Safespace, room within a room

[bluefish]

Hi, autism support worker has given me info on "Safespaces" they look like tents but are built to fit in your childs room and can only be opened from outside, so you can be sure that there are no escape attempts during the night!

Anyone got one of these?

They do look really good.and can be built with window ect

[Frangipani]

Hi,

 

I had a constant worry with my son doing a runner between meds or if meds were deliberately not taken. Even where I chose to live, luckily we live in a quiet safe cul de sac.

 

I can't ever imagine using one of those over the years for my son, I think it would freak him out.

 

I made sure we had a very good lock on the front door and other doors and removed the keys and hid them, I feel this worked adequately and never felt he was at risk to himself. I wouldnt even lock my kids in a bedroom.

 

Others may have different views. But, I dont like the sound of this at all. I would hate to be put in one, what if the child had a panic attack or worse and couldnt get out to warn you.

 

 

Fran x

Edited June 8, 2008 by Frangipani

[Enid]

Hmm. Could use one now if could get him there, but, seems to me to be a last resort with a severly autisic younger chid, I too lock all doors and keep keys in my pocket, as ds not only runs out if he feels like it but locks me out if I pop outside to the garden! Enid

[bjkmummy]

hi, i had a look and they look fab! they do have fabric like roofs so if the child shouts you would be able to hear them and if you put a baby monitor in the room also.

 

i didnt realise that once in some of the rooms they wouldnt be able to get out - this does of course have plus and minus points but as each child is different everyone will have different reasons as to if it would or wouldnt be suitable. they are certainly a good idea and i think they would be very good for some people bt of course you would probably need a free room to house it!

[NikkiSmith]

My son's ex OT was adamant that these were the solution to all my son's problems - which is why she is no longer involved with us!

Every other professional involved with my 5yr old said it was not what he needed; he apparently needed to learn that bedtime = time in his room if not actually in his bed sleeping. Also I had this image of me trying to chuck him in it and leg it out and zip the door up quickly afterwards - not practical with a solidly built 5yr old nevermind an older child!

 

We went to view one - the fact that the nearest one to me in Farnborough was in Southampton and was for an epileptic child (who understood why he went into it) and SafeSpaces themselves couldn't tell me where the nearest one in use with an autistic child was! (I asked on loads of websites and email lists and still haven't found someone.) It's worth ringing them and asking if there's one near you to go and see it in use though.

 

They are very cleverly designed; ie. totally enclosed and once inside there's nothing they can hurt themselves on, but I was told you have to ensure the child doesn't take anything unsuitable into it! It's also completely scrubable - which is a plus in this house.

 

The door closes by being zipped up and you can opt to only have the zipper bit on the outside, but if you have a sneaky child (like us!) they can indeed manage to undo it from inside so our OT wrote to SafeSpaces and asked what they recommended - somewhere in my great filing system I have a letter saying that if my son is a "houdini" then I should simply tie or lock the two parts of the zipper together and in case of emergencies all I need to do is keep a pair of scissors and a stanley knife easily accessible!! (I could put them on the flippin ceiling and my son would find a way of getting them!)

 

I did ask the social worker whether I would get into trouble if I locked my son in his room at night (sarcastically, as that's what they wanted me to do in a �3500 SafeSpace!) and she said she would not recommend it and would probably have to come and investigate the situation if I did!

 

I have since spoken to a Dad in Southampton who has two autistic boys and their OT organised a SafeSpace for one of them and he said they gave up with it in the end and it's sat dismantled in their garden. Apparently it didn't work with either child (one severely autistic and the other AS.)

 

I still haven't found a way of keeping ds2 in his room at night - we do have bolts on all the other doors (and double key locks on the doors to the outside world!) in the house, I keep the unlocked areas totally clear and free from things he can hurt himself with or climb up on and I sleep guarding the keys.

 

Good luck with the SafeSpaces option, sorry for totally slating them!

 

Nikki.

ps. sorry it's such a long reply!

Edited June 8, 2008 by NikkiSmith

[Flora]

I'm possibly being naive and of course only speaking from my own pov, but I think these sound horrible. I could not walk out of a room if I'd 'locked' one of my children into anything at all.

