Fathers and ASD Kids

[Dadofask]

I'm a new member of this forum - my wife has encouraged me to join and get more involved. I have a 13 year old Aspergers son and I seem to be in an ever worsening spiral of conflict with him. He's high-functioning, but increasingly abusive and violent towards me - some of these episodes I have brought on by my inability to cope with his tirades at either myself or his mother (more likely!). Unlike me, however, my wife is coping better and finding the power and stength within herself to stay calm more often than I can.

 

So far over the 3 week Xmas break, I have been punched in the head twice, threatened countless times, stabbed in the stomach with a fork (we've hidden the knives!) and called so many colourful names I've lost count. I'm on anti-depressants and see a councillor weekly to try to get to grips with the situation, but its getting worse from where I sit. To top it all, my wife has now suggested that I consider leaving because she cannot trust me to be left alone with him.

 

I'm pretty much worn down to a frazzle over this and wondered if anyone out there was aware of any resources for fathers who aren't able to cope with the problems being faced by their AS kids. I have read pretty widely on Asperger's and have a grasp of what the issues are - although I would say that most of what I have read does not pay enough attention on how to deal with the incoherent and illogical meltdowns that we encounter in our family. Dealing with the other aspects - literal and rigid thinking, obsessions, etc. are much easier in comparison for me.

[lindy-lou]

firstly <'> welcome to the forum,it is difficult to see past the rages and meltdowns when your the one there aimed at,my sister has had this off her AS son too,he is 13 as well and the rages are becoming less frequent with time,he is learning how to deal with his anger and trying to realise the consequences of his actions,does your son get any anger management therapy at all?i think leaving may do more harm than good,firstly to your marriage and secondly because your son will know your leaving because of him and so make him feel guilty and maybe more angry,i cant suggest too much but there is a wealth of information on this forum,take some time to read through some posts and see if any suggestions may work for your family,your not alone on here though.

 

lynda x

[Viper]

Welcome dadofask.

 

I don't have any answers for you except that I know my husband finds it hard with our 2 AS kids (one girl and one boy) and I have to deal with the meltdowns while he keeps a low profile. I think in my husbands case he can't get past the personal attacks, be it verbal or physical. I understand that my son (worst culprit) dosen't mean what he says when he calls us names, it's just part of the meltdown. Hubby on the other hand see's it as personal and takes it to heart. May be something to do with a primal hierachy thing I don't know.

 

There are Dads on here that may be able to answer your questions better.

 

Viper.

[Paula]

Hi

 

Im the mum of a 11 year old As son hell be 12 this month.

 

Sorry youre haveing such a rough time of it.I just wanted to say that recently weve noticed that our son is becomeing more physical and violent.He used to be very agressive when he was a toddler and would hit punch nip and kick me on a regular basis.It was realy upsetting and left me fealing powerless at times.

 

Lately though hes turned his attentions towards his dad.He will raise his fist and get right up into his face.My husband threatens him back and then we get into a bit of a row because i say ignore him youre making it worse and he thinks im wrong ect ect youll know the score i bet.

 

 

I look at it like this though.First and foremost youre dealing with a teenage boy.Im dealing with a pre teen just kinda going into puberty.Regardless of The AS teenage boys do get a little bit more physical and agressive all that testostarone combine that with AS or ADHD and its gonna be explosive to put it mildley.

 

 

Its so easy for parents to start argueing about how best to deal with it all ive been there most of our arguments are about how to deal with, how to deal with his behaviour whoes right whoes wrong on and on it goes with no real answers.

 

Our house has been a hell hole at times if im honest everyone yelling me crying husband thretening to kill our son.But yer know what when i look around in amongst all this aggro our AS son will be sat oblivious to it on the ps2 all thoughts of his previous meltdown and upset long gone from his mind.

 

 

Youre wife wont want you to leave itll be a knee jerk reaction.

Xmas is a stress filled time none more so than when theres AS in the mix.

 

Beleive me when my son is in full swing and im of on a rant due to my Bi polar our house is like world war 3 and armaggeden all chucked into one then wang in our teenage daughter on a strop and BANG !!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Hope it sorts hang in there.I probably aint helped but i wanted yer to know yer aint alone.

[reuby2]

Hi,

I myself posted something similar about my hubby a few weeks ago.I think the situation is so difficult that it does come between partners sometimes (it does for us anyway!)

