pingu Report post Posted February 22, 2006 Hi everyone An update ............................. As some of you may have read on a previous thread, we were debating whether to let Kieran have his MMR Booster along with his scheduled Pre school booster. We decided after speaking to the health visitor that we would not go ahead with the MMR, after what happened last time (ear infections, and regression) As i said before i am not saying the MMR is the cause of autism as kieran had symptoms before this, but there was a definate "accelaration" of symptoms. Anyway. I phoned the Doctor and spoke to him personally, to ask if he would do his Customerary "wheelbarrows" with Kieran. (long story, involving the doctor once grabbing kierans legs thus forcing him to do wheel barrows) He said he would and so i took him down today. THe doctor was great with him and told him he would do wheelbarrows after the not so nice bit !! With kieran facing me he gave him what i thought was the pre school booster, But it turned out to be the MMR as the doc had assumed i wanted this for him also. He went onto give him the preschool booster which he was not prepared for... and jumped (now bruised). The doctor trying to put right his wrongs grabbed him and slung him over his shoulder, he thought it would jolly him up as he refused his wheelbarrow ride. Kieran totally freaked at this point, and i left without signing any consent forms, the doctor appologised and said he couldn't suck it back out. This is our family GP and i dont want to talk badly of him as he has always been great with all the kids, but i do feel very let down he addmitted he rushed as he wanted it to be quick for kieran, but he also added he should have asked me first, and confirmed which jabs he was having. Since he got back, K has been very wound up, and as i type is still acting up, (upstairs) so forgive me if all this makes no sense, my mind is elsewhere, i just wanted to let you know what happened. I feel terrible that i let it happen, even though i was powerless to stop it, it was all done so quick !! Anyway, i had better get off and try and settle him before we get evicted for noise disturbance Take care everyone, i hope you are all well Shaz Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ohforaquietlife Report post Posted February 22, 2006 Hi Pingu I read your post and my jaw dropped. Had it been me, alas I feel the doctor would have left his surgery in a pine box and me with the men in white coats!!!!!!! Frankly I'm stunned. ohf Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pingu Report post Posted February 22, 2006 I think im in shock feel a bit ill and very angry Its just starting to sink in, WHY DIDNT I SAY SOMETHING ? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LizK Report post Posted February 22, 2006 How awful even if intentions were good. Maybe something you should take up with the practice manager in the next day or so when the shock has lessened. Liz x Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
call me jaded Report post Posted February 22, 2006 Please don't blame yourself. I think it's very important that you put on record that you did not consent to the jab, copying to the Chair of the PCT. Then just try not to worry. I know there are some homeopathic things you could be doing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kerre Report post Posted February 22, 2006 Isn't ho�me�op�a�thy junk? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Brook Report post Posted February 22, 2006 I think im in shock feel a bit ill and very angry Its just starting to sink in, WHY DIDNT I SAY SOMETHING ? Well, I'm gobsmacked. You must not blame yourself, and as for not saying anything it sounds like you didn't get the chance anyway! Brook <'> Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
researchboffin Report post Posted February 22, 2006 This is awful. Should you sue the GP he has to lose. Wrong jab is clin neg. I shall pray for your child's wellbeing and hope anyone who has a god will do the same. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Malika Report post Posted February 23, 2006 Hi Pingu, <'> <'> <'> Feeling so much for you and your son, sounds too much like a betrayal I must say that Gp in this country are really frightening me I feel that they constantly covering up for the system and their ignorance, and in my sugery they tend to trick you all the time like I ask my GP and she agree to test my hormons level not only respective to my thyroid probles but other hormons as well, and on Monday when I went for the blood test and been told by the nurse that they would check my liver kidney and hormons I realised that she just tick for the thyroid function, I just can wait to ask her which test she asked for. Now there is a push for the MMR again and they want H to have it which I refuse so far as well because he already had Mumps, but they cannot offer a single jab either so I have decided to stick to my no. Poor you even if the GP has been good so far I would still consider to complain are you sure he misunderstood you? Take care I hope things will get better with you and Kieran. <'> Malika. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bid Report post Posted February 23, 2006 Oh Pingu <'> I'm wondering if you have any legal redress here?? Anyone else know anymore? Bid Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Malika Report post Posted February 23, 2006 Hi <'> <'> Don't know too much about legal things but for sure giving a vaccination without checking and telling the mother what he was doing was bad practice from your GP. I have few friends who are either nurse or DR i will try to check with them, and will keep you posted. Malika. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pingu Report post Posted February 23, 2006 Thankyou for your support. I hope no one else has to go through these emotions shaz Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Elanor Report post Posted February 23, 2006 Hi Pingu What a dreadful thing to happen - but am I right in reading it as a mistake by the doctor? He didn't mean to override your wishes did he? If so, bear that in mind in how you respond. In the meantime, I really hope that Kieran doesn't react badly this time. Elanor Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lindy-lou Report post Posted February 23, 2006 oh dear how awful for you,i too am not allowing India to have her MMR and i would be aghast if this had happened to her,the doctor MUST have you sign the consent forms first,there is no excuses as to why he didnt,to protect your child and himself,he must be a very worried doctor,but i am sure not as worried as you as a parent must be,very difficult for you i know because the doctor is a trusted one and seems to have a good relationship with your little one,but really he has gone against medical practise and that is a very serious issue. <'> Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tez Report post Posted February 23, 2006 Hi Pingu, <'> This must be really upsetting for you and really difficult to deal with since you seem to trust and respect the doctor concerned. However, I agree with call me jaded that it is really important that you put in writing that you did not consent to the MMR being adminstered, even if you have no intention of making a formal complaint. The doctor does not legally have to have written consent, verbal consent or just the arm being placed for the vaccination is sufficient. See here pages 21 and 22. Hope you're feeling a bit better today. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Flora Report post Posted February 23, 2006 Pingu <'> A few years ago (actually, lots of years ago when the MMR first came out), I knew someone who took their child for the pre-school booster of tetanus etc, but NOT the MMR, they'd specifically asked for this not to be given. It was a nurse who was doing the vaccination and she gave the MMR 'by mistake'. The parents complained and to cut a long story short the nurse was sacked and struck off. Your GP went totally against your wishes; but not only that, if he made an error like this, what other errors is he capable of? It's your call obviously, but I'm so against my own son having the MMR that if this happened to us I wouldn't hesitate to make a formal complaint. <'> You must be absolutely furious and worried. Lauren Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pingu Report post Posted February 23, 2006 Hi Hi Pingu What a dreadful thing to happen - but am I right in reading it as a mistake by the doctor? He didn't mean to override your wishes did he? If so, bear that in mind in how you respond. In the meantime, I really hope that Kieran doesn't react badly this time. Absolutly, by the look on his face it appeared that he didnt do it on purpose, Im sure it was just a breakdown of communication and unfortunatly Kieran is stuck in the middle. I dont want any trouble for him, but on the other hand its a very worrying mistake to make. Thanks again for your support, just one more thing....about the consent form.... I should've signed one shouldnt I? There was no mention at all yesterday, before during and after the Jabs. i know i will have to go back and sign it, but im not looking forward to the confrontation (receptionists like security guards) My mind is Spaggetti today. Doesnt it seem that everytime you have a firm footing on life, someone grabs the rug from under your feet and you're flat on your face again.... shaz Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tez Report post Posted February 23, 2006 (edited) There is no legal need for the doctor to get you to sign a consent form, he merely needs your consent to go ahead, this can be verbal or just your agreement to your child presenting their arm for the jab. However, doctors usually like to cover themselves by getting a consent form signed. HERE is the link to the guidance given to health professionals, consent is covered on pages 21 and 22. Edited February 23, 2006 by Tez Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest hallyscomet Report post Posted February 23, 2006 (edited) <'> Thankyou for your support. I hope no one else has to go through these emotions shaz <'> I have Shaz, but I believe their is help for your child these days. Mine was too late. I have researched this to bits, I have rambled on a bit below about a process that can help. I have a Pharmacy near me that has Paediatricians recommending this type of treatment and a Paediatrician that will advise you But firstly, lets just pray that it doesn't have the same effect, they say they have improved the MMR since. It was the Mercury in it that effect some children. The following methods are being used by Paediatricians over here and I am sure over there in the UK. I will try to find some stuff about this from the Paediatrician, to prove to you that this isn't cr*p. Take a moment to read the whole thing, its a safe form of Chelation to help your child excrete the metals and Mercury that could harm him. Apparently the Epsom Salt baths help your child excrete the metals, in his system. There are two highly regarded Paediatricians over here talking about a safe type of Chelation therapy, the Epsom Salts is part of it also Clay Baths, ring around all the Pharmacies