 

Flora

[JsMum]

Hmm. Could use one now if could get him there, but, seems to me to be a last resort with a severly autisic younger chid, I too lock all doors and keep keys in my pocket, as ds not only runs out if he feels like it but locks me out if I pop outside to the garden! Enid

 

 

 

Your post made me remember when J was around 7, he was high as a kite, and his behaviour esculating, luckly the social worker (male) was available and called round, when we opened the door I let him in, J ran round the back outside, the social worker followed him, as he had that mischievous look, as we went outside, he locked the front door and ran to the back door and locked that, there was me and the social worker locked outside.

it took a lot of cagoling to get him to open it, in the end we stood talking and took away all attention, we checked to ensure he wasnt in any danger and then waited for him, the little b climbed out the window, we had to retreeve the keys, and went inside, 10 mins later it was all calm again.

 

the social worker said he has been locked inside, but never outside.

 

The most worry was what was he doing inside, he could of burnt the house down, but thankfully he didnt, too busy climbing the walls.

 

we have kitted out a small room in our house and its his sensory room, we looked into the tents, but at �3000 we just dont have the money, before we moved we had a shed and did that as his safe haven, of which he still has, its great, its got bunkbeds, and in the summer we rig it up to a tv and ps2 and he has his tea and sometimes even sleeps in it. (when theres no spiders though)

 

 

A safe haven can be just as effective with a corner, with a few bean bags, some kind of music, with options of drawing/playing music instruments.

Its a place you can unwind, express safely and feel safe and secure and that can be made with as little money as possible.

 

some peeps I know have kitted out the coupard under the stairs, basically it could be even a tent in their bedroom.

 

 

JsMum

[puffin]

Forgive me if I am being stupid - but what would happen in the case of a fire or an overheating lamp etc? They look pretty flammable to me and the child would be unable to get out alone

[bid]

How would it fit in with supporting independence with toileting, for example?

 

And of course the safety issues for a child effectively 'locked' in their room

 

Bid

[puffin]

Of course my AS daughter would like one of these to put her NT sister in when she is being annoying

[JsMum]

Of course my AS daughter would like one of these to put her NT sister in when she is being annoying

lol

 

that made me really laugh.

 

JsMum

[bluefish]

The info was in a disability magazine. I did like the fact they can be used as a safe haven in terms of low sensory enviroment for chilling out.. but many many valid points made regarding not being able to get out,fire, taking something in that could harm ect. Also wonderful comment (fran I think?)"I would hate to be put in one" actually I agree ME TOO.

My house has every lock and safety gadget known to man kind! I would never shut his door at night and would never dream of locking him in anywhere. For exactly the same reason as the concerns raised! BUT that is exactly what this safespace tent WOULD be doing!!!!! Somehow it looked different?

Good to have your eyes opened by the views of others! I saw this in the magazine and it at first sight I must admit I thought they looked bright and cozy and a solution to my fears of him getting out of the house at night.

However having been given some food for thought realize this is not a solution to having a safe happy child at bed time.. Not to mention how would he get into my bed for a hug in the middle of the night!

 

But still think it was an interesting concept,and can understand why I read it with interest.

[lorryw]

My son is now almost 22 but I know exactly how you feel.

I think I have spent years of my life either sitting outside his room, in the early hours redirecting him back in to bed or listening out for him. We had a stair gate on his open door way for years. It just meant that he had a boundary and he found difficult to cross. As he got older he simply took the gate off and the noise woke me up.to be honest after a while he didnt really need it, he realised bedtime meant you stay in bed.

Getting him to go to sleep was another battle though!

[teachermum1]

Some schools use these as an alternative to restraint.

[Kathrynh]

I still have a stair gate on B's bedroom door. He is 6 and perfectly capable of climbing it but he is used to bedtime routine and doesn't try to. At night I tie his door to the gate with an old belt and a quick release knot. I couldn't face locking it but I need someway of keeping him in his room at night both for his safety and my sanity!! It does the trick at night and in the morning if he wakes up before me, which is most mornings, he just pulls at the door and rattles the whole contraption which is a very effective alarm clock. If it came to an emergency I know that the belt tie would come undone easily and the stair gate which was hand made by B's dad could be smashed with a quick kick.