My son is 7, and has ASD , he regularly jumps on us, kicks, hits, pinches, bites etc. I try to stay calm and not take offense and that seems to work better, however Dad tends to lock horns and say "i'm not going to be spoken to like that" etc and he seems to bear more of the brunt of it.

I do confess to trying to get some peace and quiet because the outbursts from son stress me out, so when hubby starts as well I'm on overload!!!!!!!!!!

I know it really gets my hubby down the fact that his son is so aggressive towards him. I try to look past the behaviour whilst still reinforcing that It's not the way to play etc.

I think hubby makes it worse by play fighting with him. because my son then goes too far or wants to play fight when hubby doesn't and so it confuses my son.

I'm definitly going to get my hubby to read your posting and i'm sorry I don't know of any specific resourses for dads.

All the best ,hope it gets better soon <'>

[Suze]

Hi Dadofask.Welcome........I find the anger/violence my son displays very hard to cope with.I to take anti-d,s (I did have counselling but gave it up ).I find I get very emotionally vulnerable when my son is in a rage, and I can,t cope, other than to shout back at him, which makes it worse.My husband handles him much better as he can be calmer and so calms him quicker.You must not feel guilty as parents we are all different , maybe your wife can deal with him better in these situations.Also if possible remove yourself from his meltdown , walk away and leave him,(if this is possible and he poses no danger to anyone).That way you can,t engage in his fight.I spoke to a therapist about this problem and his advice was not to engage in the war, because the battle would,nt be worth winning.I was finding I was trying to parent my son as if he was NT.Trying to reason with him while in a rage was fruitless as he could never remember anything during this time.I found talking to him after was more helpful as we both were calmer and more inclined to listen to one another.Suzex.

[Guest flutter]

dads i think find it the hardest,

many i think take it personally, and i really dont mean that in a bad way,

its a bit like when kids misbehave, mums gradually work up to a shout where as dad kidna get ther emuch quicker.

my hubs and teenage son find it hard, espec in rages, but my dd doenst even know what she is dong at the time

C x

[Paula]

reuby 2

 

My husband play fights with our son also and says itll toughen him up.But what he doesnt realise is that it confuses him and then like youre son mine wants to initiate fights at an inconveniant time and then my husband whinges coz theres something on the tv and agro kicks of.

 

 

Plus and i know this is going of on a tangent a bit i get kinda annoyed with my husband because hes at work most of the time and its me who does the bulk of the careing,me who deals with the gps and schools not him.Me who has to deal with tantrums and outburst whilst shopping whilst he sits at home or is at work liveing his life all nice and conveniant.Then he tries to muscle in with telling me how to deal with stuff and do this dont do that and i get wound up and angry at him and i start with the what the hell do you know about it attitude when youre never here.

 

People dont realise the stress it puts on a marriage it pushes you to breaking point.Luckily weve come through the worst times and are still together.But its no picnic we often say its a miricle were still together.

[annie]

Hi Dadofask,

 

Welcome to the forum <'> .

 

The same thing used to go on in our house. My son (Alex) is 16 now and we only get the occasional argument these days.

 

Alex has always argued with my hubby, they've never actually come to blows (thankfully), but at one stage it was pretty close. I feel it was a mixture of AS, hormones, stress and male dominance. I'm the calm one in the house and when I could/can see Alex starting to go into meltdown I'd tell hubby to get himself out of the way. If hubby was around when a meltdown started both hubby and Alex would argue to get the last word, neither would back down. Alex has learned to go off to his room now when he feels that he's starting to get really wound up, it's taken a long while for him to learn, but he's done it. Hubby has learnt not to bite or take things that Alex says personally, again that's also taken a long while.

 

When things were at their worst, Alex was really stressed (because of school), so I think stress has played a very big part. It was Alex's stress and frustration coming out as anger and hubby was finding it hard to relate the two.

 

When things were at rock bottom, I would have been quiet happy for hubby to get up and leave. I didn't want him to, but I couldn't handle the constant arguing.

 

It is really hard when your child treats you like a punch-bag I know. I always felt I was the peacemaker, is that how your wife feels? it wore me down too.

