I am early today). I would also send a copy to the Ed Psy. What does the ofstead say about the strengths and weaknesses of the school. Get as much information as possible even if you do not get any responses to your letters you have at least sent them. I use to put on my letters you have 14 days to reply to this letter, just the same as the LEA do to us. Jen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PinkSapphireAngel Report post Posted March 30, 2006 I know hun, think I'm just a bit sensitive with everything at the moment, not usually like this. I like the 14 day rule idea lol, do they stick to it? Think I might also copy the letter tp the ASD outreach woman as the SENCO says she agrees the school the LEA offered is wrong for his needs. Thanks x Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jen Report post Posted March 30, 2006 yes they do oblighed you just write at the bottom of the letter If your want to reply to this letter please do so within 14 days that way you are not hanging around for a response. Sometimes they send a letter just to say they are looking into it. Jen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sue1957 Report post Posted March 31, 2006 I am so sick of this LEA thinking they can do what they like and get away with it, they need to remember they ARE answerable to people too. I've found the Freedom of Information Act helps them remember. Big time Don't know if this helps as its not SEN related, but the principles are probably the same. At best you might find something useful from our experience, at worst at least you'll know that sometimes being a member of the Awkward Squad can pay dividends. We are in dispute with the LA after being told by the school that we would be reported to the EWO if we took our children on holiday in term time. We took them. It has gone to LA review, and has been going on for months, and with us being given the run around right left and centre. A complete pi** take. However, one thing I have very recently learned is to start asking questions under the Freedom of Information Act. Wish I?d realised right from the start, but better late than never. Its worth reading the legislation and there is a website http://www.foi.gov.uk/ that has been very useful. Also worth checking out the Governors Guide to the Law here http://publications.teachernet.gov.uk/eOrd...0Law%202006.pdf Chapter 13 para 78 to the end of the chapter. We have made a lot of requests for information, which have either been ignored or not answered in compliance with the Act. Its caught them right out, me too until I read it all properly and realised what a powerful tool the Act can be if used right. We are intending to submit complaints to the FOI regulatory body for everyone from the HT, clerk to the governors, the chief education officer, the chief executive of the council, head of governor services........ The LA have now twigged just what a mess it is, and are suddenly taking notice. A couple of examples....Rather than rant about a decision (which was getting us nowhere) we recently wrote and asked for information on the legal basis for the advice the LA gave to the HT that he was not to see us about anything at all without the CoG present. (We?ve been banned since November which is making the day to day contact with the school difficult, and the rumour is that we're subject to an ASBO) If its c*ap and they can?t come up with anything they will have to say the information (i.e. the legal basis for the decision) does not exist, in which case we demand they reverse the decision, and an apology. The answer we?ve got so far (on the last working day to comply with the Act) was that the LA legal department gave the advice verbally ? but that?s not good enough under FOI, the information we requested was the legal basis for the advice, not how the advice was given. The wording of the request is crucial. The advice to look information up on the Dfes and teachernet websites when we asked for copies of all directives from the Dfes to the LA on holidays in term time for the previous 18 months also breached the Act. We have made objections about the information provided (along with bits I haven't mentioned here) through the council?s procedure on information requests. They have replied that they will respond within 10 working days. They sort it, or after that it?s another complaint to the FOI regulatory body. If it goes to the regulatory body, from what I see the worst that can happen for us is that our complaint isn't upheld. We have used FOI to get minutes of a meeting that the school didn't want us to see and our children?s attendance records. (Both of which have prompted more enquiries). Refusals or any breaches (and there were several before they or we realised) are going to the regulatory body for FOI. We can always withdraw them later if we make friends with the school and LA again. The schools don?t have to count school holidays as working days to provide the information, but we have now told the LA (who wrote not to give us some information, but when they calculated the last day for compliance under the Act to be taking into account the holidays) that they don?t shut in the same way so we expect information ?promptly? and no later than 20 working days, for information we are waiting for from them not the school. They have now taken over the requests for information from the school, and calculating the latest possible day for giving us very simply obtainable information for which no search was required showed that they were not intending to answer "promptly" which we believe also breaches the Act. We might be wrong on that point but its up to them to justify themselves if it goes to the regulatory body. We?ve been polite, to the point, and don't get emotional (Which is not easy I know, so I usually have a rant on paper, then 24 hours later we revise