[teachermum1]

Hmmm...can't help thinking that, in some cases, NOT being able to keep a child in a room would leave EVERYONE at more risk from a fire, especially those children with obsessions with matches and fire. I think these would only ever be used in the most extreme cases, and, in those cases, not locking a child in would be more risky to everyone than locking them in. Perhaps those who are so negative about them are those whose children are not extreme enough to need one, so naturally it's a horrible idea. But in a sleep-deprived, scarred by near-misses family of a child who genuinely meets the high care rate DLA criteria of never being able to be left unsupervised at day or night due to risk of danger to the child or others, I can completely see why these are a great idea.

 

I don't like the implication that someone's a bad parent if they used one of these. I personally wouldn't, for various reasons, but for some, it would be a welcome last resort to keep everyone safe.

[JsMum]

Hi I didnt realise people actually lock/close the doors to their kids rooms, J would go into instant panic if you were to close his door and he would almost certainly freek out if he knew the door was locked, he cant stand been trapped inside, he wont go in lifts, toilets, and the underground and he is extreamly nervous on public transport, all because he has a fear of been trapped, J is verbal and doesnt have a severe learning difficulties and yet he wouldnt still be able to express his fears with communication, he would just flip, Im just wondering if any of the escape tactics are because some are been enclosed inside a room?

 

Bedtimes are difficult for J, he has it all in a visual display, I sit with him until he is settled and asleep, we did go throw a phase of CCTV which connected via the pc/tv what about a baby monitor that has a lcd display and beeps when there is motion/noise.

 

J needs to see me all the time, if I use a barrier he becomes threatful and worried he wont see me again, he panics as it is when I have to protect myself from his rages and use a door as a barrier, its horrible even for them few mins.

 

Looking at fears around bedtime maybe needed throw an autistic specialist, or similair if your child has a higher level of communication difficulty, and looking at longer term goals, It may be that the first few weeks will have to be were you sit outside there room and do gradual return, until they understand its bedtime, it could also be that they recieve a lot of attention when trying the great escape, (they try and escape, you run after them....)

so gradual withdrawal techneque may be a way of ensuring they really understand bedtime is bedtime.

 

the point of a safe room is also a preventative measure, its actually a tool to use from very early signs of stress, so reaching them before the outburst/trying to escape, we have provided a place where hopefully J feels safe and likes the sensation he gets from been in there and that over time he can aproach the safe room without things esculating in the first place, they shouldnt need locking in.

 

Maybe look at early evening and work towards a gradual aproach to bedtime, as I know with J he requires reminders and warnings, so its not just a quick transition from playing to right bedtime, its a slow step by step steady routine.

 

JsMum

[bid]

I think a tent as a 'refuge' within their room could be a great idea. I've seen those little pop-up tents for under a tenner in quite a few high street shops

 

It's interesting for me to see parents' opinions to locking/securing their child's bedroom door at night. I work as night staff at a residesi special school for children and young adults with the most severe and complex needs, some of whom do abscond. But legally we are not allowed to lock any bedroom doors because of the fire risk, quite apart from the 'restraint' angle.

 

Bid

[NikkiSmith]

I haven't ever tried to lock my son in his room - it would never work, it would only wind him up and create more mayhem.

 

He attends a CLD school, gets top whack for both parts of DLA, is quite a houdini and barely sleeps, but still I couldn't get my head around how locking him in his room or a safespace actually helped.

I did ask the lovely lass at SafeSpaces if they were soundproofed as I knew that if I put my son in one he would scream for hours until he was totally exhausted..... I know I needed him to sleep, but not like that!

 

We also tried the camera in his room trick, but he worked out what we were up to and managed to throw enough objects at it on the ceiling to destroy it My problem is that with 3 boys on the spectrum, bedtimes are always going to be complicated cos there's only one of me.

 

Teachermum1 - do you know of a school that successfully uses one? I couldn't find one anywhere in Hampshire when I wanted to find out how they used them/made them work positively for the (autistic) kids.

 

 

Nikki.

[hev]

i want a safespace..............for me!! i would go in there with a bottle of rose,some choccie and magazines nick katie and steve wouldnt have to do the zipper up,they wouldnt see me for days

[Flora]

i want a safespace..............for me!! i would go in there with a bottle of rose,some choccie and magazines nick katie and steve wouldnt have to do the zipper up,they wouldnt see me for days

 

[bid]

Teachermum1 - do you know of a school that successfully uses one? I couldn't find one anywhere in Hampshire when I wanted to find out how they used them/made them work positively for the (autistic) kids.