 

After all my rambling , all I can suggest is get away from your son, go for a walk, hide in the shed, anything while a meltdown is in full flow. When your son is calm, teach him how to recognise when a meltdown is starting ie racing heartbeat, muscles tightening, eventually leading to him going to his room when he CAN recognise the signs. It's hard work, but you can get there.

 

Annie

<'>

Edited January 4, 2006 by annie

[reuby2]

Thanks for that Paula,

makes me feel better cos i'm the same !!

[Dadofask]

My thanks to everyone who has responded to this thread - I'll take a look around the forum of couse, but I think the best advice I can take at this time is to lie low when these meltdowns occur, at least until I can get a better grip of whats happening. The trouble is that this puts all the onus on my wife to handle these situations...

 

I think maybe someone needs to write a new book - "Aspergers Syndrome: A Father's Perspective" - I might even be able to contribute. Oh well, tomorrow's another day and maybe it'll be meltdown free.... thanks again!

[Elanor]

Hi Dadofask

 

I think I could have written your post myself a couple of years ago - although I'm the Mum, and it was me who was thinking about leaving, and it was my husband who was coping better with our son.

 

Mum or Dad, it is the personality that counts, not the gender - I think I'm not very well cut out to deal with the emotional turmoil my son's outrages caused (still do sometimes), and like the others recommend, getting out of the way is the best thing to do. Otherwise you become part of the problem.

 

I agree that too little attention is given in the books to the extreme aggression that some of us have to live with. My son takes medication, which controls the worst of his violence, and over time things have got better. The key to it, is understanding that the anger is the consequence of stress and anxiety, and when you are able to reduce the stress, the anger reduces too.

 

Don't be too tough on yourself.

 

Take care - Elanor

[smiley]

Hiya Dadofask and welcome to the forum <'>

 

We have a similar problem here - my son is much more confrontational with hubby. And hubby used to react to it. We find now - it's much better if he stays calm (much easier said than done i know!!) and either walks away or just ignores it.

 

It does leave alot of it for me to deal with. But as hubbys knowledge of AS inproves, so do his reactions. It's by no means easy for him but he's taking it as less of a personal attack now. I think it can be alot harder for dads, as 'man of the family' he feels he should be able to handle things - but often my son will just react better to me. I'm not sure if it's our apporach or just that i'm the one who's with him the most that makes the difference.

[LizC]

Hi and welcome. I only joined recently too. my middle child matthew who is 5 also has aspergers. although alot younger, he can have some nasty tantrums and throws things that seems to be getitng worse. It is so hard and quiet easy to loose your temper! hang in there. sometimes they get angry because they don't understand or are frustrated. how long has he been diagnosed? sometimes if they have only been diagnosed, maybe he is trying to deal with it all?

[OPooh]

Just wanted to say welcome to the forum and it's exactly the same in our house too - except there isn't a calm parent so we both have to try hard to keep each other calm.

[UltraMum]

Our house is like that too - I have much more patience than my other half ... but he's learning ...

 

Sometimes it seems like I only have to leave them alone together and they're at each others' throats - not literally I hasten to add!

 

I think part of the issue is flexibility as well as the patience issue - hubby lays down a rule and then sticks to it through thick and thin and imminent meltdown - I tend to see the meltdown coming and adjust before it hits - when I can ...

 

On the whole I think it is mainly because I have spent more time with our son while hubby goes out to work and brings home the bacon .. try explaining that to an ASD child!

 

Sorry not to have been more help but welcome to the forum and hope you pick up some tips

Edited January 4, 2006 by MotherEve

[hev]

hello,welcome to the forum,you have described our house exactly,the amount of times i have told my partner to go after one of stevens meltdowns is too many to count,my partner says he cannot bear steve talking to me like i am dirt and where i do get upset about it i can forget most of it right away where as my partner keeps thinking if he goes on about it to steven steven will stop but that isent the case and it all blows up again,my partner is also stevens stepdad so even though he has been with us for years and loved steven i sometimes think would he be reacting this way if steve was his own,keep posting as it does help,you are def not alone in this as you have probably gathered!

[phasmid]

I think the best advice I can take at this time is to lie low when these meltdowns occur, at least until I can get a better grip of whats happening.