the letter or email before sending it - revenge is a dish best served cold) but we have asked carefully posed questions and are probably considered to be a total pain the *rse. We now have an LA officer appointed to co-ordinate all our requests to the school and the LA. If we are polite, asking legitimate questions about our child, or our child?s school they would be hard pushed to say we are ?vexatious.? We cant get caught for asking repeatedly if we ask once, and if they fail to follow the Act we report them under the published procedure. There are exceptions to what they must provide, but then they have to justify the exemption, but we are asking for information relevant to our complaint, or our children?s welfare, which any reasonable parent might be expected to request. If enough of us start using FOI, the climate of fob off, ignore and threaten parents might start to change. We give them a fair chance first, and now head the email "request for information". If its information that a school or an LA should be providing freely to us as parents but have been giving us the run around, (like the minutes which my husband was refused sight of and turned away from the school office by the HT and Clerk to the Governors ) I am now putting something like ?It is a disgrace that as a parent I am forced to invoke the Freedom of Information Act to get information which should be openly available to me at the school.? If it eventually goes as a complaint to the FOI people (or the Dfes, MP or anyone else) then it doesn?t hurt that they know we are being forced into it by the attitude of the school or the LA. We?re getting clued up on the Act, wording everything carefully so it?s a request for information that supports a decision they?ve made about my child, or provides the legal basis for a policy, or the reasoning behind a decision or whatever. They ARE answerable, we've just got to get the questions right and work the system. If the information they provide is what we asked for, even if we don't like it, if its accurate and legal (and we check that, because a lot of what we've seen isn't) we can decide what to do next and move on. At the start of our complaint it was the stress of waiting and not knowing when or if they were going to reply that was the problem. Used right FOI removes a lot of stress. It makes them accountable. NOTHING is done verbally now, and we request read receipts for all emails, and try and copy a second person in if we can, so there's no excuse no-one got the email or letter. I don't know the circumstances well enough Pinksapphire but a threat can be followed up with a request for information that they provide documentation to support the legal basis for their threat to ....... when your child's circumstances are............................... or documentation/information to support the legal basis for their decision about (school to be attended, new attendance policy or whatever)........................ Its then up to them to prove they are right, not for us to prove that they are wrong. Turning the tables is worth a try, and at least it will give them something to do apart from come up with some very nasty tactics to try and stress us out. The EWO hasn't hammered on our door yet anyway Now what else do I want to know???????.?? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CarerQuie Report post Posted March 31, 2006 PSA,I sympathise enormously but have no practical suggestions to offer.have some ((((((hugs)))))).I keep looking to see if you've had an answer from the tribunal (I know that it can take up to 2 weeks but sometimes it's sooner.)xx Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
clintess Report post Posted March 31, 2006 i would def write 2 ruth kelly i did last week about my lea,really hope u get things sorted Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PinkSapphireAngel Report post Posted March 31, 2006 (edited) Wow Sue thanks for that, I hope you do manage to get things sorted! I got an email back from the head of educations PA this morning telling me he is out of the office till mid April so she is passing my email on to the admissions people (they won't like it lol) I have emailed her back saying it is VERY imprtant that the head of education department sees it! Be interesting to see what admissions say especially if the LEA officer we took to SENDIST has spoken to them. Edited March 31, 2006 by PinkSapphireAngel Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
asereht Report post Posted March 31, 2006 Sorry ,I was reading your thread with interest but as I am over here in Dublin had no advice to give.Should have just posted and said that though. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sue1957 Report post Posted March 31, 2006 I hope you do manage to get things sorted! Well the email on Wednesday afternoon resulted in a letter being sent out to us first class on Wednesday evening (within 3 hours) for information that we had been told the day before they would reply to by May 5th. We're not finished yet, and there's other complications to our case, but I have to say that the FOI Act has made a HUGE difference to getting answers. Hope you get some results soon too. <'> Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mother in Need Report post Posted March 31, 2006 (edited) I've found the Freedom of Information Act helps them remember. Big time That's a really useful Act, the amount of times my letters have gone either completely unanswered or only a very small part that was answered, are way too many. I will start using this. Thanks Sue! Might it be an idea to have this Freedom of Information Act information pinned? PSA you must be so worried and frustrated, I hope you get your answer soon and that it'll be what you want! Edited March 31, 2006 by Mother in Need Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