 

Professionally I would be very interested to see how a school would be able to use them legally, both for Health and Safety reasons, and because of the restraint implications.

 

Bid

[JsMum]

I wasnt against safespace, Just the locking them inside and leaving them during the night, from what Ive researched about them they are really designed for children with self injury behaviours, epilepsy and other mobility difficulty and are good because they are padded inside, there not a locking devise, but I totally do think they are a great for a safe place to go and unsensoryise, Id love one for J but they are over �3000 and just too expensive, so we opt to making our own safe place with a room, that was all I was sharing, and how locking J in a room distrubs him severly that that act alone would cause him to hurt himself, Just to make it clear from me, I think they are good for a safe haven, but not to use like a padded cell.

 

JsMum

Edited June 9, 2008 by baddad
removed link to commercial website in line with forum rules

[bid]

http://www.safespaces.co.uk/schools.html

 

I see that in schools they aren't suggested to be used overnight in a bedroom, but as a safe place or sensory 'room' within the classroom.

 

Interestingly from their webpage:

 

Safespaces are designed to facilitate care, not to be used as a substitute for supervision

 

Bid

Edited June 8, 2008 by bid

[Lynden]

I looked at these before for Logan briefly and thought No! Mainly because I would hate to be stuck in one too. We do close his door when we put him to bed, or he wouldn't stay in bed otherwise. Door closed = sleep it seems. He can't open it by himself yet though as he's not strong enough but he soon lets us know when he needs out. We do however open it before we go to bed so that he can get to us at any time he needs.

 

Lynne x

[baddad]

Hi All -

 

I think these look like a great 'safe place' for our kids to chill out - a room within a room that offers an extra 'barrier' between the real world (big, scary place) and the safety of an 'internal' world that keeps those fears at bay. Putting a child to bed inside of such a room would offer an 'extra' barrier that could help thm sleep and encourage them to stay put. Not sure it needs to be quite so complicated though, or anywhere near so expensive (taking the price from Nikki Smith's post above)... When I was little and the world got too scary I'd make camps or hole up in the cupboard under the stairs. Playing with ben, when he had bunk beds, we'd tuck a sheet or blanket on the upper bunk and towels off the corners, and the back wall gave us a 'back wall'!

 

Putting a decent sized pop up tent in the room (with sleeping bags! Woohoo - what eight year old wouldn't want that!) would offer the same sort of 'safe zone', if that was the intention...

 

The other use for it - as an 'isolation tank', really bothers me, because of the 'safety' aspects mentioned above and also because it feels so..... As I said, I LOVED the cupboard under the stairs, but i think if it had had a lock on the outside, and my mum had decided when i went in there instead of me......

 

I can understand why parents who had kids who just would not stay in bed could see this as the answer to their prayers, but I think they'd do better to push and push and push social services for occassional respite care (or even a 'sleepover carer' one night a week - somebody mentioned higher rate care component: this is exactly why they pay the higher rate - to purchase services or materials that alleviate the burden on the carer) rather than for funding on this.

 

It took me around a year to get Ben to the point he would stay in bed at night. I pretty much slept on the landing. He would be put in his room, tucked in, and would be out of the bed before I could shut the door. I did shut it though, and would let him scream/rant/cry for 10-15 minute periods. I would then go in and calm him, put him back into bed, and start the whole process again.

Eventually, at some point, he would collapse in exhaustion, and i would get a couple of hours sleep before it started again. At around five am would be 'cut-off' and he could come in my bed and (on a good day) I'd get another hour or so...

Gradually, the screaming/ranting phases got shorter, and the sleep (or quiet) periods got longer. Eventually sleep won

 

Advice to all parents with non-sleeping children - grab it when you can get it. If you're being forced to stay awake 20 hours out of twenty four there's plenty of time for everything else...

 

If you can make a plastic tent a 'safe zone' (i.e. somewhere your child is unlikely to hurt themselves) you can make a room a safe zone. Window locks/bars make good sense (I had both on the house we lived in while Ben was at his most active), but if your child can 'wreck' a bricks and mortar room to the point of making it dangerous, then a plastic room within a room hasn't got a cat in hells chance of surviving