 

I think you have just written your own straterdy for dealing with this. Phas Jr and I seem to have bouts of 'horn-locking' on an almost weekly basis at times. He is 6ft2-3 tall and is no lightweight with it! It is normally caused by the sane things you say cause the problems between you and your son. I know it will seem to be the wrong thing to do to let your wife deal with meltdowns but if she can handle them perhaps that is the best thing to do.

 

You really are not alone with this, you can see that by the responses to your posting! It is a case of finding what works best for all of you. Sit and talk to your wife, tell her how you feel about things. I hope you can get it all sorted.

 

Phas (dad of four)

[Kazzen161]

The book "Aspergers Syndrome and Difficult Moments: Practical solutions for tantrums, rage and meltdown" by B Smith Myles and J Southwick is excellent at explaining the rage cycle.

 

When your son has got to the stage of meltdown, there is nothing you can do except keep him and others safe. This may mean removing yourself from the area. It also explains about learning to recognise the signs that your child is stressed/anxious (perhaps your wife can pick these up easier than you), and to teach your child cooling down methods (eg: playing music in his room, reading a book, whatever relaxes him). You can also learn to avoid potentially stressful places/things where possible, and avoid sensory overload. You can also discuss the child's response with him, and how he coudl have responded better (eg: walk away, hit a punch bag, etc) - but only once he has calmed down. Any discussion/nagging/shouting when he is in meltdown will just make things worse. Gradually your child learns what things will stress him, what are the early signs that he is stressed, and more appropriate responses.

 

I can cope with my two AS boys meltdowns/tempers/tantrums - I do not take them personally - but my NT son's hormonal outrages are another matter! I am having to learn to walk away from him.

 

Talk to your wife, ask her to teach you how she knows what to do for the best with your son, tell her to call you if she needs your help in dealing with him (eg:if she is in danger of getting seriously hurt), and after your son has calmed down, give her a big hug and a cup of tea !

 

Karen

[annie]

I've just found this while 'googling'

 

http://mind.in/node/212

[Dadofask]

I'm definitely in the right place for advice and - pardon my naivete here - I was beginning to think that what we are facing is unusual. My biggest headache at the moment is that I have begun to so seriously dislike our son, that I am beginning to goad him into doing something drastic. That drastic step will then be one which will force the authorities to remove him from the house. I hate myself for doing this, but it just seems at times that this would be the best solution for all of us, including my wife and younger son. I haven't sat down and conciously planned that way of thinking, but during meltdowns its very difficult for me to consider otherwise.

 

I realise how desparately poor and selfish that strategy is and I still hope that we will somehow get him into a place of safety and harmony, be it at home or elsewhere. Whatever happens, however, I realise that it has to be with his involvement and buy-in and not just because I am forcing the situation upon him as a reaction to the pain his condition is causing me.

 

My thanks again for all of your feedback and advice.

[annie]

You are definately not alone in what you are going through <'>

 

You're not being selfish at all. You give so much and get nothing in return, hurt and resentment sets in....and so it goes on. Please do not blame yourself for how you are feeling.

 

I hope you don't mind me asking, but how does your son get on at school? My son's anger stemmed from not being able to cope at school. Since we've taken school out of the picture our son is like a different lad......just a thought.

[Dadofask]

Since we've taken school out of the picture our son is like a different lad......just a thought.

 

He isn't at school at the moment - since half-term in Oct/Nov last year. We have been going through the process of making alternative arrangements for him, but it's going to take a long time to resolve. In the meantime, his stress and anxiety levels remain very high.

[neda]

That drastic step will then be one which will force the authorities to remove him from the house. I hate myself for doing this, but it just seems at times that this would be the best solution for all of us, including my wife and younger son.

 

I realise how desparately poor and selfish that strategy is and I still hope that we will somehow get him into a place of safety and harmony, be it at home or elsewhere. Whatever happens, however, I realise that it has to be with his involvement and buy-in and not just because I am forcing the situation upon him as a reaction to the pain his condition is causing me.