in your area, and ask if they know anything about Chelation using Epson Salts and Clay Baths. As your child has just had the injection, it could work, to stop having anyside effects. Just briefly how not only the MMR but many injections affect our ASD children, is that they don't excrete the metals through their skin and hair like NT children. (But ring your Pharmacy and see if they have removed the Mercury from the MMR yet. (this will be good news if it isn't present) we maybe worrying over nothing. To Prove this - There is a test that a child can have to see if they are at risk, that is to go to the Naturopath get them to do a test on hair sample. (See if there are metals in the hair) -if their are metals present, that is good, it means your child excretes metals and they don't build up in the system. So MMR will no affect your child. If their are no metals in the hair, then your child is at risk of the metals building up in the system. So the Epsom Salt and Clay Baths help your child excrete these metals - now is the time to do it just after the injection. Again ask your Pharmacist. If your child starts to get Diarroreah or Irritable Bowel the Autism Association over here told me to give my child Aloe Vera Juice, it helps sooth the Colon and protect the colon. You can get it at the Chemist, just add it to fruit juice, it will say on the label for irritable bowel, the other thing they recommend is to give your child plenty of Acidophyllis use the capsule form and put it into yogurt. This is the best type. To give the bacteria in the colon healthy they say IB is caused by the MMR spreading Measles through the Bowel, this happened to my son. I suggest you source a Paediatrician over there that knows about this therapy -mild Chelation it may very well help, I feel very positive about it Shaz, as you are getting it early. It was 18 months after my sons MMR that I discovered what you know now, and too late to do anything like this. Please be calm, keep posting, and I will try and ring the Paediatrician over here and see if he know anyone in the UK you can talk to, if you can't find anyone. Or better still ring the National Autism Assoc. and ring one of the counsellors and explain what has happened and ask them to refer you to a Paediatrician that know about this. They will know about it. But I will still ring our here. Shaz there is hope. Sorry I may have repeated myself over and over but the phone is ringing and the kids are pestering me for this and that. Sorry. Almost 11pm here, minds a bit tired. Will try to find some links to prove this theory. Hailey Here is one Link: Dr Underwood Paediatrician see link, will try and find a better one http://aca.ninemsn.com.au/stories/1293.asp http://mindd.org/serendipity/archives.php/50-Events.html http://www.autism.net.au/Biomedical_Assessment.htm this is an alternative link about Epsom salts http://www.shirleys-wellness-cafe.com/detox.htm Edited February 23, 2006 by hallyscomet Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mum22boys Report post Posted February 23, 2006 Hi Pingu, I honestly couldn't believe what i was reading when i read your post. I can't imagine how you must have felt after taking the time to decide if you wanted your son to have the MMR and then for him to get it anyway. I hope you are ok. I am thinking about you. mum22boys <'> Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LizK Report post Posted February 23, 2006 Absolutly, by the look on his face it appeared that he didnt do it on purpose, Im sure it was just a breakdown of communication and unfortunatly Kieran is stuck in the middle. I dont want any trouble for him, but on the other hand its a very worrying mistake to make. Thanks again for your support, just one more thing....about the consent form.... I should've signed one shouldnt I? There was no mention at all yesterday, before during and after the Jabs. i know i will have to go back and sign it, but im not looking forward to the confrontation (receptionists like security guards) My mind is Spaggetti today. Doesnt it seem that everytime you have a firm footing on life, someone grabs the rug from under your feet and you're flat on your face again.... I've never signed a consent form for any jab my child has had, have always just given verbal consent. Take some time to decide what if anything you want to do and what outcome you would like. It doesn't sound like it was a deliberate paternalistic error done with the intent to harm your child but it is still a significant error. It might be worthwhile putting in writing what has happened and sending it to the practice and ask for assurances that procedures will be changed and this won't happen again. As a critical incident the practice really should be investigating this anyway. Hope you and your boy are ok Liz x Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Malika Report post Posted February 23, 2006 Hi Pingu this it what I found onone of the links given by Tez. Parental consent for a young child?s vaccination also needs to be obtained at each visit. The person giving the immunisation should be satisfied that parental consent has been obtained. This may be written authorisation or verbal (i.e. a telephone instruction). If in doubt, vaccination should be postponed. Management of parental refusal of child vaccination should be in line with local policy and may involve offering a parent the opportunity of a referral to the GP or community paediatrician so that they can discuss their concerns. Which is quite clarifying, Take care hope you and your son are OK now. <'> <'> <'> Malika. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