 

Welcome to the forum. Sorry you're having such a hard time with things. My nephew's behaivour was much the same as your boy's. He tried to stab his step dad and threatened it many more times, hit out at his mum and step dad and on one occasion he even hurt my mum, whilst in a rage, although it wasn't meant. He was asking to go into a home when sister spoke to social worker at end of her tether, social worker told them it wasn't what they would do, they would do everything to keep him in the home. He gave up his schooling, ended up in a residential school Monday-Friday and then in a local education scheme for kids who don't go to mainstream schooling. His rages have certainly calmed down in past 6 months, he ihas just turned 16, so hopefully as he gets slightly older some of the behaviour will calm down. The hardest part seems to be walking away when this behaviour starts or letting your wife deal with it whilst you calm down. I know its hard to admit to the feelings you have, but you are most definitely not alone with them. <'>

[annie]

We took Alex out of school November '04 and had to arrange an education package for him through the LEA, so I know how you feel with that side of things too. The stress from trying to sort that out doesn't help either. We spent months trying to undo everything that school had done to Alex.

[asereht]

Hi Dadofask,

 

This could have been us six months ago.

My son is now 14 going on 15.

The last few years were bad but things are improving as he gets older.

 

No advice to give just to say that there is light at the end of the tunnel.

 

Theresa

[DAS999]

I am sorry I cannot offer advise as I have not been in this situation but I would like to offer my support

[Paula]

This is a bit of a confession because i wanted people to know that if at times they react to an AS meltdown or just the general stress As puts on the family in general like i do sometimes and feel guilty then there not alone.

 

 

Sometimes for me it gets too much.I get so angry ,im doing everything for my son everything the worst bit being haveing to wipe his bottom and clean up the mess.Normally he is kinda loveing and gentle unless something doesnt go as he planned.But sometimes hell look at me and push me out the way or go to kick me and hell say i hate you youre awfull with no emotion on his face at all and hell just walk away.

 

Its like a knife in my heart and i snap.I normally go to my room and scream at the top of my lungs,shortley followed by swearing and general why the heck us why why WHY !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It gets too much and you realy dont see the point and its like all youre efforts have been in vaine.

 

Then it hits you they cant help it and its not personal.The guilt i feal at haveing let it get to me is horrid.

 

But you dust youreself down and carry on.

 

Surely every now and againe were allowed to let out all the upset.I find im contantly keeping a lid on it all because if i open the flood gates ill never be able to close them.

[kirstie]

I can cope with my two AS boys meltdowns/tempers/tantrums - I do not take them personally - but my NT son's hormonal outrages are another matter! I am having to learn to walk away from him.

 

 

Karen

 

First of all, Hi Dadofask and welcome <'> Also, Karen God do i know what you mean on the NT hormonal son driving you nuts, and Paula, I'm sorry you feel like this <'> <'> have a couple of them on me!

Dadofask, i think you are really brave in admitting your innermost thoughts and no-one here will condemn you for them, rest assured we have all been at our wits end and these thoughts do creep in! My son is only 6 but his temper is horrendous and he has the strenght of ten men when he kicks off. When he was a lot younger i really couldn't handle him and didn't like him atall, i just wanted someone to come and take him off my hands every day. It is a learning curve for all of us and we too as parents need 'teaching' if you like to handle csuch situations. We can't automatically know that even the way we speak to our asd kids can make all the difference. Short and sweet, telling them they are doing 'good listening' or ' good asking' etc can help. Also (and i know this is so hard) but ignoring the bad behaviour and praising the good, i was taught remember thr three c's, Clear Calm and Consistent. There is always a reason for the behaviours and it might not be apparent to us why the meltdown happens but there WILL be a reason for it. Stress is huge and Christmas can be a nightmare for our kids, everything looks different and can be too much for them to handle. Your Cahms centre should be able to help you with courses for you all as a family or at least point you in the right direction, do you have an Autistic society in your area? They can also help. And just remember this little gem, Your Son must be very comfortable with you to be able to meltdown and scream and shout at you the way he does (small consolation i know!) I tend to be fim to the point and try not to shout and lose it anymore. Lewis would push me to the edge and i'd scream and shout too but it was like argueing with an adult and there really was no reasoning with him. Don't leave home though because as hard as it is right now, it WILL get better i promise.

Take care,

Kirstie.

[ray]

hello, & welcome. have son, 17 & AS. haven't really had to deal with violence, but lots of anger, and becomes extremely frustrated very quickly over what we might regard as v.minor things. would say though as hormones have started to settle down a bit, he's less inclined, although will still meltdown occasionally. came home today from college vowing never to return because he had trouble opening the door of the bus when getting off, and others on the bus had a bit of a giggle.